90% effective vaccine EVEN without booster shot...

[firefly333]

19 minutes ago, Tree_skier said:

I work with and around at risk people.  These public health measures have been utterly catastrophic for community members on the margins of society and have done for more damage than good.  I deal with the carnage on a daily basis. I post very little personal information on CC for a reason, I have no interest in telling sad stories to try evoke an emotional response.  If people are incapable of looking at the data, critically analyzing the consequences of decisions and adjusting their views accordingly I'm sure I have no answer for their cognitive dissonance. 

... though I'd like to know how they came up with anything 15% or over of covid beds means we have to go back into lockdown, why not 20% or 25% of beds for covid usage before we shut down restaurants from 75 back to 50, shut bars, though not open here, what they call optional hospital procedures stopped. 15% seems too low to me to go back to shutting down. 

 

I'm taking my dad to the hearing aide doctor thursday, who says more than half his business gone. He worked with nursing homes, but they cant leave and come to him right now since march. So old people cant have visitors mostly or get taken to get hearing aides fixed.

 

My 97 year old aunt is living in a home, and just got out of quarantine, shes been locked in her room, but now again she can eat meal with the other residents. 

 

It's been hard on everyone. But kids have no control, I feel worse for them. 

[yogimax]

6 hours ago, BND said:

59,000 people die of rabies worldwide every year.  

Not a problem in the United States...

 

"Cases of human rabies cases in the United States are rare, with only 1 to 3 cases reported annually. Twenty-five cases of human rabies have been reported in the United States in the past decade (2009-2018)."

 

[Tree_skier]

7 minutes ago, firefly333 said:

... though I'd like to know how they came up with anything 15% or over of covid beds means we have to go back into lockdown, why not 20% or 25% of beds for covid usage before we shut down restaurants from 75 back to 50, shut bars, though not open here, what they call optional hospital procedures stopped. 15% seems too low to me to go back to shutting down. 

 

I'm taking my dad to the hearing aide doctor thursday, who says more than half his business gone. He worked with nursing homes, but they cant leave and come to him right now since march. So old people cant have visitors mostly or get taken to get hearing aides fixed.

 

My 97 year old aunt is living in a home, and just got out of quarantine, shes been locked in her room, but now again she can eat meal with the other residents. 

 

It's been hard on everyone. But kids have no control, I feel worse for them. 

I know from your previous posts that you do a lot to take care of your very aged parents.  If I remember correctly they still live independently. You are their life line. You are a noble son.  Thanks for what you are doing.

[ONECRUISER]

15 minutes ago, firefly333 said:

... though I'd like to know how they came up with anything 15% or over of covid beds means we have to go back into lockdown, why not 20% or 25% of beds for covid usage before we shut down restaurants from 75 back to 50, shut bars, though not open here, what they call optional hospital procedures stopped. 15% seems too low to me to go back to shutting down. 

 

I'm taking my dad to the hearing aide doctor thursday, who says more than half his business gone. He worked with nursing homes, but they cant leave and come to him right now since march. So old people cant have visitors mostly or get taken to get hearing aides fixed.

 

My 97 year old aunt is living in a home, and just got out of quarantine, shes been locked in her room, but now again she can eat meal with the other residents. 

 

It's been hard on everyone. But kids have no control, I feel worse for them. 

My Mother 77, Emphysema, Heart Disease, 2 time Breast Cancer survivor(last 5yrs). Lucky have me available, otherwise be in a home. Glad I'm able be here for her. My Brother & his wife currently getting over CV, his kids still negative...  My Grand Daughter hasn't seen her friends or Classmates in person since first week March, has only played with her 3 Cousins 4 times in that time having only her Parents and me to entertain her. Thank Heavens for Face Time...

Edited December 1, 2020 by ONECRUISER

[Ocean Boy]

7 hours ago, BND said:

59,000 people die of rabies worldwide every year.  Mostly from bats, but hey, bats are just squirrels with wings.  They're all rodents.  

Actually, small rodents rarely carry rabies. No need to give squirrels a bad rap.

[broberts]

1 hour ago, Tree_skier said:

Dead with the disease not from it.  Very different metric.  

 

You I cannot convince me that these 1,000,000 would have died in the last 10 months if COVID-19 did not exist.

 

Stating a fact does not strike me as emotive. If you are uncomfortable dealing with it, that should tell you something.

[Tree_skier]

34 minutes ago, broberts said:

 

You I cannot convince me that these 1,000,000 would have died in the last 10 months if COVID-19 did not exist.

 

Stating a fact does not strike me as emotive. If you are uncomfortable dealing with it, that should tell you something.

I dealt with it already however,I have provided you with a half dozen facts.  You simply ignore them.  I'll leave you to your fear.

 

[Missusdubbya]

10 hours ago, d9704011 said:

Geez Louise, tell the whole story will ya! 

1 hour ago, Ocean Boy said:

No need to give squirrels a bad rap.

This thread might be doomed but I want to give props for the use of “Geez Louise” (love it!) and not giving squirrels a bad rap 🤣

[firefly333]

5 hours ago, Tree_skier said:

I know from your previous posts that you do a lot to take care of your very aged parents.  If I remember correctly they still live independently. You are their life line. You are a noble son.  Thanks for what you are doing.

Lol actually I'm a daughter not a son. I also have a hc sister I was having to drive everywhere. She used to cruise with me. She is lower IQ and epilepsy, and cant do even/odd numbers or ascending or descending numbers..I.e. if we ever got separated she couldn't find our cabin. Only one really close call where after a show she followed people into the elevator going the wrong direction, and I just managed to see her as the elevator door was closing and pull her out. I'd told her if we got separated to ask someone to take her to guest services and ask for help. Lol. 

 

Cruises are my getaway from real life. I'll wear a mask, social distance. Do whatever I have to. April 25th a certain TA found a hump balcony with my name on it. Crossing my fingers.

Edited December 1, 2020 by firefly333

[Milwaukee Eight]

8 hours ago, yogimax said:

I have no idea what your point is.

You said.....

 

“Yes, teachers are easy targets as are their unions.  However, they are also human beings.  Many are over 60, many have medical conditions.   Like most people, they have vulnerable parents and grandparents”

 

Why would teachers expose their parents and grandparents?  They should be responsible for themselves and this means they should avoid those that have medical conditions and are in a vulnerable group. 
 

M8

Edited December 1, 2020 by Milwaukee Eight

[S.A.M.J.R.]

11 hours ago, Tree_skier said:

 

Sorry you need to read your post again.  You posted best estimate and best case.  My numbers come from the best estimate column (most likely) scenario.  Again, what context is missing by summarizing the most likely scenario.

 

Also, I don't need you to make the data easier for me.  Simply read the words.  They have meaning.

That's where I read wrong.  My apologies.

[ace2542]

3 hours ago, firefly333 said:

Lol actually I'm a daughter not a son. I also have a hc sister I was having to drive everywhere. She used to cruise with me. She is lower IQ and epilepsy, and cant do even/odd numbers or ascending or descending numbers..I.e. if we ever got separated she couldn't find our cabin. Only one really close call where after a show she followed people into the elevator going the wrong direction, and I just managed to see her as the elevator door was closing and pull her out. I'd told her if we got separated to ask someone to take her to guest services and ask for help. Lol. 

 

Cruises are my getaway from real life. I'll wear a mask, social distance. Do whatever I have to. April 25th a certain TA found a hump balcony with my name on it. Crossing my fingers.

Grip rosary  beads in those crossed fingers and start praying. Because there is little chance that will go ahead. Most have cancelled till at least early April already. The problem is not just speed of vaccine rollout down the different groupings if you want to call them that but also the crews for the ships. Many of them come from countries which may not be as effective in vaccination as the U.S might be. And they will almost surely be working on a no vaccine no employment no exception basis. And processing of crew visas if needed might also be problematic. 

[TheMastodon]

 

1 hour ago, Milwaukee Eight said:

You said.....

 

“Yes, teachers are easy targets as are their unions.  However, they are also human beings.  Many are over 60, many have medical conditions.   Like most people, they have vulnerable parents and grandparents”

 

Why would teachers expose their parents and grandparents?  They should be responsible for themselves and this means they should avoid those that have medical conditions and are in a vulnerable group. 
 

M8

 

Milwaukee its just excuse after excuse after excuse for Team Apocalypse - nothing is ever enough..  

 

"Rules for thee, but not for me!"

 

 

[BND]

1 hour ago, Milwaukee Eight said:

You said.....

 

“Yes, teachers are easy targets as are their unions.  However, they are also human beings.  Many are over 60, many have medical conditions.   Like most people, they have vulnerable parents and grandparents”

 

Why would teachers expose their parents and grandparents?  They should be responsible for themselves and this means they should avoid those that have medical conditions and are in a vulnerable group. 
 

M8

I know several teachers and they all want to be back in the classrooms.  We just talked to one on Sunday.  He teaches an AP class and his students won't be ready for the AP exam which many count on for college.  All because online just isn't effective.  It's the unions that are fighting it.  My DH and both my sons have been working this entire time and I did until I retired in March.  I was a Federal employee and my DH and sons are Fed Gov contractors who work in what are considered essential jobs because of what agencies they support.  My agency was also essential and there is no option for work from home.  We're just careful around our parents and rarely see them right now.  I don't get why some act like teachers should be treated differently than everyone else.  My DIL is a nurse in a GP/family practice office and she's been working mostly in the office with patients this entire time also.  

 

BTW, teachers and the unions are not going to like the results when all schools start back up.  A lot of people are learning they enjoy teaching their children and can teach them what they need to know instead of every PC thing that comes along.  True homeschooling also doesn't take up 7 hours a day.  Homeschooling because of how it's done takes up usually no more than 4 hours a day.    The result is less tax money going to the schools as it's per student, and that means less teaching jobs.  The unions need to seriously look at this.

 

I'm also sure that most of you are seeing what we are.  Kids of all ages are hanging out together everywhere.  Around the neighborhood, at the playgrounds, at stores, etc.  Keeping them home from school is not keeping them apart. 

Edited December 1, 2020 by BND

[BND]

10 hours ago, yogimax said:

Not a problem in the United States...

 

"Cases of human rabies cases in the United States are rare, with only 1 to 3 cases reported annually. Twenty-five cases of human rabies have been reported in the United States in the past decade (2009-2018)."

 

I did say worldwide.

Edited December 1, 2020 by BND

[BND]

9 hours ago, Ocean Boy said:

Actually, small rodents rarely carry rabies. No need to give squirrels a bad rap.

Yeah, well, not really a fan.  They've done some real damage this year to our oak trees.  Actually in order to get to a lot of the acorns, they were chewing off small branches/clumps of leaves so they would be easier to get on the ground.  All our neighbors were not amused by it. Everyone thinks we're going to have a bad winter as the squirrels have been acting "nuts" all fall.  

[Ocean Boy]

7 minutes ago, BND said:

Yeah, well, not really a fan.  They've done some real damage this year to our oak trees.  Actually in order to get to a lot of the acorns, they were chewing off small branches/clumps of leaves so they would be easier to get on the ground.  All our neighbors were not amused by it. Everyone thinks we're going to have a bad winter as the squirrels have been acting "nuts" all fall.  

All very interesting but still doesn't link rabies and rodents.

[BND]

10 hours ago, Tree_skier said:

Dead with the disease not from it.  Very different metric.  

 

480,000 people die from smoking every single year yet it is sold all across Canada and the United States and heavily taxed to fund government coffers.  

 

I think it is significant that you parsed one line from my post and then replied with an emotive post further supporting my fear mongering premise.

 

58,389,000 people die every year.  That proves nothing.

Every report I've seen says Deaths related to Covid, not Deaths FROM Covid, which to me means something.  Are we going to see adjusted numbers in a year or two?

[BND]

9 minutes ago, Ocean Boy said:

All very interesting but still doesn't link rabies and rodents.

I never said squirrels carry rabies.  I said bats do.

[BND]

I've also seen that Dr Fauci has said in the last few days that kids should be in school and that they know that kids don't spread the way adults do.  Kids are in far more danger stuck at home day in and day out sitting in front of a computer.  Depression and suicide rates are also up in younger people.  Deblasio did an about face after facing a lot of angry parents.  He closed schools all while knowing what Dr Fauci has stated and has since reopened them.  Our county up until today had only allowed K-2nd grade two days a week.  They're adding 3-5th this week.  There has been no outbreak in any of the schools.  A few staff have gotten sick, but so far no links between them.  In other words, the staff is catching it from their daily lives and not spreading it to each other as they are following protocols and keeping their distances from each other in the schools.  Also, latest info on Moderna's vaccine is 94% preventing disease and 100% preventing severe disease, which has been the goal all along, keeping people out of the hospital.

[broberts]

32 minutes ago, BND said:

I've also seen that Dr Fauci has said in the last few days that kids should be in school and that they know that kids don't spread the way adults do.  Kids are in far more danger stuck at home day in and day out sitting in front of a computer.  Depression and suicide rates are also up in younger people.  Deblasio did an about face after facing a lot of angry parents.  He closed schools all while knowing what Dr Fauci has stated and has since reopened them.  Our county up until today had only allowed K-2nd grade two days a week.  They're adding 3-5th this week.  There has been no outbreak in any of the schools.  A few staff have gotten sick, but so far no links between them.  In other words, the staff is catching it from their daily lives and not spreading it to each other as they are following protocols and keeping their distances from each other in the schools.  Also, latest info on Moderna's vaccine is 94% preventing disease and 100% preventing severe disease, which has been the goal all along, keeping people out of the hospital.

 

I wish people would convey the entire sentiments expressed by Dr Fauci, rather than glom into one fragment of his statement. He always offers the caveat that in areas with high community infection rates it may not be possible to open schools until the spread can be brought under better control. And he also says that only schools that have acceptable air circulation and the resources for proper mitigation practices should open.

 

As great as the new vaccines may be, they are not magic bullets. No matter how stellar the distribution nrtwork, regardless of manufacturing capacity, it is still going to take five or six months to physically push more than five hundred million needles into two hundred and fifty million arms. Until then at least and perhaps beyond we are going to have to continue mitigation efforts.

[BND]

8 minutes ago, broberts said:

 

I wish people would convey the entire sentiments expressed by Dr Fauci, rather than glom into one fragment of his statement. He always offers the caveat that in areas with high community infection rates it may not be possible to open schools until the spread can be brought under better control. And he also says that only schools that have acceptable air circulation and the resources for proper mitigation practices should open.

 

As great as the new vaccines may be, they are not magic bullets. No matter how stellar the distribution nrtwork, regardless of manufacturing capacity, it is still going to take five or six months to physically push more than five hundred million needles into two hundred and fifty million arms. Until then at least and perhaps beyond we are going to have to continue mitigation efforts.

I wish people would research about kids and the impact this is having on them.  He is not the only one who has said kids need to be in school and that they do not spread it the way adults do.   What you stated he said back in July. 

 

You might want to read what he said just in the last couple of days about schools.

https://www.businessinsider.com/anthony-fauci-close-bars-school-instruction-coronavirus-infections-health-2020-11

 

https://www.miamiherald.com/news/coronavirus/article247504030.html

 

 

 

Edited December 1, 2020 by BND

[Tree_skier]

7 hours ago, firefly333 said:

'm a daughter not a son.

I'm so very sorry.  It's so hard to tell, I don't no why I assumed what I did.  My bad...

[broberts]

5 minutes ago, BND said:

I wish people would research about kids and the impact this is having on them.  He is not the only one who has said kids need to be in school and that they do not spread it the way adults do.  

 

You might want to read what he said just in the last couple of days about schools.

https://www.businessinsider.com/anthony-fauci-close-bars-school-instruction-coronavirus-infections-health-2020-11

 

 

And I wish people would invest more in making schools safe before forcing kids, teachers, and service personal back into the same buildings.

 

I take no issue with getting kids back into classrooms. My problem is that many pushing for that are unwilling to come up with the necessary resources to keep them safe.

[BND]

3 minutes ago, broberts said:

 

And I wish people would invest more in making schools safe before forcing kids, teachers, and service personal back into the same buildings.

 

I take no issue with getting kids back into classrooms. My problem is that many pushing for that are unwilling to come up with the necessary resources to keep them safe.

Did you even read what I linked?  Schools aren't experiencing spread.  Kids aren't bringing it to each other or home.  The staff is bringing it in from outside, but not spreading it to each other.  Kids are very, very safe in school.  What "resources" do you think are needed that they don't already have?  You're just putting your feelings on the subject and not facts.