Is Celebrity Sailing On Troubled Waters?

[Baron Barracuda]

4 hours ago, TeeRick said:

So Baron B you have some special insight into how Celebrity measures financial health and somehow know their closely guarded secrets?  I am one of those "folks" that you refer to in your response.  I readily admit that I don't know how they measure success.  Perhaps profit statements to shareholders would be an educated guess.   I believe that ships that sail full or with "100 empty cabins" have the same cost to the cruise line- fuel, staff, food, etc.  So discounting at the end and getting people in those cabins by any means necessary helps them by generating cabin revenue and having more people on board to spend money.  I don't think that implies at all that Celebrity is in "troubled waters" referring back to the original question of this thread.

 

Have no idea how profitable X is.  Parent RCCI doesn't share line of  business financials with the public so the only one who knows for sure is Jason Liberty, their CFO.  My point of contention is that many see a full ship and assume X is doing well.  However we have no idea how much discounting was required to fill the ship.  Cabins sold at interline rates or through friends and family deals help cover costs somewhat but can result in profitless prosperity.   A quick check of current interline rates on close-in X sailings shows numerous offers at 70% - 80% below brochure rate.  Wish I qualified for interline.  

 

 

[Georgia_Peaches]

10 minutes ago, Baron Barracuda said:

Wish I qualified for interline. 

What is interline?  Never mind.  I just looked it up.  Just learned something.  Thanks!

Edited October 10, 2019 by Georgia_Peaches

[lv2cruisgrl]

On 10/7/2019 at 11:58 AM, WrittenOnYourHeart said:

 

This would be amazing. 

 

To be honest, all the negativity on here has caused me to cancel more than once and go back to my tried, true, and trusted line. Based on a long discussion with the owner of the travel agency I use, I've decided to give Edge a try for Feb and am really trying to stay positive and excited about it, but being on here sometimes makes it hard. I TRY to avoid the negative posts, but it can be a challenge sometimes. 

 

I truly appreciate everyone who is positive and shares their positive experiences.

We did Edge and loved her.  We almost canceled also because of the negative info on CC.  So please go and you will enjoy her! We are so glad we went, she is our favorite ship and will be doing Apex next year.  

[Mynki]

Do cruise lines sailing in troubled waters commission five new ships and undertake a $500 million fleet revitalization? 

[NMTraveller]

They are growing as a business.  I do have investments in RCL.  However with any growing business and with any new ship they are working out the kinks.  If they did not adapt they would be in troubled waters.

 

When and if the economy slows they may have a slowdown.  But how many years have we been hearing about the economic slowdown?  

 

I could tell you how Princess does certain things better and how Celebrity does others better.  Celebrity is just a smaller part of RCL.There is no one cruise line that does everything extremely well that I have sailed on.  I think that the non Edge ships come the closest though.  It seems like the Edge is all about making money for RCL.  As an investor I like it, as a cruiser not as much.

 

My last Edge cruise was the first time that I have not booked another Celebrity cruise while on board.

Edited October 13, 2019 by NMTraveller

[WrittenOnYourHeart]

6 hours ago, lovrccl said:

We did Edge and loved her.  We almost canceled also because of the negative info on CC.  So please go and you will enjoy her! We are so glad we went, she is our favorite ship and will be doing Apex next year.  

Thank you!! I really am excited to try something new!

[NMTraveller]

On 10/7/2019 at 9:48 AM, yorky said:

No, just off a full Equinox and everyone we spoke to loved the product. I would say it’s a line getting stronger not weaker.

Great ship.

[NMTraveller]

Still waiting for the Sky Lounge to be brought back on Edge...

 

The best of the best...  A bridge like view with a glass of wine.

 

And I have been on the bridge on Edge.  The Sky Lounge on other ships is much nicer.

 

 

Edited October 14, 2019 by NMTraveller

[danaps]

On 10/7/2019 at 5:58 PM, WrittenOnYourHeart said:

 

This would be amazing. 

 

To be honest, all the negativity on here has caused me to cancel more than once and go back to my tried, true, and trusted line. Based on a long discussion with the owner of the travel agency I use, I've decided to give Edge a try for Feb and am really trying to stay positive and excited about it, but being on here sometimes makes it hard. I TRY to avoid the negative posts, but it can be a challenge sometimes. 

 

I truly appreciate everyone who is positive and shares their positive experiences.

We are on the Edge right now and are very much enjoying it.   Other than the kind of blah martini bar, it’s been a great cruise to date.  Staff has been lovely and as an example we were able to change an excursion at the last minute without any issue.  

[cruise47]

Why are there so few posts about The Edge various cabins on the new spreadsheet compared to the S and M Class Ships Cabins Spreadsheets.
 

There are only 118 posts on The New Edge Cabins Spreadsheet. Why?
IMHO, The Edge is an Excellent Ship.

[upwarduk]

4 hours ago, cruise47 said:

Why are there so few posts about The Edge various cabins on the new spreadsheet compared to the S and M Class Ships Cabins Spreadsheets.
 

There are only 118 posts on The New Edge Cabins Spreadsheet. Why?
IMHO, The Edge is an Excellent Ship.

Because she’s only been sailing about a year, compared to the Millennium almost 20 years.g and Solstice class ships 12+ years.

Edited October 14, 2019 by upwarduk

[TeeRick]

18 hours ago, Mynki said:

Do cruise lines sailing in troubled waters commission five new ships and undertake a $500 million fleet revitalization? 

The short common sense answer in no.  But why not start a thread with a title like this one to get everybody complaining? or defending?  It worked right?  

[Mynki]

38 minutes ago, TeeRick said:

The short common sense answer in no.  But why not start a thread with a title like this one to get everybody complaining? or defending?  It worked right?  

 

Having seen the OP's other threads and when wearing my 'internet psychologist's' hat I'd say someone is attention seeking. There isn't really a polite or diplomatic way of putting it. :) 

[Spif Barwunkel]

41 minutes ago, Mynki said:

 

Having seen the OP's other threads and when wearing my 'internet psychologist's' hat I'd say someone is attention seeking. There isn't really a polite or diplomatic way of putting it. 🙂

Spif Barwunkel

• Cool Cruiser
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• September 1, 2014
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Posted Friday at 08:05 PM

On 10/11/2019 at 3:17 PM, mitz18 said:

 

Seems this is about the third thread you’ve started on this board questioning Celebrity.  I think thou protesteth to much. What are you really after?

Answers: yes; yes; yes

Actually, I'm not questioning Celebrity nor am I protesting. I'm questioning anyone who will listen. Answering, or not, is totally up to the individual and whether or not it seems worthwhile. You, mitz18, are the third person (one on each of my other two threads), who wants to know who I am and what I am all about. You realize that I am certainly not obligated to enlighten anyone about anything. Right? However, this is my last thread so here goes. At the risk of being tedious...…

 

My cruising days go back to Premier Cruise Line and The Big Red Boat. In the years up to now I have been fortunate to sail with several companies, the most recent being Celebrity. The more experienced a cruiser becomes the more aware he/she becomes of the many variables and influences that affect the journey. No cruise that I have taken has been perfect, but every cruise has been extremely enjoyable. Now hear this, and it is important, over all these years, what I've seen, heard, felt and read about - mostly pertaining to my fellow passengers - in a negative light has accumulated to the point where I just wanted to put some queries out there soliciting feedback. I thought about doing it in one thread. That would have been boorishly cumbersome. So, I put it out there in three different versions. Take notice, it's not about footstools or frosted glass or three beans in a five bean salad. It's about the human element, the interaction and consideration between cruisers as well as ships staff and passengers.

 

So there you have it, nothing nefarious, mysterious or with ulterior motive in mind. Thanks to all respondents on all three posts.

I am enlightened and I have a good idea where your heads are. More importantly, I've got nothing else for you.

 

By the way, billslowsky. I can certainly feel you when it comes to that frustratingly unreliable "Ignore Button." But hey, we are our own best ignore button. So if you are reading this, yours must have failed....again. Tech support can't help you with this one.

 

**I brought the above post over from another of my threads. Not a defense mechanism, just an explanation. All three threads did get attention, not me. That's on the viewers and respondents, not on me. Is that not what you want when you ask a question? Everyone could have subscribed to the final paragraph above. Again, that's on you, not on me.

 

4 cruises planned on X between 1/20 and 2/21. I'm on board.

Edited October 14, 2019 by Spif Barwunkel

[villauk]

52 minutes ago, Spif Barwunkel said:

4 cruises planned on X between 1/20 and 2/21. I'm on board.

 

 

Let’s hope it’s not on troubled waters then as you certainly wouldn’t want a Thomas Cook fiasco on that side of the pond too 😉. And they were paying their bigwigs millions in bonuses, right up to the end - so never say never.

[kearney]

When a ship has a significant number of unsold cabins.... I wonder if they offer a portion of those to gamblers at a significant discount or perhaps even for port charges only. If it were me and I wanted to fill up the ship... I would rather people who I know would spend money in the casino... I suspect that they know who the big losers/spenders are.... just a thought.

 

I think that if you just want a Caribbean cruise and are flexible on cabin, itinerary and timing.... you can still do well signing up after the 90 period... But if you are looking for a particular itinerary that includes stops that they don't go to often or sailing during a particular time of year (like spring break or holiday cruise)... then early is likely better... and keep an eye on prices overtime... knowing that they may not come down as much as you would like.... but you can still luck out and get a price match...

 

We were recently on Equinox... We wanted a cruise that stopped in Columbia. While on board I found one Nov 18 cruise and while few cabins remained the pricing was really pretty good.... however, we felt we would have left our dog with someone else for too long... so we booked the same itinerary in Mar... for an additional $2000 vs the Nov cruise... Frankly I am cheap and this made me sick to leave that on the table....  Now it is possible that the March cruise will drop in price... but seeing how few cabins remain this far out... I doubt it will drop by much. But again flexibility seems to be key to getting deals and the ability to jump on any deal... which is easier to do when only 2 people are involved and a challenge if planning for a larger group.

[villauk]

10 minutes ago, kearney said:

But again flexibility seems to be key to getting deals and the ability to jump on any deal... which is easier to do when only 2 people are involved and a challenge if planning for a larger group.

 

 

It is, but not very likely when still in employment and travelling as a family. The Caribbean is out too if you are having to book long-haul flights, from this side of the pond, last minute in high season. 

 

They do offer big savings to the gamblers. Look how many have cruises on Edge for free, especially when she was first released. There were many posters stating this.

Edited October 14, 2019 by villauk

[BDShramm]

5 hours ago, Spif Barwunkel said:

Spif Barwunkel

• Cool Cruiser
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• September 1, 2014
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• 282 posts

• Report post
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•  #27

Posted Friday at 08:05 PM

Actually, I'm not questioning Celebrity nor am I protesting. I'm questioning anyone who will listen. Answering, or not, is totally up to the individual and whether or not it seems worthwhile. You, mitz18, are the third person (one on each of my other two threads), who wants to know who I am and what I am all about. You realize that I am certainly not obligated to enlighten anyone about anything. Right? However, this is my last thread so here goes. At the risk of being tedious...…

 

My cruising days go back to Premier Cruise Line and The Big Red Boat. In the years up to now I have been fortunate to sail with several companies, the most recent being Celebrity. The more experienced a cruiser becomes the more aware he/she becomes of the many variables and influences that affect the journey. No cruise that I have taken has been perfect, but every cruise has been extremely enjoyable. Now hear this, and it is important, over all these years, what I've seen, heard, felt and read about - mostly pertaining to my fellow passengers - in a negative light has accumulated to the point where I just wanted to put some queries out there soliciting feedback. I thought about doing it in one thread. That would have been boorishly cumbersome. So, I put it out there in three different versions. Take notice, it's not about footstools or frosted glass or three beans in a five bean salad. It's about the human element, the interaction and consideration between cruisers as well as ships staff and passengers.

 

So there you have it, nothing nefarious, mysterious or with ulterior motive in mind. Thanks to all respondents on all three posts.

I am enlightened and I have a good idea where your heads are. More importantly, I've got nothing else for you.

 

By the way, billslowsky. I can certainly feel you when it comes to that frustratingly unreliable "Ignore Button." But hey, we are our own best ignore button. So if you are reading this, yours must have failed....again. Tech support can't help you with this one.

 

**I brought the above post over from another of my threads. Not a defense mechanism, just an explanation. All three threads did get attention, not me. That's on the viewers and respondents, not on me. Is that not what you want when you ask a question? Everyone could have subscribed to the final paragraph above. Again, that's on you, not on me.

 

4 cruises planned on X between 1/20 and 2/21. I'm on board.

I have been on the Edge and I loved it. I have two more cruises planned on the Edge. One in December and one in March. I have been on 53 cruises so I have something to compare to. Just saying. 😁👍👍👍

[ECCruise]

On 10/13/2019 at 3:55 PM, Mynki said:

Do cruise lines sailing in troubled waters commission five new ships and undertake a $500 million fleet revitalization? 

Renaissance Cruise Lines.  Asked and answered.

[Mynki]

6 hours ago, ECCruise said:

Renaissance Cruise Lines.  Asked and answered.

 

Not really. Renaissance didn't embark on a $500 fleet wide revitalization program. Nor did they commission five new ships at the same time as the upgrade program.... 

Still, some could argue they'd be no Azamara or Oceania if they didn't go bust. That's about as relevant! 

Edited October 15, 2019 by Mynki

[ECCruise]

6 hours ago, Mynki said:

 

Not really. Renaissance didn't embark on a $500 fleet wide revitalization program. Nor did they commission five new ships at the same time as the upgrade program.... 

Still, some could argue they'd be no Azamara or Oceania if they didn't go bust. That's about as relevant! 

I dunno.  I guess building 8 brand new ships in less than 3 years at a total cost of ~ $2.4 Billion in 2019 $ when there were financial issues (that not many knew about) would qualify.  They sure didn't need a $500m revitalization program (20% of what the new builds cost) since the entire inventory was new. 

[BigAl94]

The mess they have made of the UK website this week isn't going to help!

[Mynki]

2 hours ago, ECCruise said:

I dunno.  I guess building 8 brand new ships in less than 3 years at a total cost of ~ $2.4 Billion in 2019 $ when there were financial issues (that not many knew about) would qualify.  They sure didn't need a $500m revitalization program (20% of what the new builds cost) since the entire inventory was new. 

 

Indeed. I'm struggling to see how a cruise line that went bang almost 20 years ago is relevant to the OP's question though. Renaissance cruise line were hit hard by a lack of post 9/11 travellers I believe. Didn't they also refuse to work with TA's? 

Do you think Celebrity are sailing in troubled waters as per the OP's question? Personally I don't, despite being frustrated and disappointed with some of their changes! 

[ECCruise]

4 minutes ago, Mynki said:

 

Indeed. I'm struggling to see how a cruise line that went bang almost 20 years ago is relevant to the OP's question though. Renaissance cruise line were hit hard by a lack of post 9/11 travellers I believe. Didn't they also refuse to work with TA's? 

Do you think Celebrity are sailing in troubled waters as per the OP's question? Personally I don't, despite being frustrated and disappointed with some of their changes! 

They actually were in deep trouble] before 9/11, which just put the final nail in the coffin.  They folded less than 2 weeks after 9/11.  Yes, they had other issues.  No TAs, no smoking, no kids.  Would work now, but was boneheaded then.

 

No, I don't necessarily think =X= is sailing in troubled waters.  Was just responding to the other posters question as to whether it had ever happened before.  I think it really is relevant since Renaissance folded because of the stupid decisions mentioned above and then 9/11 finalized it.  And I think that Celebrity has made a number of stupid decisions lately.  

Only time will tell.  ⏲️

 

[Groovygramma]

We are at the beginning of our retirement and look forward to cruising more frequently then previously.  We have for the past 5 years cruised for two weeks a year and usually chose X as our go to as it offered the experiences that we enjoyed.  It is concerning that they are adding additional cost for less service and perks.  We currently have two future cruises booked with X but when looking for a European cruise next fall was shocked when pricing X compared to other cruise lines.  The cost of a comparable date, stateroom and #days was more than double a couple of the other companies (without any perks). We will definitely look at other cruise line options in the future and did in fact book with another line in September for 1/2 celebrities cost.  It is very disappointing because we were very loyal X customers and will likely not travel with them in the future.  What was really interesting is that Azamara had a comparable itinerary for less then X and it is all inclusive. As Azamara is touted as the elite line in the celebrity family and from our experience on an Azamara cruise was definitely above in service performance I don’t know what management is thinking.  I guess time will tell