Future booked cruises with All Included? Tips no longer included.

[Jeremiah1212]

23 minutes ago, Cap_D said:

Cookiegate is being spun by Celebrity and it's just making them look worse.   One more reason why they can't be trusted.  They would in no way know how popular the product was unless they offered it for free.  And have yet to see or read a review of the actual cookie.  So, their explanation makes no sense, as there are no reports of such a cookie being offered at the same spot, hours, etc. as included.  And, they could always have a warm cookie at OVC with plenty of equipment to heat it, present it, etc.  If cooked to order entirely then how many did they expect to sell, and why market it the way they did to seemingly promote volume consumption.  And, why mess around with the passengers?!   Meanwhile Eden Cafe has a well reviewed warm cookie, and there isn't a charge yet, but it's only available for a few hours a sailing and most passengers don't have one, know about it, etc.  Will that go to a charge to lessen current demand? 

 

 

I can't tell if you're serious or not. Rest assured, the internet pandemonium over a cookie. A cookie. Has been laid to rest. If she didn't have to be so professional I think her response would have been more along the lines of "we heard the feedback (and outrage) over the optional $2 spend, 🖕the cookies and let's move on. 

[ILgirl]

As a solo traveler I am excited to see the change to not charge a single traveler double for AI!  I usually book the single IV on E class ships to avoid the double AI charge.  I do enjoy these cabins but the unobstructed single IVs are difficult to come by.  The storage space is minimal as well.  Again, not a deal breaker but now I have options.  I did enjoy a panoramic OV on E class once and now have that option as well as all cabin types without getting gigged double for the AI.  A welcome change for me!

[kwokpot]

9 minutes ago, Jeremiah1212 said:

 

 

 

Summary of all of the items announced 8/29

*brief rundown of all the things that changed or were addressed by Celebrity this week

 

I'll be more clear. Yesterday 8/29 Celebrity hosted a call with TA's. I summarized the topics (and only the topics) that the SVP discussed. 

Thank you. That makes it very clear where the source of your information is coming from. I did not know you were a TA and it now makes your comments on my now deleted Cruisehive article more relevant. 

Edit: I was correct in my observations that the cookie test results weren't openly discussed here on CC until you brought it up on your summation thread, which is why I questioned it's validity. 

Edited August 30, 2023 by kwokpot

[39august]

Thanks, Jeremiah. I always  count on you to know what is actually true. 

[doghog]

4 hours ago, Jeremiah1212 said:

This news is all over the social media so here is a brief rundown of all the things that changed or were addressed by Celebrity this week. Not trying to start a debate as this isn't rumor or speculation. It came straight from the source. 

 

All Included

*Bookings created after 10/3 will not have gratuities included regardless if you book Cruise Only or All Included 

*Significantly more people booking Cruise Only in the past year (AI bookings were ~90% of the volume when initially introduced)

*Aqua Class will now offer a Cruise Only rate

*Gratuities can still be prepaid at the time of booking or anytime there after 

*Prices should be 'reflective' of gratuities being removed from the inclusions 

*Singles will no longer have the double charge for All Included 

*Quoting a flat $20 pp/pd (gratuity included) price to upgrade from Classic to Premium beverage package 

***Reason given - Drinks and WiFi are the two things people want most. (I don't agree with the delivery here - just passing along what was shared) Also provides some flexibility to use gratuities as a tool in future sales. 

 

Sky Suite Butlers

*Team concept is in place lead by a Head Butler 

*Head Butler will determine where/who needs extra attention (i.e. they will try to address who heavily uses their butler and who contacts them once in a cruise

*No one was terminated but positions were shuffled around including to other brands in the company 

***Reason given - many Sky Suites were requesting service at the same time which created a bottleneck for anyone getting service from a butler 

 

Cookies 

*Test pilot at the gelato bar. 

*Apparently sold hundreds over two cruises 

*Did not replace free cookies/pastries anywhere else onboard 

*Discontinued and won't be back 

***Reason given -They needed to implement a fee to temper demand since it took some time to heat the cookies 

 

Vaping 

*Tested, feedback received and discontinued. 

*Vapers will have to sneak their vapes in their cabins like they do today or head to a smoking area 

 

Removal of Retreat OBC

***Reason Given - None. Big miss here. This should have been directly addressed as it is (was) an crucial tool in justifying the high suite prices

 

Removal of Aqua and Concierge perks and canapes

*According to Celebrity nothing has been removed

*There should be a card in AQ and CC cabins to indicate if and how often you want these provided ranging from never to every day

*(Can someone confirm this card exists? I have not seen it.)

***Reason Given - most of these items go to waste (I cannot disagree with this. Retooling what is offered would solve a lot Please don't give me any more tins of pate!)

 

Perfect Day at Coco Cay

*Giving a few ships opportunity to visit Coco Cay based on guest feedback 

*Continue to welcome families as indicated by always having kid and teen programs 

*Family travel on Celebrity is different 

***Reason Given - Trying to make some apparent distinction that people with kids on Celebrity travel with their kids not for their kids. If you are traveling for your kids, you travel on lines packed with the 'kid stuff'. If you travel with your kids you bring them/drag them along with you. Not the first time they have mentioned this but I'm not sure I agree with this approach. 

 

MDR upcharge items

*These things will continue to be on the menu and evolve over time.

***Reason Given - these are test items to expand what is offered similar to entrees in some of the Specialty restaurants.

 

Groups

*Group rates will eventually not include gratuities 

*Nothing mentioned on the refundability of group rates 

*The previous FAQ showing group rates would only be Cruise Only is gone. Groups will be All Included. I'm still concerned that it even made it to a draft FAQ. 

*Very little shared in general. I'm hesitant to share much more since this really isn't meant for general customers and there is a ton of misinformation posted about how this program works. 

 

Ultimately there were some hits and misses. Prices will go up as demand goes up. That goes for any line. New to cruise and new to brand, especially on 7 night Caribbean cruises is very very high. I think this is where a lot of the removal of grats is stemming from. This segment frequently doesn't know better than to consider this cost element when they are booking. I suspect Celebrity has learned they need to get out in front of some of these changes (i.e. Butler Team) but a lot of this test type stuff never has and may never be communicated. 

 

I do think the All Included terminology needs to go away and eventually shift back to something more along the lines of the Go 1/2/3 or Big Better Best program that gave people easy to understand prepackaged incremental choices. 

Your thread (this post) needs to be added as sticky and considered a living document. Updated when applicable. 

[abbydancer2003]

3 hours ago, terrydtx said:

Last year when we moved our New Zealand cruise from March to January, on same ship same itinerary it was considered a new booking and we lost $200 ($100pp) of our deposit for  rebooking, but we picked up a better price because of a sale going on at the time.

We also had to pay when we moved from January to 2025, but our book on board OBC went with us.  We did pay the 100.00 change fee, but the booking number stayed the same.  

 

They do have to manually add the OBC back in, though, so my guess is that there will be some sort of policy decision about which package to honor on those.  Pricing, though, does go to prevailing, so you're probably right.  

 

My sister and I have a Caribbean booking that is a holding only.  We want to move it to a 2025 fall transatlantic, which will almost certainly not be released by October 4, so I guess we'll see.

[jaywoods678]

On 8/29/2023 at 2:17 PM, AtlantaCruiser72 said:

 

I jumped ship after my December 2018 cruise on the Summit and no longer even consider Celebrity when looking at cruises.  HAL and Princess have become my go to's as I feel their pricing, both for fares and ancillary items, is much more fair and consumer friendly, even with some of the recent changes.

I completely agree. Although both Holland America and Princess have also gone downhill, not nearly as much as Celebrity, and at least with them you can still get a decent price.

[jaywoods678]

On 8/29/2023 at 2:31 PM, poeticlicensed said:

In my opinion, each change they make  is part of a laid out plan to change the direction of the company and make it more closely align with RCCL. I think the c suite looked at the future of cruising and decided its in the Caribbean, where profits are high, and its families, who have disposable income. Families generally don't take 14 day and longer cruises. They are firmly in the 3 to 7 day, where parents have to get back to work and kids to school and activities . So that's the new X focus, 3 to 7 day Caribbean cruises. 

 

RCCL made a huge investment in Cococay and they are gonna wring every dollar they can from it. The move to start sailing from Canaveral is part of it. Get those Disney family dollars. Mom and dad and grandparents bring the kids to Disney for several days of madness then are rewarded by a non Disney cruise that goes to Cococay for the kids. Thats a huge opportunity for X to cash in.

 

Taking away menu selections,  paying for little add ons, those  changes will only be known and felt by loyal customers, and that is clearly not the demographic they are chasing. Its simply not as lucrative. Do you think they've forgotten longtime cruisers exist? Nope, but in the macro, the new direction pays more. Will they lose some cruisers? Yup. But not enough to make it unattractive to move this direction.

 

The repackaging of all in to take away tips was probably on the drawing board last year. They figure people aren't gonna stiff the staff, and they want you in that bev page and wifi because they are huge moneymakers.

 

It is what it is. No amount of complaining is gonna change what is clearly a long range plan. Im not their sought after demo. So im not happy and will look elsewhere for future cruises.

I agree with this 100%. Families and first timers spend more onboard, and they know that's really the only way to make more money.

[jaywoods678]

23 hours ago, poeticlicensed said:

There are many parents who take the kids to Disney, but will not do a Disney cruise or a cruise with roller coasters or water parks. I think X is priming themselves as the alternative to Disney cruises (which are wildly expensive) and Royals "turn it up to 11". I think X sees themselves as the reward for parents who don't want a theme park experience. 

 

And as someone who lives15 minutes from the mouse, I see tons of kids in the parks all year round. We never did that, I dont believe in pulling kids out of school for vacation. But believe me, there are plenty of parents who would. 

 

And again, I think this is a slow move to the a new Celebrity. It will take a couple of years, but by 2025 your experience will be very different. 

 

I think the demographic for cruising generally is changing and the different cruiselines are positioning themselves for where they want to be.

It's a few things. Some districts have year-round schools with multiple breaks throughout the year, a lot of kids are home schooled now, different regions of the country have week-long breaks like Spring break but also a week for fall (Fall break) and a week for winter (Winter break), etc. Mostly any given week some school district in the country somewhere has a school week off. But also as you mentioned, parents have no qualms about pulling kids out of school these days, usually for selfish reasons like because it's cheaper that time of year, etc. I've been on several cruises during school year that had many many kids, and even on 2 week cruises. I've asked some of the parents, and they said they pulled them out of school. I personally think it's irresponsible, but who am I to judge I guess.

[RichYak]

3 hours ago, rxlowry said:

He did a great job summarizing this info direct from Celebrity.  The reasons given were the same I heard.  

 

3 hours ago, sixpackeddie said:

Very factual and accurate information.

 

2 hours ago, micruiser2002 said:

I am confused what discussion are you talking about?  I thought your original post was a summary of all the other posts here and on other sights about the changes and any possible responses from Celebrity?

It's important to note that the bullet points in the OP are a summary of a discussion led by Celebrity with travel agents. I believe Jeremiah has provided an accurate representation of what Celebrity execs said on the call, but the information may not all be factual. 

[Georgia_Peaches]

5 hours ago, chocolabmom said:

I'm confused about the upgrade price for the premium drink package.  Is that only effective if you book after 10-3?  Or can I upgrade on the website after 10-3 for flat $20 pp?

It's already listed on the website as $20 pp/pd but it's currently on sale for 5% off.

[NutsAboutGolf]

13 minutes ago, RichYak said:

 

 

It's important to note that the bullet points in the OP are a summary of a discussion led by Celebrity with travel agents. I believe Jeremiah has provided an accurate representation of what Celebrity execs said on the call, but the information may not all be factual. 

And we’ve seen it before where X shoreside says something is fleet wide only to discover on board that isn’t the case

[Mark_T]

9 hours ago, Ex-Airbalancer said:

Really grats should be built into the base price 

Lines like MSC that did that, had to unbundle them when moving to the US market, it causes them problems with price comparison websites, and it is something that US customers seem to expect...

[Spurs Fans]

Bye Celebrity! 

[mauimary]

I just did a dummy booking on an Alaska cruise for next May and the tips were still I included with the Al incl perks. 

[Mark_T]

3 minutes ago, mauimary said:

I just did a dummy booking on an Alaska cruise for next May and the tips were still I included with the Al incl perks. 

Obviously as these changes only impact bookings for future cruises made from 4th October onwards, so there is time to book under the old rules up until then...

[awhcruiser]

 

[LINGBER]

1 hour ago, Georgia_Peaches said:

It's already listed on the website as $20 pp/pd but it's currently on sale for 5% off.

Yes but they are still adding gratuity and tax to the flat $20 pp/pd. Maybe that takes effect after 10/3?

Edited August 30, 2023 by LINGBER

[Georgia_Peaches]

10 minutes ago, LINGBER said:

Yes but they are still adding gratuity and tax to the flat $20 pp/pd. Maybe that takes effect after 10/3?

The current $20 does not include gratuity.  It's added in on the final step of check out.  I didn't do it bc I'm going to wait until we board and use OBC from our TA.  For 4 nights the gratuity to upgrade is an additional $30.

 

On second thought, it might even be cheaper to just pay any upcharges out of our OBC instead.  IDK.

Edited August 30, 2023 by Georgia_Peaches

[abbydancer2003]

One thing I find interesting is the lack of anything on the OBC for suites.  I know it wasn't addressed in the call, but have they stated it specifically, or is it just that it's no longer listed as a suite perk?

 

 

[Josie201]

21 minutes ago, LINGBER said:

Yes but they are still adding gratuity and tax to the flat $20 pp/pd. Maybe that takes effect after 10/3?

I read it as a flat rate of $20 and assumed that meant it included gratuity.  I could be wrong.  I saw it as a minor win.   Otherwise why bother.  And the current 5% off is a joke.  

Edited August 30, 2023 by Josie201

[LINGBER]

10 minutes ago, Josie201 said:

I read it as a flat rate of $20 and assumed that meant it included gratuity.  I could be wrong.  I saw it as a minor win.   Otherwise why bother.  And the current 5% off is a joke.  

I read it that way to in the post. I guess we will see if it changes In October. And yes agree -5% is a joke.  

[Northern Aurora]

I also want to thank Jeremiah for this very helpful update.  I really appreciate the clarification.

[Jeremiah1212]

36 minutes ago, Josie201 said:

I read it as a flat rate of $20 and assumed that meant it included gratuity.  I could be wrong.  I saw it as a minor win.   Otherwise why bother.  And the current 5% off is a joke.  

This is how the FAQ reads: 

 

 

[Josie201]

7 minutes ago, Jeremiah1212 said:

This is how the FAQ reads: 

 

 

Thanks !  A minor win for those of us who usually upgrade.