So is NCL ( NCLH ) in financial trouble ?

[JIMESOPUS]

With the sudden cut's in entertainment ( example Kinky Boots, Syd's and Priscilla ).

The increase in the DSC couple with the announced (  I haven't seen anything official from NCL, yet ) cuts in cabin service.

Along with missing ports to reduce the carbon footprint ( reduce fuel consumption ).

Increased cost of the beverage package ( starting 1/1/2023 ) and restaurants ( Teppanyaki and Moderno )

Along with the 9% layoffs this past month in Miami.

 

I'm wondering is it the boost year end numbers, which is due 2/27/2023 or are they in trouble?

 

 

 

[njhorseman]

Surely this thread's title is a rhetorical question. 

Edited January 4, 2023 by njhorseman

[shof515]

Teppanyaki is also reducing the food quality too. ive been seeing a new menu being posted that filet mignon is being replaced with a ny strip piece of meat

[dexddd]

I think a fair question.  I gave little hope as the shutdown kept extending yet they are here today.  I was wrong.

 

Delicate balance to get folks onboard and for us die yards here who know too much.  IMO they could care less about regular, frequent cruisers whether insides, balcony, club, suite, or Haven.  They can penny pinch onboard yet send three a week glossy flyers to our house.  Maybe give option of little extra onboard and save flyers to help carbon footprint, for our convenience, of course.

[luv2kroooz]

All cruise lines are experiencing severe financial strain due to significant debt acquired during and post COVID. Additionally, the public demand for cruising has not yet returned to pre COVID.

 

Cruise lines are reacting by cutting services, entertainment, workforce, and other costs while intentionally raising fees for internet, beverage packages,  daily service charges. It is across the board service cuts and material fee increases on a weekly basis by every cruise line.

 

We have zero cruises booked on any cruise line since the overall fares charged are no longer justified by the vacation delivered, in our opinion. We are not against paying more if more is delivered in the experience. Right now, the environment is pay more, get less. Pay more for internet, get crappy speeds; pay more for beverage packages, get less selection; pay more for service charges, get less service; pay more for specialty dining, get fewer meals. NCL makes so many changes to itineraries and onboard product offering that we don't even know what we are booking anymore.

[vacation44]

17 minutes ago, shof515 said:

Teppanyaki is also reducing the food quality too. ive been seeing a new menu being posted that filet mignon is being replaced with a ny strip piece of meat

That is disappointing.  

[njkate]

34 minutes ago, luv2kroooz said:

All cruise lines are experiencing severe financial strain due to significant debt acquired during and post COVID. Additionally, the public demand for cruising has not yet returned to pre COVID.

 

Cruise lines are reacting by cutting services, entertainment, workforce, and other costs while intentionally raising fees for internet, beverage packages,  daily service charges. It is across the board service cuts and material fee increases on a weekly basis by every cruise line.

 

We have zero cruises booked on any cruise line since the overall fares charged are no longer justified by the vacation delivered, in our opinion. We are not against paying more if more is delivered in the experience. Right now, the environment is pay more, get less. Pay more for internet, get crappy speeds; pay more for beverage packages, get less selection; pay more for service charges, get less service; pay more for specialty dining, get fewer meals. NCL makes so many changes to itineraries and onboard product offering that we don't even know what we are booking anymore.

I have to agree with you. I have a cruise on Dawn in March of this year. I have a trans Atlantic booked for April 2024 that I got at a decent price tad over 5k for two balcony including the air. 
I was looking at cruises for this summer, Europe, forget about it, between the cost of the cruise and airfare it was just too dam much. So instead we will do 9 days in France splitting our time between Paris and Normandy. Yes, the air is still outrageous but saving thousands over a cruise after air, lodging, food and drink factored in. We are renting through VRBO so we don’t have to eat all our meals out.

The one cruise I was eyeing as it stopped in Le Harve and we want to tour Normandy was well over 2k pp for an inside before airfare. That 2k pp used to buy us a balcony. Port fees and taxes are also high.

 

Then for august was looking at a 5 day from NY to Bermuda, no air involved, 4 of us, 2 ocean view cabins, after every thing was added on pushing 7k for a 5 day cruise.

The days of a cruise being a decent vacation at a decent price is long over, if it keeps going the way it is it will be only the very well to do that can afford it

[gatorchinsky]

1 hour ago, shof515 said:

Teppanyaki is also reducing the food quality too. ive been seeing a new menu being posted that filet mignon is being replaced with a ny strip piece of meat

 Very disappointing. They are also adding a $10 supplement dining plan charge to Le Bistro’s beef tenderloin.

 

We got a great deal on a Greece/Italy cruise using up FCC and military discount so this might be our last NCL cruise for awhile. Cutbacks on the things we enjoyed with NCL just don’t make it a decent value anymore.

[ColeThornton]

8 hours ago, JIMESOPUS said:

......or are they in trouble?

 

 

"Trouble" would be a major understatement.

[SimplyAlbert]

We have two cruises booked for 2023 and nothing after that.   One is a cruise that I booked on Pride of America during the shutdown and got a great deal on.  The other is an upcoming one on the Breakaway of of New Orleans (which we also did last year).  If we notice a decline in food/entertainment/service we'll probably skip cruising in 2024 and do something else.  Right now I'm going to wait to see how it goes.

 

Same thing happened with Disney World.   We used to be frequent visitors, but with the rise in costs, cuts in everything else, poor food quality, etc. we haven't been back since 2017.   Once we started branching out into other vacations (and our children are all adults now), we've had no desire to go back.

[cruiseny4life]

2 hours ago, shof515 said:

Teppanyaki is also reducing the food quality too. ive been seeing a new menu being posted that filet mignon is being replaced with a ny strip piece of meat

The menu we had this week showed NY Strip, yet we still received a filet. We'll, I didn't, because I ordered shrimp, scallops, and squid.

[JIMESOPUS]

Compared to members on this site, I would consider myself as a newbie, I threw this out last night after reading a few threads about the current conditions aboard the BA, GA and the Escape ( the next three cruises that are booked and fully paid ). I was wondering if I'm over reacting to the all the changes, I know changes will occur but it appears now that the combined effect will hurt the cruising experience.

 

 

 

[All-ready2cruise]

To me, the question is, how could they not be in trouble and if they are not in trouble, what would that tell us?  

[cruiseny4life]

5 minutes ago, JIMESOPUS said:

Compared to members on this site, I would consider myself as a newbie, I threw this out last night after reading a few threads about the current conditions aboard the BA, GA and the Escape ( the next three cruises that are booked and fully paid ). I was wondering if I'm over reacting to the all the changes, I know changes will occur but it appears now that the combined effect will hurt the cruising experience.

 

 

 

Read through the financial documents. They are in trouble. I want them to not be in trouble, but they are. They have massive debt. Their profit from 2019 would barely cover (might not quite cover) just their debt service now. They haven't been profitable yet. They claim that'll come in mid-2023. We will see about that. 

 

Personally, I want them to continue existing. Cruising NCL is good vacationing. Even if I have reasons to whine occasionally. 

[ggTexasGal]

The situation makes me think of this (from "Big Bang"):

Leonard Hofstadter:
Alright, well let me see if I can explain your situation using physics. What would you be if you were attached to another object by an incline plane wrapped helically around an axis?

Sheldon Cooper:
Screwed.

Leonard Hofstadter:
There you go.

[msbrookelyn]

2 hours ago, dexddd said:

I think a fair question.  I gave little hope as the shutdown kept extending yet they are here today.  I was wrong.

 

Delicate balance to get folks onboard and for us die yards here who know too much.  IMO they could care less about regular, frequent cruisers whether insides, balcony, club, suite, or Haven.  They can penny pinch onboard yet send three a week glossy flyers to our house.  Maybe give option of little extra onboard and save flyers to help carbon footprint, for our convenience, of course.

They could DEFINITELY cut back on the mailings. Heres the thing... if most of us are going to cruise, we are already browsing and planning. Vacations are not something that you can trick people into doing. If it's happening, it's happening. You don't need to mail me postcards. 

[shof515]

4 minutes ago, msbrookelyn said:

They could DEFINITELY cut back on the mailings. Heres the thing... if most of us are going to cruise, we are already browsing and planning. Vacations are not something that you can trick people into doing. If it's happening, it's happening. You don't need to mail me postcards. 

 

i noticed whenever i log into my NCL account, within a few days i get a post card with the free at sea advisement. seems dumb and waste of money to be printing it out and mailing

[wcook]

In trouble as in going out of business? Nope. In trouble as in not making enough money to keep the shareholders happy? Yep.  Expect belt tightening industry wide. 

[Yesimapirate]

21 minutes ago, ggTexasGal said:

The situation makes me think of this (from "Big Bang"):

Leonard Hofstadter:
Alright, well let me see if I can explain your situation using physics. What would you be if you were attached to another object by an incline plane wrapped helically around an axis?

Sheldon Cooper:
Screwed.

Leonard Hofstadter:
There you go.

Totally disagree.  NCL isn't going anywhere.   Nor are the other 3 major players.

 

Much like the post-911 airline situation, the only ones truly in danger are the creditors.  At some point,  the cruiseline holding companies with refinance to extend their debt.  Eventually,  if it become too much they'll delist and either go bankrupt or to private equity.  

 

November was the busiest month for bookings in the company's history.  They have a track record of profitability.  Wall St is not going to let them disappear. 

[BirdTravels]

3 hours ago, shof515 said:

Teppanyaki is also reducing the food quality too. ive been seeing a new menu being posted that filet mignon is being replaced with a ny strip piece of meat

And the breakfast steak was changed from filet to NY strip. The world is coming to an end. 
 

And the smoked salmon on the buffet is now a salmon moose again 😔

 

And veggie burgers are only made to

order vs being on the buffet (since 90% were being thrown out due to lack

if interest). 

[njhorseman]

57 minutes ago, JIMESOPUS said:

Compared to members on this site, I would consider myself as a newbie, I threw this out last night after reading a few threads about the current conditions aboard the BA, GA and the Escape ( the next three cruises that are booked and fully paid ). I was wondering if I'm over reacting to the all the changes, I know changes will occur but it appears now that the combined effect will hurt the cruising experience.

 

 

 

One observation on your question. Nothing that you've noted NCL is doing will have a noticeable effect on their 2022 results. Some of the more significant actions such as increasing the daily service charge, increasing the beverage package prices and decreasing cabin attendant services are only taking effect in 2023. The 2/27/23 financial reports cover 2022 so nothing that is happening in 2023 can possibly affect the 2/27 financial report .

 

It's all about the financial trouble NCLH is in . All this does for the 2/27 report is give NCL the ability to say 'Look at everything we're doing to improve our results in the future."  Forward looking statements are essentially hot air to make the company's financials look as good as possible.

Edited January 4, 2023 by njhorseman

[PATRLR]

1 hour ago, cruiseny4life said:

The menu we had this week showed NY Strip, yet we still received a filet. We'll, I didn't, because I ordered shrimp, scallops, and squid.

I wonder how you knew.  If I took a strip and cut it to about the size of a tenderloin, how would you know the difference in a Teppenyaki environment?

[njhorseman]

16 minutes ago, BirdTravels said:

salmon moose

That's giving me a mental picture I won't easily forget. 🤣

 

18 minutes ago, BirdTravels said:

 

And veggie burgers are only made to

order vs being on the buffet (since 90% were being thrown out due to lack

if interest). 

If that's the case they should have been making them to order all along, or at least not making nearly as many in advance. 

[ggTexasGal]

28 minutes ago, Yesimapirate said:

Totally disagree.  NCL isn't going anywhere.   Nor are the other 3 major players.

 

Much like the post-911 airline situation, the only ones truly in danger are the creditors.  At some point,  the cruiseline holding companies with refinance to extend their debt.  Eventually,  if it become too much they'll delist and either go bankrupt or to private equity.  

 

November was the busiest month for bookings in the company's history.  They have a track record of profitability.  Wall St is not going to let them disappear. 

Meant as a "humor post" only, since, if you we don't want to be paying more to continue cruising, we might feel "wrapped helically around an axis"!

[Illbcruzn4life]

49 minutes ago, msbrookelyn said:

They could DEFINITELY cut back on the mailings. Heres the thing... if most of us are going to cruise, we are already browsing and planning. Vacations are not something that you can trick people into doing. If it's happening, it's happening. You don't need to mail me postcards. 

 I put them right into the recycling bin. When looking at cruises I don't even consider NCL anymore.

 

Still has me wondering how a cabin @$799pp turns into a $3000 bill. What with the FREE stuff and the overinflated port charges/govt fees. Wonder why NCL's are usually twice what other cruise lines are charging.