CLIA vs CDC

[NavArch64]

CLIA asks for July 1 ..... CDC says no .... CSO still effective until Nov 1. No change. (Richard Fain tried, but no public give from Rochelle Walensky)

CDC Website still says ...   "CDC recommends that all people avoid travel on cruise ships, including river cruises, worldwide, because the risk of COVID-19 on cruise ships is very high."

RCCL needs to show that Adventure and Vision can operate flawlessly ... they are in fact the "test" voyages for North America.

We shall see.

[livingonthebeach]

The CLIA also called on the CDC to update its most recent no-sail order, which has been in effect since October 2020. 

 

CLIA's statement:

 

"The outdated CSO, which was issued almost five months ago, does not reflect the industry’s proven advancements and success operating in other parts of the world, nor the advent of vaccines, and unfairly treats cruises differently. Cruise lines should be treated the same as other travel, tourism, hospitality, and entertainment sectors." 

 

On Wednesday, the CDC said it is working on updating its no-sail order.

 

Any day now......right!

[HBE4]

I thought this thread was going to give odds on an epic smackdown.  😄

[dswallow]

I don't know what is going on at the CDC; much confusion and likely just nobody there who cares and no fire burning under them to start.

But if nothing else, at some point soon they should at least end the conditional sail order explicitly to give the cruise lines time to get everything started in order to be able to take on passengers beginning November 1, 2021. Leaving it until then without any guidance on what they plan to do next is just irresponsible.

[Milwaukee Eight]

You really think the CDC will lift the CSO before it expires?  Current administration is all about 2 masks even after vaccines and maybe a small gathering outside with family on July 4th. 
 

M8

[logan25]

3 minutes ago, Milwaukee Eight said:

Current administration is all about 2 masks even after vaccines and maybe a small gathering outside with family on July 4th. 
 

M8

Yeah, small achievable goals.

 

No need to shoot for the stars if underpromising satisfies the masses.  Can they even deliver?  Remains to be seen.  Don’t expect to see any vacation pictures on my social media.

[dswallow]

1 hour ago, Milwaukee Eight said:

You really think the CDC will lift the CSO before it expires?  Current administration is all about 2 masks even after vaccines and maybe a small gathering outside with family on July 4th. 
 

M8

 

The cruise lines say they need 90 days to restart sailing; it's probably more a case of sliding into it ship by ship over some extended window of time, not all at once - bam - at 90 days, of course. So if the CDC plans to let the order end as of November 1, 2021, they can delay saying so until August 1, 2021, and that would still permit a proper restart to begin. If they just let it end without saying anything in advance, they'll be responsible for an unnecessary additional mess. So we'll see.  I do suspect there actually are conversations ongoing between elements of the CDC and the cruise lines even now.

[smokeybandit]

Clia waited too long to play this hand.

[easyqueasy]

If cruise lines don’t start paying the grifting tax, then their sailings will continue to get the axe. 

[lovescats5]

It would be interesting to see what everyone at the CDC would do if their job was eliminated and they had to depend on someone else to pay their bills.  There are so many people that have lost jobs because of the ban on cruises, not only FL but all the other city ports and shops.  This is not just a problem in US but world wide.  It is time to use some common sense, which there is non anywhere in government right now, and get people back to work.  Maybe they should research why domestic violence and suicides have gone up.  Pretty soon they will start complaining about all the over weight people.  What is to be expected.  I have been waiting for a year for my gym to open so I could get back.  What a total mess.  And we won't even get into if masks really work or not.  I pray the sailings starting in June are a total success.  

[MaritimeR&R]

Dr. Walensky made it clear that the CDC is not making the decision to move forward with the Conditional Sailing Order on its own; there are other "agencies" involved.  

I believe the government has its own agenda as it has demonstrated in the past and until it gets something in return, albeit, at the very least, assurances that the cruise industry will in no way burden the American public.  

When the US government has an non-US industry that they can hold over a barrel, they tend to do it.

My reference point for feeling this way --- Remember the bygone days when you could win any amount of money onboard in the Casino and not be given a W2-G.   With the existence and planned builds for larger ships, RCG wanted to be able to move more money than they currently could by U.S law,  but it would need to go through Federal Reserve Banks in order to do so. The "give" was W=2G's to be issued to US citizens so that Uncle Sam could have a piece of the action. The "get" was a change in the amount of money that could be transferred. 

I believe the "give" has yet to be decided upon.

 

 

[crewsweeper]

14 hours ago, Milwaukee Eight said:

You really think the CDC will lift the CSO before it expires?  Current administration is all about 2 masks even after vaccines and maybe a small gathering outside with family on July 4th. 
 

M8

And neither of the current administrations policies are backed by science or actual historical experience data.  All based on early  supposition of how other types of viruses have behaved. 

[hallux]

15 minutes ago, MaritimeR&R said:

Dr. Walensky made it clear that the CDC is not making the decision to move forward with the Conditional Sailing Order on its own; there are other "agencies" involved

The confusing thing about this is that the CDC ALONE issued the CSO/NSO.  Why the CDC now suddenly needs input from other agencies in order to lift an order it issued on its own is baffling!

[radarcruiser]

8 hours ago, lovescats5 said:

It would be interesting to see what everyone at the CDC would do if their job was eliminated and they had to depend on someone else to pay their bills.  There are so many people that have lost jobs because of the ban on cruises, not only FL but all the other city ports and shops.  This is not just a problem in US but world wide.  It is time to use some common sense, which there is non anywhere in government right now, and get people back to work.  Maybe they should research why domestic violence and suicides have gone up.  Pretty soon they will start complaining about all the over weight people.  What is to be expected.  I have been waiting for a year for my gym to open so I could get back.  What a total mess.  And we won't even get into if masks really work or not.  I pray the sailings starting in June are a total success.  

I think the new administration told the last set of folks (union workers, BTW), whose jobs they eliminated that they could learn how to make solar panels.  So IDK if they care much about helping the cruise lines.

[dodgestang]

6 hours ago, Tolkmit said:

Hundreds of thousands of passengers on cruise ships already, with no major outbreak problems, is as large scale of a study as was done on the vaccines themselves. It's completely clear, this is a political issue not a safety issue.

 

The simple truth is, most of the public views cruising as an unnecessary luxury. If cruising is allowed, the government will have a hard time justifying restricting anything else. The safety facts are irrelevant. This administration just passed a massive stimulus bill. They have to keep restrictions in place, and this feeling like a crisis, long enough for the end of the crisis and those restrictions to be viewed as a result of that stimulus and credit to go to the current administration not the previous one.

 

This is so spot on.  It's disgusting. 

[Milwaukee Eight]

1 hour ago, crewsweeper said:

And neither of the current administrations policies are backed by science or actual historical experience data.  All based on early  supposition of how other types of viruses have behaved. 

It’s called control. 
 

M8

[rtazz17]

9 hours ago, lovescats5 said:

It would be interesting to see what everyone at the CDC would do if their job was eliminated and they had to depend on someone else to pay their bills.  There are so many people that have lost jobs because of the ban on cruises, not only FL but all the other city ports and shops.  This is not just a problem in US but world wide.  It is time to use some common sense, which there is non anywhere in government right now, and get people back to work.  Maybe they should research why domestic violence and suicides have gone up.  Pretty soon they will start complaining about all the over weight people.  What is to be expected.  I have been waiting for a year for my gym to open so I could get back.  What a total mess.  And we won't even get into if masks really work or not.  I pray the sailings starting in June are a total success.  

You realize they dont care right? For that matter the local lockdowns destroyed Americans and lical governors could care less. Power and control. I think we have learned through all this that government doesnt care about you. They just want to control you more.

 

not to mention cruise lines have been avoiding taxes for yrs in the united states by making home ports outside united states. Could be a big GFY to cruise industry. They dont care about local economy that cruising brings.

Edited March 25, 2021 by rtazz17

[wolfganghowell]

Our next cruise is 10/31.  Can you see the steam coming out of my ears?  This shutdown is government insanity at its best.  Yes, it was right to stop cruising.  But most of the population will be vaccinated by the summer.  Heck, starting Monday, every Texan 16 and over is able to sign up for the vaccine.  The CDC has no sense on this issue.  If all passengers are vaccinated, and safety protocols are still in place, there is no reason not to allow the lines to start back up.  I have emailed my senators and congressman to let them know this is an issue they need to address.

[boscobeans]

16 hours ago, dswallow said:

 

The cruise lines say they need 90 days to restart sailing; it's probably more a case of sliding into it ship by ship over some extended window of time, not all at once - bam - at 90 days, of course. So if the CDC plans to let the order end as of November 1, 2021, they can delay saying so until August 1, 2021, and that would still permit a proper restart to begin. If they just let it end without saying anything in advance, they'll be responsible for an unnecessary additional mess. So we'll see.  I do suspect there actually are conversations ongoing between elements of the CDC and the cruise lines even now.

Why would a ship like the ANTHEM need 90 days to sail from New Jersey if the date is NOVEMBER 1st??

 

It is already sailing and will start its Cape Liberty Itineraries on NOVEMBER 7th, staffed with a fully trained crew???

[Charles4515]

3 hours ago, hallux said:

The confusing thing about this is that the CDC ALONE issued the CSO/NSO.  Why the CDC now suddenly needs input from other agencies in order to lift an order it issued on its own is baffling!

 

The previous admin did not want cruise ships to sail but let the CDC take the blame. She is being more transparent. It is more than the CDC.

[boscobeans]

15 minutes ago, wolfganghowell said:

Our next cruise is 10/31.  Can you see the steam coming out of my ears?  This shutdown is government insanity at its best.  Yes, it was right to stop cruising.  But most of the population will be vaccinated by the summer.  Heck, starting Monday, every Texan 16 and over is able to sign up for the vaccine.  The CDC has no sense on this issue.  If all passengers are vaccinated, and safety protocols are still in place, there is no reason not to allow the lines to start back up.  I have emailed my senators and congressman to let them know this is an issue they need to address.

Probably a waste of time but I have also written to all my State and Federal elected officials, the White House and the C.D.C. 

 

Lot of people on Cruise Critic, A LOT. Maybe a few thousand emails would sway an opinion ??

[crewsweeper]

2 minutes ago, boscobeans said:

Probably a waste of time but I have also written to all my State and Federal elected officials, the White House and the C.D.C. 

 

Lot of people on Cruise Critic, A LOT. Maybe a few thousand emails would sway an opinion ??

Remember in CDC and Dr Fauci's eyes, a cruise ship is one giant petri dish for viruses of all kinds.

[grandgeezer]

3 hours ago, hallux said:

The confusing thing about this is that the CDC ALONE issued the CSO/NSO.  Why the CDC now suddenly needs input from other agencies in order to lift an order it issued on its own is baffling!

How do you know the CDC issued it on it's own. I seriously doubt it. I'm sure this was a decision reached my several other agencies. They issued it because that's their main focus. If you didn't know it, CDC stands for Center for Disease Control.

[radarcruiser]

7 minutes ago, grandgeezer said:

How do you know the CDC issued it on it's own. I seriously doubt it. I'm sure this was a decision reached my several other agencies. They issued it because that's their main focus. If you didn't know it, CDC stands for Center for Disease Control.

At this point CDC appears to stand for Coalition to Destroy Cruising, or Continuing Despotic Control.  

C'mon man, let's take into account that EVERYONE over 18 will be vaccinated and those under 18 will be tested.  At some point we should be free to live our lives again.  The fears of a cruise ship pulling into a US port and dumping off infected people are not based in reality anymore.  Even if they did, there's thousands of infected people already there......

[dodgestang]

22 minutes ago, radarcruiser said:

Even if they did, there's thousands of infected people already there......

Millions.....I think you meant to say....Millions