SINGLE HSC/TIPPING THREAD (Previously "Why are gratuities not included in Fares?")

[OlsSalt]

That is the menu that we dislike. Have been on 2 cruises with that menu and no way will I front up for it again.

 

There used to be a strange "international" menu a few years ago for the final dinner which was pretty unappealing. But this has now changed. What were the dates of your last two cruises? Certainly over the past 10 years the final night format has changed dramatically - remember the juggling salad bowls and the waiter napkin parades?

 

Then came that weird international menu with four blocks of choices, and now it is something else again. But very benign, no real hoopla. A work in progress. We tried to avoid them too, but now it is no longer and issue. Just a nice way to end what has always been a very nice time in the MDR for us.

[Roz]

I liked the International menu. I'd order the mezza plate as an appetizer, and the Lebanese lamb shank as my entrée.

 

Roz

[POA1]

Here's the Culinary Council menu from the last night of the cruise. (It's basically been this way since late 2014.) I have no idea why people are so put off by prime rib, pasta, trout, jumbo shrimp, and chicken. Maybe it's the scary lamb shank or the curry? Fear of Forbidden Rice?

 

I will admit however, that we ate in the Pinnacle the last night, and tipped out our MDR waiters on the second to last night.

 

An Evening with the Culinary Council

 

STARTERS - SOUPS - SALADS

 

• Tropical Fruit Medley: kiwi, mango, lychees, papaya, Malibu dressing, coconut
  
• Salmon Tartare with Baby Zucchini: cherry tomatoes, watercress, mini cornichons, bacon-curry yogurt sauce
  
• Eggplant and Lamb Jerky: burnt orange powder
  
• Wild Mushroom Soup: chive oil drizzle, creme fraiche
  
• Potato Soup with Kale: turkey sausage, cabbage, white wine
  
• Chilled Peach Soup with Goat Cheese: cucumber, bell pepper, dried-apricot, honey
  
• Coconut, Carrot and Radish Salad: creamy black sesame vinaigrette
  

 

MAIN COURSES

 

 

• Pappardelle and Veal Ragout: ricotta, basil
  
• Black Sesame Jumbo Shrimp Baharat Salad: poached egg, cherry tomatoes, red radish, brioche croutons, cheese foam, citrus-ponzu dressing
  
• Pan-Seared Rainbow Trout: spaghetti, sauteed zucchini
  
• Herb-Crusted Prime Rib: garlic mashed potatoes, roasted root vegetables, horseradish-cream, jus
  
• Lamb Shank: cauliflower-rosemary puree, crispy parsnip
  
• Corn-Fed Chicken Breast with Mushroom Jus: mushroom salad
  
• Vegetable Curry with Forbidden Rice: cauliflower florets, green peas, root vegetables, pearl onions, coconut cream, curry spice, lime, cilantro
  

 

DESSERT

 

 

• Baked Alaska: warm brandy Bing cherry sauce
  
• Poached Pear with Chocolate Fondue: caramelized nuts, white chocolate sauce
  
• Esterel Cake: almond sponge, chocolate ganache, raspberry preserves, white chocolate
  
• Strawberry Charlotte: strawberry mousseline, vanilla sponge, strawberry jam
  

[KroozNut]

POA1, that menu looks awesome. Thanks for sharing!:)

[kazu]

Here's the Culinary Council menu from the last night of the cruise. (It's basically been this way since late 2014.) I have no idea why people are so put off by prime rib, pasta, trout, jumbo shrimp, and chicken. Maybe it's the scary lamb shank or the curry? Fear of Forbidden Rice?

 

 

 

I will admit however, that we ate in the Pinnacle the last night, and tipped out our MDR waiters on the second to last night.

 

 

 

An Evening with the Culinary Council

 

 

 

STARTERS - SOUPS - SALADS

 

 

 

 

• Tropical Fruit Medley: kiwi, mango, lychees, papaya, Malibu dressing, coconut
  
• Salmon Tartare with Baby Zucchini: cherry tomatoes, watercress, mini cornichons, bacon-curry yogurt sauce
  
• Eggplant and Lamb Jerky: burnt orange powder
  
• Wild Mushroom Soup: chive oil drizzle, creme fraiche
  
• Potato Soup with Kale: turkey sausage, cabbage, white wine
  
• Chilled Peach Soup with Goat Cheese: cucumber, bell pepper, dried-apricot, honey
  
• Coconut, Carrot and Radish Salad: creamy black sesame vinaigrette
  

 

 

MAIN COURSES

 

 

 

 

• Pappardelle and Veal Ragout: ricotta, basil
  
• Black Sesame Jumbo Shrimp Baharat Salad: poached egg, cherry tomatoes, red radish, brioche croutons, cheese foam, citrus-ponzu dressing
  
• Pan-Seared Rainbow Trout: spaghetti, sauteed zucchini
  
• Herb-Crusted Prime Rib: garlic mashed potatoes, roasted root vegetables, horseradish-cream, jus
  
• Lamb Shank: cauliflower-rosemary puree, crispy parsnip
  
• Corn-Fed Chicken Breast with Mushroom Jus: mushroom salad
  
• Vegetable Curry with Forbidden Rice: cauliflower florets, green peas, root vegetables, pearl onions, coconut cream, curry spice, lime, cilantro
  

 

 

DESSERT

 

 

 

 

• Baked Alaska: warm brandy Bing cherry sauce
  
• Poached Pear with Chocolate Fondue: caramelized nuts, white chocolate sauce
  
• Esterel Cake: almond sponge, chocolate ganache, raspberry preserves, white chocolate
  
• Strawberry Charlotte: strawberry mousseline, vanilla sponge, strawberry jam
  

 

 

 

This is the menu we had on our last night on the Rotterdam in April, 2016

Some things are similar but there were some differences...

 

 

 

We had already booked the Pinnacle Grill too ;). We wanted to dine with friends on the last night ;). And yes, we tipped our MDR waiters and wine steward the second last night since we would not be there on the last night ;)

 

 

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

[Stratheden]

I had to google that^^ lol

Aussie Slang. :')

[Stratheden]

Here's the Culinary Council menu from the last night of the cruise. (It's basically been this way since late 2014.) I have no idea why people are so put off by prime rib, pasta, trout, jumbo shrimp, and chicken. Maybe it's the scary lamb shank or the curry? Fear of Forbidden Rice?

 

I will admit however, that we ate in the Pinnacle the last night, and tipped out our MDR waiters on the second to last night.

 

An Evening with the Culinary Council

 

STARTERS - SOUPS - SALADS

 

• Tropical Fruit Medley: kiwi, mango, lychees, papaya, Malibu dressing, coconut
  
• Salmon Tartare with Baby Zucchini: cherry tomatoes, watercress, mini cornichons, bacon-curry yogurt sauce
  
• Eggplant and Lamb Jerky: burnt orange powder
  
• Wild Mushroom Soup: chive oil drizzle, creme fraiche
  
• Potato Soup with Kale: turkey sausage, cabbage, white wine
  
• Chilled Peach Soup with Goat Cheese: cucumber, bell pepper, dried-apricot, honey
  
• Coconut, Carrot and Radish Salad: creamy black sesame vinaigrette
  

MAIN COURSES

 

• Pappardelle and Veal Ragout: ricotta, basil
  
• Black Sesame Jumbo Shrimp Baharat Salad: poached egg, cherry tomatoes, red radish, brioche croutons, cheese foam, citrus-ponzu dressing
  
• Pan-Seared Rainbow Trout: spaghetti, sauteed zucchini
  
• Herb-Crusted Prime Rib: garlic mashed potatoes, roasted root vegetables, horseradish-cream, jus
  
• Lamb Shank: cauliflower-rosemary puree, crispy parsnip
  
• Corn-Fed Chicken Breast with Mushroom Jus: mushroom salad
  
• Vegetable Curry with Forbidden Rice: cauliflower florets, green peas, root vegetables, pearl onions, coconut cream, curry spice, lime, cilantro
  

DESSERT

 

• Baked Alaska: warm brandy Bing cherry sauce
  
• Poached Pear with Chocolate Fondue: caramelized nuts, white chocolate sauce
  
• Esterel Cake: almond sponge, chocolate ganache, raspberry preserves, white chocolate
  
• Strawberry Charlotte: strawberry mousseline, vanilla sponge, strawberry jam
  

 

On our last couple of cruises we have had this menu at least once and on one cruise we had it twice. It is certainly nothing wonderful. I cannot understand why menus are not revised annually. Unfortunately, I think sometimes the wait staff suffer (financially) because of the poor menu offerings by HAL.

[Boytjie]

There used to be a strange "international" menu a few years ago for the final dinner which was pretty unappealing.

 

I loved that menu! The only problem I had with it was that were too many dishes that I wanted to eat and it was hard to choose.

 

 

Food can be like that: one man's trash is another man's treasure. :)

[Stratheden]

I loved that menu! The only problem I had with it was that were too many dishes that I wanted to eat and it was hard to choose.

 

 

Food can be like that: one man's trash is another man's treasure. :)

I agree. The international menu was much better than the Culinary Council Menu.

[OlsSalt]

I agree. The international menu was much better than the Culinary Council Menu.

 

No fan of either versions - and quite honestly both options for the last nigh feel like to me ..... let's get rid of the left-overs.. Which is too bad, because for the most part we find the HAL MDR dinner options, even for long cruises, to be varied and appealing.

 

However, being reminded of this latest last night menu again leaves me with ... meh. C'mon HAL send us out begging for more.

[POA1]

No fan of either versions - and quite honestly both options for the last nigh feel like to me ..... let's get rid of the left-overs..

 

I could see the leftover angle for the veal ragout, but what do you start with to get leftover prime rib, shrimp, trout, or chicken? Roast half a cow? Giant aquarium stew?

[KroozNut]

I, for one, don't want to see my fare increase by $25 pp/pd ($50 total with single supplement) in order to pre-pay the $13.50 per day (total) in HSC. That's no value to me.

 

Where do you come up with the $25 pp/pd number? :confused:

[OlsSalt]

I could see the leftover angle for the veal ragout, but what do you start with to get leftover prime rib, shrimp, trout, or chicken? Roast half a cow? Giant aquarium stew?

 

The sides, not the entree's. But I like the way your mind words.

[RuthC]

Where do you come up with the $25 pp/pd number? :confused:

It's an estimate of what HAL would have to charge in order for the recipients of the HSC to clear what they make under the current method.

When you consider the additional taxes, the $25 number is in the neighborhood.

 

However, even if HAL were to add the $13.50 pp/pd, with the recipients now getting less, singles would have to pay $27 pp/pd.

[KroozNut]

However, even if HAL were to add the $13.50 pp/pd, with the recipients now getting less, singles would have to pay $27 pp/pd.

 

Yes, and I think the argument is that a lot of folks would be fine with HAL doing just that. Include the current $13.50 pp/pd - $27 pp/pd into the cruise fare upfront, thus eliminating the separate auto-gratuity onboard, and all the (potential) drama or associated consternation that can go along with that whole process.

[RuthC]

Yes, and I think the argument is that a lot of folks would be fine with HAL doing just that. Include the current $13.50 pp/pd - $27 pp/pd into the cruise fare upfront, thus eliminating the separate auto-gratuity onboard, and all the (potential) drama or associated consternation that can go along with that whole process.

If so, then they are missing the point that their fare would not be increased by $13.50 pp/pd; it would necessarily have to be increased by more than that if the recipients were to clear the $13.50 they receive now.

While solos pay double + compared to what they are paying now.

 

Otherwise the recipients would suffer a reduction in their amount received, as some of their $13.50 pp/pd would be going to various taxes.

[cruisemom42]

It's an estimate of what HAL would have to charge in order for the recipients of the HSC to clear what they make under the current method.

When you consider the additional taxes, the $25 number is in the neighborhood.

 

However, even if HAL were to add the $13.50 pp/pd, with the recipients now getting less, singles would have to pay $27 pp/pd.

 

 

I understand the math you're applying (although the exact amounts are somewhat a matter of conjecture since none of us know exactly how much in taxes this would add to the overhead).

 

However, I'd like to pose it a different way: 1) Ships have long gotten away with this method of customers subsidizing the pay of workers to keep their costs down. 2) Carnival cruise lines made a "record profit" in 2016 of $2.8 billion.

 

Perhaps it's time Carnival made up some of the shortfall in worker pay out of their own pockets.

 

I have never had an issue with the idea that some tip/service charge/ etc. is worth paying for the wonderful service received on most cruises. I abide by whatever system is in place. But if it were up to me, I'd prefer the system used on many non US-based ships where there is no quasi-mandatory "service charge", and staff/crew do not depend on it to make a reasonable income. Any tips are truly that -- tips for service over and beyond.

[KroozNut]

If so, then they are missing the point that their fare would not be increased by $13.50 pp/pd; it would necessarily have to be increased by more than that if the recipients were to clear the $13.50 they receive now.

While solos pay double + compared to what they are paying now.

 

Otherwise the recipients would suffer a reduction in their amount received, as some of their $13.50 pp/pd would be going to various taxes.

 

I think that the anti-autogratuity crowd (which does not include ourselves BTW) would be fine with that as well. For HAL to adjust the cruise fare (by whatever fair and reasonable amount) to compensate the crew appropriately, and eliminate the separate charging of onboard accounts for gratuities which as we all know is a very heated issue / debated procedure.

[kazu]

I think that the anti-autogratuity crowd (which does not include ourselves BTW) would be fine with that as well. For HAL to adjust the cruise fare (by whatever fair and reasonable amount) to compensate the crew appropriately, and eliminate the separate charging of onboard accounts for gratuities which as we all know is a very heated issue / debated procedure.

 

I highly doubt the anti-autogratuity crowd (which does include us either) would be happy if their cruise prices increased by more than the current cost of the HSC.

 

They want the hsc included in fare without any further fare increases over and above the HSC from what I have understood despite the consequences to the crew.

[OlsSalt]

I believe the "record profits" in the cruise industry this last few years came mainly from significantly reduced fuel costs. Let's hope/assume these "profits" do get plowed back into capital improvements for everyone's enjoyment and not just higher CEO perks and compensation or shareholder dividends. 'Profit" is not always a dirty word. But of late it appears to have become so.

[cruisemom42]

I believe the "record profits" in the cruise industry this last few years came mainly from significantly reduced fuel costs.

 

Not according to their own statement: "Carnival Corp. & PLC posted record earnings in fiscal 2016, helped in part by higher ticket prices and increased onboard spending and cost reductions, the Doral-based cruise company said Tuesday."

 

http://www.sun-sentinel.com/business/tourism/fl-carnival-corp-4q16-results-20161220-story.html

 

As someone who in the past has crafted these statements for a living, the fact that cost reductions are listed third and no specific mention is made of oil prices, suggests the first two categories were larger contributors.

 

Interestingly, they also report that cumulative advance bookings for the first three fiscal quarters of 2017 are "well ahead" of 2016 at "considerably higher prices." I imagine bargain cruise prices are going to be less easy to find this year...

[OlsSalt]

Barrons - Jan 2016:

 

"The cruise industry looks shipshape for 2016. Demand is broadly rising, and although new ships are coming online, many are being diverted to the fast-growing China market. That looks likely to keep pricing firm.

A plunge in crude-oil prices will help costs. And individual cruise companies are finding new ways to boost profitability, from adding super-premium rooms to consolidating back-office work among their brands."

 

Motley Fool: Feb 2017

 

"However, one of the biggest financial risks to Carnival, as well as its competitors -- such as Royal Caribbean(NYSE:RCL) and Norwegian Cruise Lines(NASDAQ:NCLH) -- is rising fuel prices.

The industry has benefited from low fuel prices for the past couple of years, which has helped increase margins, as fuel cost is a major expense for operating cruises. These companies use fuel derivative programs to mitigate some of that risk, but that doesn't mean they're free from paying higher prices if fuel prices do rise in the year or years ahead.

These cruise lines are investing in alternative-fuel vessels -- Carnival is in the process of building three ships now that run on liquefied natural gas -- but it will be a long time before this technology is powering a sizable part of any company's fleet. "

[cruisemom42]

Barrons - Jan 2016:

 

"The cruise industry looks shipshape for 2016. Demand is broadly rising, and although new ships are coming online, many are being diverted to the fast-growing China market. That looks likely to keep pricing firm.

A plunge in crude-oil prices will help costs. And individual cruise companies are finding new ways to boost profitability, from adding super-premium rooms to consolidating back-office work among their brands."

 

Motley Fool: Feb 2017

 

"However, one of the biggest financial risks to Carnival, as well as its competitors -- such as Royal Caribbean(NYSE:RCL) and Norwegian Cruise Lines(NASDAQ:NCLH) -- is rising fuel prices.

The industry has benefited from low fuel prices for the past couple of years, which has helped increase margins, as fuel cost is a major expense for operating cruises. These companies use fuel derivative programs to mitigate some of that risk, but that doesn't mean they're free from paying higher prices if fuel prices do rise in the year or years ahead.

These cruise lines are investing in alternative-fuel vessels -- Carnival is in the process of building three ships now that run on liquefied natural gas -- but it will be a long time before this technology is powering a sizable part of any company's fleet. "

 

Your first quote is from the beginning of 2016, not the end. And both are simply predictions or analysts' opinions a priori, not a statement from the cruise line itself based on actual analysis of the year's performance.

[OlsSalt]

Your first quote is from the beginning of 2016, not the end. And both are simply predictions or analysts' opinions a priori, not a statement from the cruise line itself based on actual analysis of the year's performance.

 

Just broadening the topic.

[VennDiagram]

Just broadening the topic.

 

The topic is SINGLE HSC/TIPPING THREAD ....