Will P&O now delay announcements for future cruise pauses?

[cruisenewbie1976]

9 minutes ago, Eddie99 said:

I rate the info and advice we get from Prof Devi Sridhar, the Chair of Global Public Health at the University of Edinburgh.

She says give up on foreign travel for 2021, have a normal Xmas & New Year and return to normality or near normality for the UK 2022 summer season.

 

It may be discouraging for some but I am still amazed at the speed of vaccine development.  I honestly thought it would take at least 5years before we could think like that and, in my darkest hours, wondered if I’d ever cuddle my granddaughters again, or even live to see the world get back on an even keel.  And I consider myself an optimist, generally.

I've had to block her on twitter. She's been helping on about zero covid for months and its just not a realistic proposition. I fear she's more interested in being controversial to get air time than in giving realistic expectations. 

[cruisenewbie1976]

22 minutes ago, cruisenewbie1976 said:

I've had to block her on twitter. She's been helping on about zero covid for months and its just not a realistic proposition. I fear she's more interested in being controversial to get air time than in giving realistic expectations. 

*harping on!

[yorkshirephil]

This is the problem with experts, they don't all agree and can take totally opposing views of the same issue. Nobody knows what the future will bring so some of us form our opinions on past events, however there has not been a past event like this for over 100 years and things were totally different then. A lot of people have a habit of following the experts who tell them what they want to hear or believe in, regardless of what is happening in front of their eyes. My opinion of the pandemic is now somewhat different to what it was last April as I am sure it is with lots of others, if I could be bothered or had the time it would be interesting to compare some of our early posts with what we think now. Anybody up for a challenge? 

[arlowood]

9 minutes ago, yorkshirephil said:

This is the problem with experts, they don't all agree and can take totally opposing views of the same issue. Nobody knows what the future will bring so some of us form our opinions on past events, however there has not been a past event like this for over 100 years and things were totally different then. A lot of people have a habit of following the experts who tell them what they want to hear or believe in, regardless of what is happening in front of their eyes. My opinion of the pandemic is now somewhat different to what it was last April as I am sure it is with lots of others, if I could be bothered or had the time it would be interesting to compare some of our early posts with what we think now. Anybody up for a challenge? 

Agree totally. In any news item you will often have some talking head who is touted as "an Expert" just as a means of supporting some editorial view of the situation. My other half is sick of me shouting at the TV words to the effect "Who the **** is he/she" - when some name appears on the screen spouting their view of any situation. And don't get me started on dissecting the predictions of Professor Neil Ferguson - he of Foot and Mouth/SARS/Mers fame with wild predictions of millions of deaths.

I get the impression that some epidemiologists feel that now is their chance to have their 15 minutes of fame and put forward deliberately controversial statistics just to fan their own egos.

 

Sorry folks - rant over 

[cruisenewbie1976]

20 minutes ago, yorkshirephil said:

This is the problem with experts, they don't all agree and can take totally opposing views of the same issue. Nobody knows what the future will bring so some of us form our opinions on past events, however there has not been a past event like this for over 100 years and things were totally different then. A lot of people have a habit of following the experts who tell them what they want to hear or believe in, regardless of what is happening in front of their eyes. My opinion of the pandemic is now somewhat different to what it was last April as I am sure it is with lots of others, if I could be bothered or had the time it would be interesting to compare some of our early posts with what we think now. Anybody up for a challenge? 

Totally agree and I'm sure most us have changed our opinions month by month, or even day by day, as the situation has evolved. I try and look at a broad range of opinion. But when someone is solely interested in the negative (as Devi appears to be), then I don't take much notice of what they say. Especially when they spend their time on every TV programme known to man. Coincidentally, a lot of them also seem to have a book to sell 🤔😉

[wowzz]

3 minutes ago, arlowood said:

And don't get me started on dissecting the predictions of Professor Neil Ferguson - he of Foot and Mouth/SARS/Mers fame with wild predictions of millions of deaths.

Absolutely agree with you. Why anyone listens to him is beyond me - the man has been wrong with every prediction he has made, going back over 20 years.

[Ardennais]

44 minutes ago, yorkshirephil said:

This is the problem with experts, they don't all agree and can take totally opposing views of the same issue. Nobody knows what the future will bring so some of us form our opinions on past events, however there has not been a past event like this for over 100 years and things were totally different then. A lot of people have a habit of following the experts who tell them what they want to hear or believe in, regardless of what is happening in front of their eyes. My opinion of the pandemic is now somewhat different to what it was last April as I am sure it is with lots of others, if I could be bothered or had the time it would be interesting to compare some of our early posts with what we think now. Anybody up for a challenge? 

These are 2 comments I made last August which some ‘older’ and possibly ‘wiser’ members disagreed with, but I still stand by them! 
 

 

[yorkshirephil]

34 minutes ago, arlowood said:

 

I get the impression that some epidemiologists feel that now is their chance to have their 15 minutes of fame and put forward deliberately controversial statistics just to fan their own egos.

 

Sorry folks - rant over 

And to get a nice grant to further their careers

[Dermotsgirl]

2 hours ago, Ardennais said:

These are 2 comments I made last August which some ‘older’ and possibly ‘wiser’ members disagreed with, but I still stand by them! 
 

 

I wasn’t posting on CC when the pandemic started.  But I said elsewhere, back in March, that Covid 19 would one of the century defining events, and in future it will be talked about as a watershed event - before Covid and after Covid 

 

I stand by that view ! 

[Dermotsgirl]

3 hours ago, Eddie99 said:

I rate the info and advice we get from Prof Devi Sridhar, the Chair of Global Public Health at the University of Edinburgh.

She says give up on foreign travel for 2021, have a normal Xmas & New Year and return to normality or near normality for the UK 2022 summer season.

 

It may be discouraging for some but I am still amazed at the speed of vaccine development.  I honestly thought it would take at least 5years before we could think like that and, in my darkest hours, wondered if I’d ever cuddle my granddaughters again, or even live to see the world get back on an even keel.  And I consider myself an optimist, generally.

I have to say I agree with her.

 

I’m not even thinking about going abroad this year. I’m hoping we will have a summer similar to last year, when we had some cautious freedoms. Then, hopefully enough people will be vaccinated by autumn/winter to prevent a new wave of the pandemic. I still expect masks and social distancing to be a ‘thing’ next winter. Hopefully by 2022 we will be able to live much more freely.

 

 

[terrierjohn]

2 hours ago, Ardennais said:

These are 2 comments I made last August which some ‘older’ and possibly ‘wiser’ members disagreed with, but I still stand by them! 
 

 

Not sure why you chose 2 replies to my posts on the same thread, especially as the first comment has proved to be remarkably accurate. We created not one but a few dozen vaccines to defeat Covid19.

I would appreciate your justification for your post please.

[tring]

2 hours ago, yorkshirephil said:

And to get a nice grant to further their careers

 

A very good point for many things that are publicised by academics.  My years working in research have made me only too aware of how important it is to get funding for any project now (apart from those funded by drug companies which I have no first hand knowledge of).  Sadly more or less any other research is reliant on grants from somewhere and I too realise that as soon as I see anything of a scientific nature mentioned and the end phrase is always of course, "More work is needed".

 

However I would correct your words of "furthering their careers", which seems to imply that it would only be done by those with, perhaps OTT aspirations, to those of being able to further what could be important research.  Not everything will potentially bring big financial rewards to drug companies (hence be funded by them), so important scientific progress could be ignored altogether.  We do also rely on academics who are prominent in their field to also be present in their posts for the purpose of teaching the future generations.  In my early research years I worked in a university on a permanent employment basis with the university funding both research work, the equipment for it and the staff in those research labs (I was one of those research technicians with only a first degree, not an academic).  Now the ability to get funding for research projects and be well aware of the best way to apply for research grants is a very important skill that all academics need if to continue with any career in the academic institutions of today.

 

It is unusual now to find any academic institution research staff with security of tenure, since even professors can be on temporary contracts, albeit perhaps 5 year chairs rather than the 1 - 3 year contracts (sometimes on a rolling basis) which is what I was appointed on when returning to work after my parenting break as those roles depended on the work getting sufficient funding to be continued and diversified.   

Edited January 13, 2021 by tring

[yorkshirephil]

23 minutes ago, tring said:

 

A very good point for many things that are publicised by academics.  My years working in research have made me only too aware of how important it is to get funding for any project now (apart from those funded by drug companies which I have no first hand knowledge of).  Sadly more or less any other research is reliant on grants from somewhere and I too realise that as soon as I see anything of a scientific nature mentioned and the end phrase is always of course, "More work is needed".

 

However I would correct your words of "furthering their careers", which seems to imply that it would only be done by those with, perhaps OTT aspirations, to those of being able to further what could be important research.  Not everything will potentially bring big financial rewards to drug companies (hence be funded by them), so important scientific progress could be ignored altogether.  We do also rely on academics who are prominent in their field to also be present in their posts for the purpose of teaching the future generations.  In my early research years I worked in a university on a permanent employment basis with the university funding both research work, the equipment for it and the staff in those research labs (I was one of those research technicians with only a first degree, not an academic).  Now the ability to get funding for research projects and be well aware of the best way to apply for research grants is a very important skill that all academics need if to continue with any career in the academic institutions of today.

 

It is unusual now to find any academic institution research staff with security of tenure, since even professors can be on temporary contracts, albeit perhaps 5 year chairs rather than the 1 - 3 year contracts (sometimes on a rolling basis) which is what I was appointed on when returning to work after my parenting break as those roles depended on the work getting sufficient funding to be continued and diversified.   

I have experienced both sides of this within the Pharma industry. Big pharma pump billions into research year in year out. Most research projects fail as do most novel drugs, that is the nature of the beast. I remember the Biotech bubble and how that ended, ironically the company I worked for panned out well and still thrives, albeit under a different umbrella. Big Pharma snapped up hundreds of small one hit wonders for ridiculous amounts of money hoping that they would produce the next blockbuster drug or add to the company pipeline. It is also surprising how much private money goes into small startup's some purely as a high risk investment some by rich people who want to give back or simply care. 

[Ardennais]

54 minutes ago, terrierjohn said:

Not sure why you chose 2 replies to my posts on the same thread, especially as the first comment has proved to be remarkably accurate. We created not one but a few dozen vaccines to defeat Covid19.

I would appreciate your justification for your post please.

I was just looking quickly for my comments and as I don’t know how to select and paste multiple quotes from long ago, I decided to take quick screenshots. It just happened that the comments that I wanted (i.e. my comments) were in response to other posts and purely accidental that they were yours. Nothing deliberate. And well done you for being so remarkably accurate! 

Edited January 13, 2021 by Ardennais
Spelling

[Ardennais]

Who knows whether we’ll ever ‘defeat’ Covid as such. We might be able to keep it under some sort of control but even today, there have been reports that we might have to be jabbed every year. 

[joeecco]

18 minutes ago, Ardennais said:

Who knows whether we’ll ever ‘defeat’ Covid as such. We might be able to keep it under some sort of control but even today, there have been reports that we might have to be jabbed every year. 

That’s nothing to worry over, we are jabbed for the flu yearly and that doesn’t stop us living life. 

[tring]

23 minutes ago, joeecco said:

That’s nothing to worry over, we are jabbed for the flu yearly and that doesn’t stop us living life. 

True but the Brazilian variant which Boris mentioned as causing a lot of concern when he was being questioned by the select committee today, could make it even longer to get to grips with the disease.  It is said they can alter the vaccine within a matter of weeks, but does that mean even those already vaccinated would need done again pronto.  Lets hope not, but I cannot find anything much about this "Brazilian version".  Has anyone else seen any mention of it as yet? 

[Angel57]

10 minutes ago, tring said:

True but the Brazilian variant which Boris mentioned as causing a lot of concern when he was being questioned by the select committee today, could make it even longer to get to grips with the disease.  It is said they can alter the vaccine within a matter of weeks, but does that mean even those already vaccinated would need done again pronto.  Lets hope not, but I cannot find anything much about this "Brazilian version".  Has anyone else seen any mention of it as yet? 

First time I heard of it was during the Select Committee questions today but I think Japan found it in travellers returning from Brazil.......?

[yorkshirephil]

14 minutes ago, tring said:

True but the Brazilian variant which Boris mentioned as causing a lot of concern when he was being questioned by the select committee today, could make it even longer to get to grips with the disease.  It is said they can alter the vaccine within a matter of weeks, but does that mean even those already vaccinated would need done again pronto.  Lets hope not, but I cannot find anything much about this "Brazilian version".  Has anyone else seen any mention of it as yet? 

There's me thinking it was a new trim😁

[nosapphire]

12 minutes ago, tring said:

True but the Brazilian variant which Boris mentioned as causing a lot of concern when he was being questioned by the select committee today, could make it even longer to get to grips with the disease.  It is said they can alter the vaccine within a matter of weeks, but does that mean even those already vaccinated would need done again pronto.  Lets hope not, but I cannot find anything much about this "Brazilian version".  Has anyone else seen any mention of it as yet? 

Viruses mutate, it's what they do.

Being pedantic, I believe the report was that was,  "causing concern" rather than "a lot of concern" and simply because as yet it has not been fully studied.

 

[terrierjohn]

3 hours ago, Ardennais said:

Who knows whether we’ll ever ‘defeat’ Covid as such. We might be able to keep it under some sort of control but even today, there have been reports that we might have to be jabbed every year. 

If we have that's OK by me if it means we can treat it more like flu, in fact maybe they will combine them both and we can have a coflu jab, rather like MMR.

[yorkshirephil]

11 minutes ago, terrierjohn said:

If we have that's OK by me if it means we can treat it more like flu, in fact maybe they will combine them both and we can have a coflu jab, rather like MMR.

Or even a Fluid jab

[terrierjohn]

3 minutes ago, yorkshirephil said:

Or even a Fluid jab

That beats my tame offering.   But I am waiting to see if anyone develops frozen shoulder from a partially thawed Biontech vaccination.

[jeanlyon]

We are planning to do our October cruise on Aurora, which is Eastern Med so lovely sunshine hopefully.  We will only go if we are allowed off the ship independently which might not be a problem once people are vaccinated.  I suppose that also depends on whether Europe has opened up or not.

Edited January 14, 2021 by jeanlyon

[nosapphire]

12 hours ago, terrierjohn said:

If we have that's OK by me if it means we can treat it more like flu, in fact maybe they will combine them both and we can have a coflu jab, rather like MMR.

I recall reading last summer (can't remember where) that the boffins creating the vaccinations were already looking at the possibility of a combined influenza and covid vaccine.

Be useful if so, then we can keep the other arm spare in case of another pandemic........