SS Future Re-Open Plan: Timing, Testing Needs??!!

[jollyjones]

It's already happened.

 

France. If you want to go ashore.

[les37b]

14 minutes ago, jollyjones said:

It's already happened.

 

France. If you want to go ashore.

 

Croatia and Austria were the first to attach an expiry date to double vaccinations (at 270 days) and it was certainly that last August.

 

It did take a while, but the NHS vaccine certificate (via the app) does now show Double and booster dates and type..... So I'm good to go for a few weeks at least. (Had my booster on 30 September - so I'm guessing a 4th would be required for Japan in May next year.)

Edited December 15, 2021 by les37b

[crusinbanjo]

On 12/11/2021 at 2:56 PM, jimdee3636 said:

Terry:

 

You're not alone in being "negative and pessimistic." My wife and I, veterans of about thirty cruises---six of them transatlantics and several more wholly within Europe---recently cancelled cruises that had starting or ending ports in Lisbon, Buenos Aires, and Lima. Instead, we booked new ones that begin and end in U.S. ports. Will they be as interesting? Maybe not, but the hassle factor will be infinitely lower. Thoreau said that people should "simplify, simplify." Then or now, simplifying one's life seems like the way to go.

 

Jim

My sentiments , exactly!  Mrs Banjo and I have also canceled our cruising plans for 2022.  We were booked to cruise in Norway and also from Rome to Barcelona next year, but decided to cancel because of all the changing requirements and added paperwork, testing, etc.  We have been cruising and traveling internationally since 1990, so we are feeling like, until things calm down, it's time to see more of the USA

[turtlemichael]

On 12/15/2021 at 8:52 AM, CJANDH said:

How long before the booster shot becomes mandatory for cruising?

Not only the current booster. Having just had Silver Muse's Australian season cancelled, our next cruise is booked for January 2023, 13 months away. We've had the booster jab and we are fully expecting that we will have had to had two more "boosters" before we get on board our next cruise. This is the new life.

[cruiseej]

It's not at all clear yet whether protection after a third shot will drop off as precipitously as it does after the second shot. It may not be necessary to keep getting shots every six months. Time will tell.  

[les37b]

I'm no longer taking bets on my 3 Jan Panama cruise going ahead. France has completely banned the UK a few days ago and Germany have now imposed a 14 day quarantine for UK arrivals. It's only a matter of time before everywhere else follows suit Im sure.

 

With talks of a other lockdown coming (I've heard 5th Jan and 26th Dec mentioned).... And now rumours it could be pre Christmas. Ho Ho bloody Ho.

 

 

[TLCOhio]

14 hours ago, rkacruiser said:

I am unsure that we have made much progress since mid-March of 2020.  More "tools" are in the toolbox, of course.  Yet, the uncertainty of what to do outside one's "cave" remains.  

 

Good luck to Les in working out (which ever way it goes) for your January Panama cruise.  Not knowing for certain is not fun.  Yes, agree that we have more "tools" since March 2020, but what to do next?  It keeps getting more challenging and confusing. Right?    

 

From the New York Times Travel Section this past week, they had this headline: “On Cruise Ships, Omicron Puts Safety Protocols to the Test" with this sub-headline: "Many lines are adjusting their masking, testing and vaccine rules, while criticism is mounting about the lack of transparency in reporting positive cases to passengers and crew members.”

 

Here are some of their story highlights: “Since the cruise industry restarted operations in the United States this June, its efforts to keep the coronavirus at bay — or at least contained, unlike the major outbreaks experienced in 2020 — have been largely successful. Most cruise companies mandate full vaccinations for crew and most passengers, and have implemented strict health and safety protocols to swiftly identify coronavirus cases onboard and reduce their spread.  But in recent months, as new and highly contagious variants have emerged and case numbers steadily increase worldwide, these measures are being put to the test. Many lines are adjusting their masking, testing and vaccine rules, while criticism is mounting about the lack of transparency in reporting positive cases to passengers and crew members during sailings.”

 

Here is more from this NYT story: "Most cruise companies do not publicly announce the number of coronavirus cases identified during sailings, but all cruise ships operating to and from U.S. ports must submit daily numbers to the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention, which uses a color-coded system to inform the public whether the number of cases is above or below the agency’s threshold for an investigation. Sharing this data is one of many requirements in the Framework for Conditional Sailing Order, a series of C.D.C. guidelines that cruise companies must follow to operate in U.S. waters.  With the rise of Delta and Omicron variants, and as the virus surges across the world, cruise lines have been adjusting their health and safety protocols, reinstating measures like mask mandates and requiring additional testing from passengers."

 

Full story at:

https://www.nytimes.com/2021/12/15/travel/cruise-ships-coronavirus.html

 

THANKS!  Enjoy!  Terry in Ohio

 

Sydney to NZ/Auckland Adventure, live/blog 2014 sampling/details with many exciting visuals and key highlights.  On page 23, post #571, see a complete index for all of the pictures, postings.  Now at 234,589 views.

www.boards.cruisecritic.com/showthread.php?t=1974139

[tosteve1]

I’m triple vaxxed and still got Covid last week. Still in isolation but really just cold symptoms. Bourbon helps.  I got it from an unvaccinated family member with mild symptoms. I suspect Omicron as she had previously had Covid. I’m kind of glad to get this little booster before our February Panama Canal cruise! I believe we all have a date with covid as it becomes endemic and, hopefully, most folks experience will be mild.

[worldtraveller99]

SS have just emailed to me that I should upload my vaccine certificate onto My Silversea before we travel, which I will do after Christmas, because I will ask the NHS to post ours to me then (we have just had our boosters and I want those to show on the certificates).

 

So I guess they have gone vaccinated people only? I am crossing my fingers that Omicron peaks in January so we can still travel in March and again in July?

 

[Lois R]

1 hour ago, Silver Spectre said:

Terry, why on earth are they allowing unvaccinated people onboard? It’s a recipe for disaster.

I was reading that story this morning.........I didn't even realize they had decided to sail with a full ship.

6,000 on board.........YIKES!!!!!!!

[TLCOhio]

2 minutes ago, Lois R said:

I was reading that story this morning.........I didn't even realize they had decided to sail with a full ship.  6,000 on board.........YIKES!!!!!!!

 

Yes, Lois, 6,000 passengers is lots and LOTS!!  Plus, all of the staff, etc.  For Mr. Silver, those not vaccinated could include some children too young to get the shot, a few who have legitimate medical reasons not have it, etc.  There are always a few who have reasonable exemptions.  

 

THANKS!  Enjoy!  Terry in Ohio

[silkismom]

How do you upload the vax info--I don't know where to look on My Silversea.

[Lois R]

9 minutes ago, silkismom said:

How do you upload the vax info--I don't know where to look on My Silversea.

Hi, on Mysliversea, your cruises should be listed. Under each sailing there is a "Document" field. Depending on when you sail, there will be one that says "Vaccination Form" (or something like that).

Once that field is there, you can upload your vax card and submit it.   The field usually shows up a few weeks before the cruise. 

 

It may actually say "Covid Card".  But it won't be there when you book a cruise. It shows a few weeks before you sail.

[silkismom]

Thank you Lois. I'll keep looking for it.

[Lois R]

6 minutes ago, silkismom said:

Thank you Lois. I'll keep looking for it.

Glad to help🙂

[silkismom]

Lois, thanks again. I found it and managed to scan our cards and upload them.

[Lois R]

29 minutes ago, silkismom said:

Lois, thanks again. I found it and managed to scan our cards and upload them.

Awesome!😃👍

[Catlover54]

3 hours ago, TLCOhio said:

 

Yes, Lois, 6,000 passengers is lots and LOTS!!  Plus, all of the staff, etc.  For Mr. Silver, those not vaccinated could include some children too young to get the shot, a few who have legitimate medical reasons not have it, etc.  There are always a few who have reasonable exemptions.  

 

THANKS!  Enjoy!  Terry in Ohio

 

And, much as we seniors hate to admit it and prefer to shift  responsibility and causation to others so we can continue boarding planes and cruise ships without thinking we are contributing to spreading any problem, ,  there are *vaccinated* cruisers  -- and we now know this includes  triple vaccinated people -- who get  Covid (such as one of the recent posters on this thread, unclear if he/she has Omicron or not).  They may indeed even be asymptomatic, and they can and do spread it to others ( they may or may not have a lower risk of spreading it to others,  even if statistically they avoid hospitals more -- so far). 

 

This understanding that even the vaccinated can carry asymptomatic  disease  is why the cruise lines typically require pre-boarding testing of some kind for all (be it 2 days before the cruise, like Celebrity, or at the dock, like SS).  But that can miss a few that are early,  incubating.  So they test again a few days after getting on board (e.g., after a week on board, some on SS ships have reported).  And that will also miss a few, and so on.  The hope is that even if you miss a few, the at risk for doing poorly,  and vaxxed,  will not get very sick and thus disrupt the course of the cruise for everyone else. But if the welcome numbers of pax on board are huge, even a tiny fraction can cause headaches. 

 

If the ship really had 6000 on board, all pre- tested, 40 then testing positive over time (rounding to 1% give or take) it is what we have seen on some other lines since last summer.  What we don't know is if this % is going to rise with Omicron, and what if means going forward.  What will it mean if 10% test positive, counting crew,  and everyone feels fine or just has sniffles?  I suspect that absent someone with authority saying "don't worry about it" it will shut down cruising for a long time.

Or maybe lines will just ban old people from cruising, because they are potentially more likely to have trouble.

 

Edited December 20, 2021 by Catlover54
Typo

[CruiserFromMaine]

Reporting 44 cases without context is not doing cruising any justice.From an article about this in USA Today. “ In the statement Monday morning, it [Royal Caribbean] said that "everyone who tested positive were asymptomatic or had mild symptoms, and we continuously monitored their health."

 

Also a reminder that this was 0.78% of the 6,091 people on board (pax and crew). That is far better than most US states. 
 

So while 44 cases seems a lot in a Silversea setting, it’s not that much on Royal. The equivalent on a full Muse (596 pax plus 411 crew) would be 8 people. 
 

As I’ve written before I think it’s actually good that the 44 cases did not blossom into 440. That shows that the vaccines and health protocols work, given the high transmission rates in the wild. 

[Lois R]

Good morning Terry, there is another Royal Caribbean ship that was turned away from 2 Caribbean ports..........looks like more positive cases on these "mega vessels"........

Here is the article...........

https://www.cnn.com/travel/article/royal-caribbean-covid-outbreak-port-entry-denied/index.html

[FauxNom]

1 hour ago, TLCOhio said:

Royal Caribbean Group's 'Cruise with Confidence' program has been in place since March 2020 and applies to flagship line Royal Caribbean International, Silversea Cruises and Celebrity Cruises, Lyan Sierra-Caro, spokesperson for the cruise line, told USA TODAY.  'It allows guests to cancel up to 48 hours before their departure – for any reason at all – and get 100% of the value back in a Future Cruise Credit that they can use towards any sailing,' Sierra-Caro said.  

 

I thought Cruise with Confidence was replaced by a new policy that's not quite "for any reason at all".  Here's the language about guest cancellation. (You can still get a refund or FCC if you cancel due to contracting COVID within 30 days of the cruise).

 

Cruise Cancelled By Guest

• If, following a declaration of a Public Health Emergency, you cancel a booking for a cruise scheduled during the declared emergency, but the cruise is not cancelled, you are entitled to a FCC for the cruise fare paid to Silversea. If, following a declaration of a Public Health Emergency, you must cancel your booking because you are prohibited from traveling to the vessel due to a governmental travel restriction, but the cruise is not cancelled, you are entitled to a refund, or an optional FCC, for the cruise fare paid to Silversea. In all other cases our standard cancellation policy will apply, as set forth in the Ticket Contract for your cruise.

[jpalbny]

The "Cruise With Slightly Less Confidence" policy? 😉

 

 

 

[rkacruiser]

6 hours ago, TLCOhio said:

 For us, just sailing around or "floating on a boat" is not our prime goal/motivation.  

 

For cruising in other parts of the world, I agree.  For cruising in the Caribbean, there's not many ports that I have not visited and I would prefer simply staying on the ship and enjoy my floating resort.  

[CJANDH]

"To restore confidence, being open and "letting the sunshine in" helps customers evaluate their honest risks in sailing during these current conditions.  BUT, in defense of the cruise lines, the media does hype up these incidents when the reality is that this latest variant produces for those fully vaccinated, generally only mild symptoms.  Or, conditions where those affected were asymptomatic."

 

I am on Spirit now. The Captain has been very open. He announced yesterday that three people on board had tested positive and that two of them were disembarked in San Juan. It was encouraging that the reception crew were also willing to talk about it. Nice change from what I hear is happening on other cruise ships.

 

While this thread is emphasising that for vaccinated cruisers the effects of getting the virus are usually mild, it should be pointed out that the results of even an asymptomatic positive test are a disaster. You get thrown off the ship and your holiday is ruined.

 

Stay healthy and Happy Holidays to all.

[TLCOhio]

On 12/25/2021 at 8:58 AM, CJANDH said:

I am on Spirit now. The Captain has been very open. He announced yesterday that three people on board had tested positive and that two of them were disembarked in San Juan. It was encouraging that the reception crew were also willing to talk about it. Nice change from what I hear is happening on other cruise ships.  While this thread is emphasising that for vaccinated cruisers the effects of getting the virus are usually mild, it should be pointed out that the results of even an asymptomatic positive test are a disaster.  You get thrown off the ship and your holiday is ruined.

 

Great to hear that the Captain of the Silver Spirit is being very open about what is happening on this Silversea ship.  Plus, the staff!!  It is easier to be more open and sharing on smaller ships such as with SS.   Appreciate ALL of these wonderful comments and various follow-ups.  

 

From the Washington Post yesterday, they had this headline: “Cruise passengers on holiday trip deal with outbreaks: ‘We’re sailing on a petri dish’ ” with these story highlights: “Ashley Peterson had a different mental image of her Christmas break than what actually transpired: The 32-year-old thought she would finally visit the Caribbean reef-lined island of Bonaire, the 99th country in her quest to travel at least 100.  Instead, her cruise ship, the Carnival Freedom, sailed past its destination Wednesday after a port turned away the boat because of coronavirus infections onboard. At least four sailings on Royal Caribbean, Holland America, Carnival and others this week were altered by coronavirus outbreaks as cruise ships prepared for pre-pandemic levels before sailings were paused. Although vessels resuming cruising have beefed up coronavirus precautions, requiring vaccinations and testing passengers, the wave of new infections, fueled by the quickly proliferating omicron variant, has knocked the devastated industry and alarmed cruisers.  'We’re sailing on a petri dish,' Peterson said. 'I feel like I just spent my past week at a superspreader event.'   Carnival did not respond to a question about how many people have tested positive on the ship that was denied entry to Bonaire and Aruba.  The ship, scheduled to port in Miami on Sunday for another sailing, has 2,497 passengers and 1,112 crew members.”

 

Here is more from their reporting: "The ship is among dozens under investigation or being monitored by the CDC.  Some cruise companies have said they will alter rules in response to the rise in cases. Royal Caribbean announced it will not be accepting new bookings until Jan. 10 after dozens of people tested positive on Royal Caribbean’s Odyssey of the Seas and Symphony of the Seas, based in Florida, which has experienced a surge in cases over the past week at a greater average rate than the United States overall. The Odyssey of the Seas, turned away from Curaçao and Aruba, is set to return to Fort Lauderdale on Sunday.  In the busiest time for travel in nearly two years, the omicron variant has brought about staffing problems that have contributed to flight cancellations, upending people’s get-togethers and leading people to isolate or quarantine.  The mitigation measures in place aboard Holland America Line’s ship, the Koningsdam, were “as good as it gets,” according to Paulette York, who was a passenger on the voyage that left San Diego for Mexico on Sunday. However, after 21 crew members tested positive, the boat was turned away from Mexico’s Puerto Vallarta."

 

Full story at:

https://www.washingtonpost.com/travel/2021/12/25/christmas-cruises-covid/

 

THANKS!  Enjoy!  Terry in Ohio

 

Venice: Loving It & Why??!!  Is one of your future desires or past favorites? See these many visual samples for its great history and architecture.  This posting is now at 93,375 views.

http://boards.cruisecritic.com/showthread.php?t=1278226