Surprised there's no story up yet regarding couple stuck in Cozumel

[ultrafighter]

2 hours ago, canes20 said:

You win.  😆

[Eli_6]

15 hours ago, john91498 said:

lol, you folks will argue about anything...even insurance...lol...

I enjoy most of these "arguments."

 

At least they aren't about dinner attire in the MDR and the steakhouse.

 

And, no, I am not trying to start a debate about dinner attire in the MDR and the steakhouse.

[1kaper]

21 minutes ago, Eli_6 said:

I enjoy most of these "arguments."

 

At least they aren't about dinner attire in the MDR and the steakhouse.

 

And, no, I am not trying to start a debate about dinner attire in the MDR and the steakhouse.

 

 

Same same

[Travelling2Some]

IMO the purpose of insurance is to cover catastrophic losses, not every little thing.  I have home insurance in case the place burns down, not in case a gutter falls off.  I have auto in case of an accident involving serious injuries.  Similarly, I buy travel insurance primarily to protect me from serious medical expenses in foreign countries.  I can afford to loose the cost of a trip.  What I want to insure against is events that could result in bankruptcy.

[john91498]

Not an argument, just stating my position.

Been cruising for over 20+ years and have never thought about getting insurance. That's not going to change anytime soon. Millions cruise every year and there's maybe only a handful of medical instances.

[glrounds]

☺️

If I lived in Laguna Nigel, I wouldn't worry about any incident on a cruise setting me back too much either.

[Elaine5715]

22 hours ago, john91498 said:

lol, you folks will argue about anything...even insurance...lol...

We all have that rider.

[Elaine5715]

5 hours ago, Travelling2Some said:

IMO the purpose of insurance is to cover catastrophic losses, not every little thing.  I have home insurance in case the place burns down, not in case a gutter falls off.  I have auto in case of an accident involving serious injuries.  Similarly, I buy travel insurance primarily to protect me from serious medical expenses in foreign countries.  I can afford to loose the cost of a trip.  What I want to insure against is events that could result in bankruptcy.

Correct.  I have travel insurance for medical evacuation. The $60 or so cost is less than one day of CHEERS.

[1kaper]

6 hours ago, john91498 said:

Not an argument, just stating my position.

Been cruising for over 20+ years and have never thought about getting insurance. That's not going to change anytime soon. Millions cruise every year and there's maybe only a handful of medical instances.

 

I'm not arguing with your decision. But I have to say a handful?  I would wager good money that there are medical instances on every single cruise.  Now, again, out of a few thousand people on a ship does that change things?  Probably not.  But even deaths occur fairly regularly.  
There was a smaller ship in a port the same day we were. I witnessed a medical emergency involving a passenger from that ship.  I creeped that ship's Facebook group to find out if the person survived and there were two other deaths on that same sailing.  I found out through other means that the person I witnessed did not survive.  People on the group didn't even know about that incident.  I'm sure we only know a small fraction of what goes on. 

[john91498]

You could be right. On average, 166,000 people die each day.

 

I only said handful because if it wasn't for this thread, I wouldn't of known of any medical instances this year.

[Eli_6]

I have been on at least two cruises where there was a code blue.  I suspect those people would have coded at home in their bed, too. 

 

I'm not too worried about needing to be medically evacuated. I have managed to make it 40 years without ever having ridden in an ambulance. Only time I have stayed overnight in a hospital was when I gave birth. Only surgeries I have had were elective cosmetic procedures and a c-section.  Never had a broken bone either.  All the above applies to my kids as well...no broken bones, no hospital stays except at birth, no ambulance rides, and no surgeries.

 

 

[mjkacmom]

57 minutes ago, Eli_6 said:

I have been on at least two cruises where there was a code blue.  I suspect those people would have coded at home in their bed, too. 

 

I'm not too worried about needing to be medically evacuated. I have managed to make it 40 years without ever having ridden in an ambulance. Only time I have stayed overnight in a hospital was when I gave birth. Only surgeries I have had were elective cosmetic procedures and a c-section.  Never had a broken bone either.  All the above applies to my kids as well...no broken bones, no hospital stays except at birth, no ambulance rides, and no surgeries.

 

 

I guess we are unlucky, we had a stretch where we had at least one surgery per year. One year not only did I need an emergency appendectomy, but my 15 year old son needed one almost a year later (unfortunately he didn’t get seen in time, so it ruptured. Fortunately he was young and healthy, apparently the new protocol is high doses of IV antibiotics, morphine, frequent blood work and several days in the hospital on watch, it gets messy if they need to go in and operate). He also suffered a bad ankle break at 12 which needed emergency surgery. My daughter broke her wrist at track practice and needed to be put under to set it, another daughter ended up at a trauma center after a bad car accident. Everyone was in good health. The wrist breaker swallowed a quarter in kindergarten, had to be put under because it was blocking her airway. Good times.

[staceyglow]

1 hour ago, Eli_6 said:

I have been on at least two cruises where there was a code blue.  I suspect those people would have coded at home in their bed, too. 

 

I'm not too worried about needing to be medically evacuated. I have managed to make it 40 years without ever having ridden in an ambulance. Only time I have stayed overnight in a hospital was when I gave birth. Only surgeries I have had were elective cosmetic procedures and a c-section.  Never had a broken bone either.  All the above applies to my kids as well...no broken bones, no hospital stays except at birth, no ambulance rides, and no surgeries.

 

 

Sounds like you're overdue!

[ontheweb]

10 hours ago, staceyglow said:

Sounds like you're overdue!

And feeling invulnerable.

[ontheweb]

11 hours ago, Eli_6 said:

I have been on at least two cruises where there was a code blue.  I suspect those people would have coded at home in their bed, too. 

 

I'm not too worried about needing to be medically evacuated. I have managed to make it 40 years without ever having ridden in an ambulance. Only time I have stayed overnight in a hospital was when I gave birth. Only surgeries I have had were elective cosmetic procedures and a c-section.  Never had a broken bone either.  All the above applies to my kids as well...no broken bones, no hospital stays except at birth, no ambulance rides, and no surgeries.

 

 

I am so thankful that my DW did not need an emergency evacuation from our last cruise. 

 

Our first conversation on our wedding anniversary went Are you awake? Yes. Happy Anniversary Happy Anniversary. Could you get the daily and see when the medical center is open. This was about a week into our cruise, and we were having a sea day between Norway and Iceland. She said she had been constipated the entire cruise so far. The doctor examined her and gave her a prescription (which we later learned was an OTC drug in the USA). Still feeling that way, she saw her own doctor at home, said to take an OTC drug. And then about another week later, she ended up in an ambulance, emergency room, and, the hospital for 4 days with a twisted bowel. If this had progressed faster, we surely would have needed out travel insurance!

 

You never know what could happen.

[jimbo5544]

On 9/15/2023 at 3:47 PM, cruiserNC said:

Honestly, a reason why you have insurance and travel with a passport. It really isn't that expensive! Hope they make it through it. 

Bingo, we have a winner.

[jimbo5544]

12 hours ago, Eli_6 said:

I have been on at least two cruises where there was a code blue.  I suspect those people would have coded at home in their bed, too. 

 

I'm not too worried about needing to be medically evacuated. I have managed to make it 40 years without ever having ridden in an ambulance. Only time I have stayed overnight in a hospital was when I gave birth. Only surgeries I have had were elective cosmetic procedures and a c-section.  Never had a broken bone either.  All the above applies to my kids as well...no broken bones, no hospital stays except at birth, no ambulance rides, and no surgeries.

 

 

There were 3 on our Journey cruise.

[Joebucks]

22 hours ago, Travelling2Some said:

IMO the purpose of insurance is to cover catastrophic losses, not every little thing.  I have home insurance in case the place burns down, not in case a gutter falls off.  I have auto in case of an accident involving serious injuries.  Similarly, I buy travel insurance primarily to protect me from serious medical expenses in foreign countries.  I can afford to loose the cost of a trip.  What I want to insure against is events that could result in bankruptcy.

 

I agree that you're head is the right place more than many. The "CFAR" selling point may be the most colossal waste. 

 

However, I still suggest many re-examine the whole "bankruptcy" fear. First and most importantly, how many people might not realize that their primary health insurance already has international coverage. Not all plans do, but it's certainly worth a look. With that coverage, the need for additional coverage may plummet or even become worthless. The travel insurance might require that you use your primary insurance first, and then they may only cover a deductible or nothing at all. Now if we have insurance because we're scared of the possibility of some out of pocket costs, we're getting further away from bankruptcy fears. If you seek primary medical travel insurance, you're likely paying more, again out of a fear of some out of pocket costs. I think the public has a general bias that anything that involves "travel" has a golden value that supersedes all normal logic and thinking.

 

Then there's also the risk factor to consider. You can definitely find those horror stories out there where someone was injured and it was a nightmare. What they often don't tell you is that it was an out of shape, 60-year-old, with a bad hip, who slipped on a rock during a jungle tour of the falls. A 30-year-old going to a beach in Mexico is not the same risk factor. 

 

Everyone is free to make their choices. Again, I just advise to know what you already have, know what you need, and know what options are out there. "Insurance good" is not enough. For me, I found a reasonable HDHP health care plan that has international coverage. I also regularly contribute to my HSA account rather than to pay unnecessary travel insurances and higher health premiums to boost some companies' profits. Between my coverage and savings, it is virtually impossible at this point that a medical event either at home, or overseas, could throw my financial situation off. Also, an even more unpopular topic. I have begun to take better care of myself. Eating better foods, exercising, getting essential nutrients. Those things also pay dividends. 

[Travelling2Some]

Everyone has different risk factors.  Age, general health, a liking for risky activities, etc.  We have ZERO health insurance outside of the United States and CFAR is not sold in NY.  Technically, we could likely self-insure but I'd rather not risk a big chunk of my retirement savings that way.  Depending on the trip we sometimes buy a medical only policy, which is amazingly cheap - less than half the price of comprehensive trip insurance!  The peace of mind that comes with insurance is also of value to me, both during the trip and in the months leading up to it when we are past the point of getting our money back. 

 

Although anything can happen, the sort of travel you do can also increase the odds that it will.  Being retired we tend to take month-long trips to more offbeat locations.  Being young and in good shape is no guarantee though.  We once saw a kid of about 10 who slipped on the pool deck, cracked his head badly and had to be evacuated. 

 

One "risk factor" that has not been mentioned is having a large immediate family.  Having many children, grandchildren, elderly parents, etc., greatly multiplies the chances that "something will happen to somebody"  impacting your travel plans, even if these relatives are not traveling with you.  BTW, many people do not realize that those "pre-existing condition" clauses also apply to your nearest and dearest!

 

If there's one thing that the pandemic made clear it is that people's tolerance for risk varies widely.  Personally, I actually have a high tolerance for medical risk but a low tolerance for financial risk.

 

[Babr]

2 minutes ago, Travelling2Some said:

Everyone has different risk factors.  Age, general health, a liking for risky activities, etc.  We have ZERO health insurance outside of the United States and CFAR is not sold in NY.  Technically, we could likely self-insure but I'd rather not risk a big chunk of my retirement savings that way.  Depending on the trip we sometimes buy a medical only policy, which is amazingly cheap - less than half the price of comprehensive trip insurance!  The peace of mind that comes with insurance is also of value to me, both during the trip and in the months leading up to it when we are past the point of getting our money back. 

 

Although anything can happen, the sort of travel you do can also increase the odds that it will.  Being retired we tend to take month-long trips to more offbeat locations.  Being young and in good shape is no guarantee though.  We once saw a kid of about 10 who slipped on the pool deck, cracked his head badly and had to be evacuated. 

 

One "risk factor" that has not been mentioned is having a large immediate family.  Having many children, grandchildren, elderly parents, etc., greatly multiplies the chances that "something will happen to somebody"  impacting your travel plans, even if these relatives are not traveling with you.  BTW, many people do not realize that those "pre-existing condition" clauses also apply to your nearest and dearest!

 

If there's one thing that the pandemic made clear it is that people's tolerance for risk varies widely.  Personally, I actually have a high tolerance for medical risk but a low tolerance for financial risk.

 

 

Thank you for pointing out that the pre-existing conditions exclusion can  extend to non-traveling family members as well. Many people don’t realize that is true even if they may be aware it applies to themselves and/ or their traveling companions.

 

That is the most significant shortcoming of credit card coverage. None of them cover pre-existing conditions, and there is no waiver. The look back period means you have to be very careful when booking to be sure everyone in your circle is clear. Sometimes that is not possible.

[Travelling2Some]

57 minutes ago, Babr said:

 

Thank you for pointing out that the pre-existing conditions exclusion can  extend to non-traveling family members as well. Many people don’t realize that is true even if they may be aware it applies to themselves and/ or their traveling companions.

 

That is the most significant shortcoming of credit card coverage. None of them cover pre-existing conditions, and there is no waiver. The look back period means you have to be very careful when booking to be sure everyone in your circle is clear. Sometimes that is not possible.

Another related "tripping hazard" in the pre-existing clause is the verbiage that any new prescription or any change in a prescription during the look-back period will mean that you now have an "unstable condition".  My doctor (who is a good friend and travels frequently herself) was astonished when I told her she might mess up my trip insurance by reducing the dose of my usual high blood pressure med.  She said she buys travel insurance but has never actually read it.

 

Pregnancy can also be tricky.  We have daughters and daughters-in-law who may or may not be expecting during one of our journeys.  One had a life-threatening late miscarriage last year.  Luckily we were at home but had we been traveling I would have wanted to interrupt my trip.  I used to buy insurance (and airfare) when the cruise final payment was due, figuring I had no "skin in the game" yet.  Now I buy the (3rd party) insurance as soon as we make the refundable deposit so we can get the waiver and avoid the tricky look-back period.

[purpleally]

On 9/16/2023 at 5:00 PM, Butterbean1000 said:

Unprepared as far as travel insurance goes, I agree.  But what control did they have over a hit and run?  Stupid?  I dont think so. Accidents happen all the time.

The run is not their fault but the hit may have been. They were at an AI,so you know they were drinking…..

[Butterbean1000]

1 minute ago, purpleally said:

The run is not their fault but the hit may have been. They were at an AI,so you know they were drinking…..

All assumption. You may be right, maybe not.  We don't know

[Babr]

On 9/21/2023 at 11:23 AM, Eli_6 said:

 You should join some of the travel or points forums on the book (also not allowed to say the name). That is where I have primarily learned about the best travel CCs.  There are literally so many travel cards out there that have different benefits.  Some of them are definitely better than others.  I know for example on plat biz amex emergency medical transportation is provided at no cost if approved by them through their global assistance hotline at up to 100k. It also provides trip interruption, baggage loss, and cell phone insurance. Medical is now up to 250k per trip. (I looked it up in response to this thread. I thought it was 200k, but they upped it to 250k since I last looked it up.)  I am sure amex black offers even better but I think you have to have 500k a year in spend to qualify.  There is no min spend on amex plat but the fee is $799 after 09/26.  Gold has benefits, too, and the fee is more reasonable. I think the plum and green cards are either free or have a lower fee...not sure as I don't have one.

 

There is also a capital one card that you get by invitation (not the Venture X but even a different card) if you have a banking relationship with capital one that I was told has medical up to like a million. However, that is not who I bank with and it is too much trouble to change my bank considering I have been with my bank for 20+ years.

 

As an aside, I am talking about the plat biz because I can look at my own account. The personal platinum may have different or even better benefits...not sure.  There is also an amex black card, but the fee is the thousands and I think you have to have a spend of like 500k a year.  

 

There are many more that I don't know anything about and poster above apparently has unlimited medical on one so clearly there are even better ones out there.  I know a lot of people like the Chase Ink cars (business cards) and the Chase Sapphire, Chase Sapphire Preferred, Capital One Venture X, Citi Premier, etc.  There are co-branded cards with airlines, too, like am Amex Platinum Delta, a SW card, an American Airlines card, an Aer Lingus, Iberia, BA, etc.

 

My favorite is actually a British Air card offered by Chase and it only has a $95 annual fee. However, the reason I like it is not because of the insurance, but because once I spend 30k on it in a year, I get a companion pass so that means when I fly to Europe (even if it is in first class or business), I can fly with a friend for free. (I can actually fly anywhere that British Airways flies, but the most bang for my buck is usually Europe.)  Since those flights run 5k-10k in biz or first, that's a huge savings.  Southwest has a similar deal with a credit card where you can get a companion pass and your companion can fly free all year long with you on domestic flights. However, I don't know the ins and outs of that card as I don't have that card. 

 

 

 

https://www.americanexpress.com/us/credit-cards/features-benefits/policies/

 

https://www.americanexpress.com/us/credit-cards/business/business-credit-cards/american-express-business-platinum-credit-card-amex/61468/?linknav=US-Acq-GCP-BusinessCards-ViewAllCards-LearnMore-Platinum&irgwc=1&veid=yce2Lo1tqxyPU3AzCL15H0lvUkFRg0QHPWLV0s0&pid=IR&affid=1137073&affname=TPG&sid=SBS10051&pmc=92&rulename=&MPR=67

 

https://creditcards.chase.com/a1/23Q3/sapphire/dual?CELL=62DZ&sitelink=7&jp_cmp=cc/Sapphire+Reserve_Brand_Exact_Sapphire+Reserve_SEM_US_NA_Standard_Control/sea/p56274826623/Chase+Sapphire+Reserve&gclsrc=aw.ds&&gclid=EAIaIQobChMI67qJtePAgQMVOzrUAR0o-AooEAAYASABEgIacPD_BwE&gclsrc=aw.ds

 

 

Just not finding where it says Amex Business Platinum includes $250,000 in medical coverage. I see the usual rental car, baggage, trip cancellation /interruption, and delay; but not a word about medical.

 

I do see a link to travel insurance where you can buy medical coverage through Amex as separate build-your-own elements needed to complement coverage for  those other travel risks already included or as a comprehensive package. Is that what you are talking about?

 

Chase Sapphire Reserve, on the other hand, includes $2,500 in Emergency Medical - not a substantial amount, but many people rely on other existing coverage or pair CSR with an annual medical policy.

Edited September 24, 2023 by Babr

[sparks1093]

19 hours ago, Joebucks said:

 

I agree that you're head is the right place more than many. The "CFAR" selling point may be the most colossal waste. 

 

However, I still suggest many re-examine the whole "bankruptcy" fear. First and most importantly, how many people might not realize that their primary health insurance already has international coverage. Not all plans do, but it's certainly worth a look. With that coverage, the need for additional coverage may plummet or even become worthless. The travel insurance might require that you use your primary insurance first, and then they may only cover a deductible or nothing at all. Now if we have insurance because we're scared of the possibility of some out of pocket costs, we're getting further away from bankruptcy fears. If you seek primary medical travel insurance, you're likely paying more, again out of a fear of some out of pocket costs. I think the public has a general bias that anything that involves "travel" has a golden value that supersedes all normal logic and thinking.

 

Then there's also the risk factor to consider. You can definitely find those horror stories out there where someone was injured and it was a nightmare. What they often don't tell you is that it was an out of shape, 60-year-old, with a bad hip, who slipped on a rock during a jungle tour of the falls. A 30-year-old going to a beach in Mexico is not the same risk factor. 

 

Everyone is free to make their choices. Again, I just advise to know what you already have, know what you need, and know what options are out there. "Insurance good" is not enough. For me, I found a reasonable HDHP health care plan that has international coverage. I also regularly contribute to my HSA account rather than to pay unnecessary travel insurances and higher health premiums to boost some companies' profits. Between my coverage and savings, it is virtually impossible at this point that a medical event either at home, or overseas, could throw my financial situation off. Also, an even more unpopular topic. I have begun to take better care of myself. Eating better foods, exercising, getting essential nutrients. Those things also pay dividends. 

Great points about medical coverage, for sure. But I don't get travel insurance primarily for the medical coverage. I don't get it for cancellations or delays either. The main reason that I get travel insurance is for the medevac coverage. With a routine medevac starting at around $25k that would certainly throw a wrench in the financial pie. We get a comprehensive plan only because it isn't that much more than medevac only and we are usually one annual trip away from making an annual plan work. (And I am aware that sometimes the medevac is gratis, such as when the USCG medevacs you off the ship, but as with anything else it all comes down to the odds.)