Note Sure I Want to Cruise After Reading This

[resistk]

https://www.bloomberg.com/features/2020-cruise-ship-suicides/

 

[wo5m]

This ranks up there with the story they ran a few years back about people falling off left and right on cruise ships. 

[resistk]

Bloomberg does not like cruise lines.

[cruisingguy007]

This reminds me of a doomsday article from cruiselawnews and such. Been going on for a long time. It's sad but happens on land all the time, on average 132 times everyday in the USA but you don't hear about it so it's not in your face and spotlighted like when it happens on cruise ships. Could some conditions/policies be better? You bet! Will these stories stop me from cruising? Not a chance! When do we sail? I'm packed!  

[vwrestler171]

It seems that local governments are just as much to blame as Carnival.  If they would let their citizens home instead of the constant changing of rules, they would have been home instead of feeling like a donkey falling a carrot only to have the carrot pulled away at the last minute.  Of course that would lead to depression.  Look at the mental health issues that have escalated in the US and the majority of them can see family. 

[jperry2011]

Another article trying to deter us from cruising... 

Not gonna work here though the workers on these cruise ships are there to make a decent living and sometimes to support a family at home. I'll happily get back on at the end of this year and tip them well like they deserve.

[MsTabbyKats]

I am at a point where I either feel bad for everyone negatively affected.....or am fed up with everyone (the special people...who need to travel and/or have indoor gatherings).

 

When cruising resumes, I'll be more appreciative of people able to go on a ship and to the people who make my vacation happen.

[Aquahound]

It's very sad that a few people had a hard time coping and that, like any suicide where hindsight is 20/20, the signs were missed.  However, cherry picking a few to make tens or hundreds of thousands look neglected is so typical of today's sensationalist media.  Shame on Bloomberg (again).

[Love.II.Cruise]

4 hours ago, resistk said:

https://www.bloomberg.com/features/2020-cruise-ship-suicides/

 

Thanks for posting this article.  SHAME on all of you that have no sympathy!  You know who you are!  We are in a PANDEMIC!  

 

These crew members serve us on ships and deserve respect and dignity.  

Edited December 31, 2020 by Love.II.Cruise
edit

[cruisingguy007]

1 hour ago, Love.II.Cruise said:

Thanks for posting this article.  SHAME on all of you that have no sympathy!  You know who you are!  We are in a PANDEMIC!  

 

These crew members serve us on ships and deserve respect and dignity.  

 

I've have seen zero posts that shown no sympathy; nor any disrespect or lack of dignity. Virtue signaling isn't "doing" anything either. Will you continue to sail? This article is nothing but a industry hit piece. Sensationalism to trash the industry, knowing they can't fight back or retort for fear of being perceived in a negative light. This is purely manipulation of a set of facts and circumstances to elicit an emotional reaction. A shameful attempt to conflate the seriousness of mental heath with bashing the cruise industry as though they are knowingly causing a massive problem.

 

The cruise lines were in terrible predicament and snagged in a tangle of international rules and multi jurisdictional mazes of rules/policies. Even one of the coworkers (Van Rooyen) of the main individual of the story claimed "The company was amazing" she says "Carnival looked after us".  Suicide is a terrible thing and no one wants to see it happen but, unfortunately, it happens everyday. The situation they faced during a worldwide pandemic was tough to be sure but to try and toss the whole industry under the bus for what essentially amounts to "an act of God" is a bit disingenuous at best.    

Edited December 31, 2020 by cruisingguy007

[Love.II.Cruise]

dup

Edited December 31, 2020 by Love.II.Cruise
dup

[Love.II.Cruise]

34 minutes ago, cruisingguy007 said:

 

I've have seen zero posts that shown no sympathy; nor any disrespect or lack of dignity. Virtue signaling isn't "doing" anything either. Will you continue to sail? This article is nothing but a industry hit piece. Sensationalism to trash the industry, knowing they can't fight back or retort for fear of being perceived in a negative light. This is purely manipulation of a set of facts and circumstances to elicit an emotional reaction. A shameful attempt to conflate the seriousness of mental heath with bashing the cruise industry as though they are knowingly causing a massive problem.

 

The cruise lines were in terrible predicament and snagged in a tangle of international rules and multi jurisdictional mazes of rules/policies. Even one of the coworkers (Van Rooyen) of the main individual of the story claimed "The company was amazing" she says "Carnival looked after us".  Suicide is a terrible thing and no one wants to see it happen but, unfortunately, it happens everyday. The situation they faced during a worldwide pandemic was tough to be sure but to try and toss the whole industry under the bus for what essentially amounts to "an act of God" is a bit disingenuous at best.    

look in the mirror

[sparks1093]

5 hours ago, Love.II.Cruise said:

look in the mirror

Will you continue to sail?

[bigrednole]

There are a lot of people publishing things to manipulate market price. Some very well to do fund managers would love to see cruise lines drop 20-25% for their Shorts. Then buy back at $15-$20, sell at $25-$30. They have been doing this repeatedly since March. This article has less to do about cruising and more to do about the stock market.

[bouhunter]

4 minutes ago, bigrednole said:

There are a lot of people publishing things to manipulate market price. Some very well to do fund managers would love to see cruise lines drop 20-25% for their Shorts. Then buy back at $15-$20, sell at $25-$30. They have been doing this repeatedly since March. This article has less to do about cruising and more to do about the stock market.

This theory goes well with the one about prisoners in Florida getting top priority for vaccines.

[chengkp75]

Shame on Bloomberg for merely rehashing a story from months ago regarding cruise ship crew, almost all of whom have been repatriated by now.  What they don't go into, especially for a business oriented media like Bloomberg, is the continuing saga of the rest of the merchant mariners who continue to be stranded on their ships.  Most of those interviewed by the ITWF, as mentioned in the article, were not cruise ship crew, since cruise ship crew make up about 10% of all merchant mariners.  These mariners continue to be stuck on their ships, because the cargo shipping lines cannot take a ship out of service to bring crew home, nor can they arrange charter flights when two or three crew need to return.  As I've said, while most of the cruise ship crew have been repatriated, there are still over 500,000 merchant mariners who either cannot get home from their ships, or who cannot return to work and get paid again.

 

The major obstacle to crew repatriation is not the shipping lines or the crew members' home countries, it is the countries that don't allow crew to leave or join a ship.  As this goes on, there will be more accidents, likely some suicides, and a slowdown in global shipping, which accounts for 80+% of the world's economy.  A business based firm like Bloomberg should recognize the threat to the world economy, and highlight that over the "sexy" cruise ship crew problems.

[Joebucks]

If anything, this makes me want to cruise more. While I admit I am not cruising for charity, it is a much better feeling when you are having a good time with the crew, and your spending is helping their family vs them being sad and committing suicide. Imagine trying to be the cruiselines trying to figure this all out. When airlines are grounded, and you have thousands of people you don't know what to do with. Obviously, they were repatriated home.

 

If it wasn't clear enough already, it is obvious that cruises don't have a lot of political allies. Maybe in the future, cruise lines will reconsider their stance on donations, taxes, and propaganda.

[lenquixote66]

Earlier today or perhaps late yesterday Dr. Fauchi stated that if everyone adheres to the guidelines things could be back to normal in October ,2021.

However,it is not likely that people will do that.

[ontheweb]

11 minutes ago, lenquixote66 said:

Earlier today or perhaps late yesterday Dr. Fauchi stated that if everyone adheres to the guidelines things could be back to normal in October ,2021.

However,it is not likely that people will do that.

I am assuming that the last comment starting with however is by you, not De. Fauci.

[lenquixote66]

9 minutes ago, ontheweb said:

I am assuming that the last comment starting with however is by you, not De. 

10 minutes ago, ontheweb said:

I am assuming that the last comment starting with however is by you, not De. Fauci.

Correct

[navybankerteacher]

31 minutes ago, ontheweb said:

I am assuming that the last comment starting with however is by you, not De. Fauci.

Good assumption.  Dr. Fauci is not known for such predictions.   

 

But then, given the large numbers who have disregarded warnings so far, it is logical to anticipate that the anti-social, self-absorbed reckless behavior which has contributed to the spread of COVID so far is likely to continue.   Well under 10% of our population has been proven to have been infected to date, so just a few idiots out of the roughly 300,000,000 others can easily keep this nightmare running for another year.

Edited January 1, 2021 by navybankerteacher

[SelectSys]

1 hour ago, lenquixote66 said:

Earlier today or perhaps late yesterday Dr. Fauchi stated that if everyone adheres to the guidelines things could be back to normal in October ,2021.

However,it is not likely that people will do that.

 

The evidence suggests you are correct.  As we all now, prohibition leads to illegal substitutes and illegal bars, restaurants and casinos are now opening.  How else to explain my state's poor COVID performance?  Of course our politicians setting bad examples and breaking their own rules in some sense gave a "green light" to the behavior.

 

https://www.france24.com/en/live-news/20210101-alarm-in-france-after-2-500-mass-for-illegal-rave

https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/13614325/new-years-eve-raves-covid/

https://patch.com/new-jersey/newarknj/newark-police-bust-second-illegal-bar-2-days-authorities

https://timesofsandiego.com/crime/2021/01/01/3-injured-when-stage-collapses-at-illegal-new-years-party-in-miramar-warehouse/

The list of incidents is endless...

 

I personally believe that only mass vaccination will stop the crisis and permit a return to normal in the western world.

[resistk]

Just safely getting to a port of departure would seem to be an even bigger problem:

https://news.yahoo.com/coughing-sneezing-vomiting-visibly-ill-130006625.html

 

[Love.II.Cruise]

On 12/31/2020 at 5:49 AM, sparks1093 said:

Will you continue to sail?

Good question.  We discussed this earlier this year and actually asked ourselves if we would ever sail again. At the time we were thinking "no."  But if the vaccine is successful, I think we may?  As is, we waited 209 days to get $17.5K back from Crystal on a cruise they cancelled back on April 29th for a June cruise.  We will not be putting any money into any cruise line until we can see they are sailing successfully.  We lost 1K in airfare, even after doing a credit card dispute - Twice.  Travel insurance was completely worthless.  So there are a couple companies we will never use again. 

 

Still feel bad for all the cruise line workers that could not get home timely.  No one should have to go through what they went through.  

[Hlitner]

So let me toss out a comment for thoughtful folks.  It is more the ridiculous decisions of politicians that is contributing to increasing suicide and mental health issues then COVID.   Consider that in New York State where restaurants account for less then 2% of COVID cases....it is the restaurants that have taken the brunt of political decisions.  Meanwhile, their Governor tells folks to stay home which is where the majority of COVID cases are being spread!  Go figure.  In many States the schools have been shut down increasing stress among teens and children (which leads to increased suicide) despite contact tracing that shows relatively little COVID risk in schools that practice basic mitigation measures.

 

As has been posted, the increase of suicides among mariners is the direct result of politicians making decisions that have caused those hard working folks to be imprisoned on vessels against their will.  Political figures around the world have discovered that COVID gives them an opportunity to vastly increase their power (in the name of Public Health) and it will be very difficult to us to reign in these powers long after COVID ceases to be a major issue.

 

Hank