Virgin fires a shot across Celebrity’s bow

[MISTER 67]

On 9/19/2023 at 5:56 PM, jelayne said:

Target is broader than just X.  Once daily cabin cleaning has been a cut back on other lines.  

We’ve been on 9 cruises since the startup with 5 Celebrity cruises and have had twice a day cabin service on all 5 cruises. Not so on Holland America with only once a day with 2 cruises. With Princess we had twice a day service on 2 cruises but that was early in the startup with the Princess ships only half full.

Edited September 22, 2023 by MISTER 67

[wineoclock]

Our upcoming Beyond cruise is almost sold out. 
 

Imo I don’t think Celebrity will be changing any of their policies anytime soon if ships are sailing full, unless the cruise surveys are scathing then it may give them pause to reflect.
 

Personally I don’t see that happening unless ships are regularly not selling. 

[deliver42]

I don't think anyone knows the fallout on Celebrity until after 10/4 when the new All Included takes effect. Anything booked now is still under the old policy. We don't know what the pricing will be, whether they lower the price to offset the gratuities or keep them the same or raise the cruise price to lower the all included. On Oct 4, we'll know a lot more, and we'll see what the bookings look like.

[NutsAboutGolf]

1 minute ago, deliver42 said:

I don't think anyone knows the fallout on Celebrity until after 10/4 when the new All Included takes effect. Anything booked now is still under the old policy. We don't know what the pricing will be, whether they lower the price to offset the gratuities or keep them the same or raise the cruise price to lower the all included. On Oct 4, we'll know a lot more, and we'll see what the bookings look like.

For most the gratuity difference is under $200/pp, are many going to notice?

[NutsAboutGolf]

1 hour ago, wineoclock said:

Our upcoming Beyond cruise is almost sold out. 
 

Imo I don’t think Celebrity will be changing any of their policies anytime soon if ships are sailing full, unless the cruise surveys are scathing then it may give them pause to reflect.
 

Personally I don’t see that happening unless ships are regularly not selling. 

They’re always used occupancy based dynamic pricing.  They’ll open up high and progressively lower the price if there’s lots of available inventory

[MarkWiltonM]

When we were on a cruise in 2022 (I think it was HAL), there was a sign in the bathroom asking us if we wanted to opt in to once-a-day cleaning, limited bed-linen changing, and reusing towels as much as possible for "environmental reasons." Of course, it saves the cruise line money as well but we were all for it. We did sometimes need some extra towels or fresh washcloths but that just took a call to our cabin attendants. It is nice to have the bed straightened up and turned down in the evening (while we're at dinner). I can't remember if they still did this or not.   

[the penguins]

3 hours ago, NutsAboutGolf said:

For most the gratuity difference is under $200/pp, are many going to notice?

It will/should be pretty clear if you adding AI to your booking as the price should be around $18 a day less than it is now. Also very clear if anyone is comparing with say Princess which is around $60 a day for WiFi, drinks and tips or HAL which I think is similar or NCL around $96 which also includes an excursion credit.

[commodoredave]

On 9/19/2023 at 6:08 PM, Baggy178 said:

In all fairness who needs a cabin cleaned more than once a day anyway.

But for the rest Virgin seems to have their finger on the pulse.

I agree with you. But some folks may be messier and dirtier than us! 😆

[eroller]

1 hour ago, commodoredave said:

I agree with you. But some folks may be messier and dirtier than us! 😆

 

For me it’s just one of those differentiators that make cruising special.  Keep chipping away at them and might as well stay at a Holiday Inn.  

[vwlmember]

On 9/21/2023 at 5:45 PM, eroller said:

 

 

I think the financial stability of all cruise lines is questionable right now.  They have all extensively borrowed (except MSC) during COVID and are now trying to renegotiate the debt.  It was only this last quarter that the RCG and NCLH finally posted a quarterly profit.  All losses until just recently.  Carnival Corp. has yet to post a profit since COVID.  

True. But Virgin is a one trick pony. Their ships are identical. You don't have a choice of size, amenities or even a slight variation between builds. NCL, Celebrity,  RCL, Carnival have a variety of ships to chose from. This is an issue for them. 

[rmedistro]

4 minutes ago, vwlmember said:

True. But Virgin is a one trick pony. Their ships are identical. You don't have a choice of size, amenities or even a slight variation between builds. NCL, Celebrity,  RCL, Carnival have a variety of ships to chose from. This is an issue for them. 

Every line has to start somewhere. And typically cruise lines build ships over time in distinct class/size. I would imagine Virgin will eventually migrate to a 2nd class of new ships that vary from what they offer currently, just as all the others have decade to decade over time.

[eroller]

1 hour ago, vwlmember said:

True. But Virgin is a one trick pony. Their ships are identical. You don't have a choice of size, amenities or even a slight variation between builds. NCL, Celebrity,  RCL, Carnival have a variety of ships to chose from. This is an issue for them. 

You may see it as an issue but I think many don’t.  People love consistency across a brand, and Virgin has a much easier time delivering that with one fleet type.  Viking and the new Explora Journeys are the same.  They also take advantage of economies of scale with one fleet type, and it makes crew training much easier.  Only one ship to learn.  
 

I agree with poster rmedistro that the fleet will eventually evolve as the brand grows.  Not just to add new amenities and features, but to comply with ever changing SOLAS and other regulatory agencies.  

[bnurick]

Boarding the Disney Fantasy today for a 7 night eastern carribean cruise. Have a live review started on the DCL page. It should be a magical cruise. Cheers!

[AlaskaNewbie68]

Just to update anyone considering Virgin: As I mentioned earlier they cancelled our January cruise...I was told 11 days ago we would get refund in 7-10 days. I called Thurs to check on it and was told "it will be there tomorrow". Called last night and told "the accounting dept is closed, I can't check." Told today there was a "glitch" and it never got pushed through and they just did it, which means it takes ANOTHER 7-10 days! I asked to speak to a manager (Just call me Karen!) who said there was nothing she can do to expedite it. This is called customer service????

[doghog]

9 minutes ago, AlaskaNewbie68 said:

Just to update anyone considering Virgin: As I mentioned earlier they cancelled our January cruise...I was told 11 days ago we would get refund in 7-10 days. I called Thurs to check on it and was told "it will be there tomorrow". Called last night and told "the accounting dept is closed, I can't check." Told today there was a "glitch" and it never got pushed through and they just did it, which means it takes ANOTHER 7-10 days! I asked to speak to a manager (Just call me Karen!) who said there was nothing she can do to expedite it. This is called customer service????

Not just a VV customer service issue. 

[mahdnc]

39 minutes ago, AlaskaNewbie68 said:

Just to update anyone considering Virgin: As I mentioned earlier they cancelled our January cruise...I was told 11 days ago we would get refund in 7-10 days. I called Thurs to check on it and was told "it will be there tomorrow". Called last night and told "the accounting dept is closed, I can't check." Told today there was a "glitch" and it never got pushed through and they just did it, which means it takes ANOTHER 7-10 days! I asked to speak to a manager (Just call me Karen!) who said there was nothing she can do to expedite it. This is called customer service????

Playing the float is very profitable these days……

[The_Big_M]

On 9/22/2023 at 10:12 PM, deliver42 said:

I don't think anyone knows the fallout on Celebrity until after 10/4 when the new All Included takes effect. Anything booked now is still under the old policy. We don't know what the pricing will be, whether they lower the price to offset the gratuities or keep them the same or raise the cruise price to lower the all included. On Oct 4, we'll know a lot more, and we'll see what the bookings look like.

 

I can't see any reason to think it's different from what they said, that gratuities will no longer be included. Pricing will be the same as at present (with the usual variability). 

 

If they were going to reduce the price by the equivalent it would have been sold as being about choice, and the only reason they would do that is to reduce the headline price... but that's only going to be about ~$200 so not much impact in price advertising (or due to complaints about people paying gratuities, but that isn't the case).

 

Same reason they're also gutting the credit included to suite guests, again to boost revenue, not that they'll also cut the suite cost by $400 (+~$200) person, which makes no sense.

[mahdnc]

20 minutes ago, The_Big_M said:

 

I can't see any reason to think it's different from what they said, that gratuities will no longer be included. Pricing will be the same as at present (with the usual variability). 

 

If they were going to reduce the price by the equivalent it would have been sold as being about choice, and the only reason they would do that is to reduce the headline price... but that's only going to be about ~$200 so not much impact in price advertising (or due to complaints about people paying gratuities, but that isn't the case).

 

Same reason they're also gutting the credit included to suite guests, again to boost revenue, not that they'll also cut the suite cost by $400 (+~$200) person, which makes no sense.

 

I totally agree.  These were backdoor price increases without actually raising the price.

[NutsAboutGolf]

5 hours ago, vwlmember said:

True. But Virgin is a one trick pony. Their ships are identical. You don't have a choice of size, amenities or even a slight variation between builds. NCL, Celebrity,  RCL, Carnival have a variety of ships to chose from. This is an issue for them. 

 

Some like variety and some don't.  We fall in the camp of that we like the latest and greatest even if the new ship is identical to the old ship

[mac_tlc]

29 minutes ago, mahdnc said:

 

I totally agree.  These were backdoor price increases without actually raising the price.

I tend to agree but we shall see. I picked four random cruises and have been tracking prices since the beginning of September --- not every day, just on Fridays. I'll keep it up through about October 20th or 27th. Also will check on 10/3 and 10/4.  Here is what one looks like so far. 

 

	Celebrity Ascent - 2/2/2025 - 7N Eastern Caribbean
Category	9/1/2023	9/8/2023	9/15/2023	9/22/2023	9/29/2023	10/3/2023	10/4/2023
E2	$    4,457	$    4,542	$    4,667	$    4,467
Aqua - A1	$    5,856	$    6,131	$    6,256	$    6,131
Sky Suite	$   11,094	$  10,939	$   11,094	$   10,969

Edited September 23, 2023 by mac_tlc

[the penguins]

14 hours ago, The_Big_M said:

 

I can't see any reason to think it's different from what they said, that gratuities will no longer be included. Pricing will be the same as at present (with the usual variability). 

 

If they were going to reduce the price by the equivalent it would have been sold as being about choice, and the only reason they would do that is to reduce the headline price... but that's only going to be about ~$200 so not much impact in price advertising (or due to complaints about people paying gratuities, but that isn't the case).

 

Same reason they're also gutting the credit included to suite guests, again to boost revenue, not that they'll also cut the suite cost by $400 (+~$200) person, which makes no sense.

X did say that the change in AI pricing would be adjusted to take account of the Grats being removed. What X didn't say was by exactly how much.

[hcat]

17 hours ago, mac_tlc said:

I tend to agree but we shall see. I picked four random cruises and have been tracking prices since the beginning of September --- not every day, just on Fridays. I'll keep it up through about October 20th or 27th. Also will check on 10/3 and 10/4.  Here is what one looks like so far. 

 

	Celebrity Ascent - 2/2/2025 - 7N Eastern Caribbean
Category	9/1/2023	9/8/2023	9/15/2023	9/22/2023	9/29/2023	10/3/2023	10/4/2023
E2	$    4,457	$    4,542	$    4,667	$    4,467
Aqua - A1	$    5,856	$    6,131	$    6,256	$    6,131
Sky Suite	$   11,094	$  10,939	$   11,094	$   10,969

Interesting  chart. Are these prices per person or for 2?

 

Glad we are set with our Aqua cabin on Ascent for Jan 2024, with All In pricing (grats,  classic alc, basic wi -- not needed)

 

Re:  comments above that Virgin ships are identical..The  X ships in each class ( Horizon/ Century/ Galaxy; M Class, S, &  E)  were/ are very similar but each has its own identity in some ways...Some had various changes and additions made along the way .They follow the pattern of their class but for us they do not feel cookie cutter..or boring.

 

Celeb was much better  in many ways when it had a smaller fleet..  Once Royal took it over it began to change, not an overall improvement, but X does have great ships!

 

We are looking at a few other lines  like Cunard and O but  not Virgin ...

[mac_tlc]

5 minutes ago, hcat said:

Interesting  chart. Are these prices per person or for 2?

 

Glad we are set with our Aqua cabin on Ascent for Jan 2024, with All In pricing (grats,  classic alc, basic wi -- not needed)

 

Re:  comments above that Virgin ships are identical..The  X ships in each class ( Horizon/ Century/ Galaxy; M Class, S, &  E)  were/ are very similar but each has its own identity in some ways...Some had various changes and additions made along the way .They follow the pattern of their class but for us they do not feel cookie cutter..or boring.

 

Celeb was much better  in many ways when it had a smaller fleet..  Once Royal took it over it began to change, not an overall improvement, but X does have great ships!

 

We are looking at a few other lines  like Cunard and O but  not Virgin ...

Probably should have included a bit more info:

 

All prices are for 2. Non-refundable deposit. All-included option. 
 

mac_tlc

[hcat]

8 minutes ago, mac_tlc said:

Probably should have included a bit more info:

 

All prices are for 2. Non-refundable deposit. All-included option. 
 

mac_tlc

thought so.. 

Don't have paperwork with me but it will be interesting to compare current pricing with our booked pric fir Prime AQ..We are approaching final payment date.

[hcat]

29 minutes ago, hcat said:

thought so.. 

Don't have paperwork with me but it will be interesting to compare current pricing with our booked pric fir Prime AQ..We are approaching final payment date.

my husb found res on his laptop..

We  are paying total of  $ 4,968 for 2 late Jan 2024.

 

Seems prices went up overall since we booked, as expected..we are now priced out of AQ class..

 

next 2 cruises are an SV( APEX) and Conc Class ( Silhouette)