Buying fine art on Princess?

[keithm]

We have purchased from Park West Gallery on several occasions. After our second purchase at-sea we were invited to an all expense paid VIP auction on land that included three nights in the Four Seasons hotel, daily auctions with a featured artist (Duaiv, Tim Yanke and Michael Godard). We got pictures with Duaiv and Godard, it was awesome! Everything we bought at that event included free shipping, framing, and appraisal. We have taken a few cruises since that VIP event but it just doesn't make sense to buy on a ship anymore.

 

My advice would be to read the terms of purchase and don't buy for a return on your investment, know that it can take 12 weeks for your art to arrive. Even if you don't buy anything, attend an auction and you will learn a lot!

What was it that PT Barnum used to say? Oh yeah...Personally, I'd donate to a charity, rather than being taken as a fool, then again it's only money, isn't it? They only wine & dine you, because you continue waste your money on them..

Edited April 30, 2017 by keithm
grammar

[GUT2407]

Has anyone who is posting to "avoid" and "fraud" actually purchased any art on board or are you just trolling?

I have.

[Shoalwater]

I never have been to the art auctions, so I cannot speak to the value of what is offered, but I do have a question......In 60 cruises we have seen the same exact pictures(excuse me....fine art) on all of them. How can anything that is obviously so common be of any value?...There are so many copies of each piece that one wonders. On the other hand, I believe an object is worth what someone is willing to pay for it. I might suggest that one first check what is for sale on Ebay first.

 

Doug

HI Doug, best to you and Annie. We have pieces from years ago when Princess ran their own department, and some appraised for essentially purchase price, while others at 20% of purchase! Caveat emptor! As for now on Princess, one clue as to what you are seeing is to look and determine if the piece is under glass or not. Originals are not, prints are protected so they don't get torn. Most of the Peter Max stuff is glassed, and priced as an acrylic original. PW "auctioneers" seem mostly to carefully not identify a piece up on the easel for sale as being either an original or print, talking instead about what the artist's originals (oil or acrylic) works are selling for. They lead you to where you make the assumption that what is being shown is an original when in fact its most likely a print. Anne and I assiduously avoid taking part. We are starting to move over to Viking Ocean ships, no art department or photo gallery. Oh, we do need to do lunch one of these times.

[keithm]

Has anyone who is posting to "avoid" and "fraud" actually purchased any art on board or are you just trolling?

Not trolling, just trying to advise pax not to be taken in by the tactics of these on board thieves. If you're foolish enough to ignore people who DO have some knowledge in this area & are really just trying to protect you, then by all means please prove PT Barnum's phrase!

[dverzic]

As a side note, Thomas Kincade donated a large sum of money to one of our Catholic high schools in Cupertino, Ca. (SF Bay Area.) it enabled them to build a really nice performing arts building. [emoji846]

 

 

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[donaldsc]

As a side note, Thomas Kincade donated a large sum of money to one of our Catholic high schools in Cupertino, Ca. (SF Bay Area.) it enabled them to build a really nice performing arts building. [emoji846]

 

 

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Maybe it was conscience money to make up for the quality (?) of his art work.

 

DON

[DedeF]

Or maybe he was just being a decent guy.

[KruzeKrazy!]

Wonder if the building is a reproduction with a few brush strokes on the exterior...

[Cuizer2]

I'll take real world purchasers word over someone who says "Well, my sisters best friend read on the internet that..." any day of the week.

 

Then take a look at the lawsuits. Those are real world people that were VERY unhappy with their purchase.

[Steelers0854]

People love to post warnings about Park West on Princess because of what someone else has previously posted. Im not sure how many of them have actually made a purchase themselves.

 

Many of the complaints are regarding the fast paced nature of the auction, and people not getting what they thought they were purchasing, thus most are are quick to blame Park West.

 

We have bought several paintings on different cruises over the years. Never once did I feel Park West misrepresented what they were selling. All of our items arrived quick, exactly as described and with all the paperwork they stated they would provide. That being said I think the most expensive piece we have ever purchased was maybe $400-$500 if memory serves correct. All of our purchases have been of pairings we liked at a price we felt was reasonable. I can't speak to purchases as investments or originals etc as that is just not our target purchase.

 

Many unhappy people like to quickly voice their opinions on websites and you often hear multiple bad news stories when there are more satisfied customers out there that just don't post about their experience.

 

I'm not saying that the people that have complained are wrong, I'm not saying there aren't dishonest people that may work for Park West onboard ships. All I'm saying is take it with a grain of salt. Do your research on a piece if it is going to be an investment for you and buy something that you like at a comfortable price for you. Don't feel pressured into making a purchase at the first auction, there will be several and if you are interested in a piece talk to the art folks away from the auction, they will take a great deal of time to answer all your questions and will bring the piece out at a subsequent auction for you to buy.

 

YMMV, but this is my first hand experience and not me reiterating other reviews I have read elsewhere.

[dverzic]

Then take a look at the lawsuits. Those are real world people that were VERY unhappy with their purchase.

 

 

Yes! Both Bloomberg and The NY Times have articles about lawsuits against Park West and how they misrepresent the artwork and their appraisals. This is not opinion, this is a fact!

 

 

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[keithm]

As a side note, Thomas Kincade donated a large sum of money to one of our Catholic high schools in Cupertino, Ca. (SF Bay Area.) it enabled them to build a really nice performing arts building. [emoji846]

 

 

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Not sure that got him into heaven!

[keithm]

People love to post warnings about Park West on Princess because of what someone else has previously posted. Im not sure how many of them have actually made a purchase themselves.

 

Many of the complaints are regarding the fast paced nature of the auction, and people not getting what they thought they were purchasing, thus most are are quick to blame Park West.

 

We have bought several paintings on different cruises over the years. Never once did I feel Park West misrepresented what they were selling. All of our items arrived quick, exactly as described and with all the paperwork they stated they would provide. That being said I think the most expensive piece we have ever purchased was maybe $400-$500 if memory serves correct. All of our purchases have been of pairings we liked at a price we felt was reasonable. I can't speak to purchases as investments or originals etc as that is just not our target purchase.

 

Many unhappy people like to quickly voice their opinions on websites and you often hear multiple bad news stories when there are more satisfied customers out there that just don't post about their experience.

 

I'm not saying that the people that have complained are wrong, I'm not saying there aren't dishonest people that may work for Park West onboard ships. All I'm saying is take it with a grain of salt. Do your research on a piece if it is going to be an investment for you and buy something that you like at a comfortable price for you. Don't feel pressured into making a purchase at the first auction, there will be several and if you are interested in a piece talk to the art folks away from the auction, they will take a great deal of time to answer all your questions and will bring the piece out at a subsequent auction for you to buy.

 

YMMV, but this is my first hand experience and not me reiterating other reviews I have read elsewhere.

Why don't you get a "true" appraisal(from a REPUTABLE dealer) of your purchased "art" work & report back to us. I doubt we'll hear from you again.

[Steelers0854]

Why don't you get a "true" appraisal(from a REPUTABLE dealer) of your purchased "art" work & report back to us. I doubt we'll hear from you again.

 

 

 

I didn't post here to get into an argument over appraised values etc. art is subjective, one appraiser will value it at one price, another something different. There is no active market place to obtain a reliable valuation like there is for gemstones, currency etc.

 

I made my post to bring a different view point to everyone else that is quick accuse Park West of deceptive practices, I am happy with my purchases and I never felt deceived at any point in the process. Also, the frames on pieces of art we purchased would have cost more on land at home than I paid for the entire piece, this bit of research I did do.

 

As I said in my prior post, there very well could be individuals that work for Park West that are dishonest, just like any company any where, and those people should be held accountable. But if there were widespread fraud by the company they wouldn't be in business and certainly Princess wouldn't still contract with them.

[cr8tiv1]

I didn't post here to get into an argument over appraised values etc. art is subjective, one appraiser will value it at one price, another something different. There is no active market place to obtain a reliable valuation like there is for gemstones, currency etc.

 

I made my post to bring a different view point to everyone else that is quick accuse Park West of deceptive practices, I am happy with my purchases and I never felt deceived at any point in the process. Also, the frames on pieces of art we purchased would have cost more on land at home than I paid for the entire piece, this bit of research I did do.

 

As I said in my prior post, there very well could be individuals that work for Park West that are dishonest, just like any company any where, and those people should be held accountable. But if there were widespread fraud by the company they wouldn't be in business and certainly Princess wouldn't still contract with them.

 

Not disputing your comment. Just wondering if you made your purchase through Park West or the previous company, Princess Fine Arts? The later was terrific. I was really sad when they were outsourced to Park West. And you are very correct. Art is very subjective and a personal preference.

[Steelers0854]

Not disputing your comment. Just wondering if you made your purchase through Park West or the previous company, Princess Fine Arts? The later was terrific. I was really sad when they were outsourced to Park West. And you are very correct. Art is very subjective and a personal preference.

 

 

 

Both, I our first 2 were with Princess Fine Arts, last 2 with Park West.

 

One thing I will say is that recently we have seen a change on 2 ships we have been on with more tactics gained to drive sales that we aren't real excited about. Now you have to "register" for a bid card in order to bid on a piece. This is cheesy to me and just a way to track who is going to market more to them. The second, which may have been isolated to our art rep on that cruise, was he was real high speed all the time and up on his pedestal when talking with guests. I got the impression if you weren't spending thousands of dollars you weren't worth his time and that was the first time in 10 years on Princess that I had felt that way. But we just chose not to buy anything from him and moved along to another activity.

[KiwiFunCruiser]

I didn't post here to get into an argument over appraised values etc. art is subjective, one appraiser will value it at one price, another something different. There is no active market place to obtain a reliable valuation like there is for gemstones, currency etc.

 

I made my post to bring a different view point to everyone else that is quick accuse Park West of deceptive practices, I am happy with my purchases and I never felt deceived at any point in the process. Also, the frames on pieces of art we purchased would have cost more on land at home than I paid for the entire piece, this bit of research I did do.

 

As I said in my prior post, there very well could be individuals that work for Park West that are dishonest, just like any company any where, and those people should be held accountable. But if there were widespread fraud by the company they wouldn't be in business and certainly Princess wouldn't still contract with them.

 

All the more reason to stay well clear of the whole thing.

[Charles4515]

All the more reason to stay well clear of the whole thing.

 

 

 

There are always going to be a few who defend Park West. Some can't imagine that they could possibly be hoodwinked. Others have Stockholm syndrome. On my Princess cruise that had Godard "perform" his "art" there were passengers who booked the cruise for the art demonstrations who had been put on a mailing list based on previous large purchases. I talked to one young couple extensively. They were very naive and had very little art knowledge. Their knowledge was what the auctioneers told them. They also thought that attending and buying at the auction, they had spent thousands on a previous cruise at the art auction, made them sophisticated and knowledgeable about art. They were conned.

[easyboy]

As a side note, Thomas Kincade donated a large sum of money to one of our Catholic high schools in Cupertino, Ca. (SF Bay Area.) it enabled them to build a really nice performing arts building. [emoji846]

Hope the others follow suit.

[Hazegreyunderway]

Princess and fine art now that's a hoot!

We took a Hawaii cruise on the Grand 2x about 2 years apart.

 

On the second cruise we noticed the same paintings hanging in the gallery.

 

Our favorites were:

The sword fighting octopus missing a tentacle

The olive with legs running away from a martini glass

 

And....the dogs crossing the "rainbow bridge" to heaven.

 

We never could find the dogs playing cards painting. Maybe someone already got that one at auction.

 

Btw, don't buy into the "tanzanite " thing either.

 

 

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[dverzic]

Princess and fine art now that's a hoot!

We took a Hawaii cruise on the Grand 2x about 2 years apart.

 

On the second cruise we noticed the same paintings hanging in the gallery.

 

Our favorites were:

The sword fighting octopus missing a tentacle

The olive with legs running away from a martini glass

 

And....the dogs crossing the "rainbow bridge" to heaven.

 

We never could find the dogs playing cards painting. Maybe someone already got that one at auction.

 

Btw, don't buy into the "tanzanite " thing either.

 

 

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[dverzic]

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I definitely need a sword fighting octopus. It'll look perfect next to my velvet Elvis! Lol

[emoji6]

 

 

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[Crzn-Life]

"fine art on Princess" is an oxymoron.

 

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[JimmyVWine]

I definitely need a sword fighting octopus. It'll look perfect next to my velvet Elvis! Lol

 

Hurry. The auction starts in an hour!!

 

[donaldsc]

I didn't post here to get into an argument over appraised values etc. art is subjective, one appraiser will value it at one price, another something different. There is no active market place to obtain a reliable valuation like there is for gemstones, currency etc.

 

I made my post to bring a different view point to everyone else that is quick accuse Park West of deceptive practices, I am happy with my purchases and I never felt deceived at any point in the process. Also, the frames on pieces of art we purchased would have cost more on land at home than I paid for the entire piece, this bit of research I did do.

 

As I said in my prior post, there very well could be individuals that work for Park West that are dishonest, just like any company any where, and those people should be held accountable. But if there were widespread fraud by the company they wouldn't be in business and certainly Princess wouldn't still contract with them.

 

You can buy art because you like it or because you regard it as an investment. You sound as if you are in group 1 and there is nothing wrong with that. Enjoy your purchases.

 

The problem w Park West is that they suggest an appraisal value for the art while not informing the buyer that the appraisal was done by Park West. That is wrong.

 

DON