Is There Legal Action Available?

[cruzsnooze]

Any lawyers out there can answer this ( or anyone else know) .................Is there any legal action we can take to get our refunds?  I'm waiting for over $12,500 and I'm not happy about it. 

[capriccio]

As much as I appreciate the opinions of many of the commenters on this board, I think taking a legal opinion from an anonymous poster is unwise and asking for trouble!

[cruzsnooze]

18 minutes ago, capriccio said:

As much as I appreciate the opinions of many of the commenters on this board, I think taking a legal opinion from an anonymous poster is unwise and asking for trouble!

Opinions are what these boards are all about. Whether you take or use that opinion is up to the individual. I want to have all the opinions and advise I can gather.

[voljeep]

OP -   why haven't you already done a credit card chargeback ??

[Daniel A]

2 minutes ago, cruzsnooze said:

Opinions are what these boards are all about. Whether you take or use that opinion is up to the individual. I want to have all the opinions and advise I can gather.

"Free advice is often worth what you paid for it."

[cruzsnooze]

16 minutes ago, voljeep said:

OP -   why haven't you already done a credit card chargeback ??

I did and Princess won because they contested it and that's all they need to do. The merchant wins if they contest it. One of the cruises charges was made over 9 months ago so that one can't be disputed.

Edited May 18, 2020 by cruzsnooze

[voljeep]

1 minute ago, cruzsnooze said:

I did and Princess won because they contested it and that's all they need to do. The merchant wins if they contest it.

details ??? - I believe, at least for me, that is a first ...

[cruzsnooze]

9 minutes ago, voljeep said:

details ??? - I believe, at least for me, that is a first ...

I called citibank and filed the dispute. They put a conditional hold on disputed deposit amount. A month later they said the dispute was found in Princess' favor. I asked why and all they said was that if a merchant refuses then take it up with them and charged me back the amount on hold.

[dag144]

You can file an action in small claims court.  It must be filed in California.  Max is $10,000.

[Daniel A]

7 minutes ago, cruzsnooze said:

I called citibank and filed the dispute. They put a conditional hold on disputed deposit amount. A month later they said the dispute was found in Princess' favor. I asked why and all they said was that if a merchant refuses then take it up with them and charged me back the amount on hold.

I've done chargebacks in the past and I was always asked if I tried to work out a solution before seeking the chargeback.  It may be that if Princess tells the credit card bank that they have notified the customer a refund will be processed that might satisfy the bank that the vendor is acting in good faith.  (Don't flame me for saying this, I'm not saying Princess is acting in good faith, I just saying the bank may be satisfied with Princess' response to their inquiry.)

[Daniel A]

3 minutes ago, dag144 said:

You can file an action in small claims court.  It must be filed in California.  Max is $10,000.

You may be correct, but somewhere in the back of my head I seem to recall the passage contract stipulating taking legal grievances to a specific arbitrator and waiving the right to sue in court.  But I might be confusing Princess' PAX contract with someone else's.

[dag144]

Arbitration may get the result the writer wants.  t is not a crooked process.

[tonit964]

34 minutes ago, cruzsnooze said:

I did and Princess won because they contested it and that's all they need to do. The merchant wins if they contest it. One of the cruises charges was made over 9 months ago so that one can't be disputed.

You should call Citibank back, ask for a manager and explain the situation. You paid for something you did not receive, the merchant canceled the cruise, you did not and waiting 60, 90 or open ended for the refund is unreasonable and unacceptable.

 

Then, I would switch banks.

[mafig]

2 minutes ago, tonit964 said:

You should call Citibank back, ask for a manager and explain the situation. You paid for something you did not receive, the merchant canceled the cruise, you did not and waiting 60, 90 or open ended for the refund is unreasonable and unacceptable.

 

Then, I would switch banks.

 

Yes, I would appeal.

And I would be switching banks so fast their heads would spin.

 

Is there a local TV station that might be interested in a Consumer-type, whistleblower segment?

 

 

 

[cruzsnooze]

3 minutes ago, tonit964 said:

You should call Citibank back, ask for a manager and explain the situation. You paid for something you did not receive, the merchant canceled the cruise, you did not and waiting 60, 90 or open ended for the refund is unreasonable and unacceptable.

 

Then, I would switch banks.

I did ask to escalate this but was told once a dispute is closed it cannot be reopened. My citibank visa is tied to my Costco membership so I only use it at Costco or for travel for the rewards. 

   I'm not the only one in this wait and hold pattern for a refund that's well over 60 days. 

[tonit964]

17 minutes ago, cruzsnooze said:

I did ask to escalate this but was told once a dispute is closed it cannot be reopened. My citibank visa is tied to my Costco membership so I only use it at Costco or for travel for the rewards. 

   I'm not the only one in this wait and hold pattern for a refund that's well over 60 days. 

Something is not making sense, did princess cancel your cruise due to Covid-19 or did you cancel? If they canceled why would they contest it? They owe you the money and if they had the time to contest it, why didn't they just process your refund?

 

Sorry for all the questions but this is just strange.

[LDVinNC]

1 hour ago, cruzsnooze said:

I did and Princess won because they contested it and that's all they need to do. The merchant wins if they contest it. One of the cruises charges was made over 9 months ago so that one can't be disputed.

 

What was the date of your cruise and when did you file the dispute?

 

Are you now still waiting for Princess to give you a your refund?

 

Thanks.  This is worrisome.

[PrincessLuver]

26 minutes ago, mafig said:

 

Is there a local TV station that might be interested in a Consumer-type, whistleblower segment?

 

 

I like the idea of the local TV station especially if you are in a large market....it is amazing how a Consumer Advocate on a local station can get results.  

 

I am not sure on this matter but usually if you sue a cruise line it has to be in Federal Court, under archaic Maritime laws and usually in the American city where they have a corporate office.

[whitecap]

Since you didn't state when your cruise was cancelled it is hard to determine just how long your have been waiting.  Here what is clear to me:  COVID-19 caused the cancelation of 100's if not 1000's of cruises; 16 ships averaging approximately 3,000 passengers; lower work force to handle paperwork; Princess has acknowledged that they owe the refund.  I know it is easy for me to say but try to relax and give Princess some time.  You are 1 of tens of thousands of claims to be processed.

[tonit964]

7 minutes ago, whitecap said:

Since you didn't state when your cruise was cancelled it is hard to determine just how long your have been waiting.  Here what is clear to me:  COVID-19 caused the cancelation of 100's if not 1000's of cruises; 16 ships averaging approximately 3,000 passengers; lower work force to handle paperwork; Princess has acknowledged that they owe the refund.  I know it is easy for me to say but try to relax and give Princess some time.  You are 1 of tens of thousands of claims to be processed.

No, I don't think they are processing them. There are people that had March 14th cruises canceled that haven't received their refunds yet, that's only about a week after all cruises stopped so if they are doing them in sail date order as they stated they are, those should have been refunded already. 

[ontheweb]

1 hour ago, Daniel A said:

I've done chargebacks in the past and I was always asked if I tried to work out a solution before seeking the chargeback.  It may be that if Princess tells the credit card bank that they have notified the customer a refund will be processed that might satisfy the bank that the vendor is acting in good faith.  (Don't flame me for saying this, I'm not saying Princess is acting in good faith, I just saying the bank may be satisfied with Princess' response to their inquiry.)

Generally I let them know my efforts with the merchant before they get to ask me that question.

[cruzsnooze]

24 minutes ago, whitecap said:

Since you didn't state when your cruise was cancelled it is hard to determine just how long your have been waiting.  Here what is clear to me:  COVID-19 caused the cancelation of 100's if not 1000's of cruises; 16 ships averaging approximately 3,000 passengers; lower work force to handle paperwork; Princess has acknowledged that they owe the refund.  I know it is easy for me to say but try to relax and give Princess some time.  You are 1 of tens of thousands of claims to be processed.

My cruise was cancelled by Princess mid March. It was a pricey cruisetour July 5th to Japan in a mini suite.  Princess acknowledging a refund doesn't mean anything, actions matter. Relax isn't an option when they owe me such a large amount of money. I'm very concerned I will never see a refund and the money is lost in a bankruptcy. 

[Daniel A]

I will probably get some pushback for this but as I understand it, there are three different sets of circumstances:  1.  Passengers who cancelled their cruises.  2.  Cruises that Princess cancelled (March 12 to May 10.)  3.  Cruises that the US Government cancelled (March 14 to July 24.)

 

It's a misnomer to state that Princess has cancelled all of these cruises when it was also passengers and the government that cancelled many of these cruises too.  We are all being negatively affected by government edicts due to the Corona virus.  Many other diverse businesses and people are struggling to meet their obligations.  As is being said a lot lately "We are all in this together."  Hopefully we will all be made whole, but unfortunately there are many, many people who will never be made whole by the damage being wreaked by this catastrophe.

[whitecap]

So if, as you have indicated, a large number of people have not received their refunds and it is because Princess is being dishonest and in fact not issuing any refunds, the group should get together and solicit the services of an attorney capable of handling a "class action lawsuit".  The OP has said that her cruise was cancelled in mid March, it is now mid May, obviously 2 months.  I am still waiting for reimbursement from two class action law suits that were settled over a year ago.  At this point, what other choice do you have but to wait?   

[Daniel A]

17 minutes ago, whitecap said:

 the group should get together and solicit the services of an attorney capable of handling a "class action lawsuit".  

According to the Passage Contract item 15 (C): 

 

"WAIVER OF CLASS ACTION: THIS PASSAGE CONTRACT PROVIDES FOR THE EXCLUSIVE RESOLUTION OF DISPUTES THROUGH INDIVIDUAL LEGAL ACTION ON YOUR OWN BEHALF INSTEAD OF THROUGH ANY CLASS OR REPRESENTATIVE ACTION. EVEN IF THE APPLICABLE LAW PROVIDES OTHERWISE, YOU AGREE THAT ANY ARBITRATION OR LAWSUIT AGAINST CARRIER WHATSOEVER SHALL BE LITIGATED BY YOU INDIVIDUALLY AND NOT AS A MEMBER OF ANY CLASS OR AS PART OF A CLASS OR REPRESENTATIVE ACTION, AND YOU EXPRESSLY AGREE TO WAIVE ANY LAW ENTITLING YOU TO PARTICIPATE IN A CLASS ACTION. IF YOUR CLAIM IS SUBJECT TO ARBITRATION UNDER SECTION 15(B)(ii) ABOVE, THE ARBITRATOR SHALL HAVE NO AUTHORITY TO ARBITRATE CLAIMS ON A CLASS ACTION BASIS. YOU AGREE THAT THIS CLASS ACTION WAIVER SHALL NOT BE SEVERABLE UNDER ANY CIRCUMSTANCES FROM THE ARBITRATION CLAUSE SET FORTH IN SECTION 15(B)(ii) ABOVE, AND IF FOR ANY REASON THIS CLASS ACTION WAIVER IS UNENFORCEABLE AS TO ANY PARTICULAR CLAIM, THEN AND ONLY THEN SUCH CLAIM SHALL NOT BE SUBJECT TO ARBITRATION."

Edited May 18, 2020 by Daniel A