Is anybody else going to miss HAL's smaller ships?

[rkacruiser]

There remains some of us who sailed on Rotterdam V.  Crow's Nest?  No, but a forward observation area accessible from the Upper Promenade Deck that permitted views of the activity on the mooring deck as well as turning 180 degrees and viewing the Officers standing near the Bridge windows.  For scenic cruising?  The only place better was an observation area mid-ship at the very top of the ship above the Sky Lounge, accessible by a vertical ladder from the deck below.  

 

 

[rkacruiser]

Yes,  I will be very sad when the Volendam and the Zaandam meet "their maker" in the scrapyards of India, Turkey, wherever.  

 

The news on the Fred. Olsen Board that Boudicca, the former Royal Viking Sky that first carried me across the Atlantic for my first visit to Europe was at Alang and a photo showed that she was beached was very hurtful.  Another bit of me died when I read that and saw the pictures.  

 

Reality is not always pretty.  

[kazu]

34 minutes ago, rkacruiser said:

I really don't understand those of you who somehow think that the Crow's Nest has become extinct.

No one said it was extinct.  The question was about the OLD style Crow’s Nest which I addressed.

 

And there is no question that what is the Crow’s Nest now and what it was as the “Old” Crow’s Nest is a huge difference.

 

I far prefer the “old” Crow’s Nest for a Meet and Greet than the Billboard area on the ships that have had their Crow’s Nests “revived”.  

JMO of course.

[AncientWanderer]

More than the size of the ships, what I miss is the more old school nautical feel of the ships.  The new-builds and renovated ones have a lot of bright lights (LED?) and glaring information screens and slick surfaces of modern materials.  A lot of this stuff triggers migraine for me, so our cruising habits may necessarily change.  We may have to do fewer cruises, on smaller ships that are selected carefully for their use of more traditional materials.  

[rkacruiser]

6 minutes ago, kazu said:

And there is no question that what is the Crow’s Nest now and what it was as the “Old” Crow’s Nest is a huge difference.

 

And, kazu, that is our difference.  Some perceive the difference between the "Old Crew's Nest" and the re-imagined ones--note I said "ones", in the plural,--as being the source of our differences.  

 

As I said, whomever at HAL was responsible over the business plan for the Crow's Nest over the years when the changes began to occur had no real plan for what they were doing.  "I am employed.  I need to justify my employment.  I need to institute this "change".  Well, that didn't work.  The individual left and someone else filled the position.  And, the cycle repeated itself.  And, continues to do so.  

 

There is no quibble from me that Billboard or wherever is not a world class meeting space for a M&G.  The Crow's Nest is a great spot.  Why can't it still be?   

[rkacruiser]

8 minutes ago, AncientWanderer said:

The new-builds

 

....and their art...not to my taste.  Some is attractive; but, why ought one have to ponder this question?  What did the artist try to communicate to the observer?  No captions, titles, or explanations on anything that I saw on Nieuw Statendam.  

[kazu]

1 minute ago, rkacruiser said:

There is no quibble from me that Billboard or wherever is not a world class meeting space for a M&G.  The Crow's Nest is a great spot.  Why can't it still be?  

 

I agree with you but I can tell you honestly, that HAL will not do their Meet and Greets on the ships where the “new” Crow’s Nest is there.  I have tried and was told no, Billboard.

 

It’s only since the interactive stuff was added to the Crow’s Nests that this has occurred in my experience.

 

As some like to say, it is what it is.

One of our future Meet and Greets will be in the Billboard area and the other 2 in the ‘old’ Crow’s Nest.

[rkacruiser]

9 minutes ago, kazu said:

I have tried and was told no, Billboard.

 

I have had only one M&G experience in Billboard and that was on Nieuw Statendam.  A shadow of what once was.  No HAL personnel appeared, no platters of cookies or other goodies, no coffee/tea set-up; those of us attending had to go around "rounding up" others that may have been there for that purpose.  Nice group assembled; I made friends with a couple from Minnesota with whom I maintain contact,  We shared HH for much of the rest of our cruise.

 

But, I am wondering with such a "loosey-goosey" set-up that HAL is providing on their newest ships, why bother?  The M&G on MSC Meraviglia in January, 2020 was much more satisfactory and exclusive to our CC M&G group.  The CD on that cruise was an experienced, retired, and pulled out of retirement by MSC CD.  Did he make a difference?  

[AtlantaCruiser72]

1 hour ago, kazu said:

 

Old Crow’s Nest was in place on the P’dam and the S & R ships.  I believe it still is since our Meet and Greet on the Volendam is being held in the Crow’s Nest, Captain’s Corner 😉 

Volendam, Zaandam and Noordam (for now) all have the "Old School" Pre EXC Crow's Nest.  All other ships have some version of the new EXC Crow's Nest concept

[kangforpres]

Well there are still 2 "small" ships left in the fleet, so if loyal HAL small ship customers keep booking cruises on those ships they will keep them in the fleet. I'm sure the next HAL build will be the 4th Pinnacle class ship.

 

After that, is when we find out if HAL will just keep growing their ship size. It might be the small ship aficionados will have to be content with Viking, Oceania. I think Fred Olsen is a UK firm and not really an option for North Americans.

 

-Paul

[kazu]

35 minutes ago, rkacruiser said:

 

I have had only one M&G experience in Billboard and that was on Nieuw Statendam.  A shadow of what once was.  No HAL personnel appeared, no platters of cookies or other goodies, no coffee/tea set-up; those of us attending had to go around "rounding up" others that may have been there for that purpose.  Nice group assembled; I made friends with a couple from Minnesota with whom I maintain contact,  We shared HH for much of the rest of our cruise.

 

But, I am wondering with such a "loosey-goosey" set-up that HAL is providing on their newest ships, why bother?  The M&G on MSC Meraviglia in January, 2020 was much more satisfactory and exclusive to our CC M&G group.  The CD on that cruise was an experienced, retired, and pulled out of retirement by MSC CD.  Did he make a difference?  

 

I’ve never been to a M & G hosted by HAL where there wen’t cookies, coffee, tea and water but I haven’t been on the N Statendam.

HAl personnel don’t traditionally appear although I have had them show up on the Westerdam and Prinsendam after the new rules were in place.  I sent them invites and they came.

 

I agree, I don’t know why HAL doesn’t embrace it more.  I know they ddidn’t join in with the Meet and Mingle originally and appreciate what they do for giving us the space, etc.  I fear it was the complainers who turned them off.  Not sure.  

Was there no roped off space or signage on your N Statendam cruise?  I’ll make sure to request it for our Westerdam if there wasn’t.

[Stateroom_Sailor]

No, mainly because I've not had a chance to try them.  We would have been on the previous Rotterdam this year.  I'm happy with Signature Class, and like what Pinnacle has to offer.  On the itinerary side of things, I miss those smaller ships very much!

[aliaschief]

Miss them yes. It is what it  is but we have also enjoyed all the new venues on Pinnacle Class ships. We love visiting new ports of call and being at sea.

 

Hal is not going back but there are cruise lines with smaller ships.

 

Though different we will stick with Holland America and the crews we love.

 

Unfortunately,  times change and there usually is no going back.

 

Have one more long cruise booking on our first ship MS Volendam. We will enjoy one of these classic beauties at least one more time.

[kazu]

2 minutes ago, kangforpres said:

After that, is when we find out if HAL will just keep growing their ship size. It might be the small ship aficionados will have to be content with Viking, Oceania. I think Fred Olsen is a UK firm and not really an option for North Americans.

 There are lots of small cruise ship options out there.  I am not against the larger ships - it’s just the itineraries are more standard and in a lot of cases,  we’ve been there and done that.

I think Fred Olsen is an option for North Americans.  You might have to pay in their currency but you can certainly book.  Oceania is out for us but there are other options out there.  We’ll enjoy what we have booked, take it from there and then decide.

 

I’ll just be happy to be able to travel again and revel in that 😄 

[atexsix]

5 minutes ago, kazu said:

 

I’ve never been to a M & G hosted by HAL where there wen’t cookies, coffee, tea and water but I haven’t been on the N Statendam.

HAl personnel don’t traditionally appear although I have had them show up on the Westerdam and Prinsendam after the new rules were in place.  I sent them invites and they came.

 

I agree, I don’t know why HAL doesn’t embrace it more.  I know they ddidn’t join in with the Meet and Mingle originally and appreciate what they do for giving us the space, etc.  I fear it was the complainers who turned them off.  Not sure.  

Was there no roped off space or signage on your N Statendam cruise?  I’ll make sure to request it for our Westerdam if there wasn’t.

The last one I organized on Eurodam they didn't show up, but I think somebody asked me if I needed it when I checked with the ship to make sure everything was in order. A server checked in with me during the event and again after to inform me the space needed to be prepared for the next event.

 

We had the usual: coffee, juice, water with lemon, pastries, cookies, etc. The attendant went around a couple times taking drink orders.

[mcrcruiser]

We sailed on Ryndam, Oosterdam , Rotterdam  in the past yet the last 2 sailings have been on Koningsdam  .We love the Pinnacle class & feel it is just the right sized ship  with all the entertainment we come to appreciate  plus Tamarind  & Orange  dining  . Just wish that they add another special restaurant or two  &   upgrade Canileto   to   a full blown Italian restaurant not in the  buffet area 

[cruisemom42]

58 minutes ago, kangforpres said:

I think Fred Olsen is a UK firm and not really an option for North Americans.

 

Perfectly feasible to sail with Fred Olsen -- I have sailed with other UK-based smaller cruise lines in the past; no problem at all. 

[Btimmer]

We're itinerary driven cruisers and the small ships' itineraries of HAL really fit our niche for cruising.  That being said, we've sailed on all classes of the HAL fleet and most of our many days of cruising have been on the Volendam and the Maasdam.  And we really miss the Prinsendam. . .

[aliaschief]

40 minutes ago, mcrcruiser said: Just wish that they add another special restaurant or two  &   upgrade Canileto   to   a full blown Italian restaurant not in the  buffet area 

I never feel like we are in Lido. Window seats in summer and at least one night per cruise a nice alternative dining experience.

 

It was very special on Prisendam.

[daisybertie]

Good day everyone. We were really sad when the Maasdam was sold as we had enjoyed so many cruises on board. Seattle to Sydney and Sydney to Tahiti and return were the most memorable. It was a perfect size for us, but we did notice how the ‘entertainment’ changed over the years. But at least the Crows Nest was still the old style. We have also sailed on the Volendam, Westerdam and Zuiderdam, and would happily do so again, but nothing bigger than that. Those mega ships fill me with horror at the thought of the crowds and the noise. The beautiful Maasdam looked like a ‘proper’ship! 

[atexsix]

4 hours ago, St. Louis Sal said:

We loved the Amsterdam 😢.
 

We were docked in Sint Maarten back in November, 2019 right next to the Symphony of the Seas. It was like a floating apartment building. 
 

St Louis Sal

LOLOL.  That's how we felt whenever we were docked next to the Ruby Princess, they often homeported on the same day as the Eurodam, we'd even leave at the same time....by the next morning I could still spot a white mass off in the distance.  I'd check vessel tracker and sure enough it was the Ruby.

[atexsix]

6 minutes ago, daisybertie said:

Good day everyone. We were really sad when the Maasdam was sold as we had enjoyed so many cruises on board. Seattle to Sydney and Sydney to Tahiti and return were the most memorable. It was a perfect size for us, but we did notice how the ‘entertainment’ changed over the years. But at least the Crows Nest was still the old style. We have also sailed on the Volendam, Westerdam and Zuiderdam, and would happily do so again, but nothing bigger than that. Those mega ships fill me with horror at the thought of the crowds and the noise. The beautiful Maasdam looked like a ‘proper’ship! 

Now that's what I call a ship!  It looks so elegant and stately.  Even the Vistas, Signatures, and Pinnacles reflect the HAL tradition. 

[DeeniEncinitas]

2 hours ago, kazu said:

No one said it was extinct.  The question was about the OLD style Crow’s Nest which I addressed.

 

And there is no question that what is the Crow’s Nest now and what it was as the “Old” Crow’s Nest is a huge difference.

 

I far prefer the “old” Crow’s Nest for a Meet and Greet than the Billboard area on the ships that have had their Crow’s Nests “revived”.  

JMO of course.

🌺Jacqui I also agree with you too! I prefer the old Crow’s Nest!!

🌴Denise😊

[atexsix]

4 hours ago, rkacruiser said:

 

 

I really don't understand those of you who somehow think that the Crow's Nest has become extinct.  It's there even on the Pinnacle Class ships.  For my purposes, the new "versions" fulfill what the former Crow's Nest did--at times--depending upon what the business plan for the lounge was during that "era".  A superior indoor sightseeing venue?  That has not changed!  Is the Crow's Nest currently my favorite place for HH as it had been?  No.  When the changes began, the posts on CC made me think that if I wanted a CC-7, it would be unobtainable.  Well, I found out differently.  Several times, the Crow's Nest was the site for a solo guitar/singer, a small combo, a disco, BB King's Blues Club, or just a quiet lounge with a view.  Whomever has been in charge of HAL's business model over the years (and there have been many) regarding what the Crow's Nest ought to be are the ones that one's disappointment ought to be addressed.  

 

 

Because it no longer has the warmth or charm of the old layout with the library, it's not that bad, we did have coffee a couple times, but the starboard side is too different for us now.

[Quartzsite Cruiser]

We also miss the small ships.  We like their size, layout, and the smaller ports they can get into.
 

The largest HAL ship we’ve been on is the Westerdam.  The first time in 2017 was before they converted the Crow’s Nest, and in 2018, the Crow’s Nest had the interactive features which were rarely used.  It also had less seating, and what was there was not that comfortable.  For the most part, the Westerdam did not have the HAL feel that the small ships have.  On sea days I like to spend time in the Crow’s Nest reading, but not on the Westerdam.

 

We’ve sailed on the Prinsendam, all the S class except Maasdam, and all the R class.  Their size was much more to our liking, and the crew seemed to enjoy working in them.

 

For many years the Prinsendam was our favorite ship; then they sold her.  After her last dry dock and in-spite of the unfortunate change to her stern, Veendam became our favorite ship,.  Now, she is gone.  Like RuthC, I quit having a favorite ship as I did not want to jinx them.