HAL continuing to downgrade its product

[albingirl]

15 hours ago, Damcruiser said:

That’s the tradeoff for those outside of the hurricane zone requiring at least $1,000 to get to each cruise.  We might be cold but we do feel safer.

 I’m not complaining but I do feel sorry for those living in the path of nature’s wrath.

We feel badly as well. I'd gladly pay $1,000 to get to each cruise instead of relentless hurricane damage. It's a real drag. But, no matter where you live, there are always weather related issues.

[Hlitner]

9 hours ago, Florida_gal_50 said:

Or you could pick all those things up and take it with you to the pinnacle to show how stupid this is.

I think HAL is being very transparent.  Over the years they have held the PG out as a prize for 4 and 5*s and then they started to use it for various promotions such as Have it All.  Now that so many are entitled to free (or reduced charge) PG meals, they simply downgrade what is included (and offered) at the PG.  Many years ago (I think we were 3 or 4* at the time) DW and I enjoyed a nice dinner in the PG and I ordered coffee and DW ordered tea.  We were charged extra for the tea, which we thought was just complete BS given that tea was free in the MDR and Lido.  A few days later we went back to the PG and this time DW ordered a "teapot of hot water" for which we were not charged.  In my pocket I had several tea bags we had taken from the Lido.

 

So now, if we want a starter and a salad (perish the thought) we have to pay $7?  I think that when we our on our next HAL cruise (March) we might consider arriving at the PG with salads we obtain from the Lido.  On the other hand, how long until HAL starts charging for every item in the Lido?

 

Hank

[Florida_gal_50]

30 minutes ago, albingirl said:

We feel badly as well. I'd gladly pay $1,000 to get to each cruise instead of relentless hurricane damage. It's a real drag. But, no matter where you live, there are always weather related issues.

There is.  I wouldn’t say living in the freezing cold and dealing with relentless snow storms is fun especially when you have to get to and from work in it.  There is no way to keep warm at minus 40.

[Florida_gal_50]

4 minutes ago, Hlitner said:

I think HAL is being very transparent.  Over the years they have held the PG out as a prize for 4 and 5*s and then they started to use it for various promotions such as Have it All.  Now that so many are entitled to free (or reduced charge) PG meals, they simply downgrade what is included (and offered) at the PG.  Many years ago (I think we were 3 or 4* at the time) DW and I enjoyed a nice dinner in the PG and I ordered coffee and DW ordered tea.  We were charged extra for the tea, which we thought was just complete BS given that tea was free in the MDR and Lido.  A few days later we went back to the PG and this time DW ordered a "teapot of hot water" for which we were not charged.  In my pocket I had several tea bags we had taken from the Lido.

 

So now, if we want a starter and a salad (perish the thought) we have to pay $7?  I think that when we our on our next HAL cruise (March) we might consider arriving at the PG with salads we obtain from the Lido.  On the other hand, how long until HAL starts charging for every item in the Lido?

 

 

Hank

That is crazy to charge for tea.  It’s no different than coffee.  I hope you do that.  I’m not setting foot in the pinnacle on my cruise unless it’s for lunch.  Too many other better choices of specialty restaurants.

[true45]

11 minutes ago, Hlitner said:

I think HAL is being very transparent.  Over the years they have held the PG out as a prize for 4 and 5*s and then they started to use it for various promotions such as Have it All.  Now that so many are entitled to free (or reduced charge) PG meals, they simply downgrade what is included (and offered) at the PG.  Many years ago (I think we were 3 or 4* at the time) DW and I enjoyed a nice dinner in the PG and I ordered coffee and DW ordered tea.  We were charged extra for the tea, which we thought was just complete BS given that tea was free in the MDR and Lido.  A few days later we went back to the PG and this time DW ordered a "teapot of hot water" for which we were not charged.  In my pocket I had several tea bags we had taken from the Lido.

 

So now, if we want a starter and a salad (perish the thought) we have to pay $7?  I think that when we our on our next HAL cruise (March) we might consider arriving at the PG with salads we obtain from the Lido.  On the other hand, how long until HAL starts charging for every item in the Lido?

 

Hank

Is petty the right word?  Charge for tea and if you have starter and salad?  
 

We are new to HAL but not new to cruising - mostly Celebrity but also Oceania & Disney Rccl.  Very surprised HAL would do this in Specialty Restaurants.

[Hlitner]

2 minutes ago, Florida_gal_50 said:

That is crazy to charge for tea.  It’s no different than coffee.  I hope you do that.  I’m not setting foot in the pinnacle on my cruise unless it’s for lunch.  Too many other better choices of specialty restaurants.

On this we agree.  That tea incident happened years ago and not sure of the current policy.  DW and I both think that lunch in the PG is always a treat.  But, even this was being cut-back prior to COVID.  When they first started those PG lunches they had an excellent Wagyu Beef burger which was amazing.  But 4 or 5 years ago they changed the Wagyu to a lower quality beef.  It was still good, but just not as good!

 

Some, who only cruise on HAL, think that all the cruise lines are cutting back in a similar manner as HAL.  We have posted (several times) that on our last few cruises (Seabourn, Princess and MSC) we have not noticed cut-backs and have actually noticed some improvements in cuisine.  All the lines are suffering from having lost many experienced crew, but this is working itself out as new crew members build up their experience.   We recently read some recent comments about the Enchanted Princess (we cruised on that ship in Dec 2021) which were glowing in terms of entertainment and cuisine.  Princess and Seabourn are both part of the "HAL Group" so I cannot understand why we hear about all these cut-backs and add-ons for HAL, but it is not happening on the other lines in the group.  We hope some of these decisions will be reversed prior to our next HAL cruise or it will likely be our last cruise with the line.  It is a very competitive cruise market and consumers can make their choice as to where they spend their money.    Just the other day we decided to look at some Fall 2023 Canada/NE cruises.  At the moment we are considering Explora Journeys or Seabourn.  Although HAL has some good itineraries in that region, we are not even considering that option.  HAL used to be our "go to" line in that region, but now, they are not even a consideration.

 

Hank

[taxmantoo]

9 hours ago, Crew News said:

Maybe consuming your initial appetizers in the bar across from the PG prior to your reservation time?  Perhaps add a glass of wine, as well.

Only if it's homemade wine that you so cleverly smuggled on board 🙂 

[true45]

4 minutes ago, Hlitner said:

On this we agree.  That tea incident happened years ago and not sure of the current policy.  DW and I both think that lunch in the PG is always a treat.  But, even this was being cut-back prior to COVID.  When they first started those PG lunches they had an excellent Wagyu Beef burger which was amazing.  But 4 or 5 years ago they changed the Wagyu to a lower quality beef.  It was still good, but just not as good!

 

Some, who only cruise on HAL, think that all the cruise lines are cutting back in a similar manner as HAL.  We have posted (several times) that on our last few cruises (Seabourn, Princess and MSC) we have not noticed cut-backs and have actually noticed some improvements in cuisine.  All the lines are suffering from having lost many experienced crew, but this is working itself out as new crew members build up their experience.   We recently read some recent comments about the Enchanted Princess (we cruised on that ship in Dec 2021) which were glowing in terms of entertainment and cuisine.  Princess and Seabourn are both part of the "HAL Group" so I cannot understand why we hear about all these cut-backs and add-ons for HAL, but it is not happening on the other lines in the group.  We hope some of these decisions will be reversed prior to our next HAL cruise or it will likely be our last cruise with the line.  It is a very competitive cruise market and consumers can make their choice as to where they spend their money.    Just the other day we decided to look at some Fall 2023 Canada/NE cruises.  At the moment we are considering Explora Journeys or Seabourn.  Although HAL has some good itineraries in that region, we are not even considering that option.  HAL used to be our "go to" line in that region, but now, they are not even a consideration.

 

Hank

We were on Celebrity 2x and Carnival (never again Carnival) once this past year ) and can say Celebrity food and service was exceptional  and improved.

[Hlitner]

1 hour ago, true45 said:

We were on Celebrity 2x and Carnival (never again Carnival) once this past year ) and can say Celebrity food and service was exceptional  and improved.

For us, Celebrity is an interesting case study.  We first started cruising with them in the 80s and they rapidly became one of our favorite cruise lines.  Then, in 2005, Celebrity named Lisa Lutoff-Perlo their new CEO (she came from RCI) and she quickly increased prices and started what I called "death by a thousand cut-backs."  The cut-backs were gradual, but consistent, and were often small things that were more annoying than a major issue.  Finally, we reached a point that we reduced and then stopped booking that line!  The major cut-back we noticed was with their cuisine, which is something that had previously been Celebrity's strong suit.   But now, we have been reading numerous comments/reviews that Celebrity has again improved their cuisine, and the line has also introduced a ship within a ship concept (Retreat Suites) which has our interest.   The line is on our personal radar, and we will likely book something when we stumble on an interesting itinerary and timing that works.

 

Just a note to HAL fans.  We all (HAL cruisers) praise the wonderful HAL crew (mostly Indonesian and Filipino) who have served legions of cruisers for decades.  While I agree that the HAL crew are generally excellent, we have also experienced excellent crew with several other lines.  Celebrity crew members can also be fantastic, and we have also found wonderful crew on Seabourn and in MSC's Yacht Club (not so happy with the crew outside the YC).   On Princess we have found the crew to be hit/miss with many excellent staff (as good as we get on HAL) and others that should find another profession.    But on Princess, we have had some interesting experiences in the past year.  On our last Princess cruise (Enchanted Princess) DW and I stayed aboard during a Caribbean port day and were relaxing in our deck chairs.  I decided to order a Bloody Mary and Mimosa, but it was during a major crew drill when the deck bars were temporarily closed (the staff were participating in the big drill).  But I used their app and ordered the drinks (the staff can find you via the locator medallion worn or carried by each passenger).  About 10 minutes later a bar waiter from the International Cafe (on deck 5) came to our loungers with our drinks.  We knew this waiter and asked him why he was serving drinks on Deck 16 (a long way from his Deck 5 station).  He said that nearly all the crew was involved in the drill and he was one of the few working on Deck 5.  The system and staff realized that there was no service up on 16 so made the drinks on Deck 5 and had the waiter go up 11 decks and far forward (to where we were lounging) to deliver our drinks.  Amazing service.

 

Hank

[Damcruiser]

3 hours ago, albingirl said:

 But, no matter where you live, there are always weather related issues.

We must live in the most boring city in N America.

No tornados, no hurricanes, no earthquakes, no forest fires, no sinkholes, no landslides and the worst weather always seem to go around us.  Summer drought is a bit of an issue this year.

 

As the say, "if you can't stand the heat get out of the kitchen" (or Florida)

[Damcruiser]

14 minutes ago, Hlitner said:

For us, Celebrity is an interesting case study.  We first started cruising with them in the 80s and they rapidly became one of our favorite cruise lines.  Then, in 2005, Celebrity named Lisa Lutoff-Perlo their new CEO (she came from RCI) and she quickly increased prices and started what I called "death by a thousand cut-backs."  The cut-backs were gradual, but consistent, and were often small things that were more annoying than a major issue. 

 

Hank

Hank, I appreciate your insights more than anyone else on Cruise Critic.

Perhaps it's because you always state so eloquently what I have also experienced (except for the luxury lines).  

As a long time Celebrity cruiser, the most loyal cruisers were given a lounge from which they have now been exiled. On Celebrity, if you are not in a suite, one's loyalty means very little, and we have moved on.

[true45]

10 minutes ago, Hlitner said:

For us, Celebrity is an interesting case study.  We first started cruising with them in the 80s and they rapidly became one of our favorite cruise lines.  Then, in 2005, Celebrity named Lisa Lutoff-Perlo their new CEO (she came from RCI) and she quickly increased prices and started what I called "death by a thousand cut-backs."  The cut-backs were gradual, but consistent, and were often small things that were more annoying than a major issue.  Finally, we reached a point that we reduced and then stopped booking that line!  The major cut-back we noticed was with their cuisine, which is something that had previously been Celebrity's strong suit.   But now, we have been reading numerous comments/reviews that Celebrity has again improved their cuisine, and the line has also introduced a ship within a ship concept (Retreat Suites) which has our interest.   The line is on our personal radar, and we will likely book something when we stumble on an interesting itinerary and timing that works.

 

Just a note to HAL fans.  We all (HAL cruisers) praise the wonderful HAL crew (mostly Indonesian and Filipino) who have served legions of cruisers for decades.  While I agree that the HAL crew are generally excellent, we have also experienced excellent crew with several other lines.  Celebrity crew members can also be fantastic, and we have also found wonderful crew on Seabourn and in MSC's Yacht Club (not so happy with the crew outside the YC).   On Princess we have found the crew to be hit/miss with many excellent staff (as good as we get on HAL) and others that should find another profession.    But on Princess, we have had some interesting experiences in the past year.  On our last Princess cruise (Enchanted Princess) DW and I stayed aboard during a Caribbean port day and were relaxing in our deck chairs.  I decided to order a Bloody Mary and Mimosa, but it was during a major crew drill when the deck bars were temporarily closed (the staff were participating in the big drill).  But I used their app and ordered the drinks (the staff can find you via the locator medallion worn or carried by each passenger).  About 10 minutes later a bar waiter from the International Cafe (on deck 5) came to our loungers with our drinks.  We knew this waiter and asked him why he was serving drinks on Deck 16 (a long way from his Deck 5 station).  He said that nearly all the crew was involved in the drill and he was one of the few working on Deck 5.  The system and staff realized that there was no service up on 16 so made the drinks on Deck 5 and had the waiter go up 11 decks and far forward (to where we were lounging) to deliver our drinks.  Amazing service.

 

Hank

 

10 minutes ago, Hlitner said:

For us, Celebrity is an interesting case study.  We first started cruising with them in the 80s and they rapidly became one of our favorite cruise lines.  Then, in 2005, Celebrity named Lisa Lutoff-Perlo their new CEO (she came from RCI) and she quickly increased prices and started what I called "death by a thousand cut-backs."  The cut-backs were gradual, but consistent, and were often small things that were more annoying than a major issue.  Finally, we reached a point that we reduced and then stopped booking that line!  The major cut-back we noticed was with their cuisine, which is something that had previously been Celebrity's strong suit.   But now, we have been reading numerous comments/reviews that Celebrity has again improved their cuisine, and the line has also introduced a ship within a ship concept (Retreat Suites) which has our interest.   The line is on our personal radar, and we will likely book something when we stumble on an interesting itinerary and timing that works.

 

Just a note to HAL fans.  We all (HAL cruisers) praise the wonderful HAL crew (mostly Indonesian and Filipino) who have served legions of cruisers for decades.  While I agree that the HAL crew are generally excellent, we have also experienced excellent crew with several other lines.  Celebrity crew members can also be fantastic, and we have also found wonderful crew on Seabourn and in MSC's Yacht Club (not so happy with the crew outside the YC).   On Princess we have found the crew to be hit/miss with many excellent staff (as good as we get on HAL) and others that should find another profession.    But on Princess, we have had some interesting experiences in the past year.  On our last Princess cruise (Enchanted Princess) DW and I stayed aboard during a Caribbean port day and were relaxing in our deck chairs.  I decided to order a Bloody Mary and Mimosa, but it was during a major crew drill when the deck bars were temporarily closed (the staff were participating in the big drill).  But I used their app and ordered the drinks (the staff can find you via the locator medallion worn or carried by each passenger).  About 10 minutes later a bar waiter from the International Cafe (on deck 5) came to our loungers with our drinks.  We knew this waiter and asked him why he was serving drinks on Deck 16 (a long way from his Deck 5 station).  He said that nearly all the crew was involved in the drill and he was one of the few working on Deck 5.  The system and staff realized that there was no service up on 16 so made the drinks on Deck 5 and had the waiter go up 11 decks and far forward (to where we were lounging) to deliver our drinks.  Amazing service.

 

Hank

Yes, I won a cruise in 1984 as my first and started with Celebrity soon after in the Michel Roux days.  Recently, there were some cutbacks such as the cutting off of the pillow chocolates but to their credit, it didn’t last long.  The Apex, our last cruise with them in January was fantastic- best entertainment we ever had on a ship in variety and talent as was the food which was varied in the buffet and dining rooms.  The 4-main no extra charge rooms were wonderful.  Prices start high, yes but there are many sales.  We loved the aft balcony — giant balcony bigger cabin with doors — don’t like the infinite balcony at all.

 

We like the itineraries on Holland, therefore our first sailing with them but really hate the nitpicking.  Chocolates only on dressy nights really?  This may not seem important but cutbacks do show as they add up to taint the experience.  Will I be asked if we want turndown in evenings?  It would be the first time.

[PACD_JG]

6 minutes ago, Damcruiser said:

As the say, "if you can't stand the heat get out of the kitchen" (or Florida)

 

It is one of the dumbest things I've read in a bit...somebody who has the means to move (as a prolific cruiser), but instead complains about the weather where they live.

[Hlitner]

27 minutes ago, Damcruiser said:

Hank, I appreciate your insights more than anyone else on Cruise Critic.

Perhaps it's because you always state so eloquently what I have also experienced (except for the luxury lines).  

As a long time Celebrity cruiser, the most loyal cruisers were given a lounge from which they have now been exiled. On Celebrity, if you are not in a suite, one's loyalty means very little, and we have moved on.

We heard about the lounge (Elite) thing.  That started to wane as X moved to drink packages (now included with most bookings) which made the Elite Lounge somewhat less valuable since we no longer needed it for free cocktails.  But I do know that many folks enjoyed that evening cocktail lounge for the socialization and seeing old friends.  Now, it is all about the "Retreat" Suites.  One issue we have with those suites is that it can cost more to cruise on Celebrity in a "Retreat Suite" than to go on lines like Seabourn and even Silverseas.  Go figure.

 

Hank

[cruisemom42]

Sometimes I think that I'm lucky to have cruised many different lines but not enough with any one line to have "loyalty" perks make any difference in my decision making. 😁  It makes it simpler for me to assess what I like and what I don't like on a given line, without the intangibles.  (And I say intangibles since, to me, none of the loyalty perks at the lower levels are worth enough to sway my consideration....)

 

My four cruises since Covid restart have all been on Celebrity and I have loved every one of them. But I also like variety and I'm ready to try a different line before Celebrity starts to get stale. I hope that my 28-day Japan cruise on HAL in April will be a go, although other lines have mostly canceled their spring Asia itineraries -- it will be a good chance to get onboard a different ship with different ways of doing things. I don't really "get" people who want every ship and line to have the exact same way of doing things.

 

I'm also booked on Azamara and flirting with an Oceania booking for 2023 given that they have finally made a small nod toward solo cruisers with some solo OV cabins that are not 200% supplement....

 

Variety is the spice of life, they say.

 

[AncientWanderer]

We've always hopped around to different cruise lines in order to see what they're up to.  I post almost exclusivity on the HAL board, because all things considered, they remain our favorite and I'm most interested in keeping abreast of HAL activities.

Of course, I'm comparing HAL to other mid-tier cruise lines.  Not sure it's really fair to compare them to Seabourn.

That said, we definitely did not like seeing a big thing of bacon on the cutting board at a Lido lunch.  No-no, HAL.

[cbr663]

4 hours ago, Hlitner said:

I think HAL is being very transparent.  Over the years they have held the PG out as a prize for 4 and 5*s and then they started to use it for various promotions such as Have it All.  Now that so many are entitled to free (or reduced charge) PG meals, they simply downgrade what is included (and offered) at the PG.  Many years ago (I think we were 3 or 4* at the time) DW and I enjoyed a nice dinner in the PG and I ordered coffee and DW ordered tea.  We were charged extra for the tea, which we thought was just complete BS given that tea was free in the MDR and Lido.  A few days later we went back to the PG and this time DW ordered a "teapot of hot water" for which we were not charged.  In my pocket I had several tea bags we had taken from the Lido.

 

So now, if we want a starter and a salad (perish the thought) we have to pay $7?  I think that when we our on our next HAL cruise (March) we might consider arriving at the PG with salads we obtain from the Lido.  On the other hand, how long until HAL starts charging for every item in the Lido?

 

Hank

 

Exactly.  Over the years HAL has turned the PG from a profit centre into a cost centre as most of the passengers dining there are not paying the extra supplement to do so. As a cost centre the PG will face the same pressures as any other cost centre to reduce those costs wherever possible.

[idiebabe]

5 hours ago, Florida_gal_50 said:

Why would you like it?  I would pay for some items if they were more special in a specialty restaurant.  That doesn’t mean a salad or appetizers in the pinnacle.  I’m not willing to pay it in a dining room where they are cooking a lot at once.  If it’s because you want to support the line why not get them to add a couple thousand on your cruise fare.  That would definitely go further.  I am serious about it.

Why would I like it has nothing to do with supporting the Line?  Ridiculous comment!  🙄 Whether I think it's right or not that they have these Upcharge items will not change the fact that they are doing it.   The new options, IMO, are better because it gives people a reasonably priced choice of a dinner they may enjoy without going to a Specialty Restaurant especially since the Menu does keep declining!

 

Maybe it's you who needs to have them add on to your Cruise Fare thousands more so you can go to Pinnacle for Dinner again since they implemented the $7 charge for the 2nd App!  Maybe they'll take it off just for you!  🤣

 

We don't like the $7 charge and told them that but we're not going to act childish about it and stop going to Pinnacle when we enjoy it.

 

@Hlitner  In all my Years cruising HAL I've never been charged for a cup of Tea in the DR or any Specialty Restaurant.  I know that was a big issue all over Social Media with Carnival Cruise Lines.  Are you confusing HAL with Carnival?  Also,  I don't think comparing Seabourn to HAL is Apples to Apples when it comes to pricing.  Correct me if I'm wrong! 

Edited November 14, 2022 by idiebabe

[Hlitner]

15 minutes ago, idiebabe said:

Why would I like it has nothing to do with supporting the Line?  Ridiculous comment!  🙄 Whether I think it's right or not that they have these Upcharge items will not change the fact that they are doing it.   The new options, IMO, are better because it gives people a reasonably priced choice of a dinner they may enjoy without going to a Specialty Restaurant especially since the Menu does keep declining!

 

Maybe it's you who needs to have them add on to your Cruise Fare thousands more so you can go to Pinnacle for Dinner again since they implemented the $7 charge for the 2nd App!  Maybe they'll take it off just for you!  🤣

 

We don't like the $7 charge and told them that but we're not going to act childish about it and stop going to Pinnacle when we enjoy it.

 

@Hlitner  In all my Years cruising HAL I've never been charged for a cup of Tea in the DR or any Specialty Restaurant.  I know that was a big issue all over Social Media with Carnival Cruise Lines.  Are you confusing HAL with Carnival?  Also,  I don't think comparing Seabourn to HAL is Apples to Apples when it comes to pricing.  Correct me if I'm wrong! 

No confusion.  As I said, this happened quite a few years ago and since it never happened again, HAL stopped that practice.  As DW (the tea drinker) recalls, the explanation from Pinnacle staff was that the PG had better tea :).  DW is funny about her tea and generally sticks to Earl Gray or English Breakfast.  But she claims there is very little difference between the typical Bigelow

[Hlitner]

sorry, but the last post was not finished,  

 

We were talking about teas and DW telling me there is little difference (in flavor) between the typical Bigelow or Twinnings and some of the higher priced boutique teas such as Tea Forte (sold on Celebrity at their International Cafe).

[Hlitner]

A recent post mentioned price comparisons between Seabourn and HAL.  2 or our last 3 Sebourn cruises cost us less than $450 per passenger/day.  Consider that for that price it is all inclusive and includes unlimited top shelf booze, wine, tips (no tipping on SB), unlimited Internet, a Suite, restocked mini-bar, caviar, French Champagne, etc.  There are no -add ons on Seabourn except for expensive wines or special booze (such as XOs, JW Blue, etc).  Compare that to what you pay on HAL for a Signature Suite, tips, mini-bar stuff, drinks, etc.  And also keep in mind that the space ratios on SB are in the 70+ tons per person as compared to HAL's approximate 40.  SB also has a much better staff-passenger ratio which results in amazing service.  On SB there is no such thing as a queue, tender ticket, photographer, art auction, etc.  It is an entirely different experience than being on mass market lines (like HAL) and can be truly addicting.  When you have experienced "Caviar in the Surf" on a leased beach facility it is hard to come back to HAL.   

 

Hank

[dwc13]

2 hours ago, PACD_JG said:

 

It is one of the dumbest things I've read in a bit...somebody who has the means to move (as a prolific cruiser), but instead complains about the weather where they live.

 

In fairness, not everyone is able to relocate to another area even if financial means are not the primary obstacle. Remote working isn't an option for everyone. First responders, most health care workers, bus drivers, garbage collectors, etc., are among many who don't have that option. A person who has been with an employer for years and is relatively close to qualifying for a pension -- perhaps a school district or state/county/city government employee -- isn't likely to switch jobs and move at that point absent unusual circumstances. A licensed professional such as a doctor, attorney, plumber/electrician would have to qualify in order to practice in another state; if they have their own established practice, starting over on their own in another state would be a major undertaking. Perhaps there are elderly parents who need some assistance in the area. Many on CC are probably familiar with that scenario to some degree. On the other end of the spectrum, how about having 2 kids currently in high school with aspirations of attending the University of Florida? UF is among the top public universities in the country. And don't forget about the state income tax advantage Florida offers its residents.

 

If you live in Florida, the threat from hurricane damage is very real, even if the probability of sustaining major loss is quite low. It's a part of life and you accept it and go about your business. Basically, you're hoping when a hurricane hits the state it loses strength fast and moves away quickly and/or lands elsewhere, far enough away from your area so that any damage/losses sustained are relatively minimal. Nobody wishes their neighbors ill-will when it comes to hurricane damage; rather, people are relieved and count their blessings when they are largely spared (Tampa-St. Petersburg). Unfortunately, sometimes that means others in the Sunshine State are not as lucky and bore the brunt (Fort Myers).

 

 

[Hlitner]

4 hours ago, Damcruiser said:

We must live in the most boring city in N America.

No tornados, no hurricanes, no earthquakes, no forest fires, no sinkholes, no landslides and the worst weather always seem to go around us.  Summer drought is a bit of an issue this year.

 

As the say, "if you can't stand the heat get out of the kitchen" (or Florida)

Hmmm, you do have the LCBO :).  We will admit to enjoying your Provence (when "Junior" deems it OK for us to visit).

 

 

[daisy-mae]

1 hour ago, Hlitner said:

A recent post mentioned price comparisons between Seabourn and HAL...Compare that to what you pay on HAL for a Signature Suite, tips, mini-bar stuff, drinks, etc.  ... On SB there is no such thing as a queue, tender ticket, photographer, art auction, etc.  It is an entirely different experience than being on mass market lines (like HAL) and can be truly addicting.  When you have experienced "Caviar in the Surf" on a leased beach facility it is hard to come back to HAL.   

 

Hank

Agreed, it does sound like an entirely different experience, with an entirely different price point for those who may not be interested in a suite, unlimited drinks, or a segregated ship-within-a-ship experience.

 

We are not big drinkers, nor are we intrigued by the possibility of tasting caviar, so rather than choose to pay $450 x 2 per day, and subsidize our fellow passengers who enjoy unlimited alcohol and all of the other perks, we choose to allocate our leisure funds to more economical yet (for us) just as enjoyable vacation options. And in that regard, HAL seems to fit the bill, at least for the time being.

 

I guess it's a matter of "whatever floats your boat" 🙂

 

[Sea42]

3 hours ago, cbr663 said:

 

Exactly.  Over the years HAL has turned the PG from a profit centre into a cost centre as most of the passengers dining there are not paying the extra supplement to do so. As a cost centre the PG will face the same pressures as any other cost centre to reduce those costs wherever possible.

But that's not entirely the case. Those "free" dinners are being paid for in part, by the cost of HIA. HAL is not giving them away for nothing.