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ommboz

Crown & Anchor Program Revisions - join the merged discussions here

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Thanks for the info. Since I never got the first email, I don't think I'll be getting this one either.
You and me both. Maybe the new head of C&A will be able to figure out who should be on their mailing list.:rolleyes:

The forget me as well! I just don't get their email system. :rolleyes:

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Personally I'm a happy camper. We don't drink much but like to have a glass of wine and visit with others before or after dinner. The concierge lounge was a nice place to do this....now it will just be in a different location. This is much nicer than the single night originally offered. Of course I could look at it from the perspective that they shouldn't have taken it away to begin with but I prefer to look at it in a more positive way and be thankful that they did indeed listen to what was being said by so many C&A members.

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Although Goldstein nibbles at the edges of customer complaints about declining service...

 

 

 

...he offers no remedy beyond citing some secret surveys.

 

I would way rather have had him address the degradation in service than reinstate the happy hour with 25% discounted cocktails.

 

We still have the steak surcharge and all the other well documented cutbacks.

 

Thanks Adam, but the bell has rung and we now have these tickets on your competitor's ships. It would seem we have had our Tea Party.

 

I still love Royal Caribbean but I am no longer a captive loyalist.

.

 

I agree with Wblynch, particularly the last sentence. We already switched from a Serenade cruise to our very first Princess cruise next spring; never would have considered that until the CL announcement for Diamonds. Some damage to our relationship and loyalty has occurred. But, we remain on the Grandeur for this June to visit Canada/New England. So, thanks to this, we're open to other cruise lines. I don't believe RCCL wanted that.

 

Then again, DW and I do not like the monster ships (even Voyager was too large for us; who needs INSIDE attractions; we want to See the Sea.) This obviously is the direction RCCL is headed (we just LOVE the Radiance class).

 

Finally, I do feel this fallback plan was all set based on our reaction. The new program is not bad -- but I sense RCCL was manipulative. Not a very nice feeling.

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I was thinking the exact same thing!!! Overcrowding????!!! Easily solved. Move to another dedicated location. Lord knows these ships have the room.

 

It's all about the $$$$$$$$$

 

 

Will they still be offering appetizers or is that cut too? I kinda liked a little finger food with my wine before dinner.

 

 

Denise -- Next Sail 5/12/2009

 

 

I believe Goldstein's major point was providing the "concierge" style service, and it's hard to maintain that with multiple lounges opened for C&A. I think it's a logistics thing with taking staff and dedicating them to this instead of their regular jobs. I've been on ships with 300 - 400 Diamonds and D+.

 

Of course it's driven by economics, but it's not just the cost of the food and bev; it's also got to do with the scheduling, staffing, etc.

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Then again, DW and I do not like the monster ships (even Voyager was too large for us; who needs INSIDE attractions; we want to See the Sea.) This obviously is the direction RCCL is headed (we just LOVE the Radiance class).

 

 

I agree with you. The Radiance and Vision class are my favorite RCCL ships.....they are beautiful with all that glass and it's so nice to sit in one of their beautiful public rooms and look out at the sea! After all, that's why you're on a cruise, right?! ;)

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Actually, Bill, for perhaps the first time, I am going to disagree with you.

 

It is like a labor negotiation. Workers ask for a 10% raise. Management counters with 2%. Workers are outraged. Demand 8%. Management counters with 6%. Final agreement: 4% - both sides feel that they gained over the other.

 

People (in this case, whining C & A members), need to feel that they "won something back."

 

If RC had offered this in the first place, there would have been just as much complaining. RC really HAD to "threaten" or announce that it was removing the whole deal, then "give in" to a 25% discount deal, to appease people.

 

People would have been INCENSED that their FREE booze was taken away and being replaced by a MEASLY 25% discount.

 

It's all about the psychology.

 

:)

 

He has GOT to be kidding! He thinks we are all stupid. First they make changes due to "crowding" in the concierge lounge - now they have "learned" from us and they are now offering wine and a %25 discount on drinks! This is absolute proof that these changes are all about $$$$!

 

Quod erat demonstrandum.

 

Q. E. D.

 

See what I mean?

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Personally I'm a happy camper. We don't drink much but like to have a glass of wine and visit with others before or after dinner. The concierge lounge was a nice place to do this....now it will just be in a different location. This is much nicer than the single night originally offered. Of course I could look at it from the perspective that they shouldn't have taken it away to begin with but I prefer to look at it in a more positive way and be thankful that they did indeed listen to what was being said by so many C&A members.

 

Me, too! I especially like the fact that they will now have something on ships without a CL or a DL. Our next 2 cruises are on one of those ships, and they are long cruises. So, this is nice to look forward to every night.

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I don't think we are that far apart in our thinking. I am sure that any announcement would have met with a negative reaction but I am not prepared to believe that they made their "threat" in full anticipation of coming back with their "compromise" later on. I don't give them that much credit.:rolleyes: Besides almost everyone said "it isn't about the free booze", didn't they:eek: By the way I don't want you negotiating for me if the workers end up getting 4% when management offered 6% during the negotiations. ;)

 

Yeah, well, I have a good excuse for the lousy math.

 

I'm still jet-lagged from my flight home from Rome. ;)

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Well.. I have mixed feelings...why push the start date back to Sept...why not Dec?? I sail Enchantment in Oct..so I am still out of luck for the CL. but since I will be sailing with a larger group of Non Diamond family,probably wouldn't have gone anyhow... hopefully the new changes really ARE a result of them listening & not just some master plan they had in mind all along..

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Georget,

Yes we "Whiners" stuck together on this and had to put up with constant attacks even though we were trying to get something done. Most folks don't know this but early on (a couple days after the announcement) I was in fact "Banned from CC" for a week for "disruption". Somebody sure wanted to shut me up.

 

It would have been much easier to walk away and not put up with the stuff we "Whiners" had to put up with. But there was a princple involved that really had nothing to do with any one perk. And for some of us it was worthwhile.

 

So thank you to ALL of the WHINERS. If it wasn't for the shear numbers of you that came out in support it would have been difficult to keep this on the front page. And believe me I spent a lot of my precious time keeping it on the front page and fielding insults as did many others. Plus there are still some who are banned as I post this.

 

Thank you also to those folks who are not Diamond yet or who are Diamond Plus but joined in the Conversation and voiced their opinons without ridiculing and attacking and calling us "Whiners".

 

So I am still going to keep up my conversation with RCI in the various ways I have until this whole situation is truly resolved in a manner which is best for the company and for its long term, frequent and loyal customers.

 

Colleen

 

So in other words you are still not happy???? :rolleyes: figures....:D

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Wow, just read the e-mail this morning. I am very happy with this solution because RCCL didn't have to make any changes to the new policy, but I'm happy that they do value their loyal Diamond members and are trying to please everyone.

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Just a question (to all the whiners)

 

What do you get at one of the other cruise lines when you have same level comparable to diamond on RCI?

 

One of my cruisemates is platinum on Carnival and besides express check inn, free laundry and her name printed on some aweful silver papers, she doesn't get nothing comparable to what RCI if offering her loyal guests, and NO free alcohol at all except at the past guest party.

 

 

No broken promises! You can take your own wine on board some lines, when you use your card for purchases the employee thanks you for being a loyal cruiser, champagne in a bucket when you arrive in your cabin, high tea with classical music, more bands around the ship, chocolates on your pillow, free sushi...etc., like I said..."Greener Pastures".

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Me, too! I especially like the fact that they will now have something on ships without a CL or a DL. Our next 2 cruises are on one of those ships, and they are long cruises. So, this is nice to look forward to every night.

 

 

Peggy.........I mentioned this before, check my last response to you.

 

Royal Caribbean needs to clarify what they are going to do on ships that presently do not have a CL. How would I feel as someone that stays in Suites, but am not included in the D and D+ social hour??

 

I believe that the present ships that do not have a CL, and have never served wine, etc for D and D+ will still not serve it.

 

I would like to be the one wrong here!!

 

Rick

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Thanks for your kind words. And actually on my upcoming May Mariner cruise I have already ordered the bubbly for sailaway. Thanks to all the many posters and especially New posters like you jan de bouff who supported our efforts! Yes, lets look forward to a POSITIVE 2009 and many more sailings on RCI.

 

Colleen

 

 

We just re-booked our Voyager Transatlantic for this December! I have to say, the changes came just in the nick of time. We had researched many other TA's and were just about to call NCL to book with them when we read about the proposed changes posted on CC. With renewed faith in the direction that RCCL seems to be taking with its C&A members, we decided to give them another chance. So it is with positive thoughts that we are going forward into 2009, and excitement about the prospect of our 3rd TA with RCCL. Thanks for all your efforts in helping RCCL to recognize the value of repeat cruisers! PS - Great idea, I think we will order some bubbly as well for our balcony sailaway !!! :D

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Peggy.........I mentioned this before, check my last response to you.

 

Royal Caribbean needs to clarify what they are going to do on ships that presently do not have a CL. How would I feel as someone that stays in Suites, but am not included in the D and D+ social hour??

 

I believe that the present ships that do not have a CL, and have never served wine, etc for D and D+ will still not serve it.

 

I would like to be the one wrong here!!

 

Rick

 

Hi, Rick! Yes, I missed your response: busy thread!

 

I'm getting my opinion from some of the wording in Goldstein's letter last night, and they posted this on their C&A site this morning:

 

"A new exclusive nightly event for Diamond and Diamond Plus members to meet and mingle with other fellow members on ships without a Diamond Lounge. This will feature complimentary wine, champagne and a happy hour discount of 25% off all other beverages."

 

(The emphasis is mine).

 

I'm really happy about this one, because we're on the Rhapsody for 33 nights, and I was hoping they would have enough D and D+ on the two cruises to open a satellite lounge. Now, it's part of the program. I'm a single glass of wine type of drinker, and DH only occasionally, so it will be nice to enjoy a little something befor late seating dinner.

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I will give this a go.

 

we're making diamond on 5 cruises. one in an inside, the rest in JS or higher. As short as 2 night, as long as 12 night. So yes, we're using the rules to make our way in the program. But when you see the estimates thrown around of how much money it takes to make diamond, you'll find we're right in line. We spent a LOT of money for those higher cabins. We're far from rich, but we do in fact have more money than time when it comes to travel. So we choose to spend the extra to get the extra credits.

 

Part of my problem with Princess, one of the lines I'll be checking out due to the changes to diamond privileges, is that they do not care how much someone spends. Its all nights at sea or cruises taken. To me the perfect set up for the inside cruiser. And that's not a dig. I am perfectly happy in the inside and will mostly sail them going forward as the chasing the points is no longer worth it with the 'new and improved lesser benefits' the company is offering.

 

So although the cruise count is low, the money spent is in line with most others (the majority) who make that mark. And money is what is really important to the company. Not the number of nights you've done.

 

I see what you're saying but I was asking about loyalty program - with Princess for example after 15 cruises or 150 sea days you become Elite, I guess that's in line with Diamond somewhat. I don't see the Elite program as generous as Diamond status, and harder/longer/more $$ to achieve. I would think 15 cruises or 150 sea days would cost as much if not more that a JS for 4 cruises?

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OK that was one hurdle of many changes. What about reinstating the combination of using stock credit with other offers. At least the balchony room discount. It is not like I am pulling two coupons out of a book and trying to use them both. I invested in their company knowing the stock credit could be used in conjunction of other offers, now that is taken away....oh yeah and the stock is not worth anything now.

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It is unfortunate but I think the horse is out of the barn. The bottom line is there is still no Diamond CL's where clients thought they would be and RCL hung tough. We are not that tied to a CL but where we come from a hand shake is honored. Losing a CL will not cause us to lose sleep but not living up to the hand shake does make us lose faith. To quote Mr.Goldstein's letter: "While we knew the reaction would be negative, it has been more negative than we anticipated"". I appears they knew they were violating hand shakes but they failed to recognize how many would recognize it? There are consequences to bad decisions and most of these could have been avoided by reinstating the CL, apologizing for taking the action without first understanding the effect it would have on it's loyal customer and then taking time to understand what would make loyal customers comfortable. Instead an Executive "patch" was made to the bad decision. Where we had a real good feeling for RC it is now gone and we are opening up our options to other lines or other types of vacations.

RC has gone from being "the Line" to "a Line".

Regarding the ones who attack customers who voice their objections to the ones who were disappointed. They are either looking for attention or being bullies as if you don't have a problem with what happened they don't belong in the same theads with people who do.

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I too have interpreted Mr. Goldstein's letter as ALL ships will have a Happy Hour lounge, if they do not have a Diamond Lounge. This now means ships like Majesty & Vision. I'm hoping that's true and he didn't mean to say ships that do not have a Concierge Lounge. That' s why I sent him an email this morning, asking for clarification on that one issue.

And if that is the case, then it should be for D, D+ and suite guests I would assume.

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(Please excuse the uppercase)

IS IT? WELL, LET'S EVALUATE WHAT TRANSPIRED REGARDING THE REPOSITIONING OF RCI REGARDING THE VALUE OF A DIAMOND STATUS OF A “LOYAL” CUSTOMER.

 

RCI's STATED PROBLEM – “THE SUCCESS OF THE LOYALITY PROGRAM HAS RESULTED IN THE CONSEIRGE LOUNGE BEING OVERWELMED AND THE ‘ORGINAL PURPOSE’ OF THE CL WAS A PERK EXCLUSIVELY FOR SUITE PASSENGERS.”

 

TO ADDRESS THIS LOGISTICS PROBLEM THE INITIAL SOLUTION WAS TO REMOVE THE cl PERK FROM DIAMOND BUT CONTINUE IT FOR DIAMOND PLUS CUSTOMERS. ON LARGER SHIPS, THE DIAMOND LOUNGE WILL REPLACE THE CL FOR DIAMOND AND DIAMOND PLUS PATRONS. tHE cl WILL BE USED EXCLUSILY BY SUITE PASSANGERS.

 

 

AFTER EXPERIENCING THE NEGATIVE REACTION BY THE CUSTOMER BASE, THIS NEW POLICY HAS BEEN MODIFIED.

 

WELL, DIAMOND PASSENGERS, ON THE SMALLER SHIPS, WILL GET A NIGHTLY MEETING PLACE FOR THEM WITH FREE WINE AND CHAMPAGNE. OTHER DRINKS WILL BE AVAILABLE AT A 25% DISCOUNT. NOTE – THIS RECOGNIZES THE OTHER REASON FOR THE INITIAL CHANGE: NEED TO INCREASE REVENUES. (IT IS TOTALLY UNDERSTANDABLE THAT RCI NEEDS TO CUT SOMEWHERE OR GAIN ADDITIONAL REVENUE TO OFFET THE CHALLENGE OF PRICE REDUCTIONS.)

 

THE EASE OF REACHING DIAMOND AND DIAMOND PLUS BY GETTING ONE CRUISE ON A THREE-NIGHTER WHILE A NINE-NIGHTER GETS AN EQUAL VALUE WILL JUST POSTPONE THE VOLUME PROBLEM ON RCI SHIPS. PREDICTION - SOON THE DIAMOND LOUNGE WILL NOT BE ABLE TO HANDLE ALL THE NEW DIAMONDS AND THE NUMBER OF DIAMOND PLUS PASSENGERS WILL CAUSE RCI TO ELIMINATE THE PLUSES FROM THE CL. OF COURSE, IF THIS FIASCO CAUSES ENOUGH RCI “LOYAL” PASSENGERS TO DEFECT, THE OVERCROWDING PROBLEM WILL BE AVOIDED.

 

I UNDERSTAND THE PRESSURE RCI IS UNDER IN TRYING TO MAINTAIN A REASONABLE MARGIN AND HOPE THEIR EFFORTS KEEP RCI AS A QUALITY CRUISE LINE. I WOULD SUGGEST THAT A BETTER METHOD BE EMPLOYED WHEN CHANGE IS REQUIRED RCI AND DOES IT WITH PROPER NOTIFICATION AND RESPECT TO THEIR LOYAL BASE.

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Brilliant. Simply brilliant. I'm buying RCI stock now. These guys know how to "negotiate". This is a classic tactic: say you are taking away a truck load or stuff, then scale back on the cuts: you look like a superstar to your customers. Gov't do it all the time. Mgmt/Unions do it all the time. It seems to work all of the time too.

 

Hats off to the suits. :D

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WE ARE VERY HAPPY with Adam Golstein's announcement. RCI listened and responded...and we believe the offer is sincere and generous.

 

THANK YOU RCI!!!

 

On that note...we have just booked 8 cabins for 2010!!!

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Get over the steak charge already. No one is forcing you to buy the steak just like no one forces you to dine at Johnny Rockets and pay the surcharge. It's a choice. The steak was not even offered in the MDR until a few months ago. Personally I am glad that the complainers are moving on. It's about time.:rolleyes:

 

First of all you should not assume to have the power to command anyone to "Get over" whatever it is that you think they should "get over".

 

Second of all, I don't really give a dam about the steak surcharge I only used it as an example of one of the cutbacks that have diminished the RCCL experience. I could have picked others but I mentioned this.

 

If I posted that they need to address the understaffing of cabin attendants (my actual biggest complaint) I am certain you would have commanded me to "get over" that.

 

You must think it is your position or your duty to patrol for "complainers" and set them all right.

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