New vaccine

[pete14]

2 hours ago, pete14 said:

Hi Josy.

 

I hadn’t heard that and am thinking that it may be for a smaller group of volunteers because I got an email from them the other day that outlined unblinding arrangements in the way we have been told before. We are there for a blood test next week anyway at which point I was going to ask to be told vaccine or placebo because I should be called for vaccination in the next few weeks. If they are going to offer the opportunity to continue in the way your friend has, I think I will go along with it because it seems to make sense.

Josy - I have just been in touch with the trial who have confirmed that this is being considered but some way from regulatory approval which they will need. It sounds quite sensible though.

[zap99]

1 hour ago, pete14 said:

Perhaps we should organise a regular coach party or two, or drag kalos’ caravan down to the harbour in preparation for the summer. I hear there is a nice space right outside the harbour office. 😇

There is a nice car park by the harbour office. We could have our meet and greet there. Music , dancing, booze and still room to park our Range Rovers.🤣

[jeanlyon]

Not any more.  Whitestrand Car Park will be closed to cars once the pubs are back open.  It will be used for tables and chairs.

[zap99]

56 minutes ago, Adawn47 said:

I only hope that refusals are somehow recorded, otherwise I can see some nasty accusations coming if some of these idiots contract covid and are hospitalised. I wonder if some of these refusals are because of a fear of needles?

Avril

Spain said they are going to have a database of the refuseniks and will share it with EU. Our friends will no doubt ask us to join in.🤔

[jeanlyon]

I heard on the news this morning that they are considering trials of giving one Pfizer vaccination and an AZ one later.  They want volunteers over the age of 60.  Quite a good idea.

[Josy1953]

29 minutes ago, pete14 said:

Josy - I have just been in touch with the trial who have confirmed that this is being considered but some way from regulatory approval which they will need. It sounds quite sensible though.

Thanks for that Pete, I was thinking that I would do it so I will ask if they have any info on it when I go for my appointment next Thursday.

[zap99]

7 minutes ago, jeanlyon said:

I heard on the news this morning that they are considering trials of giving one Pfizer vaccination and an AZ one later.  They want volunteers over the age of 60.  Quite a good idea.

As we will have 600 squillion doses, we can have 3, or 4 different ones each and still have some to send to the other Countries. I will go for AZ as I like Oxford, Moderna as Ferrari's are quite nice and a Pfizer from sandwich please.

[arlowood]

13 minutes ago, pete14 said:

Josy - I have just been in touch with the trial who have confirmed that this is being considered but some way from regulatory approval which they will need. It sounds quite sensible though.

I read that earlier post about the crossover experiment being done in the Novavax trial. I think that is a brilliant idea and I'm just disappointed that the study group running the Oxford/AZ trial did not think to introduce that option for their over-70's volunteers, of which I am one. I had to ask to be unblinded and was told that I was in the placebo group so went ahead and booked a jab at one of the local hubs last Friday. Ended up with the Pfizer jab.

 

I have a review appointment in March so I will query the point with the people I see then. Too late now to consider a switch to do the crossover.

 

However, serendipitously, I believe the Government are looking at mixing and matching jabs to give them more flexibility so maybe I might get the AZ one as my follow up.

[pete14]

18 minutes ago, arlowood said:

I read that earlier post about the crossover experiment being done in the Novavax trial. I think that is a brilliant idea and I'm just disappointed that the study group running the Oxford/AZ trial did not think to introduce that option for their over-70's volunteers, of which I am one. I had to ask to be unblinded and was told that I was in the placebo group so went ahead and booked a jab at one of the local hubs last Friday. Ended up with the Pfizer jab.

 

I have a review appointment in March so I will query the point with the people I see then. Too late now to consider a switch to do the crossover.

 

However, serendipitously, I believe the Government are looking at mixing and matching jabs to give them more flexibility so maybe I might get the AZ one as my follow up.

I agree that it is a good idea but it is a pity that most over 70s will miss out on the opportunity because, like you, they have already taken the opportunity to be vaccinated in the general programme. This will presumably mean the older age groups will not be represented in the results which I would think is quite important.

[yorkshirephil]

12 minutes ago, pete14 said:

I agree that it is a good idea but it is a pity that most over 70s will miss out on the opportunity because, like you, they have already taken the opportunity to be vaccinated in the general programme. This will presumably mean the older age groups will not be represented in the results which I would think is quite important.

Most over 70s will only miss out this year, a more long term view is being taken using 2 different vaccines. We do now know that the vaccine is "safe" in the general population. As we don't know how long immunity lasts yet then we don't know when the next round of vaccine will be required. Working on the flu model I would think that the vulnerable will likely need vaccinating from September and follow the same protocol as the current one unless immunity just tapers off and a booster dose is required. Drug cocktails are becoming more popular as they can complement each other and actually greatly reduce the overall costs. It will be interesting to see how the one shot J&J vaccine pans out, and whether other companies can manufacture a one shot version soon. There are many other companies working on vaccines that will add to the arsenal for next year and beyond and hopefully give us the freedom we all crave. From a medical science viewpoint these are exiting times especially the mRNA vaccines as the potential is enormous.

[ace2542]

1 hour ago, jeanlyon said:

I heard on the news this morning that they are considering trials of giving one Pfizer vaccination and an AZ one later.  They want volunteers over the age of 60.  Quite a good idea.

 It sounds like the work of the Umbrella corporation from Resident Evil to me. Surely you can't match up two vaccine one mRNA based one none mRNA based and hope for better results. I don't think it will work like that. I am quite happy to have the same vaccine twice if need be because sadly the single shot doesn't look that effective. But I am not having a cocktail not a chance in hell.

[ace2542]

18 minutes ago, yorkshirephil said:

It will be interesting to see how the one shot J&J vaccine pans out, and whether other companies can manufacture a one shot version soon.

The effectiveness is in the mid 60s% range apparently. So hardly worth having when you compare against 80s and 90s% effectiveness.

[yorkshirephil]

6 minutes ago, ace2542 said:

The effectiveness is in the mid 60s% range apparently. So hardly worth having when you compare against 80s and 90s% effectiveness.

So chances of dying reduced by 60% not worth having? 

[ace2542]

Just now, yorkshirephil said:

So chances of dying reduced by 60% not worth having? 

As opposed to chance of dying reduce by 89%?. I was really hoping that Johnson would be in the 80s range but it is only mid 60s.

[yorkshirephil]

Just now, ace2542 said:

As opposed to chance of dying reduce by 89%?. I was really hoping that Johnson would be in the 80s range but it is only mid 60s.

Not everyone will get the chance of the higher efficacy vaccine. You don't get to pick and choose.

[ace2542]

3 minutes ago, yorkshirephil said:

Not everyone will get the chance of the higher efficacy vaccine. You don't get to pick and choose.

We have this discussion on here before but why not? If it is a choice is between getting a person vaccinated or not getting a person vaccinated. Maybe a person later on down the line has them over a barrel?.

[Dinglebert]

1 hour ago, zap99 said:

Spain said they are going to have a database of the refuseniks and will share it with EU. Our friends will no doubt ask us to join in.🤔

They can ask all they like but they won't get it under the Data Protection Act.  You would have had to agree to the information being transferred as its not part of the normal business of the NHS.

[Harry Peterson]

One of the real positives coming out of all this is that we seem to be creating a real ability via various means of getting large numbers of people vaccinated very quickly.

 

We seem very likely to have to make these vaccinations annual, possibly even twice yearly in some cases, because of changes in the virus. That’s perfectly feasible, particularly with the RNA vaccines, in terms of development and manufacture. It’s looking increasingly feasible too in terms of delivery.

 

Hugely expensive, obviously, but infinitely less costly than the alternative.

[zap99]

13 minutes ago, Dinglebert said:

They can ask all they like but they won't get it under the Data Protection Act.  You would have had to agree to the information being transferred as its not part of the normal business of the NHS.

I will agree if it means I can go to Europe on holiday. Perhaps like the bloke on telly who won't have the jab unless he needs it to go to Majorca for his hols, folks views may be a bit fluid.

[zap99]

51 minutes ago, ace2542 said:

 It sounds like the work of the Umbrella corporation from Resident Evil to me. Surely you can't match up two vaccine one mRNA based one none mRNA based and hope for better results. I don't think it will work like that. I am quite happy to have the same vaccine twice if need be because sadly the single shot doesn't look that effective. But I am not having a cocktail not a chance in hell.

Thinking it may turn you into a zombie is an interesting viewpoint.

[kalos]

54 minutes ago, ace2542 said:

 It sounds like the work of the Umbrella corporation from Resident Evil to me.

 

52 minutes ago, ace2542 said:

 So hardly worth having

 

 

2 minutes ago, zap99 said:

Thinking it may turn you into a zombie is an interesting viewpoint.

 

 

                    

[Ardennais]

3 hours ago, jeanlyon said:

Just read Jane's post with interest.  Fancy someone saying "stop stalking me".  What a pillock.  Nowt as queer as folk.

However, that gentleman could have politely refused the first invitation and could be annoyed at having been contacted again. He might even think that it was a scam call, and I’m sure we’ve all told similar callers where to go! 

[terrierjohn]

1 hour ago, ace2542 said:

 It sounds like the work of the Umbrella corporation from Resident Evil to me. Surely you can't match up two vaccine one mRNA based one none mRNA based and hope for better results. I don't think it will work like that. I am quite happy to have the same vaccine twice if need be because sadly the single shot doesn't look that effective. But I am not having a cocktail not a chance in hell.

The assumption I expect is that each vaccine will trigger a specific antibody production, so having a smorgasbord jab might be the best way to provide a broader spectrum protection.

[arlowood]

1 hour ago, ace2542 said:

 It sounds like the work of the Umbrella corporation from Resident Evil to me. Surely you can't match up two vaccine one mRNA based one none mRNA based and hope for better results. I don't think it will work like that. I am quite happy to have the same vaccine twice if need be because sadly the single shot doesn't look that effective. But I am not having a cocktail not a chance in hell.

This discussion featured in the BBC news bulletin at 1pm. It would appear that mixing vaccines is practiced routinely in other therapies. Also during the Ebola epidemic they found that employing an approach of giving mixed vaccines was shown to be more beneficial and provided better outcomes.

 

It would appear that the Pfizer and Oxford/AZ vaccines both target the spike protein on the virus but in completely different ways. On that basis there is hope that a combination approach could boost the efficacy. Time will tell but it is certainly worth trying. Also with other new vaccines in the pipeline it would make eminent sense to investigate his mix and match philosophy to help the global effort to control Covid-19

[Dinglebert]

21 minutes ago, Ardennais said:

However, that gentleman could have politely refused the first invitation and could be annoyed at having been contacted again. He might even think that it was a scam call, and I’m sure we’ve all told similar callers where to go! 

I would agree.  I imagine the scenario was very much the person received a letter with information leaflet inviting him to make an appointment to receive his vaccination.   He having read the leaflet or indeed not decides not to make that appointment.   He then receives a phone call asking him again to make an appointment which he declines.  To receive a second phone call wouldn't leave many people very happy.

 

While personally I have had my first vaccination and can't wait to get my second and equally I believe that everyone who can have it should.  However we do need to respect the rights of people to choose not to.