"Almost" Live from Explorer

[chuckw]

Good luck getting to VYR, I live down by Gig Harbor and thanks to the county plow I can't get out of my driveway and I have a large 4WD.

[Zqueeze1]

Jackie: 

do me a favor and go to the airport the day prior rather than at three in the morning. I would hate to see something happen and missing your flight. 

In the interest of your sanity (and since I forgot to take my anti anxiety meds today) I racked my brains trying to think of things for you and Dennis to do during your 8.5 hours waiting for you flight. Well, I came up with nothing useful except for the following:

-Twerk at planes coming into the gate

-Bring a loud ticking clock and put it in someone’s bag

-Teach a bartender to make Mexican Butterflies then order a beer

-Bring some crayons and a Mother Goose coloring book

-Make pretend you’re shooting down airplanes as they take off

-Ask gate agents if you can get a downgrade

-Try to offset the 800 bucks you spent to change your flight by carrying folks’ luggage for tips

-Tell a TSA agent that the wires in your vest are making you itchy. 

-Start up a conversation with a stranger then tell them that Dennis is really Carlos the Jackal

-Get a couple of electric carts and play chicken with Dennis  

 

Have a great cruise. 

Z and TB

 

[cruiseluv]

Good luck Jackie! It does irritate me when airlines push these connections as "legal"! I never accept them as I'm a pessimist at heart and believe in "Murphy's Law"

[Bellaggio Cruisers]

TC - I feel your pain.

Many of you may remember my plight last August, flying  to Copenhagen for a Regent cruise. I had booked United EWR- YYZ - Air Canada - CPN. With mileage, business class. Departing at 2pm.  My first booking allowed the change of planes as 2 1/2 hours. Plenty of time even with going through customs. Several weeks before the flights, United changed the time to 1 1/2 hours. I became concerned because I read that on Sundays, YYZ has so many fights arriving and departing, that there can be a 2-3 hour delay in landing. I phoned United and asked to be switched to the earlier flight to YYZ, allowing us 5 hours to change planes. They refused even though there were seats available. I agreed to even fly in coach on the EWR-YYZ portion. Nothing I said helped. Maybe, I should have argued more. 

We arrived at EWR, with plenty of time to spare. Checked our luggage and waited. As I predicted, the flight to YYZ was delayed. After two hours we knew! We would miss our connection to Copenhagen. 

Needless to say, I was very upset. United offered us several routes, all unacceptable. Finally, I convinced them to put us on SAS. EWR-CPN at 11:30pm. Nice flight. However, when these type of circumstances occur, that’s when other issues happen. Our luggage went missing because of this change. The rest of the story is history. 

My advice, as an experienced traveler, go with your knowledge. 

Sheila and Herb

[boblerm]

Jackie, thinking of you and hoping that everything works out in the end.  Once you are on board your favorite ship, this will all be water under the bridge.

Bob

[ronrick1943]

4 hours ago, UUNetBill said:

I sure wish I had that luxury - I have limited vacation time each year, and although I'm in a job that can (mostly) be done remotely I still need to be in the office most times.  Kind of limits me on choosing itineraries; we even have to look at which day of the week our cruises start so we can maximize weekend time.  So although we usually try to fly in a day in advance, we just don't have the option of going in two days early most times.  There have been times I've flown back in and gotten home at 2:00 AM and been in the office by 7:00 AM the same day.  Not fun, but ya gotta do what ya gotta do.   

 

Bill you will have that luxury once you retire, however you'll have to accept that you'll start to fit into the Regent's demographic---which means you'll be a lot older.  Your choice! 

[Travelcat2]

Again, thank you for all the well wishes.  Somehow it helps to know that others have been through this and understand.  

 

Dennis shoveled snow on the driveway (despite my protests) - he is a bit old to be shoveling snow and I was worried that he would hurt his back or something.  We have a very small snow blower but it was too small for the amount of snow that we have.  

 

Z, you are hysterical.  Maybe you can go to Dallas and tell us jokes for 8 hours (I'll buy drinks).

 

Can't wait until this is water over the bridge.  If there was water here today, it would be frozen!

 

Not sure if this photo will show up but this is the view from our living room at the moment:

 

 

and..... these fluffy little balls on top of our probably dead plants would look pretty under different circumstances

 

Edited February 12, 2019 by Travelcat2

[gnomie1]

As someone with almost 1.4 million BIS (butt in seat) miles (not frequent flyer miles, but miles actually flown on commercial airlines), let me add the following so that others can learn and are not in TC predicament. There is nothing worse than being stressed out prior to the start of holiday.

 

Just because an airline sells a flight with a "legal" connection, does not mean one should book the flight - common sense needs to come into play.

 

Is the connection the last flight of the day?

What time of the day is the flight?

What time of the year are you flying?

Is the flight completely domestic or is there an international component?

How important is it that you must be at the final destination on a specific date?

 

One thing to remember, if you are leaving from a warmer weather climate, your plane may be coming from a location that is not and can be delayed, esp. like on a day as today when we are having a storm in the northeast and it has caused havoc at not only the airports here, but in other parts of the country.

 

I have had my share of OJ Simpson moments, running through airports to catch connections and at this stage of my life, I try to avoid that since I no longer run so well.

 

For an international flight, I would want a minimum of a 90 minute connection if leaving from the same terminal, but even that is cutting it fine, and would likely book a flight with at least a 2 hour connecting time.

 

Like others on this board, I am still working so taking time off for travel days cuts into actual vacation time, but not making the cruise would be even worse. If the cruise is embarking from a location where it is difficult to get to and the flights are not that frequent, I always allow two extra days and take the time to explore the area before embarking on the ship.

 

In general, esp at very busy airports, the earlier the flights leave, the better the chance of it leaving on time. As the day goes on, more of a chance for things to back up, esp with air traffic control. This is not just in the USA, but in many parts of the world. That is why taking the first flight of the day and staying at hotels near the airport is a great idea because the chance of missing the flight due to some type of road traffic incident is diminished.

 

TC mentioned something very interesting - apparently Regent did not purchase the tickets directly from AA, but rather utilized the services of a consolidator. Airlines use the services of consolidators to offload excess inventory. Each airline has revenue/seat management offices which carefully tract utilization and the airlines have a good idea how many seats on each flight will be sold. So as not to "cheapen" their product, excess inventory is sold to consolidators - cruise companies, including Regent, do the same thing. Consolidators are a great way to purchase  cheaper tickets, however, they come with limitations, in that they are coded in such a way that one is usually the "low man on a totem pole" with regard to re-accommodation in the event of a problem.  Even the tickets purchased by Regent come with limitations. On one of our cruises, we were at the Sydney airport waiting to fly home and due to mechanical difficulties, our flight to LAX was cancelled. We (and others) had booked our flight directly with the airline and were immediately placed on another flight in business class and were able to catch our connecting flight back to NYC, because I had allocated a layover long enough to allow for possible disruptions. The passengers who had booked their flights with Regent were not as fortunate and we heard afterwards that they had a nightmare getting home.

 

Flying first/business does not guarantee that one will get off a plane first - it depends on the aircraft and the door being used. Some airlines hold back coach passengers to allow premium class passengers to disembark first, others do not. I have been on flights with celebrities/VIP's and an airline representative is waiting for them at the door of the plane, they go down a side door and are whisked away in a car to catch their connecting flight - I believe that some airlines allow one to pay (a pretty penny) to also receive such service. United Airlines has a level of elite referred to "Global Services" (GS) which is by invitation only and is offered to their highest revenue passengers - they would probably also receive special service to catch a tight connection but for mere mortals, we are on our own.

 

Every year I fly from NYC to Washington State and the joke is that it is easier to fly to Singapore - it requires at least two flights and the connections are horrible - either a 35 minute connection or a six hour layover - I always opt for the layover and most of the time those in the group who tried to make the tight connection end up on my flight. If the sun, the moon and the stars line up properly, one can make the tight connection, more often than not, they do not. Yet, the airlines continue to offer and sell the flights because they are allowed to do so as a result of deregulation and no consequences to them for passengers who miss their connecting flights.

 

The next time you are on a flight and an announcement is made that there are passengers who need to make tight connections so please remain in your seat and allow these passengers to disembark first - remember people like TC who were in the same boat - it is quite annoying to know that people are trying to make connections and other passengers are not being cooperative.

 

No one likes waiting at airports, I can think of lots of things I would rather be doing, but sometimes it cannot be avoided. For a long layover, one might want to consider getting a day room at a local hotel. Also, most airlines (and American Express) have spent millions upgrading their clubs so they are more pleasant than ever.

 

Long story short - just because something is being offered, does not mean it is a good option. Think ahead and plan for all possibilities, esp this time of year, it can save hours of anxiety, frustration and worries.

 

Maybe "FlyerTalker" can weigh in and add anything that I forgot.

 

gnomie

Edited February 13, 2019 by gnomie1

[gnomie1]

2 hours ago, Travelcat2 said:

Again, thank you for all the well wishes.  Somehow it helps to know that others have been through this and understand.  

 

Dennis shoveled snow on the driveway (despite my protests) - he is a bit old to be shoveling snow and I was worried that he would hurt his back or something.  We have a very small snow blower but it was too small for the amount of snow that we have.   

 

Z, you are hysterical.  Maybe you can go to Dallas and tell us jokes for 8 hours (I'll buy drinks).

 

Can't wait until this is water over the bridge.  If there was water here today, it would be frozen!

 

Not sure if this photo will show up but this is the view from our living room at the moment:

 

 

and..... these fluffy little balls on top of our probably dead plants would look pretty under different circumstances

 

Jackie:

 

DO NOT ALLOW Dennis to shovel snow!! People do not realize how strenuous it is on the heart, esp if one has not done it a long time and is not use to that type of activity. Back in my medical days when I worked in the ER, I hated snow days because we knew that there would be at least one MI, usually more, from individuals shoveling snow, sometimes with as little as four inches. The combination of cold weather and unusually activity, even in older individuals "who work out" can cause problems. I remember the Chief of Emergency always telling us that no one over the age of 60 should shovel snow.

 

gnomie

 

Edited February 13, 2019 by gnomie1

[rallydave]

10 minutes ago, gnomie1 said:

As someone with almost 1.4 million BIS (butt in seat) miles (not frequent flyer miles, but miles actually flown on commercial airlines), let me add the following so that others can learn and are not in TC predicament. There is nothing worse than being stressed out prior to the start of holiday.

 

Just because an airline sells a flight with a "legal" connection, does not mean one should book the flight - common sense needs to come into play.

 

Is the connection the last flight of the day?

What time of the day is the flight?

What time of the year are you flying?

Is the flight completely domestic or is there an international component?

How important is it that you must be at the final destination on a specific date?

 

One thing to remember, if you are leaving from a warmer weather climate, your plane may be coming from a location that is not and can be delayed, esp. like on a day from today when we are having a storm in the northeast and it has caused havoc at not only the airports here, but in other parts of the country.

 

I have had my share of OJ Simpson moments, running through airports to catch connections and at this stage of my life, I try to avoid that since I no longer run so well.

 

For an international flight, I would want a minimum of a 90 minute connection if leaving from the same terminal, but even that is cutting it fine, and would likely book a flight with at least a 2 hour connecting time.

 

Like others on this board, I am still working so taking time off for travel days cuts into actual vacation time, but not making the cruise would be even worse. If the cruise is embarking from a location where it is difficult to get to and the flights are not that frequent, I always allow two extra days and take the time to explore the area before embarking on the ship.

 

In general, esp at very busy airports, the earlier the flights leave, the better the chance of it leaving on time. As the day goes on, more of a chance for things to back up, esp with air traffic control. This is not just in the USA, but in many parts of the world. That is why taking the first flight of the day and staying at hotels near the airport is a great idea because the chance of missing the flight due to some type of road traffic incident is diminished.

 

TC mentioned something very interesting - apparently Regent did not purchase the tickets directly from AA, but rather utilized the services of a consolidator. Airlines use the services of consolidators to offload excess inventory. Each airline has revenue/seat management offices which carefully tract utilization and the airlines have a good idea how many seats on each flight will be sold. So as not to "cheapen" their product, excess inventory is sold to consolidators - cruise companies, including Regent, do the same thing. Consolidators are a great way to purchase  cheaper tickets, however, they come with limitations, in that they are coded in such a way that one is usually the "low man on a totem pole" with regard to re-accommodation in the event of a problem.  Even the tickets purchased by Regent come with limitations. On one of our cruises, we were at the Sydney airport waiting to fly home and due to mechanical difficulties, our flight to LAX was cancelled. We (and others) had booked our flight directly with the airline and were immediately placed on another flight in business class and were able to catch our connecting flight back to NYC, because I had allocated a layover long enough to allow for possible disruptions. The passengers who had booked their flights with Regent were not as fortunate and we heard afterwards that they had a nightmare getting home.

 

Flying first/business does not guarantee that one will get off a plane first - it depends on the aircraft and the door being used. I have been on flights with celebrities/VIP's and an airline representative is waiting at the door of the plane, they go down a side door and are whisked away in a car to catch their connecting flight - I believe that some airlines allow one to pay (a pretty penny) to also receive such service. United Airlines has a level of elite referred to "Global Services" (GS) which is by invitation only and is offered to their highest revenue passengers - they would probably also receive special service to catch a tight connection but for mere mortals, we are on our own.

 

Every year I fly from NYC to Washington State and the joke is that it is easier to fly to Singapore - it requires at least two flights and the connections are horrible - either a 35 minute connection or a six hour layover - I always opt for the layover and most of the time those who tried to make the tight connection end up on my flight. If the sun, the moon and the stars line up properly, one can make the tight connection, more often than not, they do not. Yet, the airlines continue to offer and sell the flights because they are allowed to do so as a result of deregulation and no consequences to them for passengers who miss their connecting flights.

 

The next time you are on a flight and an announcement is made that there are passengers who need to make tight connections so please remain in your seat and allow these passengers to disembark first - remember people like TC who were in the same boat - it is quite annoying to know that people are trying to make connections and other passengers are not being cooperative.

 

No one likes waiting at airports, I can think of lots of things I would rather be doing, but sometimes it cannot be avoided. For a long layover, one might want to consider getting a day room at a local hotel. Also, most airlines (and American Express) have spent millions upgrading their clubs so they are more pleasant than ever.

 

Long story short - just because something is being offered, does not mean it is a good option. Think ahead and plan for all possibilities, esp this time of year, it can save hours of anxiety, frustration and worries.

 

Maybe "FlyerTalker" can weigh in and add anything that I forgot.

 

gnomie

Great post gnomie.  Couple of additions.  Legal connections are not set by the airlines but, by either the airports or the FAA and are the same for each airline at each airport.  Computers list the connections and are programmed based on the legal connection times and as you said, we all have to be educated flyers and if it looks to close, take a different connection.

 

And, American Express just recently changed their admission policy for their airport clubs and if the layover is over 3 hours, people will not be admitted prior to 3 hours before their next flight and not at all if at the final airport.  Also, clubs do have space limitations and you may not be admitted to a club you have access to until enough people have left the lounge so no guarantee at any lounge that you will get in in certain circumstances. 

[Focused1]

6 hours ago, captjohn said:

Jackie, I know this a bit off topic but could you comment on the Fairmont Hotel at YVR.We are planning a trip and the air puts us through YVR over night. Thanks  Also wishing you a great cruise 🚢 As I think you know we will be boarding the Explorer in LA.

 

John

I agree with others who have stayed at the Fairmont Vancouver. We stayed their several years ago before boarding. The club lounge is excellent and it has beautiful views of the ships in port. Many restaurants and shops in the immediate area. In addition to its many amenities and proximity to the cruise port (right across the street), the morning of your embarkation, the bellman will bring your luggage to the ship as you walk with him across the street. 

[gnomie1]

28 minutes ago, rallydave said:

Great post gnomie.  Couple of additions.  Legal connections are not set by the airlines but, by either the airports or the FAA and are the same for each airline at each airport.  Computers list the connections and are programmed based on the legal connection times and as you said, we all have to be educated flyers and if it looks to close, take a different connection.

 

And, American Express just recently changed their admission policy for their airport clubs and if the layover is over 3 hours, people will not be admitted prior to 3 hours before their next flight and not at all if at the final airport.  Also, clubs do have space limitations and you may not be admitted to a club you have access to until enough people have left the lounge so no guarantee at any lounge that you will get in in certain circumstances. 

Hi Dave:

 

Actually, here is the update on the Amex clubs: Connecting flights are exempt from three hour limitation.

 

Agree with clubs being too crowded - I was in MIA a few weeks ago and was able to access the club but within 30 minutes it was closed due to filled to capacity, and 60 minutes later there were plenty of empty seats again. As far as airline clubs are concerned, those purchased at "significant discount", such as consolidators, may not be allowed admittance if the club is too crowded.

 

Access to The Centurion Network

Policy Changes effective March 22, 2019 

NOTE: FOR PLATINUM CARD MEMBERS ONLY

 The Centurion Lounge is a day of departure lounge. We will not admit arriving Platinum Card Members with boarding passes for flights that have just landed. We will admit Platinum Card Members with layovers or connecting flights who produce proof of connecting flight. 

 

 We will not admit Platinum Card Members more than 3 hours before the departure time on the Platinum Card Member’s same-day, confirmed boarding pass. This does not apply to Platinum Card Members with a connecting flight. 

 

[vegasdriven]

Focused1, I am afraid you are confusing the Fairmont Vancouver with the Fairmont yvr which is the hotel located right in the airport. I'm no expert, but I think as airport hotels (actually attached to the airport) go the Fairmont is most likely one of the best.

[Travelcat2]

Now I’m confused.  I just know that we stayed in the hotel that is accessible from inside the airport. No clue what the name is.  There is a 50/50 chance that we’ll be there again.

 

Z - do you think that I can’t drive at 3:00 a.m.?  I am the one who did the 8 hour drive from Seattle home. In the really heavy snow.  On the other hand, maybe staying at the hotel would be easier (except for the horrible traffic in the afternoon going north to the airport).  

[vegasdriven]

Jackie- it is the Fairmont at YVR. There are at least 2 other Fairmont in Vancouver, the one downtown used to be the Hotel Vancouver, and there is the newer Fairmont Waterfront, which I believe is the one Focused1 is referring to.

Neither of those two are anywhere near the airport.

[Travelcat2]

4 minutes ago, vegasdriven said:

Jackie- it is the Fairmont at YVR. There are at least 2 other Fairmont in Vancouver, the one downtown used to be the Hotel Vancouver, and there is the newer Fairmont Waterfront, which I believe is the one Focused1 is referring to.

Neither of those two are anywhere near the airport.

 

Thanks so much!

[liptastic]

Travelcat2 wishing you both a safe journey to Vancouver. That’s a real heavy snow fall in your photograph. We have had a similar situation long time ago here, and a scary drive from home to Aberdeen airport to stay overnight before the flight to LHR to connect for the next flight. We have stayed at the Fairmont Vancouver Airport hotel and really enjoyed the stay pre cruise. Very comfortable stay.

Wishing you safe travels and all goes to plan.   Jean. 

[kjbacon]

I was under the impression that if you booked your air travel through the cruise company that you were safe from missing your ship. Am I full of soup on that one?

 

(btw, this is not at all to minimize the anxiety that travel cat is dealing with at all)

[RachelG]

54 minutes ago, kjbacon said:

I was under the impression that if you booked your air travel through the cruise company that you were safe from missing your ship. Am I full of soup on that one?

 

(btw, this is not at all to minimize the anxiety that travel cat is dealing with at all)

You are not immune from missing the ship if you book through the cruise company. They MAY hold the ship for a couple of hours if they have many passengers still in transit, but they would not hold the ship an entire day.  Think about the disruption in the schedule.  It would be impossible.  

If you miss the ship, you have to catch up and board at the next port.  Fortunately I have never been in that situation, but I know folks who have.  Again, the cruise company MAY help you if you booked through them.  Sometimes figuring out how to get to the next port and actually getting there is pretty tough.  I always try to have a backup plan in my head.

[rallydave]

4 hours ago, kjbacon said:

I was under the impression that if you booked your air travel through the cruise company that you were safe from missing your ship. Am I full of soup on that one?

 

(btw, this is not at all to minimize the anxiety that travel cat is dealing with at all)

Unfortunately, yes you are full of soup.  The T's and C's clearly state that the cruise line is not responsible for third parties delays/issues and as Rachel accurately stated, sometimes the ship can wait as long as possible but, not always and that it is your responsibility to get to the ship as possible.

 

That said, there are times the cruise line has in the past helped people who booked their air thru the cruise line but, no guarantee due to the air carrier being a third party.  Like I said, the T's and C's clearly absolve the crise from third party delays/issues.  Hope this helps.  And, most, if not all cruise lines have that disclaimer in their T's and C's.

[Hambagahle]

Based on Jackie's experiences so far on this cruise I revised our California itinerary for next year this morning to have two nights in San Diego before we sail on Splendour !!   Thanks, Jackie.   I cannot believe what that Customer Service person said to you.  In your place I would have asked him if he had ever once got off a plane in 2  (Expletive deleted!!)   mins!  Even in 1st class you can't do that.  From Block time to getting out of the jetway I count at least 10mns.  Stupid man!

[morneau]

I'm really sorry this has happened and that you are going through such stress before your trip, but thank you for posting because it is a wonderful reminder for all of us to really understand what we are doing when booking flights with connections.  Under any circumstances a connection of 45 minutes is just cutting things way too close....there are a myriad of things that can go wrong.  I'm glad that you are now taking the 6am flight - inconvenient to be sure but at least you should make your connection.  One additional note as I know you very frequently tout the services of your travel agent, but this agent should not have allowed you to book such a tight connection. We deviate our flights as well, but the agent gets the confirmation and forwards it to us so it's another set of eyes. A good travel agent should have prevented you from making this error in booking.

[Travelcat2]

More snow this morning so I'm thinking of how to do things like get to an ATM in the U.S. (will use an ATM in Dallas) and, as silly as it sounds, I need a manicure and pedicure (can get that on the ship if all else fails).

 

I am not going to blame anyone besides myself for booking these flights.  Yes - AA should not book flights so close together - especially not in one of the largest airport we've ever seen.  

 

As long as we on the subject is short connection times, any thoughts about flying into dreaded Heathrow on Air Canada and departing an 1 hour 5 minutes later on TAP Portugal?

 

P.S.  The 6:00 a.m. flight that we'll be taking on Friday left 3 minutes early this morning.  I just need to get there.

Edited February 13, 2019 by Travelcat2

[UUNetBill]

36 minutes ago, Hambagahle said:

Based on Jackie's experiences so far on this cruise I revised our California itinerary for next year this morning to have two nights in San Diego before we sail on Splendour !!   Thanks, Jackie.   I cannot believe what that Customer Service person said to you.  In your place I would have asked him if he had ever once got off a plane in 2  (Expletive deleted!!)   mins!  Even in 1st class you can't do that.  From Block time to getting out of the jetway I count at least 10mns.  Stupid man!

And never mind the fact that the airlines count 'Arrival Time' as the time you land and 'Departure Time' as the time they close the aircraft door (or at least that's what I've seen happen - YMMV).  I've had travel notices ding as 'Arrived' and the plane still taxis for 10 minutes, then sometimes you wait 10-15 minutes for a gate, then you need to position the jetway, etc...so you're already 20 minutes past your scheduled arrival time but the board shows an 'on-time' arrival.  And how many times have we had an 'on-time' departure only to be pushed out on the tarmac to wait for an hour or more?

 

Yeah, it's a game.  In fact, I think I'm going to mentally adjust my acceptable layover time from 90 minutes to 2 hours just to be safer...

 

Remember when flying actually used to be enjoyable?   

[gnomie1]

21 minutes ago, Travelcat2 said:

As long as we on the subject is short connection times, any thoughts about flying into dreaded Heathrow on Air Canada and departing an 1 hour 5 minutes later on TAP Portugal?

 

Air Canada utilizes Terminal 2 and TAP Portugal utilizes both Terminal 2 and Terminal 4.

 

Heathrow is one of the busiest airports in the world and all you need is bad weather to throw a wrench into your plans. As UUNetBill mentioned, it is all a game. In order to comply with "on time arrival" requirements, the airlines heavily pad the stated flight time so that they can advertise that a certain percentage of their flights arrive early or on time. But the arrival time is not when you reach the gate, but when the plane lands. I have flown in and out of Heathrow hundreds of times and if I had one pound for every time we were delayed getting to our gate after landing I could take another vacation.

 

Even if your flight on TAP Portugal is leaving from Terminal 2, the terminals at Heathrow require walking and many airlines require that you be on the aircraft 20 minutes before departure, therefore it is a good chance that you will not make your connecting flight.

 

If the flight leaves of of Terminal 4 - I doubt you would make that connection.

 

gnomie