Is this our future?

[1985rz1]

24 minutes ago, TrulyBlonde said:

An example would be my state of CO. The Mayor of Denver put it out. You can use Google.

 

Can you help me find the statement by the Denver Mayor.  I'd be very upset with the mayor if he said something as irresponsible as this. Here's all I could find when I Googled:

 

https://www.9news.com/article/news/local/local-politics/mayor-hancock-press-conference-to-address-denver-protests/73-3a716701-4ced-4ed6-b6a1-3c0ff713304b

[clo]

7 minutes ago, 1985rz1 said:

Can you help me find the statement by the Denver Mayor.  I'd be very upset with the mayor if he said something as irresponsible as this. Here's all I could find when I Googled:

 

https://www.9news.com/article/news/local/local-politics/mayor-hancock-press-conference-to-address-denver-protests/73-3a716701-4ced-4ed6-b6a1-3c0ff713304b

Yep. Like others. But at least you and I know how to Google 🙂 

[TrulyBlonde]

1 hour ago, clo said:

Yep. Like others. But at least you and I know how to Google 🙂 

Such a rebel....I live in this State..Why do you dispute..always!

Denver Mayor Michael Hancock announced Sunday that the city will be offering free tests to demonstrators. 

"We did see and have witnessed people demonstrating in our community – peacefully, as well as after hours when it's not so peaceful – without face coverings, and so we want to remind everyone and invite you that next weekend, Friday, Saturday and Sunday, go down to the Pepsi Center and get tested for COVID-19 for free," said Hancock. "It's free, it is quick, it is painless and at least we can use that opportunity to make sure that we continue to blunt the spread of the coronavirus."

A spokesperson with the city says people would not need to declare – or prove – they'd been at a protest in order to qualify for testing, but that they would need to register online and provide a name and address. 

Edited June 29, 2020 by TrulyBlonde

[clo]

2 minutes ago, TrulyBlonde said:

Denver Mayor Michael Hancock announced Sunday that the city will be offering free tests to demonstrators. 

 

Sheesh. Here in Reno we have various places for free testing for everyone. We had a remote chance of having been exposed so made an appt. online with our county health dept. for the following AM and 48 hours later we had our (negative) results. Easy peasy.

 

[TrulyBlonde]

2 hours ago, 1985rz1 said:

Can you help me find the statement by the Denver Mayor.  I'd be very upset with the mayor if he said something as irresponsible as this. Here's all I could find when I Googled:

 

https://www.9news.com/article/news/local/local-politics/mayor-hancock-press-conference-to-address-denver-protests/73-3a716701-4ced-4ed6-b6a1-3c0ff713304b

I provided one prior on Denver. Here is a one from the Philadelphia Enquirer. I do not know how to link.

In Philadelphia, demonstrations continued Sunday as several hundred people gathered outside former Eastern State Penitentiary, now a museum, to call for the release of people from prisons and detention centers amid the COVID-19 virus. Crowds also gathered in Pittsburgh and surrounding areas for protests stemming from the death of George Floyd.

Due to the crowds, the city said Sunday that health officials believe there is increased likelihood that participants may have been exposed to COVID-19. They were urged to monitor themselves for symptoms, try to keep a distance from others for 14 days, wear masks and get a test seven days after having been in a crowd.

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“Those seeking testing do NOT need to identify that they were at a protest but instead should say they were near someone who may have had COVID-19,” the city said.

Edited June 29, 2020 by TrulyBlonde

[1985rz1]

1 hour ago, TrulyBlonde said:

I provided one prior on Denver. Here is a one from the Philadelphia Enquirer. I do not know how to link.

“Those seeking testing do NOT need to identify that they were at a protest but instead should say they were near someone who may have had COVID-19,” the city said.

 

4 hours ago, TrulyBlonde said:

Many States told the protesters they did not have to report if they were involved in a protest and needed a test. Not buying it. 

 

I think we have argued different points.  I thought you were saying that folks were being discouraged from getting tests, and I think your point was that if they had tests (which were being recommended) they didn't have to disclose they were at a protest rally. 

 

But I think it's hard to identify increases in infections with protesters, since the increase is more widespread, and the options for infections are much more complicated. 

 

While I agree that the protests may have added to the total, I'm not sure what fraction of the increase can be attributed to them regardless whether they reported being at a protest or not.  But that's JMO.

 

On the other hand, AZ's surge is so large that it's hard to see that the protest made a significant impact.

 

You folks in CO seem to have less of a problem. 

[TrulyBlonde]

2 minutes ago, 1985rz1 said:

 

 

I think we have argued different points.  I thought you were saying that folks were being discouraged from getting tests, and I think your point was that if they had tests (which were being recommended) they didn't have to disclose they were at a protest rally. 

 

But I think it's hard to identify increases in infections with protesters, since the increase is more widespread, and the options for infections are much more complicated. 

 

While I agree that the protests may have added to the total, I'm not sure what fraction of the increase can be attributed to them regardless whether they reported being at a protest or not.  But that's JMO.

 

On the other hand, AZ's surge is so large that it's hard to see that the protest made a significant impact.

 

You folks in CO seem to have less of a problem. 

Yes, mine was related to contact tracing and I found it disgusting that the info did not have to be provided when getting a test. How do you trace?

We have had a recent spike in my CO ski town and the young people are refusing to provide info. The town has said they all were at an "Event". We know what the event was. I live here.

This is why I disputed your USA Today article. 

We, like you, just do the best we can for our own health and others. I will not even go to a restaurant.

 

[clo]

11 minutes ago, TrulyBlonde said:

Yes, mine was related to contact tracing and I found it disgusting that the info did not have to be provided when getting a test. How do you trace?

We have had a recent spike in my CO ski town and the young people are refusing to provide info. The town has said they all were at an "Event". We know what the event was. I live here.

This is why I disputed your USA Today article. 

We, like you, just do the best we can for our own health and others. I will not even go to a restaurant.

 

Thank you so much for elaborating. I also didn't understand the backs and forths. Such tough times. 

Best, Cath

[1985rz1]

59 minutes ago, TrulyBlonde said:

Yes, mine was related to contact tracing and I found it disgusting that the info did not have to be provided when getting a test. How do you trace?

We have had a recent spike in my CO ski town and the young people are refusing to provide info. The town has said they all were at an "Event". We know what the event was. I live here.

This is why I disputed your USA Today article. 

We, like you, just do the best we can for our own health and others. I will not even go to a restaurant.

 

Contract tracing in AZ is somewhere between dysfunctional and non-existent.  Our biggest county, Maricopa, which includes Phoenix, is not even following CDC guidelines for tracing. 

 

We've been to a restaurant once...sat outside with well-distanced tables...before the recent surge began.

 

Masks in our city and county are mandated, and we support that to protect others.  Not everyone does. 

[Paulchili]

7 hours ago, Hawaiidan said:

It is most interesting  to see   that many spikes come almost 2 weeks after the protesting mobs did their thing in California, Utah, Texas, Min. Fl, NC  NV  and AZ WA. Ore........Hmmm   and its mostly all under 40 , interesting is  in not.

I was going to respond and say something on the subject but then I realized the facts.

Our country is now firmly divided into two very different factions that live in parallel universes. The best I can hope is that this is a temporary situation because as they say "United we stand, divided we fall"

One group believes that the current spike is due to the recent protests (BLM, etc) even though there is plenty of documentation in videos and photos that while they were not distancing, 90+% of these people wore masks (and most of these were predominantly not in the States with current spikes).

The other group believes that this increase is due to premature opening and relaxation (remember the crowds in Ozarks pools on Memorial day, Florida beaches, all the bars and recent gathering of thousands of people  who were handed masks but refused to wear them).

There is ABSOLUTELY nothing - no facts - that will convince either side to see it any way but their own.

We live in terrible times and we'd better change very soon - even Rome fell eventually, so can we.

[vaitape]

People (including rioters and protesters) travel....and bring the virus back home with them. 

 

 

 

 

 

[Paulchili]

6 hours ago, vaitape said:

People (including rioters and protesters) travel....and bring the virus back home with them. 

Of course, that is the danger.

Th question is who was more likely infected to further spread the disease. Those that were in large crowds without any masks or those who mostly had masks.

[Doubt It]

Basically, if the government orders are to social distance - then anyone, group etc who violates it should be fined.

 

This operating principle must apply to everyone period.

 

Any society that places some people, groups above the law, as we have recently seen in many locations, Canada included (our prime minister was out protesting in a big group in violation of that province's orders)  will disintegrate quickly.

 

Would be the same on a cruise ship - either everyone does or no one does.  We have all seen the poor enforcement of rules on cruise ships, so I would have O confidence in cruising re: mask wearing.

[RJB]

On 6/26/2020 at 12:12 PM, susiesan said:

No, it's not the future for all cruise companies. Windstar is resuming cruises in Polynesia in September and they are not putting on this kind of pandemic theater show. I will be on Wind Spirit in January and am not worried in the least. There will not be a vaccine by then and I will be totally comfortable. Should be a normal Windstar experience.

 

If O were to start doing the things Ponant is next year for my cancelled and postponed Baltic cruise in August 2021 I will cancel it. Either I have the normal O experience or I won't sail with them. 

To fly for 20 hours to FP is not the way to go for us.  Could be sick even before we get on the ship.  We will pass on all flights until thee is a vaccine or a cure.  Might be willing to stay in the Carib. where we could drive to the ship. 

[RJB]

9 hours ago, Paulchili said:

I was going to respond and say something on the subject but then I realized the facts.

Our country is now firmly divided into two very different factions that live in parallel universes. The best I can hope is that this is a temporary situation because as they say "United we stand, divided we fall"

One group believes that the current spike is due to the recent protests (BLM, etc) even though there is plenty of documentation in videos and photos that while they were not distancing, 90+% of these people wore masks (and most of these were predominantly not in the States with current spikes).

The other group believes that this increase is due to premature opening and relaxation (remember the crowds in Ozarks pools on Memorial day, Florida beaches, all the bars and recent gathering of thousands of people  who were handed masks but refused to wear them).

There is ABSOLUTELY nothing - no facts - that will convince either side to see it any way but their own.

We live in terrible times and we'd better change very soon - even Rome fell eventually, so can we.

So right you are.  All of us must work together to solve this. 

[clo]

2 hours ago, Doubt It said:

Basically, if the government orders are to social distance - then anyone, group etc who violates it should be fined.

 

This operating principle must apply to everyone period.

 

Any society that places some people, groups above the law, as we have recently seen in many locations, Canada included (our prime minister was out protesting in a big group in violation of that province's orders)  will disintegrate quickly.

 

Would be the same on a cruise ship - either everyone does or no one does.  We have all seen the poor enforcement of rules on cruise ships, so I would have O confidence in cruising re: mask wearing.

Perhaps the businesses need t have hefty fines levied and then they'd comply.

[KirkNC]

1 hour ago, clo said:

Perhaps the businesses need t have hefty fines levied and then they'd comply.

In our hometown they have told restaurants that if they don’t follow the rules they will have their liquor license suspended, that got their attention.

[clo]

57 minutes ago, KirkNC said:

In our hometown they have told restaurants that if they don’t follow the rules they will have their liquor license suspended, that got their attention.

Great idea! Over a month ago I reported to our mayor a local place for masks and social distancing and they had a notice served on them.

[susiesan]

2 minutes ago, clo said:

Great idea! Over a month ago I reported to our mayor a local place for masks and social distancing and they had a notice served on them.

OK Karen.

[Hawaiidan]

11 hours ago, vaitape said:

People (including rioters and protesters) travel....and bring the virus back home with them. 

 

 

 

 

 

Correct....it is just common  sense   to realize  the vast majority of gatherings  were  the mobs and comprised of some of the most vulnerable  folks    many of which  traveled from riot to riot..  Salt lake Seattle, Las Vegas, Los Angeles  Atlanta, Houston, Austin..... and a slew of others.       and the age groups affected.. are almost all in the  composition of those mobs........   Its pure cause and effect 

[clo]

1 hour ago, Hawaiidan said:

.it is just common  sense   to realize  the vast majority of gatherings 

I don't think there's anything "common" about sense and I don't on this either. Have there been a lot of protests in FL, AZ, etc.? 
 

And just to be clear, do you ever post links that provide good data on things? Or is it always just your never humble opinion?

[Aloha 1]

Remember our old friend, Common Sense?

Common Sense, says gathering in large groups, marching shoulder to shoulder while also screaming out slogans creates an environment conducive to spreading the virus. The mantra is not just masks but social distancing also.

 

Common Sense, says the more you test the higher the likelihood you will find more virus positives.

 

Common Sense, says if you keep teen and 20 somethings cooped up for 3 months then open the bars, you should expect more cases.

 

Common Sense, says ALL of these are contributing to the spike in cases. So let's stop arguing over one or the other and use our Common Sense.

 

There is a spike. There are multiple reasons. It doesn't change the fact that we ( those of us in the vulnerable age group) need to keep doing what we're doing. It is obviously working since the script has flipped and the majority of these new positive cases are below age 35.

[TrulyBlonde]

3 minutes ago, Aloha 1 said:

Remember our old friend, Common Sense?

Common Sense, says gathering in large groups, marching shoulder to shoulder while also screaming out slogans creates an environment conducive to spreading the virus. The mantra is not just masks but social distancing also.

 

Common Sense, says the more you test the higher the likelihood you will find more virus positives.

 

Common Sense, says if you keep teen and 20 somethings cooped up for 3 months then open the bars, you should expect more cases.

 

Common Sense, says ALL of these are contributing to the spike in cases. So let's stop arguing over one or the other and use our Common Sense.

 

There is a spike. There are multiple reasons. It doesn't change the fact that we ( those of us in the vulnerable age group) need to keep doing what we're doing. It is obviously working since the script has flipped and the majority of these new positive cases are below age 35.

You have Common Sense. Thank you.

[deadzone1003]

1 hour ago, Aloha 1 said:

Remember our old friend, Common Sense?

Common Sense, says gathering in large groups, marching shoulder to shoulder while also screaming out slogans creates an environment conducive to spreading the virus. The mantra is not just masks but social distancing also.

 

Common Sense, says the more you test the higher the likelihood you will find more virus positives.

 

Common Sense, says if you keep teen and 20 somethings cooped up for 3 months then open the bars, you should expect more cases.

 

Common Sense, says ALL of these are contributing to the spike in cases. So let's stop arguing over one or the other and use our Common Sense.

 

There is a spike. There are multiple reasons. It doesn't change the fact that we ( those of us in the vulnerable age group) need to keep doing what we're doing. It is obviously working since the script has flipped and the majority of these new positive cases are below age 35.

Very good, don't forget that even if infections  and hospitalizations are up, it is the ICU (plus number of ventilators) that were the limiting factors of our medical system.  During this recent surge of infections, the number of people with the disease needing the ICU has been dropping.  There are spot shortages, but even when Houston said their ICU's were 95-97% full - they didn't tell you that most of those people in the ICU were non-Covid19 related.  That's what happen when you go back into your regular business - you want to fill those beds to make money especially when you have a 3-month backlog.  For those young people who are getting infected, the odds of dying from an auto accident is still greater than dying from Covid19.  If you are young and have underlying medical conditions, going to one of those protests or rallies is just getting you to the front of the line for a Darwin award.  Just keep everything in perspective.

[Paulchili]

1 hour ago, deadzone1003 said:

Very good, don't forget that even if infections  and hospitalizations are up, it is the ICU (plus number of ventilators) that were the limiting factors of our medical system.  During this recent surge of infections, the number of people with the disease needing the ICU has been dropping.  There are spot shortages, but even when Houston said their ICU's were 95-97% full - they didn't tell you that most of those people in the ICU were non-Covid19 related.  That's what happen when you go back into your regular business - you want to fill those beds to make money especially when you have a 3-month backlog.  For those young people who are getting infected, the odds of dying from an auto accident is still greater than dying from Covid19.  If you are young and have underlying medical conditions, going to one of those protests or rallies is just getting you to the front of the line for a Darwin award.  Just keep everything in perspective.

What wonderful news - I feel so much better and safer now (sarcasm emoji).