Celebrity losing its way?

[WonderMan3]

You don't have to be a 'long time cruiser' to notice the cutbacks, particularly in frontline staff. We only started sailing in 2012 and have sailed exclusively with Celebrity. On our first cruise, there were plenty of bar staff circulating and taking orders in the buffet, on the sun decks and in the theatre. In Nov, we waited over an hour for the drinks that we had ordered to be delivered on the sun deck. In the theatre, the performance was half over before my brandy appeared. On numerous occasions, we gave up on waiting for someone to take our order in the buffet. Maybe not deal breakers, but hardly 'modern luxury' or even 'premium' cruising come to that.

 

 

I've been sailing with Celebrity since 2013, 4 cruises so far, and have not noticed any of the things you have described. We have noticed some places like the Martini Bar becoming busier with each cruise leading to longer waits for drinks but that was because it had become more popular; there have always been 2-3 people behind the bar. The only time we encountered some grumpy staff and some longer than normal waits at the buffet was when there was a Noro outbreak on our first cruise which was very stressful with some very rude pax testing the staff's patience. I've encountered a couple operational issues with some shore excursions (as I have with other cruise lines) and a couple staff issues (mainly butlers) but those were isolated issues. Maybe I've just been lucky. Great staff overall, great food (good in the MDR and buffet, very good in specialty, fantastic in Luminae), comfortable accommodations, clean public areas. I've been thoroughly satisfied with Celebrity and have seen them being consistent year over year. Of course when I'm on vacation I'm at my most relaxed so I tend not to get bothered by nit-picky issues. Maybe others let those little things destroy their entire cruise. Each to their own I guess.

 

 

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[anniegb]

You don't have to be a 'long time cruiser' to notice the cutbacks, particularly in frontline staff. We only started sailing in 2012 and have sailed exclusively with Celebrity. On our first cruise, there were plenty of bar staff circulating and taking orders in the buffet, on the sun decks and in the theatre. In Nov, we waited over an hour for the drinks that we had ordered to be delivered on the sun deck. In the theatre, the performance was half over before my brandy appeared. On numerous occasions, we gave up on waiting for someone to take our order in the buffet. Maybe not deal breakers, but hardly 'modern luxury' or even 'premium' cruising come to that.

 

Agreed - similar experience.

 

I just rate Celebrity as a standard mass market line with inconsistent service.

Nothing special.

 

Annie

[ChucktownSteve]

Has anyone noticed the lack of seafood (other than a piece of fish) on the MDR menu recently? How about the shrimp they serve being the tiny kind that's about 1/3 the size of the shrimp they used to serve.

 

Try ordering a shrimp cocktail with three tiny shrimp. My server brought me a double order in one martini type glass and I still didn't realize he had. :eek:

 

I didn't notice any scallops. Don't expect many other molluscs or crustaceans. The lobsters they do serve are pre-frozen tiny tails without claws.

[Swampbabe]

Has anyone noticed the lack of seafood (other than a piece of fish) on the MDR menu recently? How about the shrimp they serve being the tiny kind that's about 1/3 the size of the shrimp they used to serve.

 

Try ordering a shrimp cocktail with three tiny shrimp. My server brought me a double order in one martini type glass and I still didn't realize he had. :eek:

 

I didn't notice any scallops. Don't expect many other molluscs or crustaceans. The lobsters they do serve are pre-frozen tiny tails without claws.

 

 

 

I wouldn't order shrimp on a cruise ship, regardless. Nasty farmed stuff. Will admit that I'm spoiled and buy/catch my fish fresh.

[Baron Barracuda]

If you think those perks are free, I've got some oceanfront property in Montana for sale.

You don't record record profits for giving away all that free stuff.

One way or another, most of the ships we've sailed on, over the last fourteen years, were full one way or the other.

 

 

 

Yes, you don't record record profits by giving away free stuff, and RCCL's profits have been growing nicely of late. How much X has contributed however is known only to Richard Fain and RCCL corporate. They don't break out line of business results in their financials. RCCL attributes much of their earnings growth to higher yields on new ships (X hasn't had one in years) coupled with expense reductions (that we've seen). Because X is only about 25% of the company the BBB give-away doesn't unduly impact RCCL earnings. Fortunately for them RCI's promos aren't nearly as generous as X's. I've been waiting for years to get a free bev package from them.

 

As far as ships sailing full, they almost always do. We just don't know how heavily they had to discount those last rooms. Rates often drop sharply after final payment.

 

Although I had included quotes on "free" IMO the cost of percs hasn't led to escalation in base room rates. A standard balcony today is only slightly higher than what I paid twenty years ago (still have all my confirms) and back then there were no percs.

[WonderMan3]

Yes, you don't record record profits by giving away free stuff, and RCCL's profits have been growing nicely of late. How much X has contributed however is known only to Richard Fain and RCCL corporate. They don't break out line of business results in their financials. RCCL attributes much of their earnings growth to higher yields on new ships (X hasn't had one in years) coupled with expense reductions (that we've seen). Because X is only about 25% of the company the BBB give-away doesn't unduly impact RCCL earnings. Fortunately for them RCI's promos aren't nearly as generous as X's. I've been waiting for years to get a free bev package from them.

 

As far as ships sailing full, they almost always do. We just don't know how heavily they had to discount those last rooms. Rates often drop sharply after final payment.

 

Although I had included quotes on "free" IMO the cost of percs hasn't led to escalation in base room rates. A standard balcony today is only slightly higher than what I paid twenty years ago (still have all my confirms) and back then there were no percs.

 

Having worked for a cruise company before I can say that we used to be able to discount our cruise-only products (those without land stays) by as much as 50% and still make some profit. Obviously those steep discounts only happened when we were desperate and trying to get rid of last minute space. They want to sell every last cabin because those final few dozen cabins on ships as large as Celebrity's are basically pure profit. And then they can earn additional revenue from things those pax buy onboard (casino, shore excursions, retail, etc.).

Edited January 7, 2017 by WonderMan3

[varoo]

.........So many items missing from the past...we know it...because we are long time X cruisers (Elite Plus) so we are not "newbies"...It seemed to us that many items were not "mentioned" or provided with hopes that the passengers would not know what they were missing!!????

 

Exactly! Those nice little touches that made Celebrity special are gradually being phased out.

Apparently they have abandoned Let Us Exceed Your Expectations, instead now hoping to attract new passengers with their promotions for unlimited "free" booze.

 

Their current, unstated policy is: Cruise with Celebrity where we keep the drinks flowing so you won't even notice or care what is missing. ;)

 

[Germancruiser]

So I am not the only one missing the X from the " past" - I sailed with them for the past 15 years and decline kept going on an on!

[Lastdance]

First, you have the choice to cruise on Celebrity or any other cruise line. Second, nothing stays the same, and third, nostalgically speaking, the good old days will always be the good old days. Our brain just works that way. I for one am glad that my recall of memories past remind me of a kinder and gentler time period in my life. As newbies book Celebrity, they compare it to other lines and use their own filters to assess their likes and dislikes...and so the story goes...

 

 

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Edited January 7, 2017 by Lastdance

[grandgeezer]

Yes, you don't record record profits by giving away free stuff, and RCCL's profits have been growing nicely of late. How much X has contributed however is known only to Richard Fain and RCCL corporate. They don't break out line of business results in their financials. RCCL attributes much of their earnings growth to higher yields on new ships (X hasn't had one in years) coupled with expense reductions (that we've seen). Because X is only about 25% of the company the BBB give-away doesn't unduly impact RCCL earnings. Fortunately for them RCI's promos aren't nearly as generous as X's. I've been waiting for years to get a free bev package from them.

 

As far as ships sailing full, they almost always do. We just don't know how heavily they had to discount those last rooms. Rates often drop sharply after final payment.

 

Although I had included quotes on "free" IMO the cost of percs hasn't led to escalation in base room rates. A standard balcony today is only slightly higher than what I paid twenty years ago (still have all my confirms) and back then there were no percs.

 

Not to get in a debate but I see the base rates up considerably especially in the last 3-4 years. Our first cruise on Celebrity was on the Infinity in 2004 and we paid $80 p.p. per day in Concierge going to Hawaii. Our second cruise was the same year, 11 days to Mexico on the Mercury and that was about $65 per day. In comparison, in December we paid $120 per day on the Silhouette. They were all balconys and I also have my receipts. None included perks from Celebrity but all came with very generous obc from the travel agency.

If the beverage packages were indeed free, why aren't they included for inside cabins and repositioning cruises no matter what the cabin category??

[Germancruiser]

Great answer Lastdance- first- exactly what I did- Cunard- second- thats for sure- and nothing to be done about it ( LOL ) third- MY brain works that way too- but remember- those olden days those golden days- are not that long ago! LOL! That is just the point it was so nice to see that X had not forgotten old traditions. Newbies can´t compare that´s right!

I also remember when I was on my first Cunard voyage ( never say cruise with Cunard- or one is thrown overboard at once) I also could not compare and was so so so happy. One barwaiter mentioned the Carnvialisation of Cunard- I had no idea what he was talking about! That was 12 years ago!LOL!

[caribill]

Because X is only about 25% of the company the BBB give-away doesn't unduly impact RCCL earnings..

 

The BBB promotions are not giveaways.

 

On a 12 day cruise I am on next year the cost difference between 2 perks and 4 perks is $540/person ($1080 for two people).

 

When you pay $1080 for those two extra perks, it is not a giveaway.

 

Costs if you were paying for these perks:

Tips for two: $324

Internet for two: $564 (and you probably only need one unlimited package)

$300 OBC for the cabin: $300

(I did not look up beverage plan cost)

 

So if the extra two perks were tips and internet, it would be worth $888 and for that you would pay $1080.

 

If the extra two were tips and OBC, it would be worth $624 and for that you would pay $1080.

 

I do think this does affect earnings. It increases them.

[ABoatNerd]

Excellent analysis by the posters here.

 

Celebrity now is not the Celebrity product of the past that many long time customers remember.

 

It is my impression that Celebrity is moving towards the RCL model becoming "a bit better than RCL". They are not moving towards the "premium" model like an Oceania.

 

So consumers who wish to cruise with a product like Celebrity provided in the past can choose to migrate elsewhere.

 

I and others have stated opinions that there can be a variance between what Celebrity advertises "simply the best", "exceeding expectations","modern luxury" and what they deliver - same analysis that appears on other cruise line boards. It is difficult, but not impossible, for corporations to ensure that the majority of their customers understand the product they will receive. When this is done successfully, customer dis-satisfaction is minimized. This operating principle applies to every company.

 

This is rather an output of the OP's query. Generally, 1) is Celebrity successful in clearly articulating the on board product offering to the public? and 2) do they consistently deliver said product on Every ship on Every cruise subject to unforeseen circumstance?.

 

The answers to these key questions are unique to each consumer - so there is no right or wrong answer.

 

ABoatNerd

[Softball20]

The BBB promotions are not giveaways.

 

On a 12 day cruise I am on next year the cost difference between 2 perks and 4 perks is $540/person ($1080 for two people).

 

When you pay $1080 for those two extra perks, it is not a giveaway.

 

Costs if you were paying for these perks:

Tips for two: $324

Internet for two: $564 (and you probably only need one unlimited package)

$300 OBC for the cabin: $300

(I did not look up beverage plan cost)

 

So if the extra two perks were tips and internet, it would be worth $888 and for that you would pay $1080.

 

If the extra two were tips and OBC, it would be worth $624 and for that you would pay $1080.

 

I do think this does affect earnings. It increases them.

 

The premium beverage package is $65/day/person if you were to purchase it. That's 780/person right there.

[ChucktownSteve]

The premium beverage package is $65/day/person if you were to purchase it. That's 780/person right there.

 

You forgot to include the 18% gratuity which is included in the perk or charged if you pay for it.

[NLH Arizona]

Hi Rich:) my sister just returned from sailing Reflection and they said

the food in the dining was pretty good. But she also said every time

she turned around they were PUSHING the drink packages. And pushing

it again., etc....she told them no thanks but it seems "the push is on".

 

I am sure I will have a good time but not sure what I am doing later in

the year.

Lois, good to hear about the food on the Reflection, as I'm boarding her today.

 

Thankfully, I already got the drink package as a perk, so they will leave me alone on that.

 

Nancy

[caribill]

The premium beverage package is $65/day/person if you were to purchase it. That's 780/person right there.

 

You forgot to include the 18% gratuity which is included in the perk or charged if you pay for it.

 

My analysis was of the difference between what you would pay for two additional "included" perks. If the drinks package was one of the first two perks, then its cost/benefit does not factor into the additional two perks which can be purchased for hundreds of $$ less than the price difference between better and best.

 

By the way, RCCL Corp says one reason profits are up is the additional money they make from drinks packages and Internet package sales.

 

So anyone getting the beverage package is definitely contributing to the bottom line whether paying for the package via higher pricing for the cabin or as a separate package.

[harz99]

I don't know if they are losing their way or not.

I had just got out from the solstice Christmas and NYE cruise and I'm very disappointed with the cruise, the ship and with celebrity.

I was expecting service, luxury, attention to detail and great food. I found nothing of those, instead I found lack of service, so so entertainment, an old style ship with no life.

Martini bar was very crowded and I found comfort in world class with cocktails prices at USD15.00 and above not many people stoped there.

With most people buying the drinks package I found quite difficult at times to get waiters wondering around to offer drinks. So the level of service is bad.

This was my first and last cruise with celebrity.

 

 

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I'd have to agree with you as we also were on that cruise. Didn't feel much like Christmas at all, too many sales events in the daily programme and too many events back to back in tiny overcrowded Celebrity Central.

 

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[wallie5446]

We still like and will continue to sail with Celebrity. Are we loyal to Celebrity, no. Our first Cruise was in 1991 but our first Celebrity Cruise was in 1994 on the Zenith and yes we have noticed some of the changes but we just adjust and accept the changes and have fun. Years ago the tag line "let us exceed your expectations" I guess was discontinued for a reason.

 

I stopped reading with your post. Our first Celebrity cruise was in 1994 on the Zenith also. Sailed on seven diff lines.

We are booked for the third time on the Equinox in November.

[ChucktownSteve]

I'd have to agree with you as we also were on that cruise. Didn't feel much like Christmas at all, too many sales events in the daily programme and too many events back to back in tiny overcrowded Celebrity Central.

 

You mean like this?

 

 

They crowded the passageway with table goods. This is alongside the casino on deck 4

[Lois R]

Lois, good to hear about the food on the Reflection, as I'm boarding her today.

 

Thankfully, I already got the drink package as a perk, so they will leave me alone on that.

 

Nancy

 

Hi Nancy, Bon Voyage...have a good time:)

[Baron Barracuda]

The BBB promotions are not giveaways.

 

On a 12 day cruise I am on next year the cost difference between 2 perks and 4 perks is $540/person ($1080 for two people).

 

When you pay $1080 for those two extra perks, it is not a giveaway.

 

Costs if you were paying for these perks:

Tips for two: $324

Internet for two: $564 (and you probably only need one unlimited package)

$300 OBC for the cabin: $300

(I did not look up beverage plan cost)

 

So if the extra two perks were tips and internet, it would be worth $888 and for that you would pay $1080.

 

If the extra two were tips and OBC, it would be worth $624 and for that you would pay $1080.

 

I do think this does affect earnings. It increases them.

 

 

Won't take issue with your math, but doubt many folks who are given Go Better pay to trade up to Go Best as the cost always exceeds the benefits. Hopefully at least cc'ers are smart enough to run the numbers. Wouldn't do it myself at half the price. My ta throws in the grats and internet only costs around $200 after Elite discount (just need 1). OBC covers that. I'm not sophisticated enough to need premium beverages. Patronize cafe al bacio more than the bars.

 

Booked my last four sailings onboard and was given all three 123 Go percs plus extra obc. Cost for these sailings was no higher than what Royal and Princess were charging for similar itineraries, but those lines offered much less generous percs. So to me X's percs came free. Last July when X decided to keep Equinox in the Caribbean full time they gave away Go Best for free to everyone who booked oceanview and higher for sailings thru Nov 2017. Lots of folks on my roll calls took advantage of this and raved about the pricing. Booked one for this Nov and wanted a couple more but dw says our calendar is full enough.

 

As a customer love the percs. As a stockholder not so much. Fain sould be asking Ms. Lisa why X needs to be so much more promotional than peers. Maybe the service cuts have gone too far.

[Flatbush Flyer]

Maybe, by disappointing the regular Celebrity clients, the parent company is trying to get the more well-traveled (et al.) clientele to "move up" to their premium brand, Azamara(?)

 

 

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[ChucktownSteve]

Maybe, by disappointing the regular Celebrity clients, the parent company is trying to get the more well-traveled (et al.) clientele to "move up" to their premium brand, Azamara(?)

 

Maybe. It worked on me but they also sent me to Oceania. So how did they win on that one?

 

Baron Barracuda: They haven't had 123 Go for quite some time so you booked those long ago. Regarding the Equinox...They had an empty ship when they moved her and had to fill it some way. Thus the early people who booked got the perks which are not available any longer as they were once y'all bit and booked.

[harz99]

Yes, a bit like your pic ChucktownSteve. Lol. Although I was thinking more of all the staff in the small theatre/cinema.