Tipping Longshoremen--do you or don't you?

[chengkp75]

The six figure salary that is quoted is at the upper limit of longshoremen pay and is probably not earned by porters. The salary was easy to find by well... just googling. Seniority, skills needed (operating large machinery to move containers from docks to ships?) can determine pay rate. The lowest is $15 per hr; median is $24.58; highest is $40.67. With overtime, tips, bonuses, profit sharing, a Longshoreman's salary ranges from $36k to 126k USD. I don't think the porters picking up luggage at the docks are in the 126K area. Probably most of them are not full-time employees and only work when there are cruise ships in port.

 

Google can be your friend not matter what some people think.

 

Ramona

 

Actually, you couldn't be further from the truth. The longshoremen who work the cruise ships are typically the most senior members in that port, since the job is relatively easy, the hours short (explained later), and the ability to shake down the passengers for tips is there. As for "part time", all longshoremen are permitted to come in whenever they feel they want to work, and get assigned jobs as they are available, and per seniority. So, these guys who work the cruise ships may in fact only work the cruise ships, and in many ports that would be nearly full time, or they may also work other ships on other days and shifts.

 

The less senior longshoremen are relegated to the jobs where they have to stand out in the rain for a full shift working a container ship, wrestle with 15 foot long steel rigging bars, dance on container tops while a crane moves a 40 ton container around you and the 30' fall to the steel deck, or drive balky, poorly maintained tractors around finding containers to load on the ship or places to park containers off the ship. Swinging a few bags onto a cart under a roof is a cake walk compared to those jobs.

 

Now to explain about the short hours. Longshoreman shifts are typically broken at noon, so one shift will work noon to 8pm, one from 8pm to 4am, and one shift from 4am to noon. So, for a cruise ship, this means that they will work from 4am to noon (with the ship not being in port until typically 6-7am, so no work until then), or from noon to 8pm, with sailaway being typically earlier, so no work done after that. They typically empty the terminal of nearly all bags by 3-4pm, so again, no work after that. Further, it is a regular feature of longshore contracts to experience "ghost workers", where the cruise line contracts with the stevedoring company for so many longshoremen to handle the ship, and pay for that many workers, but to find out that 2 or 3 of the most senior guys have decided to "mail in" their hours (they get paid, but are actually in their backyard grilling). Trust me, the guys working the cruise docks are in the six figure bracket.

[Copper10-8]

Cheng; when the longshoremen come onboard, they are often referred to as "a gang" (not a criminal one ;p) by their supervisors. I've seen that same description written down on the paperwork submitted to the ship the night before. Any idea where that description came from?

[Copper10-8]

My bad!!! Thanks for the correction am better for the schooling.

 

We all are! Have a great day! :)

[OlsSalt]

Actually, you couldn't be further from the truth. The longshoremen who work the cruise ships are typically the most senior members in that port, since the job is relatively easy, the hours short (explained later), and the ability to shake down the passengers for tips is there. As for "part time", all longshoremen are permitted to come in whenever they feel they want to work, and get assigned jobs as they are available, and per seniority. So, these guys who work the cruise ships may in fact only work the cruise ships, and in many ports that would be nearly full time, or they may also work other ships on other days and shifts.

 

The less senior longshoremen are relegated to the jobs where they have to stand out in the rain for a full shift working a container ship, wrestle with 15 foot long steel rigging bars, dance on container tops while a crane moves a 40 ton container around you and the 30' fall to the steel deck, or drive balky, poorly maintained tractors around finding containers to load on the ship or places to park containers off the ship. Swinging a few bags onto a cart under a roof is a cake walk compared to those jobs.

 

Now to explain about the short hours. Longshoreman shifts are typically broken at noon, so one shift will work noon to 8pm, one from 8pm to 4am, and one shift from 4am to noon. So, for a cruise ship, this means that they will work from 4am to noon (with the ship not being in port until typically 6-7am, so no work until then), or from noon to 8pm, with sailaway being typically earlier, so no work done after that. They typically empty the terminal of nearly all bags by 3-4pm, so again, no work after that. Further, it is a regular feature of longshore contracts to experience "ghost workers", where the cruise line contracts with the stevedoring company for so many longshoremen to handle the ship, and pay for that many workers, but to find out that 2 or 3 of the most senior guys have decided to "mail in" their hours (they get paid, but are actually in their backyard grilling). Trust me, the guys working the cruise docks are in the six figure bracket.

 

 

Thank you. As suspected. Now we just need to get rid of their intimidating extortion tactics demanding tips, and save that for passengers who truly need and appreciate their well-salaried extra assistance. We already gave at the office is the best response, if/when they simply handle the luggage as they are expected to do for that day's choice of job assignment.

[chengkp75]

Cheng; when the longshoremen come onboard, they are often referred to as "a gang" (not a criminal one ;p) by their supervisors. I've seen that same description written down on the paperwork submitted to the ship the night before. Any idea where that description came from?

 

Well, I looked up the origins of the term "gang", and it meant a "group of people travelling together", so no criminal intent, but that was added later. In the old days, a "factor" or "stevedore" would go to the ship's Captain and offer his services to unload or load the ship. If the Captain hired the stevedore, it was up to him to provide enough labor to move the cargo in the agreed amount of time. To this day, the company is referred to as a "stevedoring" company, and the workers as longshoremen. The stevedore would make the rounds of the flophouses and taverns and recruit his "gang" of workers. These days, because of the way the unions handle handing out work shifts, the "gang" is not a fixed group of workers, it is a fixed number of workers, who can be anyone who showed up at the union hall that day looking for employment, so easier to refer to them as a "gang" than by any other, specific designation. It makes the workers into "interchangeable parts".

[Copper10-8]

Well, I looked up the origins of the term "gang", and it meant a "group of people travelling together", so no criminal intent, but that was added later. In the old days, a "factor" or "stevedore" would go to the ship's Captain and offer his services to unload or load the ship. If the Captain hired the stevedore, it was up to him to provide enough labor to move the cargo in the agreed amount of time. To this day, the company is referred to as a "stevedoring" company, and the workers as longshoremen. The stevedore would make the rounds of the flophouses and taverns and recruit his "gang" of workers. These days, because of the way the unions handle handing out work shifts, the "gang" is not a fixed group of workers, it is a fixed number of workers, who can be anyone who showed up at the union hall that day looking for employment, so easier to refer to them as a "gang" than by any other, specific designation. It makes the workers into "interchangeable parts".

 

Copy that and thanks again! One is never too old to learn new things :)

[not-enough-cruising]

Actually, you couldn't be further from the truth. The longshoremen who work the cruise ships are typically the most senior members in that port, since the job is relatively easy, the hours short (explained later), and the ability to shake down the passengers for tips is there. As for "part time", all longshoremen are permitted to come in whenever they feel they want to work, and get assigned jobs as they are available, and per seniority. So, these guys who work the cruise ships may in fact only work the cruise ships, and in many ports that would be nearly full time, or they may also work other ships on other days and shifts.

 

 

 

The less senior longshoremen are relegated to the jobs where they have to stand out in the rain for a full shift working a container ship, wrestle with 15 foot long steel rigging bars, dance on container tops while a crane moves a 40 ton container around you and the 30' fall to the steel deck, or drive balky, poorly maintained tractors around finding containers to load on the ship or places to park containers off the ship. Swinging a few bags onto a cart under a roof is a cake walk compared to those jobs.

 

 

 

Now to explain about the short hours. Longshoreman shifts are typically broken at noon, so one shift will work noon to 8pm, one from 8pm to 4am, and one shift from 4am to noon. So, for a cruise ship, this means that they will work from 4am to noon (with the ship not being in port until typically 6-7am, so no work until then), or from noon to 8pm, with sailaway being typically earlier, so no work done after that. They typically empty the terminal of nearly all bags by 3-4pm, so again, no work after that. Further, it is a regular feature of longshore contracts to experience "ghost workers", where the cruise line contracts with the stevedoring company for so many longshoremen to handle the ship, and pay for that many workers, but to find out that 2 or 3 of the most senior guys have decided to "mail in" their hours (they get paid, but are actually in their backyard grilling). Trust me, the guys working the cruise docks are in the six figure bracket.

 

 

 

I have reached the high point of my Cruise Critic posting career. A comment of mine was just validated by Cheng. I can die complete. [emoji12][emoji12]

 

 

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[Dogstar]

This is fun reading. I’ve been thoroughly edumacated today. [emoji1303]

[KroozNut]

Does anyone know a specific person who did not get their bags or got therm in bad conditon? Or is it just urban legend being re peated of fear it Might happen if one does not tip?

 

More likely urban myth as you suggest. Sort of like another fear that is sometimes heard about folks not wanting to send their steak back in a restaurant when it's not cooked right. they worry about what 'might happen' to their steak when it comes back. And I'm not talking about just overcooking the heck out it in spite either.:eek:

[Copper10-8]

The ship's upholsterers are busy just about every voyage with repairs to damaged luggage (not to say some of that damage did not occur somewhere between home and the port, i.e. airline/airport). Those guys (from the Philippines) are talented but some of it is unfixable

[KroozNut]

It appears to many, room service tipping is "required".

 

Really? I've never seen that opinion expressed here on these boards. Hmmmm..

[ON cruiser]

A most interesting discussion; thanks to all, and especially Cheng and Copper for their informative posts.

 

As for me, the path of least resistance beckons. A few bucks to avoid controversy and, as an earlier poster stated, to maintain a happy mood, will likely be my approach.

 

Happy travels to all.

[bEwAbG]

I am fine with tipping, but I resent the ones who make very strong implications that it's in your best interest to do so. FLL workers are notorious for this. One actually said "this is the part where you give me the tip for the services I'm about to render." It was not subtle and it was intimidating. I wish they had the equivalent of hack inspectors who would police this. It's very off-putting.

[doublebzz]

Just wondering if those that grumble about a $2 tip to dockside porters are the same people that remove hotel service charges from their cruise bill.

[sail7seas]

I have yet to read anyone say on this forum that thy removdt the auto hotel s/c from their account. No one that I can recall has ever chosen to post that.

[sammiedawg]

We would be fearful of what might happen to our bags, so we tip.

Longshoreman are not to be fooled with. Their union power is ridiculous but business entities are afraid, so their tactics continue.

 

I’m surprised to read how much luggage people travel with. Years ago, we put the prom dresses and suits away. Travel is much easier now.

[OlsSalt]

We would be fearful of what might happen to our bags, so we tip.

Longshoreman are not to be fooled with. Their union power is ridiculous but business entities are afraid, so their tactics continue.

 

I’m surprised to read how much luggage people travel with. Years ago, we put the prom dresses and suits away. Travel is much easier now.

 

Today's formal wear is light-weight, easily packable, looks great and is very comfortable. Welcome to the 21st Century.

 

A simple thank you for doing the job they are paid to do is all that is necessary for routine baggage handling at the dock. Your worries seem misplaced.

[drowelf]

I always tip them. Our main bags are always in the 60-70 lbs range, so its tough even for me to sling them around.

 

This time embarking/disembarking in Amsterdam, I had longshorewomen hefting my bags. The first one was this small dutch girl who probably weighed less than 2 of the bags, but she got into and ported the bags into the terminal without too much of a struggle.

 

Of course she got a tip.

[peaches from georgia]

It appears to many, room service tipping is "required".

We have experienced exactly the opposite on all our HAL cruises. If we don't already have tip $ in our hands before we open the door for room service they are gone before we can give it to them.

[DaveOKC]

We have experienced exactly the opposite on all our HAL cruises. If we don't already have tip $ in our hands before we open the door for room service they are gone before we can give it to them.

 

Same here - you need to have the tip ready when they arrive as they do not wait around - turn your back for a second and they are gone. Of course, they do seem to appreciate the tips.

[c-boy]

You guys have too much luggage. Never tip the porters since we only have two carry-on sized roller bags. We 'porter' these ourselves.

1 bag for a 2 week cruise ?

[mcrcruiser]

A most interesting discussion; thanks to all, and especially Cheng and Copper for their informative posts.

 

As for me, the path of least resistance beckons. A few bucks to avoid controversy and, as an earlier poster stated, to maintain a happy mood, will likely be my approach.

 

Happy travels to all.

 

Yes let us all keep that Happy Mood going forward with those small baggage tips . :D

[mcrcruiser]

1 bag for a 2 week cruise ?

 

Steve Reeves the guru of Europe travel goes for one month travel with one roll on a a sling of stuff over his shoulder . Things like quick dry underwear makes for far less numbers to be loaded into luggage .Read his articles years ago about light weight packing . In Europe many of the train stations have no porters & also stairs to climb . Thus ,light every thing is the best travel policy :)

[mcrcruiser]

Many airlines have recently upped the luggage fees from $25 to $30 for checked bags & there have been talks in the airline industry to start charging for carry on luggage . :(

 

Now the cruise lines will no longer enforce the MDR dress codes because of the luggage hassles from the airlines & the new generations attitudes toward dress codes :o

[sail7seas]

We have experienced exactly the opposite on all our HAL cruises. If we don't already have tip $ in our hands before we open the door for room service they are gone before we can give it to them.

 

 

That is exactly my experience ... so much s o thgt when I LET THEM IN, i alreay d havde tip in hand anad redygto give them. ty e all are ina nd out in a flash. have i had a HAL room service sgeward linger looking for a tip.