3rd vaccine dose likely needed

[smokeybandit]

Vaccines are doing just fine against the variants

[nomad098]

1 hour ago, smokeybandit said:

Vaccines are doing just fine against the variants

 

If that was the case there would be no need for booster shots

 

Astrazeneca would still be being used in South Africa against the South African variant

 

And the Novaxx trials would tend to disagree a 6 fold decrease in effectiveness against the South African variant

 

The mRNA vaccines seem to be holding up better but they have not been widely deployed in areas of concern except in the UK

 

 

[smokeybandit]

Just now, nomad098 said:

 

If that was the case there would be no need for booster shots

 

Astrazeneca would still be being used in South Africa against the South African variant

 

And the Novaxx trials would tend to disagree a 6 fold decrease in effectiveness against the South African variant

 

The mRNA vaccines seem to be holding up better but they have not been widely deployed in areas of concern except in the UK

 

 

Of course the manufacturers want to push booster shots. That doesn't mean we'll need them (and as of now there's not enough data to suggest we will).

[jonbgd]

15 hours ago, James4me said:

 There, does that upset you so much?  

You not getting vaccinated doesnt upset me

what upsets me is when someone dies

 

(Disappointed) Like my buddy, that was a highly decorated Navy Seal, that got bad blood transfusion

He ended up dying of Aids, but when I first went in, it was still HTLV3 pre HIV 

 

 (Unhappy)Or this sweet little old lady that had CHF and COPD. She was a Patient on and off for 3+ years. Hadnt seen her for a few months. I was called to another hospital, that i used to assist the Pathologist to do Posts. Well i pulled her out of the cooler and  i lost it emotionally. Just in case you dont know what a Post is, It is an autopsy. I had to open and close her, for the Pathologist to weigh her organs 

 

(worried) My miracle wife, that is a 2 time stage 4 breast cancer survivor, gets a treatment every 3 weeks for the last 6 years to keep her in remission. If her heart cant handle it they will have to stop.

So i will take her to baseball game Weds night 2 weeks and a day after 2nd shot. We will have our masks on, being socially distanced, knowing one day her cancer may come back.

 

I couldn't control any of these, but i can take a vaccine that will  help us and others around us, to get back to normal hopefully. If it requires a 3rd or annual, i will, as this isnt about just me, its about all of us irrelevant of going on a cruise or not

 

 

Edited April 25, 2021 by jonbgd

[ReneeFLL]

On 4/23/2021 at 11:44 AM, Keksie said:

I trust my Doctor.  

What if your dr told you to get the shot? Would you?

[yogimax]

17 hours ago, xpcdoojk said:

Didn’t yogi just say that is why we can’t.  For someone wanting to do.... seems to find infinite reasons to do not...

 

just sayin

Not logical.

 

Saying there are reasons not to cruise now (valid reasons) does not mean I don't want to cruise at some point.  I love cruising but I want to cruise safely, both for myself and others.  Got it?

[yogimax]

2 hours ago, jonbgd said:

You not getting vaccinated doesnt upset me

what upsets me is when someone dies

 

(Disappointed) Like my buddy, that was a highly decorated Navy Seal, that got bad blood transfusion

He ended up dying of Aids, but when I first went in, it was still HTLV3 pre HIV 

 

 (Unhappy)Or this sweet little old lady that had CHF and COPD. She was a Patient on and off for 3+ years. Hadnt seen her for a few months. I was called to another hospital, that i used to assist the Pathologist to do Posts. Well i pulled her out of the cooler and  i lost it emotionally. Just in case you dont know what a Post is, It is an autopsy. I had to open and close her, for the Pathologist to weigh her organs 

 

(worried) My miracle wife, that is a 2 time stage 4 breast cancer survivor, gets a treatment every 3 weeks for the last 6 years to keep her in remission. If her heart cant handle it they will have to stop.

So i will take her to baseball game Weds night 2 weeks and a day after 2nd shot. We will have our masks on, being socially distanced, knowing one day her cancer may come back.

 

I couldn't control any of these, but i can take a vaccine that will  help us and others around us, to get back to normal hopefully. If it requires a 3rd or annual, i will, as this isnt about just me, its about all of us irrelevant of going on a cruise or not

 

 

Thank you for your moving and meaningful post.  I have nothing to add except to say that our hope and prayer is that your wife will continue to be a survivor.

[Keksie]

2 hours ago, ReneeFLL said:

What if your dr told you to get the shot? Would you?

I already was fully vaccinated before I even saw my new doctor.  My second shot was in February.  We have only lived here a little over a year and I just now got around to finding a doctor.  He did mention that he was fully vaccinated and then I said well so am I.  Not exactly sure why you assumed I hadn't already been vaccinated since I live in Florida and it is super easy to get a vaccine.

[James4me]

Where are you planning to cruise to anyway?  Most Countries have shut their borders.  England isn’t inviting anyone, Italy, nope, Canada, nope, and so on.  The shots you’re receiving are not working.  But go ahead and believe the scientists, they and the pharmaceutical companies are paid for by Bill Gates and company.  

[Coralc]

Wow. There seem to be very different beliefs between Southern California and Northern California.  Although I guess people that think certain things tend to find and hang out with people that feel similarly so it becomes their majority opinion, whether it is in the minority or not. 

[James4me]

7 minutes ago, Coralc said:

Wow. There seem to be very different beliefs between Southern California and Northern California.  Although I guess people that think certain things tend to find and hang out with people that feel similarly so it becomes their majority opinion, whether it is in the minority or not. 

?????  Don’t try so hard on your response.

Edited April 25, 2021 by James4me

[John&LaLa]

On 4/23/2021 at 11:40 PM, yogimax said:

And that's precisely why the rest of us will not be cruising in the near future.

 

So the primary reason to get vaccinated is to ensure cruising resumes. 🤔

 

What about saving lives.😉

[harkinmr]

8 hours ago, nomad098 said:

 

If that was the case there would be no need for booster shots

 

 

 

 

Variants aren't the only issue.  We are still not certain how long vaccine protection will last.  It would not be surprising at all if annual vaccines are necessary.  Maybe it will be longer.  Let's hope!

[harkinmr]

1 hour ago, James4me said:

Where are you planning to cruise to anyway?  Most Countries have shut their borders.  England isn’t inviting anyone, Italy, nope, Canada, nope, and so on.  The shots you’re receiving are not working.  But go ahead and believe the scientists, they and the pharmaceutical companies are paid for by Bill Gates and company.  

I guess us vaccinated folks will be visiting Europe starting this summer.  Just announced this afternoon!

 

https://www.nytimes.com/2021/04/25/world/europe/american-travel-to-europe.html

 

 

[xpcdoojk]

6 hours ago, jonbgd said:

You not getting vaccinated doesnt upset me

what upsets me is when someone dies

 

(Disappointed) Like my buddy, that was a highly decorated Navy Seal, that got bad blood transfusion

He ended up dying of Aids, but when I first went in, it was still HTLV3 pre HIV 

 

 (Unhappy)Or this sweet little old lady that had CHF and COPD. She was a Patient on and off for 3+ years. Hadnt seen her for a few months. I was called to another hospital, that i used to assist the Pathologist to do Posts. Well i pulled her out of the cooler and  i lost it emotionally. Just in case you dont know what a Post is, It is an autopsy. I had to open and close her, for the Pathologist to weigh her organs 

 

(worried) My miracle wife, that is a 2 time stage 4 breast cancer survivor, gets a treatment every 3 weeks for the last 6 years to keep her in remission. If her heart cant handle it they will have to stop.

So i will take her to baseball game Weds night 2 weeks and a day after 2nd shot. We will have our masks on, being socially distanced, knowing one day her cancer may come back.

 

I couldn't control any of these, but i can take a vaccine that will  help us and others around us, to get back to normal hopefully. If it requires a 3rd or annual, i will, as this isnt about just me, its about all of us irrelevant of going on a cruise or not

 

 

Thanks for obligatory guilt trip.  Wasn’t there a kitty that was killed too?  

 

I appreciate your caring, and I am sorry for your losses, but ....

 

 

[tosteve1]

On 4/23/2021 at 4:12 PM, nomad098 said:

Booster shots great.

 

But what are you actually getting a booster shot against?

 

The present crop of vaccines target a very specific part of a very specific spike protein the booster shots will be the same just for a variant.

 

Covid19 mutates naturally however viruses can be pressured to mutate by external mechanisms like mass vaccination roll outs. This makes it easy for them to mutate beyond the design of the present vaccines, Dr Fauci and the UK advisors have been talking about this for a while

 

The problem is no one knows what variants will be in circulation in 3 to 9 months time, this is the timeframe to create a vaccine for a known variant, the Novaxx trial tells us that the probability is that the vaccines will have a limited to no effect on a variant it was not designed to protect against.

 

We all know quickly covid 19 circled the globe, the Kent variant to become the dominant strain in the UK during lockdowns and for 3 other variants of concern to be recognised. Unlike influenza vaccine makers and manufactures will not be able to anticipate what the next variant will be

 

The Novaxx trial did throw out some other interesting information, that those previously exposed to older variants of covid-19 seemed to be protected from the new South African variant only having mild symptoms.

 

There is science that shows that an live vaccine like yellow fever teaches the immune system to recognise the whole virus and is not rendered ineffective by changes at the surface. 

 

 

But we know the gene sequence of new variants very quickly. Updates to mRNA vaccines can be produced within weeks. As long as people are willing to get boosters, it shouldn’t be a problem. But hey, we can just lockdown forever instead!

[yogimax]

40 minutes ago, xpcdoojk said:

Thanks for obligatory guilt trip.  Wasn’t there a kitty that was killed too?  

 

I appreciate your caring, and I am sorry for your losses, but ....

Was that necessary?

[cured]

3 hours ago, James4me said:

Where are you planning to cruise to anyway?  Most Countries have shut their borders.  England isn’t inviting anyone, Italy, nope, Canada, nope, and so on.  The shots you’re receiving are not working.  But go ahead and believe the scientists, they and the pharmaceutical companies are paid for by Bill Gates and company.  

Go ahead and believe your conspiracy theories. 

 

I prefer the truth. Such as the Pfizer vaccine was developed and funded by a German company (BioNTech) founded by an immigrant Turkish couple. It had nothing to do with the US government nor did it take a dime of funding.

 

And contrary to your opinion, the facts show that the vaccines are working very, very well. Follow up studies are showing they are far exceeding expectations.

Edited April 26, 2021 by cured

[cured]

3 hours ago, Coralc said:

Wow. There seem to be very different beliefs between Southern California and Northern California.  Although I guess people that think certain things tend to find and hang out with people that feel similarly so it becomes their majority opinion, whether it is in the minority or not. 

This pretty much sums up "opinion"

 

[harkinmr]

3 hours ago, James4me said:

Where are you planning to cruise to anyway?  Most Countries have shut their borders.  England isn’t inviting anyone, Italy, nope, Canada, nope, and so on.  The shots you’re receiving are not working.  But go ahead and believe the scientists, they and the pharmaceutical companies are paid for by Bill Gates and company.  

I think I’m going to invite Mr. Gates on my trip to Europe this summer to thank him for the vaccine that is making it all possible. 😎

[cured]

6 minutes ago, harkinmr said:

I think I’m going to invite Mr. Gates on my trip to Europe this summer to thank him for the vaccine that is making it all possible. 😎

Yes, tell him thank you. The chip in my arm doesn't hurt one bit. The buzzing when it moves between towers is a bit annoying but a small price to pay to be able to travel.😉 

[Coralc]

Well...I was going to say that if you think Bill Gates as a humanitarian who strongly believes in vaccines (for like malaria) and funds pharmaceutical companies is a bad person, then you must have only Macs and Apple products in your house and Tim Cook is a better person? And Sundar Pichai from Google must fall somewhere in the middle?  But I don't want to get in to the beliefs of others. The whole thing is just eye rolling without getting in to personal attacks. 

 

In my opinion? People who are not vaccinated will be left out of some of the fun stuff. 

[nomad098]

3 hours ago, cured said:

This pretty much sums up "opinion"

 

 

And that's your "opinion"

 

All the post proves is that everyone suffers from conformational bias, the person who wrote the article, the poster and myself.

 

I remember the experts the UK government went to when SARS 1, MERS and Ebola looked like being a threat, when these people did not agree with the government's point of view and approach to Covid-19 they were suddenly deemed to be fringe scientists and called far worse by the mainstream media, talk about confirmation bias. These people were not discredited scientists but world leading experts in their respective fields. 

 

When the people we elected to govern us set a path and the scientists advising the UK government did not agree with them they undermined the government  and released information that forced the government to change their course, when did these scientists become experts in governance?

 

There are many many scientific experts that do not agree with the approach of the UK government scientific advice, some of these sit on the committee advising the government, when their voices went unrepresented by their superiors they wrote an open letter to the government, they were immediately vilified for their views, yet we have been paying them to advise us for over a year.

 

In such a fluid situation disagreeing with an "experts" view does not make you right nor will it necessarily mean you're wrong. 

[nomad098]

7 hours ago, harkinmr said:

Variants aren't the only issue.  We are still not certain how long vaccine protection will last.  It would not be surprising at all if annual vaccines are necessary.  Maybe it will be longer.  Let's hope!

 

From looking at older research into RNA viruses

 

The chances are long term immunity to the version of covid-19 your vaccinated for

Limited protection against present variants if not exposed to the virus previously or had a booster jab

Less or no protection for future variants if not exposed to the virus previously.

 

What we know about live vaccines and previous exposure to covid-19 in the Novaxx trial is that this offers protection against present disease and known variants.

 

This is why they are working on mRNA vaccines that mimic more of the whole virus to give better protection against variants

 

Exposure to the disease or a mRNA or other vaccine that mimics the whole virus may abrogate the need for boosters. 

[nomad098]

6 hours ago, tosteve1 said:

But we know the gene sequence of new variants very quickly. Updates to mRNA vaccines can be produced within weeks. As long as people are willing to get boosters, it shouldn’t be a problem. But hey, we can just lockdown forever instead!

 

No matter how quickly the updates can be produced the logistics, verification, approval process and manufacture takes time all the while the virus is mutating.

 

From the little science available exposure once vaccinated might provide better long term protection than continual booster shots for variants you may never come in contact with.