Are you also worried about cost cutting that we don't see

[ghstudio]

It's clear to me that celebrity is on a "reduce the cost, increase the revenue" course at flank speed. As passengers we have seen several areas where people have been reduced, prices have been increased, etc...no need to rehash them here..plenty of other threads. But I have a new concern....if there is this "full steam ahead on cost cutting" that we see.....what about the operation of the ship, the maintenance of the ship (no, not the rust we see...the stuff we don't see), the inner workings of the ship.

 

It's hard to believe that the only cutbacks are passenger facing. I have no facts...how would I....but this must be going on in parallel.

 

Am I the only one who is concerned?

Edited May 14, 2014 by ghstudio

[ECCruise]

It's clear to me that celebrity is on a "reduce the cost, increase the revenue" course at flank speed. As passengers we have seen several areas where people have been reduced, prices have been increased, etc...no need to rehash them here..plenty of other threads. But I have a new concern....if there is this "full steam ahead on cost cutting" that we see.....what about the operation of the ship, the maintenance of the ship (no, not the rust we see...the stuff we don't see), the inner workings of the ship.

 

It's hard to believe that the only cutbacks are passenger facing. I have no facts...how would I....but this must be going on in parallel.

 

Am I the only one who is concerned?

 

It's funny, but we have thought exactly the same thing.

If there is no fear of cutbacks in the areas that are front and center, what might be happening in the areas that are less obvious?

 

Let the cheerleading begin....:)

[TomTN]

It's clear to me that celebrity is on a "reduce the cost, increase the revenue" course at flank speed. As passengers we have seen several areas where people have been reduced, prices have been increased, etc...no need to rehash them here..plenty of other threads. But I have a new concern....if there is this "full steam ahead on cost cutting" that we see.....what about the operation of the ship, the maintenance of the ship (no, not the rust we see...the stuff we don't see), the inner workings of the ship.

 

It's hard to believe that the only cutbacks are passenger facing. I have no facts...how would I....but this must be going on in parallel.

 

Am I the only one who is concerned?

 

Is that what happened at Carnival or was the breakdown of so many of their ships just coincidence?

 

Twenty years ago I worked as a consultant for a chemical company in xxx. The CEO received a bonus based on the bottom line, and their bottom line looked great. I worked on tax issues, but primarily worked with engineers and maintenance people. I questioned the decrease in tax that was being paid in the manufacturing area. Their explanation was that the CEO had ordered the elimination or reduction of ongoing preventative maintenance. they were all very concerned about the possibility of an explosion.

Yes, he received his bonus.

 

Is something similar happening at X?:confused:

 

I have said I would not sail on Carnival because I believe this is what happened to them. Well, other reasons too.;)

[OCruisers]

Excellent thought provoking thread! Certainly a concern!

LuLu

[20pluscruises]

It's clear to me that celebrity is on a "reduce the cost, increase the revenue" course at flank speed. As passengers we have seen several areas where people have been reduced, prices have been increased, etc...no need to rehash them here..plenty of other threads. But I have a new concern....if there is this "full steam ahead on cost cutting" that we see.....what about the operation of the ship, the maintenance of the ship (no, not the rust we see...the stuff we don't see), the inner workings of the ship.

 

It's hard to believe that the only cutbacks are passenger facing. I have no facts...how would I....but this must be going on in parallel.

 

Am I the only one who is concerned?

 

It has crossed my mind more than once. :eek: However, I would think/hope they would never put their customers in danger.

[Phxazzcruisers]

I truly hope that there were too many lessons learned about the consequences when breakdowns, etc occur. I believe they would want to avoid any of those issues at any cost. The dollar cost in terms of loss (reputation, passengers, etc)are far greater than the costs they could save through cuts.

[20pluscruises]

Is that what happened at Carnival or was the breakdown of so many of their ships just coincidence?

 

Twenty years ago I worked as a consultant for a chemical company in xxx. The CEO received a bonus based on the bottom line, and their bottom line looked great. I worked on tax issues, but primarily worked with engineers and maintenance people. I questioned the decrease in tax that was being paid in the manufacturing area. Their explanation was that the CEO had ordered the elimination or reduction of ongoing preventative maintenance. they were all very concerned about the possibility of an explosion.

Yes, he received his bonus.

 

Is something similar happening at X?:confused:

 

I have said I would not sail on Carnival because I believe this is what happened to them. Well, other reasons too.;)

 

:eek::eek::eek: Was his bonus also over one million?

[TomTN]

:eek::eek::eek: Was his bonus also over one million?

 

Of course, and stock options. Better income typically gois along with a higher stock price so he made plenty there.

 

Like most of these guys he left before his management issues caught up with him.

 

This was/is a very honorable company who put the wrong guy in charge. he put himself before the company.

[nomad098]

It's clear to me that celebrity is on a "reduce the cost, increase the revenue" course at flank speed. As passengers we have seen several areas where people have been reduced, prices have been increased, etc...no need to rehash them here..plenty of other threads. But I have a new concern....if there is this "full steam ahead on cost cutting" that we see.....what about the operation of the ship, the maintenance of the ship (no, not the rust we see...the stuff we don't see), the inner workings of the ship.

 

It's hard to believe that the only cutbacks are passenger facing. I have no facts...how would I....but this must be going on in parallel.

 

Am I the only one who is concerned?

 

Not so much worried about operation of the ship, ship safety or essential maintenance as I would have thought these things like this are checked by outside bodies

 

But things like cuts to call centre staffing, training, back room staff, non essential maintenance (window washing), downgrading of things like the cleaning products that are less effective but cheaper probably have a detrimental effect on the people we do not generally see but are an integral part of our cruising experience

[20pluscruises]

Of course, and stock options. Better income typically gois along with a higher stock price so he made plenty there.

 

Like most of these guys he left before his management issues caught up with him.

 

This was/is a very honorable company who put the wrong guy in charge. he put himself before the company.

 

...and cashed out all of his stocks before they fell I'm sure. AWFUL!!!

[kysupt]

It's clear to me that celebrity is on a "reduce the cost, increase the revenue" course at flank speed. As passengers we have seen several areas where people have been reduced, prices have been increased, etc...no need to rehash them here..plenty of other threads. But I have a new concern....if there is this "full steam ahead on cost cutting" that we see.....what about the operation of the ship, the maintenance of the ship (no, not the rust we see...the stuff we don't see), the inner workings of the ship.

 

It's hard to believe that the only cutbacks are passenger facing. I have no facts...how would I....but this must be going on in parallel.

 

Am I the only one who is concerned?

 

This post represents my concerns very well.

[h20cruzer]

I just came off the Summit to Bermuda. You can see the cut backs in staff. The asst waiters now take drink orders in the dining room. Less bar staff on the ship. Less staff in the buffet clearing tables etc. In cafe al Bacio we like cream in our coffee not milk, they ran out took them 2 days to get it. Come on now cant someone just go to the store room and pick it up. We ended up going to the buffet and bringing our own cream. Hummm.

They seemed to have plenty of help checking people in at the pier and assisting when we docked again in Bayonne.

They have a different kind of chocolates in the room now, we only got a towel animal twice because we actually requested it. Our room steward told us they only give ice if requested.

Never say anyone in Michaels club, no Zenith members on our cruise, but still not used to my knowledge me suite guests. A shame it sat empty and dark all week.

All in all still a very good cruise.

Norma

[CruisingChick]

I just came off the Summit to Bermuda. You can see the cut backs in staff. The asst waiters now take drink orders in the dining room. Less bar staff on the ship. Less staff in the buffet clearing tables etc. In cafe al Bacio we like cream in our coffee not milk, they ran out took them 2 days to get it. Come on now cant someone just go to the store room and pick it up. We ended up going to the buffet and bringing our own cream. Hummm.

They seemed to have plenty of help checking people in at the pier and assisting when we docked again in Bayonne.

They have a different kind of chocolates in the room now, we only got a towel animal twice because we actually requested it. Our room steward told us they only give ice if requested.

Never say anyone in Michaels club, no Zenith members on our cruise, but still not used to my knowledge me suite guests. A shame it sat empty and dark all week.

All in all still a very good cruise.

Norma

 

Sounds like they are turning into Royal Caribbean. They also do not give you ice in your stateroom unless asked for and in the MDR the assistant waiters also have to act as sommeliers - which they are not - so they really don't know about wine but they are the ones that your order your wine from.

 

Sad to see so much cutting. One thing Celebrity really had about the other lines was terrific service and 2 to 1 crew to passenger ratio. Not any longer.

[cle-guy]

in the MDR the assistant waiters also have to act as sommeliers - which they are not - so they really don't know about wine but they are the ones that your order your wine from.

 

 

On my TA, a proper sommelier was by my table at least 3 times each night. In fact she's really the one person on the ship who stood out to me for the great service.

 

One thing to ponder about the Asst. waiter having more duties like drink orders...is it possible that now with all the alternate dining options specialty restaurants etc.) enough people have moved there to not require the same old full-staff in the MDR that's always been there - I see tons of empty seats in the MDR these days, especially after the 1st night, sometimes entire tables empty.

 

So just for example, in the past there were 1000 people dining each night at each seating and lets say 50 staff in the dining room. Now there are only 750 dining in the MDR as the other 250 are spread out in the specialties... so no need still for all 50 staff, so cut it to 38 staff members to cover the MDR (25% reduction in diners equals a 25% reduction in staff)?

 

But back to the OP's query, It's something to ponder, but with the outside over site, and lack of a track record of issues, and the fact that they know a breakdown costs them way more than the savings (review the current earnings report and discussion on the effect of the broken azipods, and closed Galveston harbor and its effect on profits) I think they are more forward focused than instant focused and at this time, am not at all concerned myself.

[cruisingsince94]

It has crossed our thoughts as well but for now anyway it seems as if the cuts are confined to the service and support staff at this stage. As an earlier poster mentioned I would think that there would be no cuts to any staff that would jeopardize the safety of the passengers, crew, and ship.

That being said it will become a growing concern and I agree that the lack of regular and routine maintenance played a role in all the Carnival ships issues. For now we will continue to cruise but the rising prices and service cutbacks may influence our plans after 2015.

[miched]

I see it being run like many companies. I worked in the auto industry. Jack the Knife came in and ruined our company. He cut everywhere he could and showed a profit, took his big bonuses and then left the company in total ruin. Problem is when everything is in top notch condition it is easy to neglect and skimp and run out the full tank but eventually you are running on fumes and then everything heads south.

 

The company now has to start pumping tons of money in to get everything back to decent shape and also hire new personel because they were and are needed for the proper operation. Doesn't matter to the man at the top that left. He took his money and ran off to "save" another company.

 

Some companies survive but many don't and they end up declaring bankruptcy, again hurting those at the bottom but rewarding those that took the stock profits and ran leaving many holding the empty bag.

 

💰

[cruisead]

We've seen little things happening, but when added together makes a significant impact. For instance, in Cafe al Bachio, they no longer have the little sandwiches, only sweets. In Tuscan, we noticed a number of things that no longer happen, such as, you used to be served a little platter of tiny "eats" like cheeses, Parma ham, olives and the like. Each table received one of those plates, but now a waiter just brings a small tray and gives everyone one small taste of the items. They also used to bring a three part divided plate that had roasted garlic, sun dried tomatoes and olive tapenade that you used with the bread or breadsticks , but that's all gone now.

 

I guess they think that if they take away things, a little at a time, despite hiking prices, that we won't notice, or care.

[Gracie115]

I too have thought about this very thing....but without any evidence to show that it is happening can only hope that it is not....I sure don't want to find out different while ON a ship......:eek::p

[Photo_Traveler]

It's clear to me that celebrity is on a "reduce the cost, increase the revenue" course at flank speed. As passengers we have seen several areas where people have been reduced, prices have been increased, etc...no need to rehash them here..plenty of other threads. But I have a new concern....if there is this "full steam ahead on cost cutting" that we see.....what about the operation of the ship, the maintenance of the ship (no, not the rust we see...the stuff we don't see), the inner workings of the ship.

 

It's hard to believe that the only cutbacks are passenger facing. I have no facts...how would I....but this must be going on in parallel.

 

Am I the only one who is concerned?

 

What we experienced on the Infinity was an eye opener. The "Honeymoon" with Celebrity that we had on the Constellation and the Eclipse is over. Chances are 50/50 that we will cancel the cruises listed in my signature and rebook on a Princess or HAL cruise.

 

Some people think that expectations of having full ice buckets and bottled water is trivial. Believe me, it isn't on the hot itineraries when hydration is important. And, As you pointed out, there may be more going on behind the scenes.

 

The funniest thing that happened at the MDR was the beef goulash without beef. I suspect the cook might have dipped a steak in it. :)

 

We loved Cartagena and would like another dose of it. So, the East side trips that hit Several islands, Costa Rica and do half the canal sound enticing.

 

The April 29th thread was interesting with the description of folks in haz-mat suits spraying in public areas during the Infinity TA.

 

 

Thanks for the thought provoking post!

Mike

[We're The Groupnors]

I try not to worry about vacations. I do enough of that between vacations. I could just as easily fall victim to cost cutting at my local auto shop, on my city's public transit system, or wherever. I still believe Celebrity is better than most lines, and I will continue to sail them without too much worry.

[hcat]

We've seen little things happening, but when added together makes a significant impact. For instance, in Cafe al Bachio, they no longer have the little sandwiches, only sweets. In Tuscan, we noticed a number of things that no longer happen, such as, you used to be served a little platter of tiny "eats" like cheeses, Parma ham, olives and the like. Each table received one of those plates, but now a waiter just brings a small tray and gives everyone one small taste of the items. They also used to bring a three part divided plate that had roasted garlic, sun dried tomatoes and olive tapenade that you used with the bread or breadsticks , but that's all gone now.

 

I guess they think that if they take away things, a little at a time, despite hiking prices, that we won't notice, or care.

 

Gee...hope they still have these items in Blu...

 

yes, we are concerned abt the bigger unseen issues like maintenance, safety and cleanliness and sanitation.

[ORV]

Sounds like they are turning into Royal Caribbean. They also do not give you ice in your stateroom unless asked for and in the MDR the assistant waiters also have to act as sommeliers - which they are not - so they really don't know about wine but they are the ones that your order your wine from.

 

Sad to see so much cutting. One thing Celebrity really had about the other lines was terrific service and 2 to 1 crew to passenger ratio. Not any longer.

 

What I thought was odd on RC was that you didn't get hand soap in the stateroom bathroom unless you requested it. Being a compulsive handwasher on cruisers I thought this was nuts. When our room steward realized we were Diamond we got it right away.

[Germancruiser]

I also ended the Infinity Transatlantic in Harwich earlier this week. Yes they have less staff in the dinning room- but on my cruises with X I never had any better service in the MDR. I suppose that deppends on the waiter one get´s! Our´s was perfect!

( Thank you Andres..)

I also had the funny " goulash experience" - it was listed as Soup- I found some two or three nice, tinny little peaces of meat in that soup!

Oh it was so nice to get this oh so familiar tasteing soup. I have the same soup at home as a emergency dinner thread! Canned Goulash Soup! Almost made me smile! I wonder how many of those soups come in canned and bottled or what ever!

I always wondered if the dressings of the salad´s are still " home- meaning X- made" ! Bringing in premixed food products reduces cost immensly! Nicly presented- well almost nobody is the wiser!

Edited May 15, 2014 by Germancruiser

[ghstudio]

I also ended the Infinity Transatlantic in Harwich earlier this week. Yes they have less staff in the dinning room- but on my cruises with X I never had any better service in the MDR. I suppose that deppends on the waiter one get´s! Our´s was perfect!

( Thank you Andres..)

I also had the funny " goulash experience" - it was listed as Soup- I found some two or three nice, tinny little peaces of meat in that soup!

Oh it was so nice to get this oh so familiar tasteing soup. I have the same soup at home as a emergency dinner thread! Canned Goulash Soup! Almost made me smile! I wonder how many of those soups come in canned and bottled or what ever!

I always wondered if the dressings of the salad´s are still " home- meaning X- made" ! Bringing in premixed food products reduces cost immensly! Nicly presented- well almost nobody is the wiser!

 

With the exception of the onion soup, celebrity has almost no solids in their soups. I have even been served onion soup with the cheese melted on top with no onions although usually their onion soup is the one exception and it actually has lots of onions. So goulash soup with no meat would not be a surprise..i would expect a beef broth. This is not new..it's been that way for a couple of years.

Edited May 15, 2014 by ghstudio

[rM3panno]

Why is everyone looking for a reason to be negative? Sure there are cost cutting measures. They exist in every industry in almost every corner of the world. Efficiency has its own evolution.

 

A lot of the Carnival incidents happened because they they went cheap from the build phase on. Systems were interconnected and not redundant. We had dinner with the chief engineer on the summit last year and he relayed that carnival was the only major cruise line with that set up and after their problems wer switching to a more standard set up in the industry.

 

In the meantime, I'm going to cruise and be happy looking forward to the next time I can get on a ship. And if their cost cutting leads to some major failure then they will pay in the end when the lawyers argue gross negligence.