NJ Couple Forced Off Allure of Seas ... medical

[xxHadleyxx]

1 hour ago, ShillyShally said:

  But at the end of the day costs make people gamble and then expect a bailout if they gambled wrong.

and therein lies the problem

[ShillyShally]

5 minutes ago, xxHadleyxx said:

and therein lies the problem

100% Agree, the quote I have had forever on my desk is by P J O'Rourke "There is only one basic human right, the right to do as you damn well please.  And with it comes the only basic human duty, the duty to take the consequences."  

[The Sunset Glow]

12 hours ago, Boatdrill said:

And if all went well and they had a great time, they would still be ill prepared, and we wouldn't know a thing about it.  Not everyone is perfectly prepared for trips !  I guarantee the majority of  your fellow passengers aren't well prepared either.  Can we give this couple a break ?  Hopefully their close call will help them (and others) better prepare  for their next trip together.   

 

No they don't get a break. They don't get a pass because they got lucky. You know why? Because they are not taking responsibility for their actions! If they took the gamble and lost but also took responsibility and accepted the consequences then fine. But they didn't - they are crying foul and blaming the cruise line. That does not get a pass in my book.

 

Also, they have been on 16 cruises so they should know the difference - if they were first timers I might give them a break, but they are far from that.

[ONECRUISER]

19 hours ago, SRF said:

 

 

When my mother was removed, my dad went in the ambulance, and I packed a couple of small bags for us, then went to the dock.   The port agent called a cab for me, and while we were waiting, I got to talking to him.  This was Halifax, NS, Canada.

 

There was another person also headed to the hospital, his wife had fallen and broken her collar bone. He had a HUGE stack of luggage (8 night cruise) and spent the whole time complaining about various things.

 

After he left, I asked the port agent about the most people coming off for medical.    He said he was port agent for more than one line.  And one time, he had an NCL ship, that pulled and replaced the gangway SIX times for medical evacs off the ship.  One would get off, they would wait a bit, pull the gangway, get notified of another one, replace the gangway, let those off, then removed it, and ......

 

The port agent was FABULOUS.  After waiting for a while, HE drive me to the hospital.  And actually took my inside and stayed with me until I hooked up with my Dad.  And then gave me his cell number in case I needed any more assistance.

I sail longer sailings with an older crowd, have had many as 3-4 Medical Emergencies each sailing. Have had to speed up to next Port, return to Port, go to alternate Port, several Helo Basket removals while at Sea. Have experienced many missed or Changed Ports/Port times. Been told my luck no one should travel when I do. In a 18 month period air travel had flat Tire(2!), cracked windshield, electronic issue, inop Air Conditioning(In Arizona!) and broke bathroom...

Edited February 27, 2019 by ONECRUISER

[ShillyShally]

2 hours ago, ONECRUISER said:

I sail longer sailings with an older crowd, have had many as 3-4 Medical Emergencies each sailing. Have had to speed up to next Port, return to Port, go to alternate Port, several Helo Basket removals while at Sea. Have experienced many missed or Changed Ports/Port times. Been told my luck no one should travel when I do. In a 18 month period air travel had flat Tire(2!), cracked windshield, electronic issue, inop Air Conditioning(In Arizona!) and broke bathroom...

Please tell me you won't be on Indy next week 😉

[ONECRUISER]

5 minutes ago, ShillyShally said:

Please tell me you won't be on Indy next week 😉

Nope, you are good to go...

[Foodluvr]

3 hours ago, ONECRUISER said:

I sail longer sailings with an older crowd, have had many as 3-4 Medical Emergencies each sailing. Have had to speed up to next Port, return to Port, go to alternate Port, several Helo Basket removals while at Sea. Have experienced many missed or Changed Ports/Port times. Been told my luck no one should travel when I do. In a 18 month period air travel had flat Tire(2!), cracked windshield, electronic issue, inop Air Conditioning(In Arizona!) and broke bathroom...

I think you and I have similar luck!  In one trip we had: delayed flight, lost luggage, hotel fire, forgot keys at hotel and realized at the airport, plane issues causing flight delay, no AC on cross country trip, watched suicide by jumping in front of train from terminal to baggage, no keys to get car and call to locksmith at 5 AM after cross country red eye w no keys for car or house.  This was our honeymoon.. Yes, still married!!

[ShillyShally]

14 minutes ago, Foodluvr said:

I think you and I have similar luck!  In one trip we had: delayed flight, lost luggage, hotel fire, forgot keys at hotel and realized at the airport, plane issues causing flight delay, no AC on cross country trip, watched suicide by jumping in front of train from terminal to baggage, no keys to get car and call to locksmith at 5 AM after cross country red eye w no keys for car or house.  This was our honeymoon.. Yes, still married!!

Ha, WOW, well when you have that start off in a marriage how could you not stay together? 🙂

[ONECRUISER]

58 minutes ago, Foodluvr said:

I think you and I have similar luck!  In one trip we had: delayed flight, lost luggage, hotel fire, forgot keys at hotel and realized at the airport, plane issues causing flight delay, no AC on cross country trip, watched suicide by jumping in front of train from terminal to baggage, no keys to get car and call to locksmith at 5 AM after cross country red eye w no keys for car or house.  This was our honeymoon.. Yes, still married!!

Wow, don't know which is worse all at once or a hiccup each trip. Also had plane slid off getting stuck in snow. Good thing we were flying in day ahead. One piece Luggage did get lost, though made it to our Miami Hotel in am before leaving for Pier. Same trip my Wife didn't bring any ID. I got her on Delta Flight and our ship with just her Birth Cert, Marriage Licence. Was post 9/11, not sure if me being Military with ID helped... Since then have always put half of everything in each bag, one gets lost not as bad.

Edited February 27, 2019 by ONECRUISER

[ShillyShally]

10 minutes ago, ONECRUISER said:

Wow, don't know which is worse all at once or a hiccup each trip. Also had plane slid off getting stuck in snow. Good thing we were flying in day ahead. One piece Luggage did get lost, though made it to our Miami Hotel in am before leaving for Pier. Same trip my Wife didn't bring any ID. I got her on Delta Flight and our ship with just her Birth Cert, Marriage Licence. Was post 9/11, not sure if me being Military with ID helped... Since then have always put half of everything in each bag, one gets lost not as bad.

Military probably helped, I know when DH was in law enforcement that always helped!  Now I think I stick copies in everything in every bag!  

 

And thank you for your service!

[nelblu]

6 hours ago, ShillyShally said:

And there are still HMO and POS plans that have restrictive network and limited to no out-of-network coverage so that could be it too.  But if that was the case they'd really need additional coverage when going out of the area.  But at the end of the day costs make people gamble and then expect a bailout if they gambled wrong.

 

More likely that there's no coverage outside the US.  We have a Plan F in conjunction with Medicare which covers 80% outside the US.  In addition, my CC covers to an extent outside the US.

[ShillyShally]

2 minutes ago, nelblu said:

 

More likely that there's no coverage outside the US.  We have a Plan F in conjunction with Medicare which covers 80% outside the US.  In addition, my CC covers to an extent outside the US.

Good information!  I fully admit the Medicare marketplace is daunting to anyone facing it, I have helped many retiring employees navigate the waters and still never feel like I can know enough and only hope to be well informed when I get there!

[AlanF65]

14 hours ago, Saltdog said:

 

 

I'll just expand on this a bit. Not buying insurance doesn't make you irresponsible per se, but someone who doesn't get it and is a responsible person will accept the consequences and not blame someone else. I don't buy the insurance usually, but again, that's my risk if something happens, and you'll never hear me complain about it if it does. 😎

 

My first response to the actions and reactions of these two in the article contains a few words that are unprintable in polite company. 

 

I consider someone taking responsibility for what happens without insurance as self insured. That is a risk reward calculation and I would assume a self insured had the wherewithal to cover the costs or live with the consequences.

 

But I would never expect that if I ended up in San Francisco general hospital emergency room that they don't have any contracts with any insurance companies so all services are out of network and if my Medicare Advantage sends them 6k and they want 15 I am on the hook for 9k. https://www.sfchronicle.com/politics/article/SF-supervisors-ask-city-s-General-Hospital-why-13634951.php

 

So even in the US you don't want to end up in some emergency rooms.

A-

 

 

 

[nelblu]

1 hour ago, ShillyShally said:

Good information!  I fully admit the Medicare marketplace is daunting to anyone facing it, I have helped many retiring employees navigate the waters and still never feel like I can know enough and only hope to be well informed when I get there!

 

Fortunately, I worked for the largest Benefit Consulting Firm.  Also, my wife worked as a Medical Secretary and had a lot of insight to the various medical insurance companies and their reimbursement policies in NJ.

 

Still when I retired, I had to educate and attend seminars before deciding on the type of policies.

Edited February 27, 2019 by nelblu

[ShillyShally]

25 minutes ago, nelblu said:

 

Fortunately, I worked for the largest Benefit Consulting Firm.  Also, my wife worked as a Medical Secretary and had a lot of insight to the various medical insurance companies and their reimbursement policies in NJ.

 

Still when I retired, I had to educate and attend seminars before deciding on the type of policies.

I expect I'll be doing similarly along the way!  And with the ever changing healthcare market who knows what I'll learn, re-learn, un-learn and learn again!

[nelblu]

1 hour ago, ShillyShally said:

I expect I'll be doing similarly along the way!  And with the ever changing healthcare market who knows what I'll learn, re-learn, un-learn and learn again!

 

The annual re-enrollment booklet from Medicare is helpful, but very limited.  There's so much investigation to be done with regards to costs for any supplemental plans and RX plans.  Fortunately, with RX plans we meet with our local Pharmacist and he loads up our RX history plus premiums charged by the provider and arrive at a very educated decision. 

[ShillyShally]

13 hours ago, nelblu said:

 

The annual re-enrollment booklet from Medicare is helpful, but very limited.  There's so much investigation to be done with regards to costs for any supplemental plans and RX plans.  Fortunately, with RX plans we meet with our local Pharmacist and he loads up our RX history plus premiums charged by the provider and arrive at a very educated decision. 

I feel in some ways I'm starting now for my husband and myself by helping fellow employees retiring.  I just feel fortunate to understand the language of benefits!  I too recommend for those needing to choose Med D Rx Plans that they talk to their pharmacist on which one plays the best with that pharmacy and the drugs they take because everyone these days seems to offer a Med D plan!

[40yearcruiser]

On 2/26/2019 at 6:47 PM, AnnaNicole said:

Is your policy just for medivac?  Does it cover medical expenses?  Is it primary over your health insurance plan?

 

Where did you purchase your policy?

 

TIA

The policy we bought does not cover medical expenses but will cover medical evacuation by helicopter, plane, or ambulance worldwide. It also offers assistance in planning the evacuation and also covers transportation for those traveling with you. It pays after any medical insurance, so is basically catastrophic coverage. Thankfully we haven't had to use it so no personal experience with it yet, but have been on ships four times when there have been helicopter evacuations of passengers or crew and know those must have cost a fortune. Also on one transatlantic our ship diverted to Bermuda where it anchored offshore and a medical evacuation boat came out to pick up a passenger and his family. Scary stuff! Our policy is with MASA, website masaglobal.com  and we have the Medical Transport Solutions lifetime policy. It's pricey but if we ever need it overseas I'm sure it will pay for itself. Like all insurance, you hope to never need it.

[AnnaNicole]

37 minutes ago, 40yearcruiser said:

The policy we bought does not cover medical expenses but will cover medical evacuation by helicopter, plane, or ambulance worldwide. It also offers assistance in planning the evacuation and also covers transportation for those traveling with you. It pays after any medical insurance, so is basically catastrophic coverage. Thankfully we haven't had to use it so no personal experience with it yet, but have been on ships four times when there have been helicopter evacuations of passengers or crew and know those must have cost a fortune. Also on one transatlantic our ship diverted to Bermuda where it anchored offshore and a medical evacuation boat came out to pick up a passenger and his family. Scary stuff! Our policy is with MASA, website masaglobal.com  and we have the Medical Transport Solutions lifetime policy. It's pricey but if we ever need it overseas I'm sure it will pay for itself. Like all insurance, you hope to never need it.

Thanks for the info   🙂

[Ombud]

On 2/25/2019 at 2:18 PM, DaniDanielle said:

I find it hard to believe that Medical threw them off the ship.  If they couldn’t help them leaving the ship sounds like the only option.

 

Her statement was: "He (MD) told me I could have a heart attack or I could bleed out ... and I needed a blood transfusion and they had no facilities to do a blood transfusion, so he wanted me to get to a hospital," Carol said" 

 

Can you imagine the backlash if he tried to treat something he did not have facilities for and SHE DIED! 

 

Headlines: passenger bled to death on cruise ship - MD ignored warning signs

 

it is regrettable that they did not have travelers insurance, pitfalls of self insuring

Edited February 28, 2019 by Ombud

[South Shore 41]

My husband and I are 20 years younger than this couple and we both have health issues. You wouldn't know it if you saw us because we try to keep an active and healthy lifestyle. However for the last 5 years whenever we go on a trip, we always purchase travel insurance.  The medication I am on lowers my white blood cell count so it is harder to for me to fight infection.  I've read several other threads regarding Noro and Flu breakouts and I had a discussion with my doctor about this seeing that we will be my upcoming cruising in April.  He said to me, you can't live in a bubble for the rest of your life and we made a "game plan".  That being said, internal bleeding is a very serious and potentially deadly condition. And to be honest, the price they would have paid for travel insurance would have be less that what they had to spend trying to get back home.  I've never had to use travel insurance, thank God, but its there if needed.  

  

[crewsweeper]

Haven't been through all the posts here, but Costa Maya does not have a hospital. Nearest could have been in Playa del Carmen. But maybe Cancun was all they could say to the taxi driver.

 

What I see in poor travel arrangements is a panicking elderly couple, who may or may not should have been cruising in the first place, if her condition was so serious.  They were frantic.  Perhaps some one in their party could have stayed with them or assisted. 

 

Had they stayed on board, she could have died.  Then what? 

 

The highway from Costa Maya to Playa is NOT dangerous, gets travelled all the time by tourists heading south and to various ruins.  Level 2 Warning just says, "hey folks be careful out there, don't venture off the main path. "

Edited February 28, 2019 by crewsweeper

[Itchy&Scratchy]

On 2/26/2019 at 10:33 AM, momofmab said:

Unless I was unconscious, I would gamble with trying to get back to the US also.  No way I'd want to be treated for a serious condition in Mexico.

 

I've posted on CC before about my dad being put off the ship by NCL in Samana, DR (10+ years ago) because he was diagnosed with pneumonia.  He spent two weeks in an open-air "clinic" before they would release him to travel back to the US. 

DR is very different from Mexico, apparently. And yeah, with a bleeding ulcer you could become unconscious within minutes.

[Baron Barracuda]

Well, they were back on tv this morning (NJ news 12) relishing their 5 minutes in the spotlight and still insisting  Royal done them wrong and they deserve an apology.    The new video reveals that they did have travel insurance but it didn't cover everything.

 

http://newjersey.news12.com/story/40026167/couple-says-they-were-left-stranded-in-mexico-after-being-kicked-off-cruise-ship

 

  Love the first reader comment following the article:

"Dear Passenger, We apologize for you having a medical emergency we couldn't correct, and rather than having you die on our ship, we arranged your transfer to a hospital... which you then ignored and instead risked returning to the US directly. In the future, should such an event happen again, we'll take you out to sea and push you overboard. Better for everyone."

[DragonOfTheSeas]

I have never purchased my travel insurance through RCL.  However, We were on the Jewel of the Seas TA in November. [leaving Civitavecchia]  Our travel companion fell in the lobby of the hotel on the morning of embarkation.  The hotel called an ambulance, but he would not go to the hospital.  He hit the wall as he fell backwards and had a small cut on the ear.  The medics put some type of glue on it and it stopped bleeding.  

 

After boarding the ship he waited until around 4pm and then went to the DR on the ship.  [getting stiff and just wanted to be checked out] Since he was on a blood thinner they told him he had to go to the hospital. [could not sail]  It had been 8 hrs since the fall, but the hospital in Civ transferred him to Rome for 24 hr observation.  The Ship sent a crew member that spoke Italian ashore with them to help them out.  

 

One thing I thought that was interesting was that she had to pay for her own ticket home, but had to get RCL to place the order.  She told me she felt she could have done better on the flight on her own.  However, RCL insurance paid for his ticket home and the 3 nights in the hotel waiting for seats on a plane home.