What will happen with Tiers and Benefits in case of a cruise line bankruptcy?

[Prost Seattle]

11 hours ago, 4774Papa said:

Many US airlines in the past have gone bankrupt.  I probably can't remember them all, but here are a few:

Eastern, PanAmerican, TWA are major airlines that went bankrupt.   Many others have merged and been absorbed by other airlines, for example, US Airways, Northwest Airlines, Continental, Allegheny and more.

 

The bankrupt lines could not handle the competition with others when in the 1970s the US government deregulated the air industry, significantly lowering air fare prices.   Airlines like TWA, PanAm and Eastern had overpriced union contracts and couldn't compete with others.  For example, Delta, until it incorporated Northwest had no union.   Airlines like Southwest, with excellent management once only flew out of Texas, but later grew to be a major domestic carrier.

 

 

That is not true.  Delta pilots and dispatchers were and are unionized, before and after the merger with Northwest. 

[waterbug123]

5 hours ago, Prost Seattle said:

That is not true.  Delta pilots and dispatchers were and are unionized, before and after the merger with Northwest. 

 

And the NW flight attendants had to give up their union; the Delta FAs were not union pre-merger and still are non unionized.

[4774Papa]

6 hours ago, Prost Seattle said:

That is not true.  Delta pilots and dispatchers were and are unionized, before and after the merger with Northwest. 

You are correct regarding Delta pilots and dispatchers when the NW merger took place.

https://www.nationalreview.com/2010/12/delta-and-unions-robert-verbruggen/

 

However, I remember that Delta at one time, during the 60s and 70s was non-union.   Also, I remember that the employees actually purchased an aircraft for Delta.

[4774Papa]

We find that the perks on Celebrity  (free Elite Happy Hour and free laundry) are worth about $300-$350.  On Royal Caribbean the Diamond benefits are worth slightly more than that.

Platinum benefits on NCL are worth less, they have no free happy hour, but you get free laundry and some free specialty dining meals.

[dkjretired]

13 hours ago, cruise kitty said:

 

Still have my card as well....  didn't join on our very first cruise, as we figured we'd be one and done...  think I joined in 2003 for our second hawaii cruise on the infinity...  never did get credit for that first cruise.   DH doesn't have a card as we figured why pay for two memberships when you share the benefits....  think I paid either $25 or $35 can't remember...  I actually still have the letter that came with the card in a box somewhere 🙂

 

Actually, if you remember you could not join on your first cruise, had to take the first cruise and then join on the second.   

[cruise kitty]

5 hours ago, dkjretired said:

 

Actually, if you remember you could not join on your first cruise, had to take the first cruise and then join on the second.   

 

it was so long ago I honestly don't remember.   :)   Still wish I could have received credit for that first one though :)   

 

Hope you're staying safe & healthy where you are :)

[wrk2cruise]

If you have any documentation proving you took that first cruise and you submit to Captains Club I believe they will add it for you.   Seapass card or something like that.

[sptrout]

5 hours ago, dkjretired said:

 

Actually, if you remember you could not join on your first cruise, had to take the first cruise and then join on the second.   

 

That is correct. We joined the CC in 02/1995 after our first Celebrity cruise in 01/95. The cost was $25 (I do not remember if it was p/p or family). We no longer have the membership cards (still have the CC lapel pins!), but I think our numbers were around 750. I was able to convince the CC CSR several years ago to accept the number of cruises we had taken without documentation. Back then 1 cruise equalled 1 CC point no matter the cabin (maybe suites were different). My current CC account correctly shows our previous cruises.

[hawk/hornfan]

Interesting topic. I have never been brand loyal. I book airfare, hotels, cruises and car rentals solely on price, itinerary, and convenience. I use my AAA and AARP cards to gain discounts with those entities that I have a rewards card with. If they are unequal, I go with the best deal. So many of the perks offered are useless to me, i will take the cash savings over perks every time.

[dkjretired]

1 minute ago, hawk/hornfan said:

Interesting topic. I have never been brand loyal. I book airfare, hotels, cruises and car rentals solely on price, itinerary, and convenience. I use my AAA and AARP cards to gain discounts with those entities that I have a rewards card with. If they are unequal, I go with the best deal. So many of the perks offered are useless to me, i will take the cash savings over perks every time.

 

The tier benefits are free now, we were talking about the program in the 90s.   Now you can get both your cash savings and certain perks since they are free.  

[hawk/hornfan]

2 minutes ago, dkjretired said:

 

The tier benefits are free now, we were talking about the program in the 90s.   Now you can get both your cash savings and certain perks since they are free.  

I wasn't speaking about about that and You totally missed my point. But that is okay, I was talking about ALL reward programs currently and in the past of all travel related programs, not just X in the '90's , which i never sailed. But it is ok you keep sailing X for the perks. They are grateful for your loyalty, maybe.

[Droop]

Pardon me if I’ve missed this but does anyone know if a deposit was placed on a cruise (we are booking April 2022 to Australia) and the cruise line goes in the bankruptcy, would we get our deposit back? I talked to our TA and she suggested getting insurance for the deposit until we make final payment. When we make final payment we would get additional travel insurance for the cruise itself. Any ideas or thoughts?

[4774Papa]

4 hours ago, Droop said:

Pardon me if I’ve missed this but does anyone know if a deposit was placed on a cruise (we are booking April 2022 to Australia) and the cruise line goes in the bankruptcy, would we get our deposit back? I talked to our TA and she suggested getting insurance for the deposit until we make final payment. When we make final payment we would get additional travel insurance for the cruise itself. Any ideas or thoughts?

First of all, unless you purchase cancel for any reason trip insurance not sure that cruise line bankruptcy would be a problem with the insurance paying off.  I strongly suspect that bankruptcy would be covered, however, if you purchase trip insurance, check the terms first.

 

I believe that we will discover this year if the cruise lines are in jeopardy of bankruptcy.  Even if they do go bankrupt, it is likely that it would be a reorganization and not total collapse of the business.

 

If you booked with Celebrity, the deposit is usually $600 pp, so the insurance would not be terribly expensive in any event.

[Charles4515]

Pardon me if I’ve missed this but does anyone know if a deposit was placed on a cruise (we are booking April 2022 to Australia) and the cruise line goes in the bankruptcy, would we get our deposit back? I talked to our TA and she suggested getting insurance for the deposit until we make final payment. When we make final payment we would get additional travel insurance for the cruise itself. Any ideas or thoughts?

 

You need third party insurance. If you can get any. But my advice is not to put any deposits down right now if you are worried about getting them back. The situation should be clearer later on.

 

 

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[Droop]

Papa/ Charles 

We  usually do not purchase the insurance for the whole cruise until we make a final payment. The main reason why I was asking was for the deposit. There are two other couples that are going to be traveling with us and I’m doing all the planning and I wanted to make sure that all my bases are covered. I was mainly asking for the deposit which each of us will be placing to hold the cabins. Each of us will be placing a deposit of 900 per cabin. When we have booked cruises before we usually make sure that we purchase the refundable insurance, but we do not purchase the insurance (for the entire cruise) until we make final payment. 
 

The TA had suggested purchasing insurance for the deposit and it varies depending on the age in the state that you’re located at. 
 

Charles I understand completely what you’re talking about as far as being concerned. The reason why I don’t want to wait is because I wanted to lock the cabins in that we prefer.  I’ve been planning this trip for quite a while for my retirement. And I just wanted to make sure that everybody was covered. Thank you both for your responses. I guess I should’ve been a little more clear on the insurance for the deposit.😄

[Charles4515]

Droop

 

I always buy third party insurance within two weeks of when I book. Because that is how to get coverage for preexisting conditions. I don’t wait until until final payment. I was never concerned about bankruptcy but I think given the current situation bankruptcy is a real concern. If you want to protect your deposit against bankruptcy buying now would be your only option. If you have a credit card that includes insurance I would check to see if it covers bankruptcy. I always use a credit card that has travel insurance when I book any travel. Check all your credit cards. You might have one with coverage and not know about it.

 

 

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[MarkWiltonM]

3 hours ago, 4774Papa said:

First of all, unless you purchase cancel for any reason trip insurance not sure that cruise line bankruptcy would be a problem with the insurance paying off.  I strongly suspect that bankruptcy would be covered, however, if you purchase trip insurance, check the terms first.

 

I believe that we will discover this year if the cruise lines are in jeopardy of bankruptcy.  Even if they do go bankrupt, it is likely that it would be a reorganization and not total collapse of the business.

 

If you booked with Celebrity, the deposit is usually $600 pp, so the insurance would not be terribly expensive in any event.

 

I have two cruises booked and bought insurance for both, not through the cruise line.  The insurance for the first cruise in January 2021 unfortunately does not cover financial default of the cruise line.  The insurance I bought for the second cruise in January 2022 does cover financial default.  Usually, to get financial default coverage, you have to buy the insurance within 14 days of making your initial payment, and it has a 14-day exclusion period (meaning you are covered if the cruise line doesn't become insolvent within 14 days of you purchasing the insurance).  This means you can't retroactively go and buy insurance with financial default coverage now if your deposit was paid more than 14 days ago. 

 

I checked online yesterday and the only plans that were still available with financial default coverage all required that you purchase the insurance within 14 days of your initial trip payment.

 

I've never thought about financial default before when purchasing travel insurance, but I certainly will now.

 

This issue is of interest to me because I paid in full for the January 2021 cruise.  I just had some extra cash and figured I'd go ahead and pay for the cruise and not worry about a payment later, knowing I could always get the money back before the final payment date (ha!).  That was, of course, pre-COVID-19. I haven't canceled the January 2021 cruise yet to get my money back, but I'm probably going to--reluctantly because I want to go on that cruise badly, though realistically I know there won't be a vaccine by then.  On the other hand, if my spouse and I discover that we were exposed to the virus and have immunity, once the blood tests for that come out in a few months, we could go without fear of getting the virus or of giving it to anyone. If we were exposed we are completely asymptomatic, but I have heard reports that scientists think up to 25 percent of people with the virus may be asymptomatic, which could be why it is so incredibly infectious.  (The idea that you are not carrying the virus if you don't have symptoms has been proven to be completely fallacious.)

 

[Droop]

Mark I guess on this cruise I have to double check and see what the cost would be to get the amount to charge for booking the whole cruise. It’s an 18 They cruise out of Sydney which ends up in Honolulu. For years we have booked through travel guard and prefer that over booking through the cruise line. The travel agent stated that she was going to check for us. 
 

Hopefully there will be a vaccine by that time. But you never know this particular strain may mutate. We have always been playing it on the safe side by getting cruise insurance because you never know if you have to be air evacuated  or for any other reason. 
 

I really do appreciate everyone’s input.I really do appreciate everyone’s input

[TeaBag]

On 3/30/2020 at 7:13 AM, dkjretired said:

 

Actually, if you remember you could not join on your first cruise, had to take the first cruise and then join on the second.   

And you had to pay $35 which we never got back as we didn't cruise for about 6 years when they were offering it back.

[4774Papa]

4 hours ago, Droop said:

Mark I guess on this cruise I have to double check and see what the cost would be to get the amount to charge for booking the whole cruise. It’s an 18 They cruise out of Sydney which ends up in Honolulu. For years we have booked through travel guard and prefer that over booking through the cruise line. The travel agent stated that she was going to check for us. 
 

Hopefully there will be a vaccine by that time. But you never know this particular strain may mutate. We have always been playing it on the safe side by getting cruise insurance because you never know if you have to be air evacuated  or for any other reason. 
 

I really do appreciate everyone’s input.I really do appreciate everyone’s input

I believe you are planning a Sydney to Honolulu cruise in the Spring.   We took a wonderful 23 day Royal Caribbean cruise from Sydney to Seattle in April 2018.  Here is my review of that cruise.

Melbourne, New Zealand and  Explorer of the Seas TransPacific cruise

https://www.cruisecritic.com/memberreviews/memberreview.cfm?EntryID=620702&et_cid=3065755&et_rid=17221689&et_referrer=Boards

 

Royal had two TransPacific cruises, one from Sydney to Seattle that visited French islands, Fiji and Hawaii (Oahu and Maui) then ended in Seattle, the other went to NZ for one port then on to Tahiti and ended in Hawaii.   The Celebrity cruise ended in Hawaii and was more expensive than the Royal cruise, so we picked the Explorer of the Seas to Seattle.

 

As for booking the cruise, you have a year before the cruise.   The gamble is that a vaccine may not be available by then, but it may be.  You could book cancel for any reason (it costs more, but you would be protected).

 

 

[Droop]

Papa the cruise we are looking at is for April 17, 2022 so that gives us approximate two years. Hopefully God willing they will have a vaccine by then. Royal Caribbean didn’t have any on the itinerary that we were looking for. The celebrity cruise that we were wanting goes to New Zealand, Fiji and all of those islands as well. We could do a back to back which would leave out of Honolulu to go to Vancouver but we want to stay in Hawaii for a bit. Who knows they may change the cancellation policy as well.

[4774Papa]

9 hours ago, Droop said:

Papa the cruise we are looking at is for April 17, 2022 so that gives us approximate two years. Hopefully God willing they will have a vaccine by then. Royal Caribbean didn’t have any on the itinerary that we were looking for. The celebrity cruise that we were wanting goes to New Zealand, Fiji and all of those islands as well. We could do a back to back which would leave out of Honolulu to go to Vancouver but we want to stay in Hawaii for a bit. Who knows they may change the cancellation policy as well.

I am sure that a vaccine will be available for your trip.  Are you planning a pre-cruise visit to Australia?  We love Australia.  It is a huge country and lots to see.  If you need an advice about where to go, hotels, etc.  feel free to ask.

George

[waterbug123]

On 4/3/2020 at 3:03 AM, Droop said:

Pardon me if I’ve missed this but does anyone know if a deposit was placed on a cruise (we are booking April 2022 to Australia) and the cruise line goes in the bankruptcy, would we get our deposit back?

 

If it's a reorganizational bankruptcy, then the answer is probably yes, because debit will be restructured so that the company can continue to operate.  If it's a complete dissolution bankruptcy, meaning the business will close entirely and the assets are being sold off then probably not, as secured creditors would be paid first and if the company is going out of business it's because they don't have the cash to continue operating on any level.  And if that's the case, then it's all but certain that even secured creditors won't be paid in full.  That leaves unsecured creditors, like you, empty-handed.

[Ride-The-Waves]

Several airlines are already reducing/changing frequent flyer "benefits."  This will likely continue and expand to other industries, especially cruise lines, as corporations review options for reducing costs.  Much easier to accomplish than reduce crew.  

[waterbug123]

On 4/4/2020 at 8:24 AM, Ride-The-Waves said:

Several airlines are already reducing/changing frequent flyer "benefits."  This will likely continue and expand to other industries, especially cruise lines, as corporations review options for reducing costs.  Much easier to accomplish than reduce crew.  

 

Just curious....what airlines have done that already and what sort of changes?

 

Delta, in fact, has just announced that they will extend the status of their medallion level frequent flyers, roll over their status qualifying miles, and keep benefits unchanged through 2021. 

https://news.delta.com/delta-extends-medallion-status-club-memberships-and-more-support-skymiles-members-future-travel?fbclid=IwAR2i2elUOrYjIFYJCv2Ya7jzMgq7bdtLW2A3g46CpRP5FW2QHw6hrMKc4E8

 

Edited April 5, 2020 by waterbug123