This Thread Is To Be Used For All Discussions About HAL's On Board Smoking Policies

[sail7seas]

No one ever has to guess my opinion, do they? :D :D

 

Oh well....... It's clear I hope HAL bans verandah smoking but I cannot say I 'know' they will.

[taxmantoo]

I don't wish one way or the other. I don't smoke, but don't really care if those around me smoke or not. Being a former smoker, I understand all too well how enjoyable it is, and hold no ill will for those who chose to indulge.

 

I have no knowledge of if or when HAL will adjust the policy, but I do believe that the edict has come down from Carnival Corp that HAL will continue to capture the smoking population.

 

I really don't think "if" is in doubt. The only issue HAL needs to resolve is "when" they can reconcile their decision to modify their smoking policy with their bottom line.

[SJSULIBRARIAN]

I really don't think "if" is in doubt. The only issue HAL needs to resolve is "when" they can reconcile their decision to modify their smoking policy with their bottom line.

 

Maybe after the Koningsdam comes out and the two small ships leave the fleet.

Just speculating

[Aquahound]

Until the policy is changed, I would hope you would have someone beside you like me, who with a simple request would not smoke on the balcony if they know you are there and it is bothersome for you.

 

As a smoker, I know it can be bothersome to others.

 

KevInPitt, thank you. :) If everyone was like you, this whole debate may not even exist. As a non smoker, the only time I've politely asked smoking balcony neighbors not to smoke was while we were eating...and even then, it was not well received. Not only does that sour the moment, it makes the rest of the cruise awkward. Unfortunately, I think this attitude represents most people nowadays. You just can't confront people...even politely...anymore. The days of men simply talking to one another about issues are sadly long gone. :(

[hrhdhd]

Unfortunately, I think this attitude represents most people nowadays. You just can't confront people...even politely...anymore. The days of men simply talking to one another about issues are sadly long gone. :(

 

Well, if you're confronting someone, that doesn't sound polite.

 

Anyway, you might have been polite with your request, and the smoker, who has the permission of the cruise line to smoke, still refused to stop smoking. That you didn't get your way doesn't mean the encounter couldn't have been polite. ;)

[cbr663]

I am sorry you were met with such a disrespectful response. I would certainly have acquiesced. It would be the polite thing to do.

 

Unfortunately, there are far too many selfish inconsiderate people in this world. The polarity of this topic can bring out the worst in people and magnify selfish inconsiderate behavior.

 

Each side has their opinion and preference. The real core of what I see is finding a reasonable balance between the two. But no matter what, basic common courtesy shouldn't be like dust in the wind (pardon the terrible pun).

 

HAL has, as is its right to do so, determined the "balance" - balconies are currently designated a smoking area. Some passengers would find it rather presumptuous, inconsiderate and very rude to ask someone not to smoke in a designated smoking area.

[KevInPitt]

HAL has, as is its right to do so, determined the "balance" - balconies are currently designated a smoking area. Some passengers would find it rather presumptuous, inconsiderate and very rude to ask someone not to smoke in a designated smoking area.

 

You are quite accurate on HAL's policy.

 

On the subject of balconies as a designated smoking area, this passenger wouldn't find it any of those things you ascribe to a neighbor's polite request to not smoke if it bothers them when they are also on the balcony.

 

Sometimes its about being allowed to do something and sometimes its not... but its always about trying to be considerate of someone else.

[hrhdhd]

HAL has, as is its right to do so, determined the "balance" - balconies are currently designated a smoking area. Some passengers would find it rather presumptuous, inconsiderate and very rude to ask someone not to smoke in a designated smoking area.

 

Thanks for stating what I meant more clearly than I was able to. :) It is interesting to me that the smoker who is using his or her balcony as is allowed (and who probably booked a balcony to be able to smoke) is considered rude because he or she is smoking on the balcony.

[Lizzie68]

Does HAL allow burning of oil or incense on balcony to counteract the cigarette smell?

 

 

Hmm. An interesting thought. And why not, indeed? There could certainly be no objection to the method of burning the oil or incense, given that lighters, matches, cigarettes, cigars etc are allowed. Or perhaps a fan to blow the smoke in another direction? Of course you would need an extension cord to connect to an electrical plug inside the room, but I'm sure there are ways.....

[Aquahound]

Sometimes its about being allowed to do something and sometimes its not... but its always about trying to be considerate of someone else.

 

Bingo! That's it, right there. It's always about being considerate. We all have bad habits, but those of us who are considerate curb those habits when in near vicinity of other people....whether those habits are legal or not. Unfortunately, some people just can't see beyond what's allowed. :(

[Cruzaholic41]

So let me see if I got this right. I just read a pleasant exchange between a smoker and a non smoker, yet still some people can't help but jump in and ruin it with their attitudes of - it's permitted so no one can say anything? Sad. very, very sad.

[cbr663]

Bingo! That's it, right there. It's always about being considerate. We all have bad habits, but those of us who are considerate curb those habits when in near vicinity of other people....whether those habits are legal or not. Unfortunately, some people just can't see beyond what's allowed. :(

 

How do you know that the passenger next to you has not curbed their smoking? How do you know that the passenger next to you may already be accommodating the passenger on their other side or above or below them? Unfortunately, some people just can't see beyond the fact that they are not the only passenger on a ship and they may not be the only passenger making demands on other passengers.

[LMaxwell]

So let me see if I got this right. I just read a pleasant exchange between a smoker and a non smoker, yet still some people can't help but jump in and ruin it with their attitudes of - it's permitted so no one can say anything? Sad. very, very sad.

 

You can read pleasant or non-pleasant exchanges. I haven't read all of the replies, but I am going to assume they are along the lines of that right now the smoker has the right, and so whether you call 'em George Carlin's 7 dirty words, have a pleasant exchange, or reach across the balcony and do the secret handshake it doesn't make any difference in the fact that the smoker doesn't need to cease what they are doing.

 

Can you refrain from smoking while I am out here? It sounds reasonable on the cover of it. But currently a balcony is a smoking zone. Is it reasonable to walk into a smoking zone and ask someone not to smoke? But enough people have had enough of being subjected to it and are looking for a sea change.

 

Being polite is always the optimal way to deal with something, when practical and possible. But it doesn't mean it will change an action.

[Aquahound]

How do you know that the passenger next to you has not curbed their smoking? How do you know that the passenger next to you may already be accommodating the passenger on their other side or above or below them? Unfortunately, some people just can't see beyond the fact that they are not the only passenger on a ship and they may not be the only passenger making demands on other passengers.

 

I don't, but thanks for proving my point. The days of simply being able to talk to other people are long gone. Even right here, I try to tell a story of politely talking to a neighbor, yet you translate it as a "demand." This also proves another point.....polite people like KevInPitt are a very rare breed nowadays. :(

 

Being polite is always the optimal way to deal with something, when practical and possible. But it doesn't mean it will change an action.

 

You are absolutely correct, and in my story I made it clear my attempt at talking to my neighbor was met by a foul mouthed wife...which was the crux of the point I was making. If it was simply a case of making a request that was not honored, I wouldn't have even told the story. I probably wouldn't even remember something like that.

Edited February 19, 2015 by Aquahound

[taxwiz]

Okay, as a non smoking cruiser who enjoys balconies/verandas, I am wondering about the relative value of those cabins on HAL ships. So this question is mainly for HAL non smokers. Would you be willing to pay HAL to upgrade from an oceanview to a veranda, and if so how much?

[hrhdhd]

So let me see if I got this right. I just read a pleasant exchange between a smoker and a non smoker, yet still some people can't help but jump in and ruin it with their attitudes of - it's permitted so no one can say anything? Sad. very, very sad.

 

I didn't say that no one can say anything; of course, people are free to make any request they desire. It's just interesting that the smoker is always expected to be the "considerate" one, even though he or she is not doing anything he or she isn't allowed to do.

 

Oh, and "jumping in" is kind of what a message board is about. ;) It'd be pretty boring around here if no one jumped in with another perspective.

[Blue Mudshark]

It seems very bizarre to me; the notion that one cannot possibly be considered rude or inconsiderate, as long as one is following the "letter of the law" (ship's rules). One poster recounted being cursed at by another passenger. If there is no rule against cursing at fellow passengers, does that mean it's not rude?

[Aquahound]

It's just interesting that the smoker is always expected to be the "considerate" one, even though he or she is not doing anything he or she isn't allowed to do.

 

Negative. That's just one example because it happends to be the topic of this thread. Everyone is expected to be the considerate ones when it comes to allowable activities. That's the point here. Whether it's smoking, playing music, partying, balcony lights, or any other allowable but potentially annoying activity, the responsibility to be considerate of neighbors falls on all of us.

[SJSULIBRARIAN]

Okay, as a non smoking cruiser who enjoys balconies/verandas, I am wondering about the relative value of those cabins on HAL ships. So this question is mainly for HAL non smokers. Would you be willing to pay HAL to upgrade from an oceanview to a veranda, and if so how much?

 

You have a 50/50 chance of getting a smoker next to you. If it is worth it to you I would take the chance. If not, keep the ocean view. I like a veranda to go out in the early AM to check the weather, to watch sail away, or to enjoy room service. I don't go out just to sit because generally we are either doing a shipboard activity or touring a port. I know others like to spend lots of time out on their veranda. I think you have to think how you would use it. JMO

[CRUZBUDS]

I just watched an episode of "All in the Family" from 1975. Archie came home all upset because a woman asked him to put out his cigar in an elevator, the stench offended her.

 

The debate then covered then current issues like smoking in theaters, restaurants and elevators.

 

Archie figured out who was responsible for causing all of the trouble for the smokers -- it was "big business".

 

Meathead: "What big business?"

 

Archie: "the companies that make the No Smoking signs" :D

 

We've come a long way baby - someday we'll shake our heads in disbelief that balcony smoking was ever allowed.

[taxwiz]

Thanks. I'm considering the balcony on HAL but only if it is a good price and a forward cabin to try to minimize the smoke

[sammiedawg]

Thanks. I'm considering the balcony on HAL but only if it is a good price and a forward cabin to try to minimize the smoke

 

The wind blows in more than one direction. Don't count on a certain location to minimize the problem. We have booked OV on HAL since our experience with an unusable balcony for the entire cruise. I book balconies on the other cruise lines I sail. I say vote with your feet, book another cruise line.

Edited February 19, 2015 by sammiedawg

[sail7seas]

You have a 50/50 chance of getting a smoker next to you. If it is worth it to you I would take the chance. If not, keep the ocean view. I like a veranda to go out in the early AM to check the weather, to watch sail away, or to enjoy room service. I don't go out just to sit because generally we are either doing a shipboard activity or touring a port. I know others like to spend lots of time out on their veranda. I think you have to think how you would use it. JMO

 

I think the odds of having a neighbor smoking on their verandah is higher than 50/50. If 75% of those in verandahs these days are smokers, the odds of having a smoking neighbor goes up!

 

I am among those who think some of the new HAL verandah cruisers have moved over from other cruise lines in order to be able to smoke. How many have come to HAL vs. how many verandah 'smoke avoiders' have left HAL?

[KevInPitt]

I didn't say that no one can say anything; of course, people are free to make any request they desire. It's just interesting that the smoker is always expected to be the "considerate" one, even though he or she is not doing anything he or she isn't allowed to do.

 

Oh, and "jumping in" is kind of what a message board is about. ;) It'd be pretty boring around here if no one jumped in with another perspective.

 

In hopes it doesn't make me sound like I'm the opposite of a nice person, I certainly didn't mean to infer that my consideration of others was completely one-sided. In a polite exchange, as was graciously acknowledged by Sail7Seas, Auqahound and others, you find a pleasant way to "co-habitate" so everyone can enjoy equally.

 

As for doing things that are and aren't allowed, I'll share this experience from my last cruise: The neighbors next to me would have loud long-winded "discussions" on their balcony for what seemed like all day every day (as the rare non-smoker will often characterize their smoking neighbor). Since I enjoy lounging on my balcony with a good book or even take a short nap, would it have been presumptuous and rude of me to ask if they could kindly keep their curse-filled arguments to a lower volume?

 

Under the theory that there's no rule against loud talking on the balcony, I guess it would have been.

 

On the other side of my loud-mouthed neighbors was a family with children - very well behaved children. I was also concerned with those little ones hearing all the vulgarity and "driven off their balcony by the cursers". But then again, there's no rule against "talking" on the balcony so I guess saying something about allowable but obtrusive behavior should be avoided.

 

To me, this kind of puts my whole perspective in a different light doesn't it? Be nice and hopefully others will be too (at least I hope so).

Edited February 19, 2015 by KevInPitt

[Silver sailor]

I think the odds of having a neighbor smoking on their verandah is higher than 50/50. If 75% of those in verandahs these days are smokers, the odds of having a smoking neighbor goes up!

 

I am among those who think some of the new HAL verandah cruisers have moved over from other cruise lines in order to be able to smoke. How many have come to HAL vs. how many verandah 'smoke avoiders' have left HAL?

 

Do you have any reliable statistics indicating that 3 out of 4 veranda passengers will be smokers?

I find the 50/50 split a little bit of over kill

PS I am a nonsmoker quit 18 years ago