Nonrefundable Cruise Deposit - Really???

[Anchors Away]

25 minutes ago, jelayne said:

Since they have shortened  not cancelled your cruise what did the TA tell you the fare for the shortened cruise will be?  and are they offering any OBC  or FCC for sticking with the  shortened itinerary? 
I would think that everyone who was booked still has their original cabin until they advise X what they want to do.  
 

Since your can’t change your time off maybe you could stay a few days at a nice resort or spa before you board the shortened cruise; making lemonade out of lemons.

I wondered if our reservation would be automatically moved to the 4-day cruise so I signed on to my account on the Celebrity website. It says I have 0 reservations. Our travel agent didn't mention the price for the four day cruise so I researched it myself. Our original cabin has been booked by someone else but there is one similar cabin near it still available.

 

There has been no mention of a FCC at all but I imagine the $200 OBC offered in the email would be applicable if we rebook the four day cruise. Your suggestion of a resort stay before the shortened cruise is not a bad idea we may consider however the price for the 4-day cruise is much higher than a trip to the Bahamas is worth to me.

[NMTraveller]

Bahamas is a less desirable port for me also.

[jelayne]

The price may not be what you would pay as a new booking.    We had a 7 day cruise cancelled for a charter and one of the options was a 9 day cruise for the price of the 7 day.  
Celebrity doesn’t want to start from scratch trying to fill a ship.  I looked and it is pretty empty right now.  It looks like they have blocked  many of the.

cabins that hold 3 or 4  but when I put in 3 passengers vs 2 most of the blocked ones are available and the cabins for 2 are blocked.

[JaneStarr]

1 hour ago, Anchors Away said:

{{Snip}}}

 

I have done a little research on travel insurance and I don't see any mention of reimbursement for 'shortened'  vacations.

 

I appreciate those of you who suggested emailing the company. If the answer we receive is not good news, we will definitely email, call, write letters, etc. but I hope it doesn't come to this. I will let you know when we hear back concerning our deposit.

 

Thank you for all your input.

 

Anchors Away

It’s too bad that the refund issue had to be escalated, but I’m confident Celebrity will (eventually) do the right thing by you.  Celebrity’s front line customer service often seems not to be fully informed about these types of issues.

 

As far as trip insurance, if you don’t end up taking  vacation during the timeframe covered by your policy, check with the agent or issuer about getting a credit to be applied to a policy on a different trip. I understand some insurers unofficially allow this, upon request.

 

We had an Azamara booking chartered out from us after we had independently purchased trip insurance (through tripinsurance store dot com). Steve, from the Trip Insurance Store, got the provider (Travel Guard) to issue us a voucher towards a policy for a future trip. It had an expiration date,  but it was at least 2yrs in the future.

 

I actually just redeemed the voucher for a land trip we are taking in February.

Jane

[cynalan]

I am a travel agent and can definitely tell you that if Celebrity cancelled your cruise, you are entitled to a full refund of your deposit. If you have not received it or Celebrity is balking, sorry... but time to get a new travel agent. He/she is doing his/her job.

 

 

Edited October 20, 2019 by cynalan

[jelayne]

1 hour ago, cynalan said:

I am a travel agent and can definitely tell you that if Celebrity cancelled your cruise, you are entitled to a full refund of your deposit. If you have not received it or Celebrity is balking, sorry... but time to get a new travel agent. He/she is doing his/her job.

 

 

According to the info tge OP posted a few hours ago the cruise was not cancelled it was “shortened” from 8 night to 4.  What happens when a cruise is shortened?

[NMTraveller]

5 minutes ago, jelayne said:

According to the info tge OP posted a few hours ago the cruise was not cancelled it was “shortened” from 8 night to 4.  What happens when a cruise is shortened?

Sounds like legal bs to me.  I was thinking that they had less of an obligation to the customer in the contract.

[Anchors Away]

43 minutes ago, NMTraveller said:

Sounds like legal bs to me.  I was thinking that they had less of an obligation to the customer in the contract.

 

NMTraveller:

 

I am thinking the same thing. If they shortened the cruise but did not cancel it, I am concerned that may mean they don''t have to refund the deposit. There is a cruise still available to us that week, just not the one we booked. I am trying to keep a positive attitude until Wednesday but I am concerned. The email they sent doesn't have the word cancelled in it anywhere and I didn't even notice that until I re-read it today to answer questions people asked me here on this thread. I guess I have to wait and see.

 

 

[cynalan]

2 hours ago, jelayne said:

According to the info tge OP posted a few hours ago the cruise was not cancelled it was “shortened” from 8 night to 4.  What happens when a cruise is shortened?

 

Changing a cruise from 8 days to 4 days is breaking the contract that the cruise line had with their client as it is a fundamental change to the expected deliverable through no fault of the client. The client has the right to a full refund if they are unhappy with the change. If your travel agent is not getting a satisfactory answer with the Celebrity rep they should escalate to their regional development manager for assistance. The OP said "big box travel agent". If that means somewhere like Costco... good luck, all bets are off. I am not sure where the OP is located but in Ontario, Canada there are very precise rules that cover a situation such as this.

 

Edited October 21, 2019 by cynalan

[ldubs]

13 hours ago, jelayne said:

If cruise lines could not charter ship once they take a deposit by a passenger then it would seem fair that all deposits would be non-refundable  and  no price drops before final payment would be allowed.  

 

I honestly don't know. It is a possible outcome, though I would suspect the cruise lines would not drop the option of refundable fares.   It really would be up to them. 

 

All I can say is what does seem fair to me is that someone with a valid booking doesn't get bumped because someone else comes along who will pay more.   

 

Anyway,  just a friendly side discussion.  The one thing we can all agree on is the OP should get 100% refund of the deposit.  

 

 

[TeeRick]

15 hours ago, Anchors Away said:

We are researching other cruise lines and land based vacations to celebrate our anniversary. It may be on a tug boat or in a tent since Celebrity is sitting on $900.00 of our vacation money. 🤑

 

On a positive note, we are blessed this is the first time this has happened to us. We have been cruising together for 18 years. When I had a better job with more vacation time, we cruised twice a year and then my husband would take a third cruise with his kids and grandkids each year. So we have been fortunate to enjoy 18 years of vacations before we were unceremoniously uninvited by Celebrity. And we are only 6 years from retirement when our schedules will become flexible and a reschedule will not be a problem.

Have you cruised Celebrity before?  Are you a member of the Captain's Club?  Sometimes a quick telephone call to their dedicated line gets things resolved quickly.  You are in the right on this.  If you know your reservation id number then just call them.  Go around the big box TA who has not resolved this for you.

[Iamthesea]

14 hours ago, cynalan said:

I am a travel agent and can definitely tell you that if Celebrity cancelled your cruise, you are entitled to a full refund of your deposit. If you have not received it or Celebrity is balking, sorry... but time to get a new travel agent. He/she is doing his/her job.

 

 

I agree!  And you should not have to wait until Wednesday to receive an answer!!!

 

BTW-  The $900 deposit is for a cruise that is longer - 10 days and up.  A deposit for a shorter cruise is less.  At the least, you should get back some of your deposit because the cruise was shortened to 4 nights.

 

"Deposit requirements vary based on length of cruise and number of guests per stateroom. Generally, deposit guidelines for double occupancy staterooms are $200 per stateroom for 1 to 5 night cruises, $500 per stateroom for 6 to 9 night cruises and $900 per stateroom for 10 night or longer cruises."

Edited October 21, 2019 by Iamthesea

[Fouremco]

13 hours ago, cynalan said:

The OP said "big box travel agent". If that means somewhere like [redacted]... good luck, all bets are off. 

We've used the big box to book numerous cruises ever since it opened its travel arm in Canada and have had nothing but very positive experiences with them. In addition to bookings, we've had cancellations, re-faring and other changes made without any issues. Based on hundreds of positive posts on Cruise Critic as well as our personal experience, I have no reason to believe that they don't act as responsible and effective representatives for its customers as you seem to suggest.

[mitz18]

13 hours ago, Anchors Away said:

 

NMTraveller:

 

I am thinking the same thing. If they shortened the cruise but did not cancel it, I am concerned that may mean they don''t have to refund the deposit. There is a cruise still available to us that week, just not the one we booked. I am trying to keep a positive attitude until Wednesday but I am concerned. The email they sent doesn't have the word cancelled in it anywhere and I didn't even notice that until I re-read it today to answer questions people asked me here on this thread. I guess I have to wait and see.

 

 

 

It is possible that X will not consider the cruise cancelled but changed (which is probably “allowed” in the terms).  If so, they are not bound to refund the deposit.  However if so, I would tell/demand your TA fight for OBC and future credits from X. The lines normally protect themselves from every conceivable event, but also want to keep customers; so will usually give something for inconvenience.

[bEwAbG]

The contract allows them to change the ports, but it doesn't allow them to fundamentally alter the product, like lopping off days.  The OP bought an 8-night vacation.  Celebrity turning it into a 4-night is not what was purchased.

[Redtravel]

Absolutely wrong.  Unfortunately, Celebrity has changed. Sadly, it is not getting better.  The more that I read about changes and cutbacks, the less I am thinking about booking on Celebrity.  With lots of vacation choices, I hope that you find a vacation to celebrate your anniversary.  Hope that you get your money.  Happy Anniversary!

[GeorgesGal]

21 hours ago, Anchors Away said:

Of course we are hoping for the best possible outcome when we hear back from the travel agent sometime before Wednesday. I was just so surprised when I learned Celebrity could change our vacation plans and call our deposit nonrefundable.

 

Some of you have asked questions that made me go back and read the email we got notifying us of the change in itinerary. It is worded so oddly, I had to read it a couple of times. Here is what it says:

 

'Please be advised the Celebrity Equinox has been chartered for a 4-night sailing departing on May 27, 2020. Due to this charter, the 8-night Eastern Caribbean & Bahamas sailing departing May 23, 2020 has been shortened to a 4-night Bahamas cruise.'

 

Interesting that they use the word 'shortened' not 'cancelled'. This concerns me that they are playing word games in order to not refund our deposit. The email doesn't say our room is still reserved on the 4-night cruise, but it also doesn't say it isn't.

 

The next paragraph says that if we are interested in similar itineraries, they suggest moving our reservation to a 10-night Southern Caribbean cruise on May 13 or the same 8-night Caribbean itinerary we were on for June 6 or June 20. If we selected one of the three listed options, we would get a $300 on board credit and if we re-booked any other sailing the OBC would be $200.00.

 

Of course the problem is my inflexible work vacation. The week beginning May 23, 2020 is the only time I will have off until 2021. Unfortunately moving to one of their suggested alternatives or any other Celebrity cruise in 2020 is not an option unless my husband wants to travel alone.

 

I have done a little research on travel insurance and I don't see any mention of reimbursement for 'shortened'  vacations.

 

I appreciate those of you who suggested emailing the company. If the answer we receive is not good news, we will definitely email, call, write letters, etc. but I hope it doesn't come to this. I will let you know when we hear back concerning our deposit.

 

Thank you for all your input.

 

Anchors Away

 

Anchors, I don't see any mention of a reduction in the cruise fare from what you paid for an eight day cruise to the 'reduced' four day cruise.  Was this option not covered in their notification?  

 

Here's what I'm seeing upon reading the notification and Celebrity's non refundable deposit.  You have had your original cruise shortened and you can opt for either taking that four day cruise or any of the other options mentioned by Celebrity.  Failure to take one of these 'options', Celebrity feels entitled to keeping your deposit.  We (Celebrity) have made several suggestions to 'make you whole' and you have turned them down, therefore we will keep your NRD.

 

Despicable, yes; but could actually be legal.  (And please don't flame me - I do not agree with this tactic at all.)

 

Donna

 

[mitz18]

 

17 hours ago, Anchors Away said:

 

NMTraveller:

 

I am thinking the same thing. If they shortened the cruise but did not cancel it, I am concerned that may mean they don''t have to refund the deposit. There is a cruise still available to us that week, just not the one we booked. I am trying to keep a positive attitude until Wednesday but I am concerned. The email they sent doesn't have the word cancelled in it anywhere and I didn't even notice that until I re-read it today to answer questions people asked me here on this thread. I guess I have to wait and see.

 

 

 

Anchors - just as info, the following is from Celebrity's Ticket Contract:

Carrier may for any reason at any time and without prior notice, cancel, advance, postpone or deviate from any scheduled sailing, port of call, destination, lodging or any activity on or off the Vessel, or substitute another vessel or port of call, destination, lodging or activity. 
 

And this is from RCL:

 

In the event of strikes, lockouts, riots, weather conditions or mechanical difficulties, or for any other reason whatsoever, Royal Caribbean® may, at any time and without prior notice, cancel, advance, postpone or deviate from any scheduled sailing or port of call and may, but is not obliged to, substitute another ship or port of call and shall not be liable for any loss whatsoever to guests by reason of such cancellation, advancement, postponement, deviation or substitution. Royal Caribbean® shall not be responsible for any failure to adhere to the arrival and departure times published in this brochure for any of its ports of call.

 

I presume various forms of this language is standard in the industry. Basically, "We can do what we want for any reason...."

 

[bEwAbG]

The last two posts are unnecessarily alarmist.  Celebrity will do what they always do and give a full refund, unless the OP wants to move the booking to another trip.

Edited October 21, 2019 by bEwAbG

[mitz18]

42 minutes ago, bEwAbG said:

The last two posts are unnecessarily alarmist.  Celebrity will do what they always do and give a full refund, unless the OP wants to move the booking to another trip.

Not being an alarmist in fact I said “just as info”.  OP asked for info so I passed it along. 

[Fouremco]

Any experienced cruise passengers is well aware of the contractual provisions allowing cruise lines to modify a cruise. As NCL passengers recently learned, that includes missing scheduled ports, but none of the contracts state that a cruise can be arbitrarily reduced in duration by 50%. While it might ultimately be left to the courts to render a decision, it's clear that Celebrity has cancelled the original cruise, not modified it within the provisions of the contract.

[NMTraveller]

5 hours ago, Fouremco said:

Any experienced cruise passengers is well aware of the contractual provisions allowing cruise lines to modify a cruise. As NCL passengers recently learned, that includes missing scheduled ports, but none of the contracts state that a cruise can be arbitrarily reduced in duration by 50%. While it might ultimately be left to the courts to render a decision, it's clear that Celebrity has cancelled the original cruise, not modified it within the provisions of the contract.

The Sept 9th Edge sailing was also rerouted on two different ports due to weather.  A couple of the ports were on different days. First time in 10 cruises we were juggling ports.

But OPs problem was caused by Celebrity not weather.

Edited October 22, 2019 by NMTraveller

[abbydancer2003]

I'm not sure the problem isn't with the Big Box Agency.  I know what the contract says, but we had a ship redeployed from under us and X was quite reasonable.  Full refund or price protection onto a similar cruise.  (and it was for 2021, but the price protection included 2020).  

 

I know it wasn't completely cancelled, but I still think there's something wrong here.

 

[RickT]

Hoping the OP comes back today to report what happened.  Very curious to see if the issue was with their TA or Celebrity and whether or not the reduction in Days is a valid reason for X not to refund the deposit.

[barbette165]

This is from the T&Cs on the UK site

 

Occasionally, we have to make changes to the brochure and other details both before, and after, bookings have been confirmed and, even more rarely, cancel confirmed bookings. There may be a requirement to carry out maintenance/building works on your cruise/hotel. Where the works are likely to seriously impair your holiday, we will notify you as soon as possible. Occasionally we may also be forced to cancel a U.S. back to back cruise due to local legal restrictions preventing us from allowing you to travel on this basis but will endeavour to advise you promptly after making such a booking if this is necessary (see Frequently Asked Questions, What about Consecutive Cruises?).

Whilst we always endeavour to avoid changes and cancellations, we must reserve the right to do so. If we have to make a significant change or cancel, we will tell you as soon as possible. If there is time to do so before departure, we will offer you the choice of the following options:- 

(a)    (for significant changes) accepting the changed arrangements or 

(b)    purchasing an alternative holiday from us, of a similar standard to that originally booked if available. We will offer you at least one alternative holiday of equivalent or higher standard for which you will not be asked to pay any more than the price of the original holiday. If this holiday is in fact cheaper than the original one, we will refund the price difference. If you do not wish to accept the holiday we specifically offer you, you may choose any of our other then available holidays. You must pay the applicable price of any such holiday. This will mean you paying more if it is more expensive or receiving a refund if it is cheaper. 

(c)    cancelling or accepting the cancellation in which case you will receive a full and quick refund of all monies you have paid to us within 14 days of such cancellation. 

Please note, the above options are not available where any change made is a minor one. 

What is a significant change? 

A significant change is a change to your confirmed holiday, which we can reasonably expect will have a significant effect on it. Examples of significant and minor (defined below) changes are as follows: 

Significant change: Examples include a cruise itinerary change from two days port of calls to two days at sea instead; a change in UK departure airport (excluding changes between local airports) and a change in the time of your outbound flight by more than 12 hours on a 14 night holiday. 

 

Their definition of significant change are certainly less than the changes to the OPs cruise.  Also they say 'refund of all monies' which will include the deposit, which is normally non-refundable in the UK.