C19 Cruise Ship Guidance for Europe

[BlerkOne]

As Legend will be cruising in Europe (allegedly)

 

http://www.imo.org/en/MediaCentre/HotTopics/Documents/COVID CL 4204 adds/Circular Letter No.4204-Add.26 - Coronavirus (Covid-19) - Guidance On Cruise EU.pdf

 

 

[mark316]

6 hours ago, fyree39 said:

I got through the introduction. Death by PDF.  lol I'm hoping someone else will read and post the crib notes.

Agreed...I’ll wait for the movie!

[d9704011]

Nothing very specific; bedtime reading for those who may be contemplating developing a plan for their ship/company/port and all the issues they may wish to consider covering in the plan.  

[ontheweb]

11 hours ago, mark316 said:

I’ll wait for the movie!

LOL, that brought back a memory from way back in high school in the 60s when a classmate basically said that to our English teacher when asked about the book we were supposed to be reading.

[Roz]

We need the Cliff notes.

[NCTribeFan]

Not really intended for passengers.  But I did skim it.  Stuff at the end interesting about pre-boarding testing.

 

I've been saying for weeks that taking someone's temp before they enter a building (or ship, in this case) is pretty much pointless since people can be totally asymptomatic yet contagious.  Just because someone isn't running a fever means nothing except they aren't currently running a fever!  Waste of time and energy.

 

I think the protocols will change considerably if/when a vaccine and/or anti-viral meds are available for widespread use.

[BlerkOne]

12 minutes ago, NCTribeFan said:

Not really intended for passengers.  But I did skim it.  Stuff at the end interesting about pre-boarding testing.

 

I've been saying for weeks that taking someone's temp before they enter a building (or ship, in this case) is pretty much pointless since people can be totally asymptomatic yet contagious.  Just because someone isn't running a fever means nothing except they aren't currently running a fever!  Waste of time and energy.

 

I think the protocols will change considerably if/when a vaccine and/or anti-viral meds are available for widespread use.

 

Catching 40% of carriers before they spread the disease to more people is far from pointless. A vaccine will be far from perfect. Too many people are depending on that fantasy. Effective treatments would be wonderful, but that is after someone has the virus.

[joeyancho]

1 hour ago, BlerkOne said:

 

Catching 40% of carriers before they spread the disease to more people is far from pointless. A vaccine will be far from perfect. Too many people are depending on that fantasy. Effective treatments would be wonderful, but that is after someone has the virus.

How do you know the vaccine will be  "far from perfect"? Some vaccines have eradicated diseases and are incredibly effective.  Let's see what happens before we judge. 

[chipmaster]

49 minutes ago, joeyancho said:

How do you know the vaccine will be  "far from perfect"? Some vaccines have eradicated diseases and are incredibly effective.  Let's see what happens before we judge. 

 

We have history and past results, but yes I believe in unicorns and maybe this time my lottery ticket is a winner.

[joeyancho]

1 hour ago, chipmaster said:

 

We have history and past results, but yes I believe in unicorns and maybe this time my lottery ticket is a winner

Smallpox, polio, diphtheria, mumps, measles, rubella, and there are more have all been eradicated from the United States buy a vaccine and not unicorns. I hope you do hit the lottery, that would be awesome.  

[BlerkOne]

5 minutes ago, joeyancho said:

Smallpox, polio, diphtheria, mumps, measles, rubella, and there are more have all been eradicated from the United States buy a vaccine and not unicorns. I hope you do hit the lottery, that would be awesome.  

Actually not all of those. and nearly eradicated is not eradicate. Some see upticks now and then. Measles certainly made a comeback. And people who travel to areas of the others can brig it back to the US.

 

But for extra credit, find anything from a coronavirus that is 100% prevented by a vaccine.

[chipmaster]

2 hours ago, joeyancho said:

Smallpox, polio, diphtheria, mumps, measles, rubella, and there are more have all been eradicated from the United States buy a vaccine and not unicorns. I hope you do hit the lottery, that would be awesome.  

 

And what was the history of those development, on WARP speed ?

[ontheweb]

12 hours ago, BlerkOne said:

Actually not all of those. and nearly eradicated is not eradicate. Some see upticks now and then. Measles certainly made a comeback. And people who travel to areas of the others can brig it back to the US.

 

But for extra credit, find anything from a coronavirus that is 100% prevented by a vaccine.

Measles made a comeback because people did not take the vaccine. That happened in my state until the legislature passed and the governor signed a bill taking away the "religious" exemption. And even then the courts had to uphold the challenges to the state's right to protect public health.

 

I know of someone who could have exempted their child from the shot for medical reasons, a compromised immune system, but ended up having him take the shot because they thought it was a lesser risk before the state stopped this nonsense from the anti-vaccine crowd.

[chengkp75]

On 8/6/2020 at 7:57 PM, d9704011 said:

Nothing very specific; bedtime reading for those who may be contemplating developing a plan for their ship/company/port and all the issues they may wish to consider covering in the plan.  

 

23 hours ago, Roz said:

We need the Cliff notes.

 

17 hours ago, NCTribeFan said:

Not really intended for passengers.  But I did skim it.  Stuff at the end interesting about pre-boarding testing.

 

I've been saying for weeks that taking someone's temp before they enter a building (or ship, in this case) is pretty much pointless since people can be totally asymptomatic yet contagious.  Just because someone isn't running a fever means nothing except they aren't currently running a fever!  Waste of time and energy.

 

I think the protocols will change considerably if/when a vaccine and/or anti-viral meds are available for widespread use.

This is pretty much "boiler plate" legalese taken from what to include in a shipping company's ISM (International Safety Management) code, about identifying all risks, and writing specific policies and procedures for mitigating the risks, and then just amending the wording to be covid specific.  As, noted, it is a guide to the cruise lines and the ports on things to consider when making their plans, it is not a plan per se.  Basically, they are saying to make the "Covid19 Company and Ship Management Plan" a part of the company's ISM code.  Despite the bashing of the US CDC over it's requirements for resumption of cruises, this is exactly the type of "guidance" document the US CDC provided, albeit in more detail, but again it is mostly a reiteration of how to develop an ISM code.

[cruiser man 60]

Well MSC have all approvals for 2 ships to start 16ty August, Italy, Greece & Malta stops.

70% occupancy with rapid test before boarding, also full cover included so if you get denied boarding, have to leave mid cruise etc you get refunded & medical costs paid

[Eli_6]

1 hour ago, cruiser man 60 said:

Well MSC have all approvals for 2 ships to start 16ty August, Italy, Greece & Malta stops.

70% occupancy with rapid test before boarding, also full cover included so if you get denied boarding, have to leave mid cruise etc you get refunded & medical costs paid

Does MSC provide the rapid tests? Or do you have to get them somewhere yourself?  

 

Once the rapid tests are widely available, this seems like it would be a good method of cutting down the chances of infection. I suppose a person could have become infected a day or two before and test negative, but would at least prevent anyone with an active case from getting in board. 

[NCTribeFan]

On 8/7/2020 at 2:40 PM, BlerkOne said:

 

Catching 40% of carriers before they spread the disease to more people is far from pointless. A vaccine will be far from perfect. Too many people are depending on that fantasy. Effective treatments would be wonderful, but that is after someone has the virus.

 

Taking someone's temp who is asymptomatic is going to catch 40% of the carriers?  You lost me.

 

Now, a rapid test makes some sense.

[BlerkOne]

7 hours ago, NCTribeFan said:

 

Taking someone's temp who is asymptomatic is going to catch 40% of the carriers?  You lost me.

 

Now, a rapid test makes some sense.

 

You take the temp of everyone and you should be able to weed out 40%. If you stop one spreader, it is worth it.

 

If you test someone who was just exposed, it will be negative 100% of the time. Or even a few days after exposure. The tests themselves have margins of error, too.

[SeaHunt]

On 8/8/2020 at 12:29 PM, cruiser man 60 said:

Well MSC have all approvals for 2 ships to start 16ty August, Italy, Greece & Malta stops.

70% occupancy with rapid test before boarding, also full cover included so if you get denied boarding, have to leave mid cruise etc you get refunded & medical costs paid

 

Some people are upset that you can't leave the ships in any port unless you're on an MSC shore excursion - NO touring on you own.  😉

 

"One of the most interesting aspects of MSC's new COVID-19 health and safety protocols is the requirement that passengers must take part in an MSC-designed shore excursion in order to disembark the ship.

 

Initially, no independent explorations ashore will be allowed. MSC has instead designed a collection of shore excursions in each port that will use guides wearing PPE and which conform to all local health and safety protocols on shore. This helps to further control passengers onshore and help protect local communities in the event of any sort of medical outbreak, while still providing passengers with an enjoyable experience.

 

In many ways, it is not so dissimilar to an expedition cruise experience, where passengers typically only disembark as a group and rarely travel ashore independently.

 

MSC will offer at least one of these excursions complimentary for all cabin grades, though additional excursions can be purchased depending on the cabin "Experience" that cruisers book. MSC's "experiences" come with numerous inclusions, including drink packages and other offerings.

 

Passengers booking stays in the MSC Yacht Club, MSC's luxury ship-within-a-ship concept, will receive all five shore excursions (one in each port of call) for free. Passengers in other cabin grades can purchase up to three shore excursions for a flat, all-in rate of 100 Euros per person.

 

Passengers wishing to explore independently will be required to take an excursion, as no one will be allowed off the vessel without one. Passengers wishing to stay onboard are welcomed to do so.

 

MSC notes that these rules also apply to its own crewmembers. The line is reportedly working on group tours for crew wishing to go ashore in port as well".

 

https://www.cruisecritic.com/news/5510/