P&O Cruisers - What are things like where YOU are?

[Eglesbrech]

1 hour ago, Ardennais said:

Takes a lot to offend me, I have a thick skin having been a teacher for years and years! 
We who live in this so-called United Kingdom (!!) have been shaped by our upbringing and our localities and have differing perspectives, traditions, customs, language etc They make us what we are today. That’s why it’s really difficult to legislate centrally and why I personally welcome devolution. What works in one place doesn’t always work elsewhere. I love reading about your lives around the country and hope that I can at least contribute something about my part of the country. 

I agree. While we are all part of the U.K. the culture is certainly very different between and even in each country in different areas. That’s part of why I like cruising, meeting new people with interesting and different life experiences to mine.

[zap99]

3 hours ago, grapau27 said:

No excuse for anyone to break the rules.

Quite right. My point was that a person with symptoms, who was far more important that Cummings flew to Scotland with his wife and entourage to self isolate . So, why is it that people continually harp in about Durham and he is ignored. Double standards are in play. Can't we just move on without continually revisiting that event from 6 months ago.

[grapau27]

23 minutes ago, zap99 said:

Quite right. My point was that a person with symptoms, who was far more important that Cummings flew to Scotland with his wife and entourage to self isolate . So, why is it that people continually harp in about Durham and he is ignored. Double standards are in play. Can't we just move on without continually revisiting that event from 6 months ago.

Wrong is wrong in my eyes no exception.

Cummings and Boris put us in lockdown and Cummings should have adhered to it.

To say you were testing your eyesight going to a well known beauty spot on your wife's birthday was insulting everyone's intelligence especially when it is narrow winding country roads from Durham to Barnard Castle going through several small villages.

Edited November 25, 2020 by grapau27

[terrierjohn]

27 minutes ago, zap99 said:

Quite right. My point was that a person with symptoms, who was far more important that Cummings flew to Scotland with his wife and entourage to self isolate . So, why is it that people continually harp in about Durham and he is ignored. Double standards are in play. Can't we just move on without continually revisiting that event from 6 months ago.

You are flogging a dead horse if you think you can change the minds of the Boris bashers.  Every other country in Europe has faced similar problems in Spring and the 2nd wave in Autumn, and some appear to have far more people willing to ignore the rules than we do, so I wonder who their govt bashers lay the blame on? 

[Harry Peterson]

30 minutes ago, zap99 said:

Quite right. My point was that a person with symptoms, who was far more important that Cummings flew to Scotland with his wife and entourage to self isolate . So, why is it that people continually harp in about Durham and he is ignored. Double standards are in play. Can't we just move on without continually revisiting that event from 6 months ago.

Clearly not - I think that's self-evident. Not just from posts here, but from public reaction. 

 

It isn't going to go away because we have a situation, recently repeated all over again, in which people who have very clearly done wrong are actually supported at the very top instead of being asked to leave office.

 

This may have been happening in the US over recent times, but we don't expect it here.

[P&O SUE]

10 hours ago, kalos said:

Has everybody got their heads around  the "Christmas Bubbles " yet ?

 

The way I read them is ..

 

A family of 3 adult children decide to spend  time  with Mum & Dad for Christmas day .

Am I right in thinking they would have to turn one of them away ?

Unless one was at Uni  and normally lived with the parents then this could happen ?

 

Meanwhile next door to them live a family of 8  and their eldest daughter who moved 

out decides to come home for Christmas with her hubby and two kids .

Also they decide grandma & granddad who live over the road can come over on 

Christmas day .

There seems to be no limit to the capacity , just 3 bubbles  unless I have missed something .

 

So the next door can have 13  meanwhile the family of 5 must turn on of their kids away .

Meanwhile the small local pub must remain closed ?

Only advice I see is you do not have to keep your space but just be careful within these 

bubbles .

 

 

Not trying to go political , I just want to know ,could it have been done any better ? 

 

 

 

That’s  what I thought Kalos, small families are penalised. We are all 2 adults in my family except my son who is 2 adults plus a 2 year old. Me and hubby normally go back to work straight after Boxing Day, we never celebrate for 5 days. I spent all day yesterday stressing what to do. In an ideal world I’d like to see my parents and my son, partner and grandson. That’s it , sometimes my sister and husband (no kids) come up Christmas Day, some year’s we go to her Boxing Day. She lives 2 hours away. 
However my sons partner has a big family and obviously would like to see them. So 3 households doesn’t work for us even though I would see a small group of people over one or two days.

Anyway I’ve spoken to our son today and he said they’ve decided to just have Christmas together, just the three of them, rather then choose. Then he’ll pop over for a socially distanced present drop at some point over the weekend. Very sensible I thought,.

We’ll  have just my mum and dad over for Christmas Day as I don’t want them to be alone and they want to come. Haven’t see my sister since last Christmas but hopefully we’ll have a better one next year. What I’ll find really hard is not seeing my son, grandson and parents for ages after Christmas. 

Edited November 25, 2020 by P&O SUE

[terrierjohn]

2 minutes ago, P&O SUE said:

That’s  what I thought Kalos, small families are penalised. We are all 2 adults in my family except my son who is 2 adults plus a 2 year old. Me and hubby normally go back to work straight after Boxing Day, we never celebrate for 5 days. I spent all day yesterday stressing what to do. In an ideal world I’d like to see my parents and my son, partner and grandson. That’s it , sometimes my sister and husband (no kids) come up Christmas Day, some year’s we go to her Boxing Day. She lives 2 hours away. 
However my sons partner has a big family and obviously would like to see them. So 3 households doesn’t work for us even though I would see a small group of people over one or two days.

Anyway I’ve spoken to our son today and he said they’ve decided to just have Christmas together, just the three of them, rather then choose. Then he’ll pop over for a socially distanced present drop at some point over the weekend. Very sensible I thought,.

We’ll  have just my mum and dad over for Christmas Day as I don’t want them to be alone and they want to come. Haven’t see my sister since last Christmas but hopefully we’ll have a better one next year. What I’ll find really hard is not seeing my son, grandson and parents for ages after Christmas. 

I suspect lots of families will be faced with the same dilemma, but like in all things there has to a line drawn somewhere, and we will all need to find an equitable way to handle our Xmas celebrations.

[wowzz]

2 minutes ago, terrierjohn said:

You are flogging a dead horse if you think you can change the minds of the Boris bashers.  Every other country in Europe has faced similar problems in Spring and the 2nd wave in Autumn, and some appear to have far more people willing to ignore the rules than we do, so I wonder who their govt bashers lay the blame on? 

Well John, where shall we start?

Implementing lockdown two weeks too late, allowing foreign flights into the UK with no health checks on passengers, discharging hundreds of elderly patients from hospital into care homes without tests, not allocating PPE to care home staff, appointing a totally useless  person in charge of track and trace - he's just useless. 

[wowzz]

5 hours ago, Snow Hill said:

more sense comes from the respective leaders in Scotland and Wales. 

That would include Mark Drakeford, who decided that no one could buy a book during the Welsh lock down! How does not buying a book in Tesco help control the spread of CV19?  Answers on a postcard (not that you could buy one at the time) please.  Complete nincompoopery, 

Some of these local politicians have never had a proper job in their lives, and now have an over inflated sense of their own importance. 

[Peanut006]

Well Xmas is certainly going to be different this year!! We are a step-family with four children between us, two with children of their own all living in locations from Newcastle to Cambridge plus our own older parents. Decisions to be made as we would usually see them all at some point over Xmas. Luckily we have Facebook Portal which will help but can never replace cuddles and excitement of been together. 

 

Michelle

[Selbourne]

10 hours ago, zap99 said:

Quite right. My point was that a person with symptoms, who was far more important that Cummings flew to Scotland with his wife and entourage to self isolate . So, why is it that people continually harp in about Durham and he is ignored. Double standards are in play. Can't we just move on without continually revisiting that event from 6 months ago.

You know the answer Zap. We have a few armchair critics on here who cannot resist the slightest opportunity to knock the government and are masters of hindsight. They will continually harp on about a former government advisor who, although he is an odious individual, drove a car with only his family in it, yet ignore the former Labour Party leader who hosted a dinner party of multiple households, or an SNP MP who travelled by train to Scotland having tested positive. The latter two are elected members of parliament and their actions risked far more people than just their own families, but mentioning those in the same criticism of an unelected government advisor doesn’t suit their argument! 

[Selbourne]

Yesterday the Chancellor highlighted the current financial impact of the pandemic (quite frightening and we are not over it yet) and today the Chair of the British Medical Association highlighted the current health impact as a result of the near complete shutdown of the NHS to deal with this one issue;

 

4.5 million patients now on waiting lists 

12 million outpatient appointments cancelled during the first peak

2 million fewer routine operations during the first peak

140,000 patients have now been on waiting lists for more than a year. In August 2019 this number was just 1,000.

 

[grapau27]

15 minutes ago, Selbourne said:

You know the answer Zap. We have a few armchair critics on here who cannot resist the slightest opportunity to knock the government and are masters of hindsight. They will continually harp on about a former government advisor who, although he is an odious individual, drove a car with only his family in it, yet ignore the former Labour Party leader who hosted a dinner party of multiple households, or an SNP MP who travelled by train to Scotland having tested positive. The latter two are elected members of parliament and their actions risked far more people than just their own families, but mentioning those in the same criticism of an unelected government advisor doesn’t suit their argument! 

They are all wrong and should all be penalised no matter who they are.

As a Brexit Boris supporter the Cummings incident and subsequent support he got turned my stomach and totally changed my opinion of Boris.

[terrierjohn]

10 hours ago, wowzz said:

Well John, where shall we start?

Implementing lockdown two weeks too late, allowing foreign flights into the UK with no health checks on passengers, discharging hundreds of elderly patients from hospital into care homes without tests, not allocating PPE to care home staff, appointing a totally useless  person in charge of track and trace - he's just useless. 

Where is the evidence that starting the first lockdown was 2 weeks too late, lots of media hype and some experts with 20:20 hindsight.

You yourself have said that flying was fairly safe, and everyone was told to self isolate if they developed symptoms, so its unlikely this was a major source of infection.

I accept, and so does Boris that, hospital discharges to care homes was badly handled, but its the old clearing the swamp and alligators metaphor that applies here.  The need to free up hospital beds because of the large numbers of covid admissions to hospitals led to this poor decision.

PPE shortages were a major issue, and many areas suffered as a result.  But of course now, hindsight specialist Starmer is using this rush to secure badly needed supplies as a stick to suggest crony profiteering.

The one area I agree is track and Trace, but I feel certain Boris probably regrets appointing Harding, as well as wishing he had not made as many outlandish claims.

 

Edited November 26, 2020 by terrierjohn

[zap99]

32 minutes ago, Selbourne said:

You know the answer Zap. We have a few armchair critics on here who cannot resist the slightest opportunity to knock the government and are masters of hindsight. They will continually harp on about a former government advisor who, although he is an odious individual, drove a car with only his family in it, yet ignore the former Labour Party leader who hosted a dinner party of multiple households, or an SNP MP who travelled by train to Scotland having tested positive. The latter two are elected members of parliament and their actions risked far more people than just their own families, but mentioning those in the same criticism of an unelected government advisor doesn’t suit their argument! 

Thanks for that. I thought I was living in my own little bubble. It sometimes feels like that Monty python sketch where they reminisce about the old days and don't mention the war. Fortunately I made some changes some time ago so I don't see some posts untill they are reposted. Easier to ignore when they are secondhand ramblings🤣

[Selbourne]

12 minutes ago, grapau27 said:

They are all wrong and should all be penalised no matter who they are.

As a Brexit Boris supporter the Cummings incident and subsequent support he got turned my stomach and totally changed my opinion of Boris.

Sounds as though we might be in a similar place Graham, in that my opinion of Boris has changed, and not for the better, but I firmly believe that had we ended up with Corbyn as PM (which, let’s not forget, was the only alternative) then the errors that Boris has made would fade into insignificance compared to the complete and utter car crash that we would have had. Where we probably disagree though is about the Cummings ‘incident’. Daft though it was, I don’t buy the argument (often heard, including on this forum) that his car journey resulted in everyone else deciding that they would ignore the rules. We all have to take responsibility for our own actions and I firmly believe that those who disobeyed the rules thereafter quoting ‘Cummings’ were going to disobey them anyway and he was just used as an excuse to justify actions that they would have taken regardless. 

[wowzz]

21 minutes ago, terrierjohn said:

You yourself have said that flying was fairly safe

Safe in the sense of not contracting CV19 on the flight, but unsafe in the sense of spreading the virus once the passengers were in the general population.

Edited November 26, 2020 by wowzz

[zap99]

2 minutes ago, Selbourne said:

Sounds as though we might be in a similar place Graham, in that my opinion of Boris has changed, and not for the better, but I firmly believe that had we ended up with Corbyn as PM (which, let’s not forget, was the only alternative) then the errors that Boris has made would fade into insignificance compared to the complete and utter car crash that we would have had. Where we probably disagree though is about the Cummings ‘incident’. Daft though it was, I don’t buy the argument (often heard, including on this forum) that his car journey resulted in everyone else deciding that they would ignore the rules. We all have to take responsibility for our own actions and I firmly believe that those who disobeyed the rules thereafter quoting ‘Cummings’ were going to disobey them anyway and he was just used as an excuse to justify actions that they would have taken regardless. 

You said it all with far more eloquence and patience than I could. I find politics on this site has taken over. Cummings is of no importance now he has gone. No mention of Corbyn at all.😁

[grapau27]

11 minutes ago, Selbourne said:

Sounds as though we might be in a similar place Graham, in that my opinion of Boris has changed, and not for the better, but I firmly believe that had we ended up with Corbyn as PM (which, let’s not forget, was the only alternative) then the errors that Boris has made would fade into insignificance compared to the complete and utter car crash that we would have had. Where we probably disagree though is about the Cummings ‘incident’. Daft though it was, I don’t buy the argument (often heard, including on this forum) that his car journey resulted in everyone else deciding that they would ignore the rules. We all have to take responsibility for our own actions and I firmly believe that those who disobeyed the rules thereafter quoting ‘Cummings’ were going to disobey them anyway and he was just used as an excuse to justify actions that they would have taken regardless. 

I totally agree with you on Corbyn.

As someone who has lived in the Durham area all my life all I hear from many people in this area is people's resolve on lockdown changed totally after Cummings jolly and subsequent approval.

Unless you live here it is hard to grasp the significance of his actions.

[Splice the mainbrace]

10 minutes ago, terrierjohn said:

Where is the evidence that stating the first lockdown was 2 weeks too late, lots of media hype and some experts with 20:20 hindsight.

You yourself have said that flying was fairly safe, and everyone was told to self isolate if they developed symptoms, so its unlikely this was a major source of infection.

I accept, and so does Boris that, hospital discharges to care homes was badly handled, but its the old clearing the swamp and alligators metaphor that applies here.  The need to free up hospital beds because of the large numbers of covid admissions to hospitals led to this poor decision.

PPE shortages were a major issue, and many areas suffered as a result.  But of course now, hindsight specialist Starmer is using this rush to secure badly needed supplies as a stick to suggest crony profiteering.

The one area I agree is track and Trace, but I feel certain Boris probably regrets appointing Harding, as well as wishing he had not made as many outlandish claims.

 

 

I agree with most of what you say but IMO the first lockdown was too late, they waited until deaths ramped up until locking down which was too late due to the typical 3 to 4 week lag between infection and death. On March 9th there was 1 death but on April 1st there were 672 in the UK. It was well known in mid-February about the situation in Italy and that it wasn't just a disease in a far flung typical far East disease. In our area in mid-February it was well known about the risks after a school ski trip came back from Italy and the pupils were being monitored carefully.

 

Our last trip to the local theatre was in late Feb and there was already a certain anxiety and you see people looking at each other if someone was coughing around them. We were watching David Baddiel and he made a joke that he was surprised that so many people had turned up due to the risk of the disease.

 

We should have learnt from Italy and assume that the same would happen here not wait until the death rate showed that it did. 

 

 

[kalos]

21 hours ago, kalos said:

 

Has everybody got their heads around  the "Christmas Bubbles " yet ?

 

Not trying to go political , I just want to know ,could it have been done any better ? 

 

 

 

 

10 minutes ago, zap99 said:

You said it all with far more eloquence and patience than I could. I find politics on this site has taken over. Cummings is of no importance now he has gone. No mention of Corbyn at all.😁

 

Well I did try Zapp   and to answer my own question  ,How could it have been done any better ?

The easy answer to that is I do not know   

 

What I do know is the answer does not lie in a trip to Durham or a train trip to Scotland .

Which the kind lady did say "The virus made me do it , it makes you do things "

There is still a lot we don't know about this virus ?

Like why does it make them want to head north ?  

 

[batholiver]

34 minutes ago, zap99 said:

You said it all with far more eloquence and patience than I could. I find politics on this site has taken over. Cummings is of no importance now he has gone. No mention of Corbyn at all.😁

And yet despite your complaints about politics you keep bringing it up when it suits your particular viewpoint. 

 

Corbyn went long ago. He's an irrelevance now. Cummings was there controlling the PM until very recently indeed, and the PM that supported his appalling behaviour is still there. That's the difference. 

[zap99]

8 minutes ago, kalos said:

 

 

Well I did try Zapp   and to answer my own question  ,How could it have been done any better ?

The easy answer to that is I do not know   

 

What I do know is the answer does not lie in a trip to Durham or a train trip to Scotland .

Which the kind lady did say "The virus made me do it , it makes you do things "

There is still a lot we don't know about this virus ?

Like why does it make them want to head north ?  

 

As the American Lady said " you can't get no virus if drink American beer from  alooominum cans. It's.. in Miami where they drink Corona beer from the bottle". She may be right. Who knowns. Donald Rumsfeld got it right.🤣

[zap99]

5 minutes ago, batholiver said:

And yet despite your complaints about politics you keep bringing it up when it suits your particular viewpoint. 

 

Corbyn went long ago. He's an irrelevance now. Cummings was there controlling the PM until very recently indeed, and the PM that supported his appalling behaviour is still there. That's the difference. 

Gone. Corbyn ?. You think?.

[zap99]

6 minutes ago, batholiver said:

And yet despite your complaints about politics you keep bringing it up when it suits your particular viewpoint. 

 

Corbyn went long ago. He's an irrelevance now. Cummings was there controlling the PM until very recently indeed, and the PM that supported his appalling behaviour is still there. That's the difference. 

No. It goes nice and Crusey for a

 while and then some wag thinks they will mention Barnard Castle and expect the whole world will fall about laughing. Move on I did young Skywalker.