Zaandam and Rotterdam Situation (merged topics starting March 22, 2020)

[arabrab]

Just now, Priya2 said:

I’m sorry if this question has already been asked and answered, but this thread is too long to read through entirely. I’m wondering when this cruise set sail?

Look up 3 posts.

[dockman]

1 minute ago, purrlinda said:

Very strange - my clients specifically stated they tested negative for the virus.  

  Sorry .  My brother did mention everyone getting "tested" a day or so ago but when i asked if it was covid test he said no only sick got that...his "test" was temperature and few questions.  No covid.

I asked today if any plans/announcements to test all for covid and he said nothing like that has been mentioned.  He is about same age as your clients with no symptoms at all.

[purrlinda]

1 minute ago, Priya2 said:

I’m sorry if this question has already been asked and answered, but this thread is too long to read through entirely. I’m wondering when this cruise set sail?

March 7th.  It was due to arrive in Santiago (San Antonio) Chile on March 21.

 

My clients were on a B2B and were supposed to continue up the cost of South America en route to Ft. Lauderdale.  

[Vict0riann]

4 minutes ago, Priya2 said:

I’m sorry if this question has already been asked and answered, but this thread is too long to read through entirely. I’m wondering when this cruise set sail?

Just go back 3 posts before yours...

Edited March 28, 2020 by Vict0riann

[Max2003]

4 minutes ago, Priya2 said:

 

 

5 minutes ago, Priya2 said:

I’m sorry if this question has already been asked and answered, but this thread is too long to read through entirely. I’m wondering when this cruise set sail?

3/7/2020	Sat	BUENOS AIRES
3/8/2020	Sun	Buenos Aires
3/9/2020	Mon	Montevideo
3/10/2020	Tue	At Sea (South Atlantic Ocean)
3/11/2020	Wed	At Sea
3/12/2020	Thu	Port Stanley
3/13/2020	Fri	Scenic cruising Strait of Magellan
3/14/2020	Sat	Punta Arenas
3/15/2020	Sun	Ushuaia
3/16/2020	Mon	Scenic cruising Cape Horn
3/17/2020	Tue	Scenic cruising Sarmiento Channel
3/18/2020	Wed	Scenic cruising Chilean Fjords
3/19/2020	Thu	Puerto Montt
3/20/2020	Fri	At Sea (South Pacific Ocean)
3/21/2020	Sat	SAN ANTONIO (SANTIAGO)

 

[purrlinda]

1 minute ago, dockman said:

  Sorry .  My brother did mention everyone getting "tested" a day or so ago but when i asked if it was covid test he said no only sick got that...his "test" was temperature and few questions.  No covid.

I asked today if any plans/announcements to test all for covid and he said nothing like that has been mentioned.  He is about same age as your clients with no symptoms at all.

Mine have no symptoms either.  Their testing was done yesterday.

 

I just read that Reuters article that said the health screening was essentially a questionnaire and temperature check.  This does not seem reasonable to me because in many cases symptoms don't appear immediately.  My thought process is that the only way they could know if the passengers heading to the Rotterdam are healthy is to do the test for the virus.  

 

[rabidstoat]

25 minutes ago, rkacruiser said:

Can one imagine the difficulty of not just getting the guests transferred in such a situation, but also the luggage of those guests!  I think about my normal two pieces of luggage and their weight, carrying them down the stairs leading to the landing platform and then up the stairs from the Rotterdam's landing platform, plus getting them into and out of the tenders!  What an extremely difficult situation that must be for the crew and as well as the guests!

 

Do we know what they're doing about luggage, though? I can see them restricting it to one suitcase per passenger, and leaving the rest behind with tags so it can be shipped home once the ship is berthed somewhere.

[rafinmd]

12 minutes ago, rabidstoat said:

 

Do we know what they're doing about luggage, though? I can see them restricting it to one suitcase per passenger, and leaving the rest behind with tags so it can be shipped home once the ship is berthed somewhere.

I would expect that as well.  They're already doing that with the World Cruise.

 

Roy

[3rdGenCunarder]

25 minutes ago, purrlinda said:

Mine have no symptoms either.  Their testing was done yesterday.

 

I just read that Reuters article that said the health screening was essentially a questionnaire and temperature check.  This does not seem reasonable to me because in many cases symptoms don't appear immediately.  My thought process is that the only way they could know if the passengers heading to the Rotterdam are healthy is to do the test for the virus.  

 

 

They don't have enough tests to test everyone. And the test is a snapshot in time, not a predictor. "Healthy" today could be "positive" tomorrow. And with the long incubation period, someone could have been exposed but not have enough viruses to trigger a positive yet. 

 

[Desert Diamond]

Here is a link with some additional information about when the first Covid tests were brought onboard.

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/mar/28/very-scary-pleas-for-safe-harbour-from-stranded-cruise-ship-near-panama

[3rdGenCunarder]

14 minutes ago, rabidstoat said:

 

Do we know what they're doing about luggage, though? I can see them restricting it to one suitcase per passenger, and leaving the rest behind with tags so it can be shipped home once the ship is berthed somewhere.

 

That makes sense to me. 

 

And for those wondering why it's taking so long, remember social distancing. When we use the boats as tenders, we're crowded together. I would expect that the tenders are not going out that full. 

 

[Copper10-8]

53 minutes ago, Max2003 said:

Rotterdam tenders 7 & 9 are shuttling back and forth all day.  I assume they are moving the 60 or 120 passengers mentioned or more.  They have many trips but not knowing the number of passengers (and luggage) on each trip, it is hard to know where they are on the mission. The wind/current seems to have changed.  I hope the sea state doesn't deteriorate.

 

 

Without luggage at regular tenders ports, they are filled with up to 80-90 pax

[iancal]

The crew making these transfers are pros.  I have no doubt that it is being accomplished as quickly and as safely as possible.   Chances are that luggage is the least of the cruisers concerns..

[3rdGenCunarder]

5 minutes ago, iancal said:

The crew making these transfers are pros.  I have no doubt that it is being accomplished as quickly and as safely as possible.   Chances are that luggage is the least of the cruisers concerns..

 

I agree about the tender crew. They're amazing. I love how they time the rise and fall of the tender to move people at just the right moment when it's bouncy. On difficult tender days, I've sent one of those "how are we doing" cards to say thank you to the tender crew.

 

QE2 was the worst for tendering. You went down steps to a floating dock and then to the tender. Those guys kept a tight grip as they helped people. I had little finger mark bruises one time. Better that than a dip in the sea!

Edited March 28, 2020 by 3rdGenCunarder
typo

[Copper10-8]

2 minutes ago, 3rdGenCunarder said:

 

I agree about the tender crew. They're amazing. I love how they time the rise and fall of the tender to move people at just the right moment when it's bouncy. On difficult tender days, I've sent one of those "how are we doing" cards to say thank you to the tender crew.

 

QE2 was the worst for tendering. You went down steps to a floating dock and then to the tender. Those guys kept a tight grip as they helped people. I had little finger mark bruises one time. Better that than a dip in the sea!

 

Just a heads up; a HAL tender crew "normally" consists of a tender driver (quartermaster or sailor AB) and one assistant (a sailor). The guys assisting pax in, besides that assistant/sailor, and out of the tender positioned on the ship's tender platform and ashore on the tender dock are members of what's known as the MAT (Mobility Assistance Team). MAT (team) members belong to the Beverage and Dining room (Food Service) Depts. onboard and receive extra training for that collateral assignment  

[rkacruiser]

4 minutes ago, 3rdGenCunarder said:

I agree about the tender crew. They're amazing. I love how they time to rise and fall of the tender to move people at just the right moment when it's bouncy. On difficult tender days, I've sent one of those "how are we doing" cards to say thank you to the tender crew.

 

 

I strongly concur as well!  I remember a couple of times that I would not have been safely transferred from shore to tender or tender to shore if these strong armed men had not been able to do so.

 

Rotterdam is also fortunate at this time to have Captain Albert aboard since tender operation classes are one of the things he does as a Fleet Master.

[rkacruiser]

2 minutes ago, Copper10-8 said:

The guys assisting pax in, besides that assistant/sailor, and out of the tender positioned on the ship's tender platform and ashore on the tender dock are members of what's known as the MAT (Mobility Assistance Team). MAT (team) members belong to the Beverage and Dining room (Food Service) Depts. onboard and receive extra training for that collateral assignment  

 

I never realized this.  I just thought when I would see a crew member whom I recognized from another area of the ship that he had been assigned to this job because his "regular job" didn't need to be done at that time.

[Himself]

1 hour ago, Copper10-8 said:

 

Let me give it a try; Zaandam's pax were in Punta Arenas, Chile on 14 Mar as one of their regularly scheduled ports of call on this voyage, when everything was still copacetic in South America. Everyone got back on and the ship departed for Ushuaia, Argentina, her next port of call the following day. Mister Murphy showed up, making the Argentinians close their borders/ports that day, March 15th, which meant a no go for Zaandam, as far as heading back to the South Atlantic!

 

After the Chileans then, on March 16th, closed San Antonio, Zaanie's regularly scheduled disembarkation port for the end of this fourteen-day itinerary, her captain attempted to persuade the Chilean government to get them to approve disembarking his pax in either Valparaiso or Punta Arenas (so there, in Punta Arenas, for a second time if they would have received approval). However, as fate would have it, that was also then denied by the Chileans, because they had closed all their ports to cruise ships, so ultimately, Zaandam finds herself off Panama and things can only be described as a cluster, having gone from bad to worse. Hoping and praying for a positive outcome! 

Where is the virtue of Charity?  How van a United States port close to American citizens.  Has everyone taken leave of their senses?

[rkacruiser]

5 minutes ago, rkacruiser said:

 

I never realized this.  I just thought when I would see a crew member whom I recognized from another area of the ship that he had been assigned to this job because his "regular job" didn't need to be done at that time.

 

There is so much that goes on behind the scenes that even an experienced cruise guest does not have a clue!

[3rdGenCunarder]

2 minutes ago, Himself said:

Where is the virtue of Charity?  How van a United States port close to American citizens.  Has everyone taken leave of their senses?

 

I think Charity is being outvoiced by fear. I don't know how many "not in my city" posts I've seen on this thread. Nobody wants more cases in their local hospitals.

 

And to be fair, accepting the ship does mean accepting responsibility. What if people can't get flights home, where do they stay? And if they're going to be quarantined at the port, what facility can do that? Ports are mostly in cities, and sites for incoming cruise passengers could be arranged. But in some cases, I think local officials are afraid to accept a ship because they know the frightened people in their city will be furious at what they see as the "plague passengers." 

[Himself]

8 minutes ago, 3rdGenCunarder said:

 

I think Charity is being outvoiced by fear. I don't know how many "not in my city" posts I've seen on this thread. Nobody wants more cases in their local hospitals.

 

And to be fair, accepting the ship does mean accepting responsibility. What if people can't get flights home, where do they stay? And if they're going to be quarantined at the port, what facility can do that? Ports are mostly in cities, and sites for incoming cruise passengers could be arranged. But in some cases, I think local officials are afraid to accept a ship because they know the frightened people in their city will be furious at what they see as the "plague passengers." 

Remember the words of FDR:  The only thing we have to fear is fear itself.  There is a distinction from acting from fear as opposed to with fear. 

Edited March 28, 2020 by Himself

[Woofumz]

Just adding good wishes to those on board or have loved ones on board.  Truly hope there is a good resolution soon.

 

[Wehwalt]

This has some interesting coverage of some of the people on Zaandam.

 

https://www.businessinsider.com/elderly-couple-on-coronavirus-stricken-ship-says-theyre-stuck-aboard-2020-3

[Himself]

My heart goes out to those stuck on the Zaandam.

[Copper10-8]

28 minutes ago, 3rdGenCunarder said:

 

I think Charity is being outvoiced by fear. I don't know how many "not in my city" posts I've seen on this thread. Nobody wants more cases in their local hospitals.

 

And to be fair, accepting the ship does mean accepting responsibility. What if people can't get flights home, where do they stay? And if they're going to be quarantined at the port, what facility can do that? Ports are mostly in cities, and sites for incoming cruise passengers could be arranged. But in some cases, I think local officials are afraid to accept a ship because they know the frightened people in their city will be furious at what they see as the "plague passengers." 

 

This is pure speculation on my part, but I have a feeling, if a Panama Canal transit remains a no go, you will see a repeat of the Grand Princess (still anchored off Hunters Point in San Francisco Bay as we speak) experience with a voyage by Zaandam to a U.S. west coast port (or naval base) like Oakland, following the same protocol as said Princess ship; serious cases to hospitals, U.S. pax transported (by chartered or military aircraft) to, and quarantined at, U.S. military installations like Travis AFB, CA, MCAS Miramar, CA, Dobbins AFB, GA and Lackland AFB, TX, the personnel and staff there having gained valuable experience and expertise with the Grand Princess pax; foreign nationals being flown home on chartered aircraft for quarantine there, and crew quarantined onboard their ship for two weeks while receiving medical assistance if required. Time will tell