Celebrity just tried to bump us

[hcat]

How do you know your cruise is overbooked?

 

Our cruise...Silhouette Jan 26th...was shown as almost sold out very early on, Then it came off the list for sale. We thought maybe it was a charter situation,, esp with rumors of the big Greek group.

 

 

Sev Celeb Reps, TAs etc confirmed it WAS in fact overbooked at some point. We were told something about unsold cabins being called back ...(I am not a TA so do not really know what that was all about.) At a certain point, sales opened up...insides only. And assurances were given no one would be bumped. Group Hug!

 

Hoping that is the truth....but lately cruise lines are quite squirrely!

[ridgerunner51]

Our cruise...Silhouette Jan 26th...was shown as almost sold out very early on, Then it came off the list for sale. We thought maybe it was a charter situation,, esp with rumors of the big Greek group.

 

 

Sev Celeb Reps, TAs etc confirmed it WAS in fact overbooked at some point. We were told something about unsold cabins being called back ...(I am not a TA so do not really know what that was all about.) At a certain point, sales opened up...insides only. And assurances were given no one would be bumped. Group Hug!

 

Hoping that is the truth....but lately cruise lines are quite squirrely!

 

Thank you.

[Can'tstopcruising]

We don't do fb but that's an idea...also if this thread stays on CC maybe it will be noticed

 

We won't be crushed if the Jan cruise is yanked because we had signals it is/ was overbooked and there is a large " mystery" group on board, supposedly. We .Love Silho, have a great AQ cabin, great price but we can't get excited til we are actually at the SAILAWAY....

 

Our upcoming Ca cruise has involved alot of pre planning and pent up enthusiam...That would really be major upset.....and the end of our relationship with X

 

We are on the same cruise, followed by the Eclipse, Feb. 4.

We booked this a very long time ago and we booked a hotel for 2 nights prior (Sheraton points .... I don't know about refundable) and air that was over $700pp.

Needless to say, if we were to be bumped, it would be very problematic, and although we are elite plus, Celebrity wouldn't see us again.

[hcat]

We are on the same cruise' date=' followed by the Eclipse, Feb. 4.

We booked this a very long time ago and we booked a hotel for 2 nights prior (Sheraton points .... I don't know about refundable) and air that was over $700pp.

Needless to say, if we were to be bumped, it would be very problematic, and although we are elite plus, Celebrity wouldn't see us again.[/quote']

 

Truly hoping all the rumors and anxiety are behind us,.Looking forward to Silhouette,,great itin, even if we lose St Maarten.....

 

Wish Celeb would be more open about all the booking stuff,,groups on board, potential charters,...etc. Isn't going to happen!

[serendipity1499]

Hence another reason to use a TA:cool:

 

I agree with you!

[RDC1]

Lots of questions here; will do my best to answer...

 

1. We would first run a list of all pax on the sailing. We would start with pax booked in the category that was overbooked. We would eliminate anyone traveling with pax in another cabin, save for less frequent instances where more than one cabin needed to be moved. (We generally staggered them, 21 days out, 14 days, 7 days, etc. with hopes that cancellations naturally reduce the overbookings as we got closer to departure). We would also eliminate anyone who had not booked airfare with us as their tickets would not be changeable without huge fees and it would be a big hassle for them. We would then eliminate any of our frequent travelers (traveled with us 3 times or more) as the company executives did not want us to disturb them. (This was a point of contention for us making the calls as it was much easier for us to get a frequent traveler to accept an offer as they knew and trusted us vs. someone who was traveling with us for the first time) We would also review comments in the records of remaining pax on our list to see if anyone had issues with their booking and had been complaining to customer service as we know they would likely not be open to offers. We also generally had to stay away from people flying from smaller airport home cities (like say Tampa or Orange County) and focus on major home cities (like MIA, LAX, NYC, etc.) This was because of air costs; when moving pax to another departure it was easier to find a choice of flights and fares from the bigger cities. This sometimes made it a very small pool of people to choose from. Also, we always identified the person who would be a forced move first thing and did not contact them as we never wanted to call someone twice. I would always try to base it on last person booked (they normally didn't have a cabin assignment) but sometimes I couldn't if they were a frequent traveler or were traveling with people in other cabins; those people could not be force moved.

 

2. When I was making calls to pax we had great leeway in the type of offers we could make. The company tightened the belt over time and made very strict rules on what could be offered based on how far from departure or how far someone would have to move to another sailing. It failed to take into account what the pool of available pax to contact was though; the more people you had to choose from the more likely you were to find someone to accept an offer so you could start lower. An easy move was offering a pax to move to a sailing within 3 days of their original. You could sometimes get away then with just giving them a free cabin upgrade. Or maybe just $150pp in future travel credit if in the same category or maybe a combination. Things got more complicated if you could only offer something several weeks away, or say late August/September departures where the later you move the less pleasant the weather becomes. Of course less desirable travel times were also cheaper so pax would get a refund of cost difference on top of any incentive we offered. The direction of travel was also another spoiler as some people only wanted to travel Amsterdam to Vienna not the reverse for example. Air costs had to be kept in mind so we had to send a list of pax with the new sail date we wanted to move them to over to our air department so they could review and advise costs. If it was too high (usually more than $500) then I had to skip those people. I would always start low with my offers with my initial calls. If I could sense that I had someone on the phone who would accept by giving them just $100 more or so then I would try that, otherwise I'd move on. Some savvy pax would try to get me to go much higher with the offer but I wasn't allowed. I would make note of their name and come back to them if I couldn't find anyone else. Most moves were voluntary. Forced moves were a last resort. If it came to that we always had a recommended sailing we wanted them to move to but the choice was theirs. They could always cancel with a full refund plus get a future travel credit on top of that. If they accepted the move the offers varied again based on how the customer accepted the change but were obviously much higher than a voluntary move, usually in the $1000pp future credit range. Eventually when the company reached a point where they did far fewer overbookings (more of the costs not being worth it rather than customer feedback) then any forced moves got a free cruise.

 

3. If it was voluntary and there was a large pool to choose from then you accept their no and move on. If I had fewer people to call then I might try to negotiate and up the offer a bit to see if they'd bite. People were generally pleasant and some excited to receive an offer. A few grumpy gusses would go off on a rant about why we were overbooking, etc. I always started the conversation by talking about the offer and get them interested before advising why we were offering or talking about moving dates. Always better to start with a positive than a negative. Forced moves were always an unhappy call of course. You had to unfortunately start with the bad news first but then quickly get to the incentives they would be getting to soften the blow. Most did not take it well. I had people scream at me or cry, many wanted to talk to a manager at a higher level (which usually did no good). A very few times we had to back down and find someone else when they called in a connection they had to an executive at the company. It was easier to get them to accept it if we had another sailing to move them to a few days later. Some of those calls wound up ending positively when they realized all the incentives they were getting for just traveling a couple days later. You could never predict people's reactions.

 

4. Like I mentioned above, when I started on the phones our offer guidelines were loose. To try and reign in costs official offer guidelines were later established. When I transitioned from moves and changes calls to revenue management now I was responsible for the number of overbookings added and deciding when they get removed and what the offer guidelines would be. We would modify offers based on feedback from the agents on the phones based on what was or was not working. We would push back on them when we saw them spending too much money as we were responsible for that budget. I would share my own best practices from my time on the phones with newer agents as they would come on to the team.

 

5. Basically if you are in a forced move situation then you want the cruiseline to not leave you disadvantaged. So any expenses that you may have incurred that are non-refundable like air tickets, travel insurance, tours, hotels, you need to make them aware of and make sure they compensate you for it. It never hurts to ask for something more too than what they are offering like maybe a higher cabin category, etc. Be honest about your situation though. If you truly cannot travel on any other date then make sure they know that this was a once in a lifetime cruise and try to get them to change their minds even if it means asking to speak to a supervisor. But if you can be flexible then go with it and take advantage of the offer. Always be firm but I would not recommend being rude and angry and yelling at the agent on the phone. They are just doing their job and putting them on the defensive will not help things.

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Forums

 

Having had a customer service unit reporting to me in the past (along with other functions such as pricing, contracts, etc. it seems that a system for forced move such as you describe, is considerably more complex and has the potential for more ill will, than a voluntary system where an e-mail goes out to everyone in the needed class (and sometimes classes above) and then take the first volunteers that call the contact number that is willing to accept the terms.

 

What is the logic behind the forced moved vs the voluntary move over, except for the fact that the offer might be better in the voluntary system. Clearly the voluntary approach has a larger set since it can be sent to classes that are exempt under the system you described.

[varoo]

Having had a customer service unit reporting to me in the past (along with other functions such as pricing, contracts, etc. it seems that a system for forced move such as you describe, is considerably more complex and has the potential for more ill will, than a voluntary system where an e-mail goes out to everyone in the needed class (and sometimes classes above) and then take the first volunteers that call the contact number that is willing to accept the terms........

 

I also noticed that interline passengers were not even mentioned, despite being among the most flexible about changing travel plans and accustomed to doing so on short notice.

For most interliners who are frequent travelers, a last minute change in travel plans is usually not the traumatic event that it appears to be for some others.

They frequently even volunteer for such changes, when offered an appealing incentive to do so.

 

A fallacy previously mentioned was making the decision about whom to call based on someone's home airport.

Many of us are not traveling directly from our home airport to the cruise port, but may be taking the cruise as an adjunct to a land vacation, or a visit to friends or family, or even after disembarking from another cruise, all situations where our home airport is irrelevant.

Airlines routinely overbook, and at some airports you can hear them calling for volunteers.

But they (airlines as well as cruise lines and hotels) know when they are overbooking and do not need to wait until the last minute to find volunteers.

At some departure gates, they assemble a list of volunteers in advance, so when you hear them call "Passenger Jones" to the counter, it is not always for an upgrade.

Sometimes, it is to say "Thank you for volunteering, but we won't be needing your seat today."

Certainly the cruise lines should be able to do something similar.

As someone previously suggested, there could be a box to check on the booking form as to whether or not you want to be contacted for a possible cabin change, or cruise change, or cancellation.

Then when needed, the cruise line would know which customers to contact and which to leave alone, instead of bombarding everyone with notices, upsetting and wasting the time of passengers who have no interest in a move to another cabin, or to another cruise, or to accepting compensation for a cancellation.

Edited September 18, 2017 by varoo

[gwsster]

Something doesn't smell right that Celebrity would do this 2 days before a vacation...If this happened to me I would have the same reaction at the OP. Some folks are retired and can be flexible with changing travel arrangements. This would not be the case for my DH and myself as our Bosses would not be "flexible" with Celebrity changing our vacation plans. I hope that his cruise is a good one for them.

 

I agree about both of these cabins. I just left both of these cabins on the Infinity. We were in 6030 and friends were in 6035. We could run across the ship to take in the view of Hubbard Glacier. Needless to say, I was always watching our reservation to make sure that we didn't lose our rooms. This was our first Celebrity cruise as we were comparing cruise lines for future travel.

 

 

Actually, there have been times when we have researched and booked early, just to get a specific cabin. For example, we've been lucky enough to snag a corner "Sweet Sixteen" (6030 & 6035) on a couple of our Millie-Class cruises. Although these cabins are among the cheapest Veranda (2C) categories, their oversized balconies put them up among the best-kept secrets in the X fleet. So, if I had one of those booked, and I got a call offering to 'upgrade' me to a randomly-located Concierge Class Cabin, I would definitely decline. :eek:

CruiseRaider: PLEASE feel free to upgrade me! :halo:

Edited September 18, 2017 by gwsster

[ReneeFLL]

Probably because it's an indefensible policy. Perhaps we should ALL add a comment on every one of their postings on Celebrity's fb page, "Interesting, but how many fully booked and paid-up passengers have you compulsorily bumped off in 2017?"

 

I like that. They just seem to be going down hill more and more. :mad:

[fshagan]

Princess handles overbookings by making move over offers (I received one about a week before my recent British Isles cruise). They make the offers to a large number of people, until they get enough to accept. The offer they made was, free cruise (up to 16 days in length), refund of paid fare on current cruise in the form of refundable OBC on the replacement cruise, up to $500 per person for non-refunable expenses, airline change fees, etc. Unlike Celebrities method of involuntarily bumping someone, Princess uses volunteers.

 

That seems reasonable, and is a "win win" for both the cruise line and the passenger who takes the offer.

 

The overbooking X is doing is very troubling. I can't see a reason for a business that has guaranteed revenue with non-refundable payments to overbook. If the cabin is unsuitable for habitation on a fully-sold cruise, I could understand it. But after final payment date the money is locked in. What possible reason is there to sell a non-refundable cabin to two different parties?

 

If X isn't careful the more statist among us will demand Congress look at the issue, like they do with airlines, and then also notice they are using an exemption in the tax code for "shipping companies" to avoid paying income taxes. This could cost them all a lot more.

[iancal]

Sooo...for comparsion purposes

 

Princess called us two years ago in late Dec. We were booked on a Feb. South American cruise. They were overbooked.

 

Their offer, right out the gate if we accepted:

 

-full refund on our cruise

-a 'free' 14 day cruise anywhere on any Princess ship

-an upgrade on that cruise from a balcony to a mini suite

-compensation, up to $300USD for cost associated with cancelling our flights (fortunately we were booked on air points and the cancellation fee was about $100 per person

 

It took us an entire 3 seconds to say yes and another second to ask them to put in in writing.

 

They did, and Princess honoured the deal. We subsequently took a Fiji cruise and met a couple who had experienced a similar off on a different Princess cruise that they had booked.

 

We did that original South America cruise this past winter. We were hoping that Princess would call up again and offer us this move over deal. Alas, they did not.

[phoenix_dream]

This whole thing just doesn't pass the smell test. If anything, Celebrity favors first time cruisers. I'm wondering if this wasn't in fact a move over offer that was mishandled by the Celebrity representative. Strange that because of a threatened $10,000 compensation suddenly the demand was rescinded. Just because you threaten that you want $10,000 doesn't mean they would have to give it to you so why would they back down because of that?? If this was a regular habit with Celebrity these boards would be on fire! Yes, there was a thread awhile back but that was due to an unforeseen and unpreventable circumstance of cabins being uninhabitable. Other than that I have been a Cruise Critic member for years and years, mostly on Celebrity, and I have never heard of this before.

 

Before heading to their Facebook page and posting comments on how awful this is, perhaps we need to all step back a bit. The OP is new to Celebrity, and this was his first post. Doesn't make it wrong or right, but this is not someone we 'know' as a regular visitor so we have only the word of a stranger to base our reactions on. Only the OP was there, so only the OP really knows what happened (or didn't). Let the OP do the escalating to the President of Celebrity, or the posting on Facebook. There may be more to the story, and/or another side to the story we are not hearing.

[upwarduk]

The overbooking X is doing is very troubling. I can't see a reason for a business that has guaranteed revenue with non-refundable payments to overbook.

Unfortunately, too many people book multiple cruises in USA, as they don't loose their deposit when they cancel the cruises that they decide they no longer want to take.

The sooner the industry introduce non refundable deposits ( as per U.K.) then Celebrity won't be over booking their ships ( they don't want to sail half empty)

[kenevenpar]

Unfortunately, too many people book multiple cruises in USA, as they don't loose their deposit when they cancel the cruises that they decide they no longer want to take.

The sooner the industry introduce non refundable deposits ( as per U.K.) then Celebrity won't be over booking their ships ( they don't want to sail half empty)

 

HAL has non-refundable as an option (default some say). Is this a prelude to all non-refundable? I don't know.

[MustBCruzn]

This whole thing just doesn't pass the smell test. If anything, Celebrity favors first time cruisers. I'm wondering if this wasn't in fact a move over offer that was mishandled by the Celebrity representative. Strange that because of a threatened $10,000 compensation suddenly the demand was rescinded. Just because you threaten that you want $10,000 doesn't mean they would have to give it to you so why would they back down because of that?? If this was a regular habit with Celebrity these boards would be on fire! Yes, there was a thread awhile back but that was due to an unforeseen and unpreventable circumstance of cabins being uninhabitable. Other than that I have been a Cruise Critic member for years and years, mostly on Celebrity, and I have never heard of this before.

 

Before heading to their Facebook page and posting comments on how awful this is, perhaps we need to all step back a bit. The OP is new to Celebrity, and this was his first post. Doesn't make it wrong or right, but this is not someone we 'know' as a regular visitor so we have only the word of a stranger to base our reactions on. Only the OP was there, so only the OP really knows what happened (or didn't). Let the OP do the escalating to the President of Celebrity, or the posting on Facebook. There may be more to the story, and/or another side to the story we are not hearing.

 

Very well said, thanks for the voice of reason.

[RickT]

I tend to agree with phoenix_dream and wonder if we have all the details. I've been on these boards for over a decade and don't believe I've heard of anyone being bumped except for maybe one case with the ship had experienced some fire damage and lost a number of cabins.

 

I'd love to know what ship, and did anyone else booked also get "bumped".

[Cruise Junky]

This whole thing just doesn't pass the smell test. If anything, Celebrity favors first time cruisers. I'm wondering if this wasn't in fact a move over offer that was mishandled by the Celebrity representative. Strange that because of a threatened $10,000 compensation suddenly the demand was rescinded. Just because you threaten that you want $10,000 doesn't mean they would have to give it to you so why would they back down because of that?? If this was a regular habit with Celebrity these boards would be on fire! Yes, there was a thread awhile back but that was due to an unforeseen and unpreventable circumstance of cabins being uninhabitable. Other than that I have been a Cruise Critic member for years and years, mostly on Celebrity, and I have never heard of this before.

 

Before heading to their Facebook page and posting comments on how awful this is, perhaps we need to all step back a bit. The OP is new to Celebrity, and this was his first post. Doesn't make it wrong or right, but this is not someone we 'know' as a regular visitor so we have only the word of a stranger to base our reactions on. Only the OP was there, so only the OP really knows what happened (or didn't). Let the OP do the escalating to the President of Celebrity, or the posting on Facebook. There may be more to the story, and/or another side to the story we are not hearing.

 

Completely agree with you and I don't believe the OP spoke with them on the first phone call, it was the OP's wife. There are always two sides to every story.

[WonderMan3]

That seems reasonable, and is a "win win" for both the cruise line and the passenger who takes the offer.

 

 

 

The overbooking X is doing is very troubling. I can't see a reason for a business that has guaranteed revenue with non-refundable payments to overbook. If the cabin is unsuitable for habitation on a fully-sold cruise, I could understand it. But after final payment date the money is locked in. What possible reason is there to sell a non-refundable cabin to two different parties?

 

 

 

If X isn't careful the more statist among us will demand Congress look at the issue, like they do with airlines, and then also notice they are using an exemption in the tax code for "shipping companies" to avoid paying income taxes. This could cost them all a lot more.

 

 

 

They do it because of cancellations. While yes, the cruise line gets to keep money when a cancel happens after the final payment period they still lose out on all the additional potential revenue from onboard purchases, excursions, etc.

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Forums

[fshagan]

They do it because of cancellations. While yes, the cruise line gets to keep money when a cancel happens after the final payment period they still lose out on all the additional potential revenue from onboard purchases, excursions, etc.

 

Well, not really. Their revenue model should include the number of expected cancellations at the last minute and the average spend the cancellation offsets, and raise prices the minuscule amount to make up that tiny piece of revenue. I can't imagine the bad press of doing this is worth the revenue they lose from people who, like us, are seriously considering making our first Celebrity cruise our last. We have a lot of choices, and lines that handle this like Princess are worthy of a consideration.

[villauk]

I tend to agree with phoenix_dream and wonder if we have all the details. I've been on these boards for over a decade and don't believe I've heard of anyone being bumped except for maybe one case with the ship had experienced some fire damage and lost a number of cabins.

 

I'd love to know what ship, and did anyone else booked also get "bumped".

 

There have been a couple this year:

 

http://boards.cruisecritic.com/showthread.php?t=2483289&highlight=Bumped

 

http://boards.cruisecritic.com/showthread.php?t=2431082&highlight=Bumped

Edited September 19, 2017 by villauk

[djmarchand]

Completely agree with you and I don't believe the OP spoke with them on the first phone call, it was the OP's wife. There are always two sides to every story.

 

I am the OP, sitting here in Celebritiy's cafe sipping a latte reading these posts. I am not going to give any more details or complain to the president. I started this thread to see how prevalent involuntary bumping was and fortunately it seems minimal. Yes, this is my side to the story but I think I have portrayed it accurately.

 

My wife got the call, spoke maybe a dozen words to the agent, broke down crying and handed the phone to me to deal with the agent as she couldn't. Believe me, the $200 OBC we were given to compensate for her distress doesn't begin to assuage the hard feelings we developed after this episode. We paid almost $7,000 for this cruise and its value to me at least is now a fraction of that. But DW wanted to go in spite of how we were treated, so here we are.

 

David

[villauk]

And here was the mysterious leak thread, that none of us actually on Connie at the time knew about and was not going to be repaired for 2.5 weeks (with a cruise in between) :rolleyes:, when several balconies were offered downgrades to OVs:

http://boards.cruisecritic.com/showthread.php?t=2392332&highlight=Leak

 

Suddenly some took the offers of compensation and downgrading to OV and magically the 2A cabins became available ;). It's worth also noting that offers were made to those in Aqua and Concierge cabins which were nowhere near each other (as per the roll call), but the cruise had been sold out for months prior to the sailing :confused:.

 

There have also been threads on CC where GTY Concierge was oversold so X reassigned some 1C cabins as Concierge Class (I'll try and post the links to the threads - it was awhile back ;)).

[Yoshikitty]

First of all, I sympathise with the OP.

 

But if we put ourselfs in the shoes of the cruiselines - their goal is to squeeze as much revenue as possible from their cruises.

And that means, that they are overbooking to a certain % from experience, that X% cancel prior to the trip which would then leave X cabins empty. Of course there will be some partial compensation as canceling fees but the empty cabins could still be sold for a certain amount which makes this highly profitable in the end.

So in contrary to many, I find the practice of overbooking to a certain degree understandable and allright.

Cruise companies operate to make money!

 

That "business model" however means, that if there are really too many people on the ship, the company has a reponsibility to make up cases when they must approach customers and ask them not to travel at that point.

 

Telling passengers to involuntarily drop them off is simply inacceptable imo!

The only line of action will be to offer compensations high enough so that the right number of passengers voluntarily agree to travel at another point of time.

Edited September 19, 2017 by Yoshikitty

[varoo]

Well, not really. Their revenue model should include the number of expected cancellations at the last minute and the average spend the cancellation offsets, and raise prices the minuscule amount to make up that tiny piece of revenue. I can't imagine the bad press of doing this is worth the revenue they lose from people who, like us, are seriously considering making our first Celebrity cruise our last. We have a lot of choices, and lines that handle this like Princess are worthy of a consideration.

Overbooking is common practice throughout the travel industry in the USA. It is not only cruise lines.

Airlines, hotels, motels, rental car agencies do it as well.

 

Even medical offices overbook appointments, in anticipation of some last minute cancellations.

When customers book a refundable reservation, naturally a certain percent of them will cancel. The companies know this and expect it.

So if they did not overbook, they would need to raise prices appreciably to offset their losses, not just a "minuscule" amount.

Many companies (especially hotels and airlines) will offer customers the option of a non-refundable booking at a lower price, or a refundable booking at a higher price.

 

While I certainly understand your point of view, personally I prefer the flexibility of the current method.

Sure there have been times when I was unhappy at not finding the rental car that I reserved ready and waiting for me, although US rental car companies usually give you a free upgrade when the car that you reserved is not available.

 

But I also like that I am not hit with a penalty if I need to cancel that reservation at the last minute.

 

Most hotels do the same. I have often received free upgrades at hotels, but also have occasionally been bumped to a hotel across the street or down the block, despite having booked a reservation in advance.

 

This is a possibility that I willingly accept in exchange for the freedom to cancel without penalty if my plans change.

 

I find it unlikely that Celebrity would bump passengers off a ship involuntarily instead of seeking volunteers or offering alternate options, and agree with the previous posters who said that we probably don't know all the details of this situation.

There was a similar case some time back where some passengers claimed to have been bumped by the cruise line, but it turned out that their travel agent had messed up their reservation and tried to blame it on the cruise line.

 

 

In any case, if you are happier with Princess than Celebrity, I agree that you should book with Princess. I think it would be a mistake for others to try to talk you into choosing Celebrity just because they prefer Celebrity.

 

I, for one, really like having choices and would not want all cruise lines to do everything the same way.

Edited September 19, 2017 by varoo

[hcat]

Hope OP can salvage a nice cruise for himself and his wife,

 

What I do not understand is how AFTER accepting final payments and assigning cabins to guarantees, the cruise line suddenly discovers it is overbooked...how does that happen so late in the process?

 

Sounds like the children's game of Musical Chairs...too many rear ends...not enough seats,,,