Starting up a cruise ship.

[Sir PMP]

How long will it take to get a cruise ship ready to sail again? To get the crew back and trained, supplies back on board, my guess is 4 to 6 weeks.

[Copper10-8]

32 minutes ago, Sir PMP said:

How long will it take to get a cruise ship ready to sail again? To get the crew back and trained, supplies back on board, my guess is 4 to 6 weeks.

 

If the ship is in "hot" or "warm" layup like what was happening off Grand Stirrup Cay, Bahamas in the Atlantic and off Baja California, Mexico in the Pacific, meaning full crew, it would take a week or so. A hot/warm layup is estimated to cost $2 to $3 million per month, per vessel.

 

That game plan has changed for several cruise lines however, with non-essential crew transfers to other ships which are now enroute to Asia and Europe to repatriate crew (take them home) who hail from those continents.

 

When that is accomplished, several, if not all, of those ships will go into prolonged layup, meaning a minimum crew and limited technical operations. That cost is projected to be approx. $1 million per ship. Those ships will take "weeks" to go back into full service with a full crew, fueled up and full provisions, ready to take on pax. Then they got to get to their "home base" for their planned itineraries.

 

Your estimate is more than likely right on, Meneer uit Den Haag. Btw, Carnival has already identified ships in their fleet that will not go back into service until October and November of this year. One can conclude that similar planning will take place for the other brands of the Carnival Corp plc, incl HAL.

[cruzingnut]

1 hour ago, Sir PMP said:

How long will it take to get a cruise ship ready to sail again? To get the crew back and trained, supplies back on board, my guess is 4 to 6 weeks.

 

Here is information on that, taken from Lloyds Register.  I'm sure that when cruising resumes, it will be in limited areas.  With limited areas, all of the ships won't be able to be activated and some will be put into a longer layup.  Amsterdam is most likely going to be one of them.  I only say this as they are planning on laying up in Malaysia with limited crew onboard and are also going to be overdue a required hull inspection (Dry dock was scheduled 5/12 in Freeport, Bahamas).  Who knows when things will start going again but will probably begin in the Caribbean.

 

Linda R

[atexsix]

Fascinating topic.  Does anybody know what will be involved with the interiors of the ships for a hot/warm lay-up?  I've been scouring the internet for pictures of how our ships are faring during this time period.  I think all of us have a bit of sentimental attachment to them, I guess I need to know they will be okay. 

 

We have history to look back on for answers to some of these questions.  When QEII was taken out of service, prior to her conversion as a 5 star hotel in Dubai, I was surprised to see from photos that nothing had changed.  The rooms were not lit, but other than that everything was in place like she was getting ready to receive her next group of passengers, even the grand piano sat at the ready on a stage. 

 

During periods of world war, ships were taken out of service for several years at a time, some would be repurposed or commissioned by governments.  For example, when Titanic's sister Olympic began 5 years of war service, most of first class including the grand staircases were completely sealed off from the rest of the ship.  The first class dining saloon, along with 2nd/3rd class were used as a hospital, but all furnishings and fixtures from passenger service had to removed and stored in warehouses.  After the war and her decommissioning, it took over a year to prepare the ship for a return to passenger service which included a complete refit and a conversion of the engines from coal to oil.  There's a great documentary on YouTube about her and the other great ladies of the ocean if anybody is interested; videos are all we got right now!

 

So I'm wondering how modern ships will weather the down time.  Will the furnishings and fixtures have to be mothballed?  Will mattresses and furniture be sealed up in some way for dust protection?  Of course this is nothing compared to battle during a war, at least not in a physical sense, but I'm wondering what way a ship could be repurposed during the down time?  Or will they sit lonely and abandoned for a time like the QEII?  I hope not!  I hope somebody is on them giving them the TLC they deserve.

[sevenseasnomad]

Current position of Nieuw Statendam and Zaandam is way out in the North Atlantic with speeds of 15 knots.  Not sure what this means for either ship as both of these ladies have been sailing between Bahamas and Florida for weeks with periods where both were doing 0 knots.  Anyone know what this means for these two ships?  Copper maybe?

[Copper10-8]

23 minutes ago, sevenseasnomad said:

Current position of Nieuw Statendam and Zaandam is way out in the North Atlantic with speeds of 15 knots.  Not sure what this means for either ship as both of these ladies have been sailing between Bahamas and Florida for weeks with periods where both were doing 0 knots.  Anyone know what this means for these two ships?  Copper maybe?

 

 

They're both headed for the city of Rotterdam, the Netherlands at speed in order to repat European crew. ETA there for both ships is May 12

[sevenseasnomad]

Thank you, Cooper.  Guess I'm holding out less and less hope for our July 4th cruise from Boston.  Should I give up hoping altogether and realize I won't be doing any B2B in Canada this year?  I was due to return to Boston on July 11th sailing from Montreal.

[Copper10-8]

3 minutes ago, sevenseasnomad said:

Thank you, Cooper.  Guess I'm holding out less and less hope for our July 4th cruise from Boston.  Should I give up hoping altogether and realize I won't be doing any B2B in Canada this year?  I was due to return to Boston on July 11th sailing from Montreal.

 

You should never give up hope however, it's all still too early to tell what will happen schedule-wise and of course, the Canadian government has a 100% say in your particular itinerary! This is going to be baby steps but there is light at the end of this tunnel Stay safe!

[sevenseasnomad]

2 minutes ago, Copper10-8 said:

 

You should never give up hope however, it's all still too early to tell what will happen schedule-wise and of course, the Canadian government has a 100% say in your particular itinerary! This is going to be baby steps but there is light at the end of this tunnel Stay safe!

Absolutely!  I'm an optimist at heart and know that if it's safe my friends and I will sail.  If not, then God is looking out for us, and maybe, I wasn't meant to sail this itinerary this year.  Canada's numbers seems to be stabilizing.  Each day I check their National Health Department's website.  Of course, they may ban tourists coming into their country from nations who still have increasing new COVID-19 cases, and I wouldn't blame their government for that policy. 

 

Also, the CDC still has a ban on cruising, so a lot of dominos have to fall into place before we go.  We're now two months from sailing, but if it takes a ship a week or so to prepare, will this leave enough time should CDC lift its ban and Canada reopen ports on June 30th.?

[rkacruiser]

6 hours ago, Copper10-8 said:

Carnival has already identified ships in their fleet that will not go back into service until October and November of this year.

 

I'd appreciate you pointing me to where I could find what those ships are if possible.

[Gail & Marty sailing away]

7 hours ago, Copper10-8 said:

 

If the ship is in "hot" or "warm" layup like what was happening off Grand Stirrup Cay, Bahamas in the Atlantic and off Baja California, Mexico in the Pacific, meaning full crew, it would take a week or so. A hot/warm layup is estimated to cost $2 to $3 million per month, per vessel.

 

That game plan has changed for several cruise lines however, with non-essential crew transfers to other ships which are now enroute to Asia and Europe to repatriate crew (take them home) who hail from those continents.

 

When that is accomplished, several, if not all, of those ships will go into prolonged layup, meaning a minimum crew and limited technical operations. That cost is projected to be approx. $1 million per ship. Those ships will take "weeks" to go back into full service with a full crew, fueled up and full provisions, ready to take on pax. Then they got to get to their "home base" for their planned itineraries.

 

Your estimate is more than likely right on, Meneer uit Den Haag. Btw, Carnival has already identified ships in their fleet that will not go back into service until October and November of this year. One can conclude that similar planning will take place for the other brands of the Carnival Corp plc, incl HAL.

It would be nice to know Holland America plain.

[Gail & Marty sailing away]

Amsterdam will it do the 2021 world cruise?   and Veendam  ??

[Copper10-8]

42 minutes ago, rkacruiser said:

 

I'd appreciate you pointing me to where I could find what those ships are if possible.

 

As the COVID-19 situation continues to evolve, we regret to inform our guests that Carnival Cruise Line is having to cancel the following sailings:     All Carnival Sunrise sailings through and including October 19, 2020 All Carnival Legend sailings through and including October 30, 2020 All Carnival Radiance sailings through and including November 1, 2020

[Flying-Dragon]

1 hour ago, sevenseasnomad said:

Absolutely!  I'm an optimist at heart and know that if it's safe my friends and I will sail.  If not, then God is looking out for us, and maybe, I wasn't meant to sail this itinerary this year.  Canada's numbers seems to be stabilizing.  Each day I check their National Health Department's website.  Of course, they may ban tourists coming into their country from nations who still have increasing new COVID-19 cases, and I wouldn't blame their government for that policy. 

 

Also, the CDC still has a ban on cruising, so a lot of dominos have to fall into place before we go.  We're now two months from sailing, but if it takes a ship a week or so to prepare, will this leave enough time should CDC lift its ban and Canada reopen ports on June 30th.?

 

I live in Vancouver, and although our Covid statistics are very good and improving, I believe there will be great reluctance to risk adding new cases by letting cruise ships into ports here this early in the recovery process.  Per capita of the countries I've been tracking, the Netherlands still has 5 times the BC rate of new cases, the US has 8 times, and we won't even talk about the New York area.

 

My guess with two months to go is that the port closure will be extended throughout the summer.  In our city alone we get 800,000 cruise passengers each summer - the risk of infection locally would be high, and I doubt anyone will risk it in 2020.

 

Our own plan is not to make a decision on cruising for a year, to allow for whether we get 2nd and 3rd waves and to see which cruise lines are still operating, and with how many ships on a severely revised sailing schedule.

[Gail & Marty sailing away]

32 minutes ago, Copper10-8 said:

 

As the COVID-19 situation continues to evolve, we regret to inform our guests that Carnival Cruise Line is having to cancel the following sailings:     All Carnival Sunrise sailings through and including October 19, 2020 All Carnival Legend sailings through and including October 30, 2020 All Carnival Radiance sailings through and including November 1, 2020

I wish Holland America would tell us the same way.

[kevingastreich]

3 hours ago, atexsix said:

So I'm wondering how modern ships will weather the down time.  Will the furnishings and fixtures have to be mothballed?  Will mattresses and furniture be sealed up in some way for dust protection?  Of course this is nothing compared to battle during a war, at least not in a physical sense, but I'm wondering what way a ship could be repurposed during the down time?  Or will they sit lonely and abandoned for a time like the QEII?  I hope not!  I hope somebody is on them giving them the TLC they deserve.

It stands to reason that not all ships will make it through this. Some will most likely be "retired" in some way.  This whole thing has been pretty sad for our favorite vessels!

[sppunk]

8 hours ago, Copper10-8 said:

 

If the ship is in "hot" or "warm" layup like what was happening off Grand Stirrup Cay, Bahamas in the Atlantic and off Baja California, Mexico in the Pacific, meaning full crew, it would take a week or so. A hot/warm layup is estimated to cost $2 to $3 million per month, per vessel.

 

That game plan has changed for several cruise lines however, with non-essential crew transfers to other ships which are now enroute to Asia and Europe to repatriate crew (take them home) who hail from those continents.

 

When that is accomplished, several, if not all, of those ships will go into prolonged layup, meaning a minimum crew and limited technical operations. That cost is projected to be approx. $1 million per ship. Those ships will take "weeks" to go back into full service with a full crew, fueled up and full provisions, ready to take on pax. Then they got to get to their "home base" for their planned itineraries.

 

Your estimate is more than likely right on, Meneer uit Den Haag. Btw, Carnival has already identified ships in their fleet that will not go back into service until October and November of this year. One can conclude that similar planning will take place for the other brands of the Carnival Corp plc, incl HAL.

For the crew still on ships, are they moved to guest accommodations to help space them out? I hope that’s an option for the ones working hard without the joy of seeing guests. 

[Copper10-8]

1 hour ago, sppunk said:

For the crew still on ships, are they moved to guest accommodations to help space them out? I hope that’s an option for the ones working hard without the joy of seeing guests. 

 

 

Yes, they are, Mr, Boston Red Sox fan, and yes also, they are spaced out (not literally 😉 ) in those guest cabins - Good for them!

[Seasick Sailor]

11 minutes ago, Copper10-8 said:

 

 

Yes, they are, Mr, Boston Red Sox fan, and yes also, they are spaced out (not literally 😉 ) in those guest cabins - Good for them!

 

John, just read on my newsfeed where NCL Escape employees weren't allowed separate cabins even though cabins are available. The article stated something about a certain class of employees?

[Copper10-8]

3 minutes ago, Seasick Sailor said:

 

John, just read on my newsfeed where NCL Escape employees weren't allowed separate cabins even though cabins are available. The article stated something about a certain class of employees?

 

 

Didn't hear about that one but, then again, that's NCL (Norwegian Cruise Line) so, in other words, the bloody Vikings with their Spam. The Dutch like cheese 😉

 

 

 

[rjbean4]

2 hours ago, Seasick Sailor said:

 

John, just read on my newsfeed where NCL Escape employees weren't allowed separate cabins even though cabins are available. The article stated something about a certain class of employees?

Watch this video from Traveling with Bruce that I found on Youtube. He talks about  this. Also a Dr. on the Norwegian Gem that has apparently passed away. When I saw this and they have so many crew on two ships. Then I think of HAL and out of the 14 ships in the fleet, 12 of them are now involved with taking crew home. A much better situation for the crew to be more spread out. Way to go HAL.

 

[chengkp75]

I'll just interject a few thoughts here on this topic.  First off, things that are stated as applying to various states of lay up, even from as good a source as Lloyd's, will be applicable to cargo ships, and not cruise ships, as none have been laid up in recent times, and the requirements are quite a bit different.  The difference is not necessarily on the technical end, but in maintaining the hotel side.  I believe that from the technical side, the ships will be in a condition similar to what Lloyd's calls "warm lay up (one week activation)".  My reasoning for this is that going any further into lay up means dropping to emergency power or deck generators, and these would not provide enough power to keep the hotel in condition.

 

What I see is that all linens will be stripped, laundered, and stored.  Provisions will be drawn down, and then replenished as needed by the minimal technical crew (as noted, probably below the statutory minimum manning with approval from class and flag state, maybe 15-30).  The AC will be maintained throughout the hotel at a reduced capacity to keep humidity under control, and keep mold from forming.  Technical side will rotate equipment as needed to keep it all "fresh".

 

The major timeline for reactivating will be getting the crew back onboard.  Once there, and a couple of days of refresher training, some safety drills, and then they need to clean and prep the hotel again, and then move the ship to its homeport for provisioning and fueling.  I'm going to say 3-4 weeks, but that depends on how the airline situation is at the time.

[bouhunter]

13 hours ago, sevenseasnomad said:

Thank you, Cooper.  Guess I'm holding out less and less hope for our July 4th cruise from Boston.  Should I give up hoping altogether and realize I won't be doing any B2B in Canada this year?  I was due to return to Boston on July 11th sailing from Montreal.

Sadly I believe the only decision you're going to have to make is whether you want a refund or FCC when they cancel.  I'd take the refund, and hope it shows up someday.

Edited May 3, 2020 by bouhunter

[darwinsrule]

 

12 hours ago, Flying-Dragon said:

 

My guess with two months to go is that the port closure will be extended throughout the summer.  In our city alone we get 800,000 cruise passengers each summer - the risk of infection locally would be high, and I doubt anyone will risk it in 2020.

 

Our own plan is not to make a decision on cruising for a year, to allow for whether we get 2nd and 3rd waves and to see which cruise lines are still operating, and with how many ships on a severely revised sailing schedule.

 

Agree completely.  There are two things currently in place that need to change.  One is the border restrictions that currenty go month to month basically limiting visits between Canada and the U.S. to essential travel only.  Those are currently set to expire May 21st, they will be extended again at least on the Canadian side for another month. The cruise ban is a completely separate issue, yes it expires July 1st, no doubt that it is extended (my guess is end of August).  The issue here, like many other places, is those confined, collective type institutions that allow the virus to spread easily, that includes ships.  There just isn't going to be the risk tollerance at this stage to allow the cruises to proceed. 

 

And yes it sucks, but this is where that old Star Trek line about "the needs of the many" comes in to play.    We have Koningsdam booked for August 29th out of Vancouver, so yes directly impacted, but there will be other cruises.  

[YXU AC*SE]

13 hours ago, Copper10-8 said:

All Carnival Sunrise sailings through and including October 19, 2020 All Carnival Legend sailings through and including October 30, 2020 All Carnival Radiance sailings through and including November 1, 2020

 

These are all re-fit delays though, no?   Carnival Radiance (former Victory) is in Cadiz, ES along with Carnival Sunrise (former Triumph) and were already out of service pre-COVID?   And Carnival Legend was to be repaired after its unfortunate Cozumel mash-up w/ Carnival Glory?   https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pYILfMI8nds       Scott.