Ruby Princess

[Aus Traveller]

11 minutes ago, BRANDEE said:

I don't know the consumer law of Australia, but the suit is not "really" someone died because of Covid...but the cruise contract promised a certain type of experience and it was not delivered.  And peopled suffered from not getting what the contract said.  That is a "watered" down version of it..but that is the angle..they did not deliver the product promised.  (as of Nov)

 

And of couse, who suffered because it was not delivered.

I do not see that any cruise line 'promises a certain type of experience'. If there is very bad weather during a cruise, many passengers will get seasick. They would not be enjoying their cruise, but can they sue????

 

In really bad weather cold food is delivered to cabins and the dining rooms are closed. Can I complain if I can't have the meals and the experience that are shown in the brochure? No, I can't.

 

Even the cruise contract makes it clear that they do not have to take you to the ports that are on the itinerary. They do not actually promise anything in their contract.

Edited January 26, 2021 by Aus Traveller

[BRANDEE]

7 minutes ago, Aus Traveller said:

I do not see that any cruise line 'promises a certain type of experience'. If there is very bad weather during a cruise, many passengers will get seasick. They would not be enjoying their cruise, but can they sue????

 

In really bad weather cold food is delivered to cabins and the dining rooms are closed. Can I complain if I can't have the meals and the experience that are shown in the brochure? No, I can't.

 

Even the cruise contract makes it clear that they do not have to take you to the ports that are on the itinerary. They do not actually promise anything in their contract.

Just found my notes:

Branch of Aust Consmer Law:  negligence..engaged misleading and deceptive conduct

1.  The cruise should have been cancelled

2. cease activities on ship..masks given to passenger to protect themselves and kept in cabin.

 

Damages for distress and disappointment

Damagess for pain and suffering

Loss of capacity to provide domestic services

Aggravated compensation

Edited January 26, 2021 by BRANDEE

[BRANDEE]

1 hour ago, NSWP said:

Is the above fair dinkum, the matter you are talking about, re the $1.25? Or hypothetical? 

Just found this;  

Shine gets 20% plus 25% uplift.  Funding agreement (company putting up the $$ to sue) gets reimbursement of cost plus 25%.  Clients get to split $1.25

[Aus Traveller]

24 minutes ago, BRANDEE said:

I don't know the consumer law of Australia, but the suit is not "really" someone died because of Covid...but the cruise contract promised a certain type of experience and it was not delivered.  And peopled suffered from not getting what the contract said.  That is a "watered" down version of it..but that is the angle..they did not deliver the product promised.  (as of Nov)

 

And of couse, who suffered because it was not delivered.

I am puzzled. I have skimmed through the Passage Contract printed in the Princess cruise brochure. I cannot see where they promise any particular type of experience and certainly not a good time.

 

They do say "You warrant that You are medically and physically fit for travel, and that such travel will not endanger yourself or anyone else". It is clear that one passenger (maybe unknown by them at the time) was ill and endangered him/herself and others.

[Aus Traveller]

Just now, BRANDEE said:

Just found this;  

Shine gets 20% plus 25% uplift.  Funding agreement (company putting up the $$ to sue) gets reimbursement of cost plus 25%.  Clients get to split $1.25

Yes. The people who should get most of the money get very little.

[GUT2407]

19 minutes ago, Aus Traveller said:

I agree with your comment that Princess would not have taken the risk to allow pax to board to sail if they had any idea there could be COVID on board. I also agree that the lawyers will have to pull a rabbit, or more than one, out of a hat. I hope Carnival doesn't settle just to stop bad PR. There will always be people who believe the claims made, even if evidence is to the contrary.

Sometimes settling is the economic solution, not saying it is or not this time. But usually even if you get an order for costs it doesn’t cover all your costs, and not the costs of your staff being tied up in preparation, discovery etc. it is unfortunate but true that many times a settlement is made as a commercial decision.

[MicCanberra]

29 minutes ago, Chiliburn said:

Yes there was a death.

 It was the credibility of the cruise industry.

I don't agree, but even if covid has had that effect, it happened after the cruise.

[Aus Traveller]

9 minutes ago, BRANDEE said:

Just found my notes:

Branch of Aust Consmer Law:  negligence..engaged misleading and deceptive conduct

1.  The cruise should have been cancelled

2. cease activities on ship..masks given to passenger to protect themselves and kept in cabin.

 

Damages for distress and disappointment

Damagess for pain and suffering

Loss of capacity to provide domestic services

Aggravated compensation

In retrospect, we would all say that the cruise should have been cancelled. There was respiratory illness on board - but isn't there nearly always? I would not be happy if they ceased all activities on a cruise I have paid for because several people have a cough. I am not talking about COVID because it was not confirmed until many hours after the ship docked that there was COVID on board. The only tests done during the cruise resulted in a negative result.

 

I don't think the Court is stupid.

[Aus Traveller]

1 minute ago, GUT2407 said:

Sometimes settling is the economic solution, not saying it is or not this time. But usually even if you get an order for costs it doesn’t cover all your costs, and not the costs of your staff being tied up in preparation, discovery etc. it is unfortunate but true that many times a settlement is made as a commercial decision.

I fully understand that.

[GUT2407]

3 minutes ago, Aus Traveller said:

Yes. The people who should get most of the money get very little.

Or they could do it all themselves, including all the legal work and pony up the costs and keep whatever they get.

[BRANDEE]

1 minute ago, Aus Traveller said:

In retrospect, we would all say that the cruise should have been cancelled. There was respiratory illness on board - but isn't there nearly always? I would not be happy if they ceased all activities on a cruise I have paid for because several people have a cough. I am not talking about COVID because it was not confirmed until many hours after the ship docked that there was COVID on board. The only tests done during the cruise resulted in a negative result.

 

I don't think the Court is stupid.

Totally agree with you.  Panic would have prevailed on board.  And there was no sign of a major outbreak of anything.   

[lyndarra]

54 minutes ago, Aus Traveller said:

 

Was the ship clean? There have been many submissions reporting that the crew were cleaning the ship constantly.

The ship, in all probability, was most likely clean. Somebody who went on board wasn't. Can the ship be blamed for that? One would need to prove that Princess knowingly let an infected passenger on board.

There was no testing then in the way there is now. One would have to successfully argue that Princess knew the odds were that an infected passenger would board and shouild therefore make a decision to cancel the cruise. In a sense, they took a gamble and lost but is that proof of culpability? A long bow to draw.

Isn't hindsight a wonderful thing?

 

 

Edited January 26, 2021 by lyndarra

[Aus Traveller]

11 minutes ago, GUT2407 said:

Or they could do it all themselves, including all the legal work and pony up the costs and keep whatever they get.

But they are not going to do that, even if they had the ability. I feel it is unfortunate that with litigation funders now operating, people who feel they might be able to get some money, put in a claim without taking any risk. If the Court finds against them, they don't lose anything.

 

They are encouraged to sue because they are not risking anything.

Edited January 26, 2021 by Aus Traveller

[Aus Traveller]

3 minutes ago, lyndarra said:

The ship, in all probability, was most likely clean. Somebody who went on board wasn't. Can the ship be blamed for that? One would need to prove that Princess knowingly let and infected passenger on board.

There was no testing then in the way there is now. One would have to successfully argue that Princess knew the odds were that an infected passenger would board and shouild therefore make a decision to cancel the cruise. In a sense, they took a gamble and lost but is that proof of culpability? A long bow to draw.

Isn't hindsight a wonderful thing?

Very good post.🙂 

 

When the ship left (24th Feb) there was hardly any COVID in Australia. It was not in the community.  Princess didn't allow people who had been to China (and I think Singapore) in the previous 14 days to board. I did hear about a couple from the UK who were denied boarding because they transited through Singapore. Maybe Princess should have included people from other overseas countries.

[BRANDEE]

1 minute ago, lyndarra said:

The ship, in all probability, was most likely clean. Somebody who went on board wasn't. Can the ship be blamed for that? One would need to prove that Princess knowingly let and infected passenger on board.

There was no testing then in the way there is now. One would have to successfully argue that Princess knew the odds were that an infected passenger would board and shouild therefore make a decision to cancel the cruise. In a sense, they took a gamble and lost but is that proof of culpability? A long bow to draw.

Isn't hindsight a wonderful thing?

 

 

First off..Happy Australia Day to y'all

 

Second..I hold NSW Health totally responsible for the ship sailing and people on board getting sick and spreading it to all the home countries of the passengers. It is called dereliction of duty.  I am very disappointed in the Special Commission that just slapped the wrist of NSW Health.

 

Third..I was only giving information regarding the class action suit that I personally know of..

 

Fourth..Not one adult was bound and gagged and dragged up the gangplank the day the Ruby set sail!!

 

Did not mean to start a debate..again..over who is responsible...just let you know what the class action is based on. The breach of the Australian Consumer Law.

 

 

 

[Aus Traveller]

13 minutes ago, BRANDEE said:

First off..Happy Australia Day to y'all

 

Second..I hold NSW Health totally responsible for the ship sailing and people on board getting sick and spreading it to all the home countries of the passengers. It is called dereliction of duty.  I am very disappointed in the Special Commission that just slapped the wrist of NSW Health.

 

Third..I was only giving information regarding the class action suit that I personally know of..

 

Fourth..Not one adult was bound and gagged and dragged up the gangplank the day the Ruby set sail!!

 

Did not mean to start a debate..again..over who is responsible...just let you know what the class action is based on. The breach of the Australian Consumer Law.

Thank you for your posts. 🙂

[NSWP]

Brandee, I appreciate your contribution to this topic. Stay safe in NY. Only been there once for a couple of days, but loved it.

[lyndarra]

26 minutes ago, BRANDEE said:

First off..Happy Australia Day to y'all

 

Second..I hold NSW Health totally responsible for the ship sailing and people on board getting sick and spreading it to all the home countries of the passengers. It is called dereliction of duty.  I am very disappointed in the Special Commission that just slapped the wrist of NSW Health.

 

Third..I was only giving information regarding the class action suit that I personally know of..

 

Fourth..Not one adult was bound and gagged and dragged up the gangplank the day the Ruby set sail!!

 

Did not mean to start a debate..again..over who is responsible...just let you know what the class action is based on. The breach of the Australian Consumer Law.

 

 

 

My apologies if it looked like I was restarting a debate.

Just me thinking about stuff again and for the last two and a half years I have had  no one to share them with.

Thank you for the good wishes on Our Day.

[lyndarra]

1 minute ago, NSWP said:

Brandee, I appreciate your contribution to this topic. Stay safe in NY. Only been there once for a couple of days, but loved it.

I was planning a trip to NY for Sep 2020 when the brown stuff hit the fan. Now there's no knowing if/when I'll get the chance again, if ever.

[NSWP]

3 minutes ago, lyndarra said:

I was planning a trip to NY for Sep 2020 when the brown stuff hit the fan. Now there's no knowing if/when I'll get the chance again, if ever.

One city I could return to.

[Chiliburn]

51 minutes ago, MicCanberra said:

I don't agree, but even if covid has had that effect, it happened after the cruise.

The shock jocks are eager to bring up ruby and her sister ships as the standard of the cruise industry.

 

[BRANDEE]

7 minutes ago, lyndarra said:

I was planning a trip to NY for Sep 2020 when the brown stuff hit the fan. Now there's no knowing if/when I'll get the chance again, if ever.

Hope you get to visit in the future..the city, the suburbs, the beaches and mountains.  I regret that my Australian trip was cut short due to covid.  Still a few more places on my list to visit!

 

No apologies needed..I do appreciate your late night conversations with me over the past year!!

Edited January 26, 2021 by BRANDEE

[lyndarra]

1 hour ago, Aus Traveller said:

I am puzzled. I have skimmed through the Passage Contract printed in the Princess cruise brochure. I cannot see where they promise any particular type of experience and certainly not a good time.

It's just like the burger that's handed to you over the counter looks nothing like the one on the poster or in the TV ads. Some have been down that path, unsuccessfully.

[Aus Traveller]

1 minute ago, lyndarra said:

It's just like the burger that's handed to you over the counter looks nothing like the one on the poster or in the TV ads. Some have been down that path, unsuccessfully.

The beautiful people shown in the photos in the cruise brochure aren't ever on board when I go on a cruise. 🙂And the sky isn't as blue .......

[OzKiwiJJ]

1 hour ago, Aus Traveller said:

They always arrive around 6.30 am and leave by 4pm or 8pm. On this occasion, they arrived around 2 am to disembark two ill pax, and embarkation of the new passengers was delayed while the ship was deep cleaned. They left that evening.

I thought the cruise where they arrived at 2am was the last cruise ie the one where Covid got onboard.