The End of Lincoln Center

[The-Inside-Cabin]

1 hour ago, SharonN said:

The 7:30 show was almost full at least downstairs I couldn't see the balcony. 

There ended up being about 50 people at the 9:30 - but the 9:30 shows are always light on most ships - esp world cruises.    

[TiogaCruiser]

13 hours ago, 3rdGenCunarder said:

Perhaps the problem with LC is that it didn't generate any profit. Rolling Stone and BB King have bars, don't they? There's no beverage service at LC on the ships where it's squeezed into Explorer Lounge. Even when LC had its own space on K'dam, bar waiters came around before the performance, but once it started, there was no service. This was appropriate, as a waiter moving through the rows would have been distracting, but it reduced HAL's chance to make some money. 

 

Ah, the Hell Cats. I was not sorry to see them screech their way out the door.

Prior to LCS Adagio was in Explorers Lounge, and there was a bar server there. That was my evening hangout for several hours. Often the place was full.  I prefer that to the short concerts that comprise LCS.

[3rdGenCunarder]

7 hours ago, paulvdb1 said:

9:30 is too late for the type of crowd that like LCS. On Noordam it was often in the afternoon then 6 and 8. They're just using the management model to kill things - change the location and time, take away the more personal nature of the performance. No-one turns up, then they say "no-one like LCS any more so we've eliminated an unpopular option" On Noordam we had 100 at every show that I went to (out of 1700 passenger cruise). That was more than Rolling Stone / Billboard / World Stage for just about any of their events. 

World Stage in HAL is abysmal. I think the management types have just said we need $x per m2 out of every section of the ship and are killing anything free.

If that continues then why would anyone travel HAL or any cruise ship if they are all doing it.   

 

"the management model to kill things" What a good way to explain it. The first time I was on K'dam, Lincoln Center had its own space. Because it was so open to a walkway, they had to post signs and a "shh!" person outside to keep the nearby noise down. The times were convenient, and the place was always packed, both early and later performances. 

 

The next year, LC had moved into BBKing space. Because HAL gave BBK the best evening time slots, LC got stuck with late afternoon, when people are returning from excursions and not thinking about entertainment. And 6:00 is ridiculous. People who eat early are in the dining room, and people who eat later are getting ready for dinner. I went as often as I could, but it was not convenient. I think I watched a lot of movies on that cruise. 

 

 

 

 

[Shep_Proudfoot]

21 hours ago, Mary229 said:
 

It is hard for live entertainment to compete with streaming video, movies and other mass media.  It is a new generation 

Could not disagree more. Live entertainment, done well as Lincoln Center was, is infinitely more compelling than commoditized digital entertainment will ever be.

[SilvertoGold]

I expect the Explorer Lounge will be renovated with an added bar. Given its size it would be better than the Pinnacle Lounge as a pre-dinner lounge.

[HappyInVan]

7 hours ago, paulvdb1 said:

9:30 is too late for the type of crowd that like LCS. On Noordam it was often in the afternoon then 6 and 8.

 

Agreed. I've been on K twice in 2022. Strong turnout in the LCS venue at 6pm. Less so at 4pm and 8pm.

 

Anyway, I wonder what will replace the quartet? Hip Hop? 😁

 

[Mary229]

2 hours ago, Shep_Proudfoot said:

Could not disagree more. Live entertainment, done well as Lincoln Center was, is infinitely more compelling than commoditized digital entertainment will ever be.

You don’t like the London Symphony, the Boston Pops, the NY Phil?  

Edited January 8, 2023 by Mary229

[OlsSalt]

Recent Konnigsdam Lincoln Center - it was packed, when they were playing straight classical pieces - got standing ovations - they were superb.

 

Smaller crowds, when required to play watered down, out of the classical genre selections. Loved having this long standing HAL tradition continue and the space offered for this was lovely in all regards - except for the acoustic compromises being an open-sided space on one side.

 

This is Chamber Music - to be played in a smaller more intimate setting; not on the World Stage and NEVER with the use of microphones to fill such a large inanimate space if offered only as a special evening performance. The early evening, pre-dinner hours worked best for us to have a few special musical moments  to wind down from the day.

 

Agree, this would be a loss to a long standing HAL tradition for evening "chamber music". May this tradition continue on the smaller ships,  even if reduced to only a two- person ensemble since many of them were quite good.

[cruisemom42]

37 minutes ago, Mary229 said:

You don’t like the London Symphony, the Boston Pops, the NY Phil?  

 

I do, but seeing them on TV or the internet is not the same kind of experience as seeing and hearing music played live.  At least, not for me.

 

I'd venture to guess if they were to hook one up to one of those machines that measures brain activity, the areas that would "light up" at a live concert versus a virtual one would be quite different.

 

 

[Mary229]

2 minutes ago, cruisemom42 said:

 

I do, but seeing them on TV or the internet is not the same kind of experience as seeing and hearing music played live.  At least, not for me.

 

I'd venture to guess if they were to hook one up to one of those machines that measures brain activity, the areas that would "light up" at a live concert versus a virtual one would be quite different.

 

 

The audio fidelity is amazing with good ear pods.  I performed in college and I am perhaps a bit more critical .  I would prefer to listen to virtuosos. I have not found that the performances on the music walk that satisfying.  I have enjoyed soloists or special performers in theater 

Edited January 8, 2023 by Mary229

[Ipeeinthepools]

47 minutes ago, Mary229 said:

You don’t like the London Symphony, the Boston Pops, the NY Phil?  

 

When are they scheduled to be on HAL ships?   Let me know and I'll be there.

[Mary229]

Just now, Ipeeinthepools said:

 

When are they scheduled to be on HAL ships?   Let me know and I'll be there.

We were talking about streaming or with Apple Music you can download it for your onboard enjoyment.   Again Cruise Critic needs to get nesting 

[ToBe]

On 1/7/2023 at 1:06 PM, tupper10 said:

I guess they no longer want us to cruise anymore with them. It was one of the things we liked best about their cruises. The demise of Lincoln Center means that they don't really value their loyal customers and want to change the demographic, oh well.  

I totally agree.  Lincoln Center was the best entertainment we ever have had on a cruise ship. 

[Tampa Girl]

1 hour ago, Mary229 said:

You don’t like the London Symphony, the Boston Pops, the NY Phil?  

 

How does not liking digitalized performances equate to a general dislike to the London Symphony, etc?  I greatly enjoy listening to digitalized music, but agree with the poster that a live production is, for me, much more compelling.  

[Mary229]

4 minutes ago, Tampa Girl said:

 

How does not liking digitalized performances equate to a general dislike to the London Symphony, etc?  I greatly enjoy listening to digitalized music, but agree with the poster that a live production is, for me, much more compelling.  

I responded to someone who called streaming music as “commoditized”. I assumed by that comment that poster was not aware of the high quality performances available.   I am trying to be very delicate here and have tried to diplomatically state my opinion of the HAL music walk performance but perhaps I should just say it - they are not satisfactory.  And the worst offender is BB King 

Edited January 8, 2023 by Mary229

[SharonN]

4 hours ago, SilvertoGold said:

I expect the Explorer Lounge will be renovated with an added bar. Given its size it would be better than the Pinnacle Lounge as a pre-dinner lounge.

There is a Classical Duo scheduled most days on the Zuiderdam right now in the Explorer's Lounge so probably similar to what they used to have. Haven't been by there when they're playing so don't know any more than that.

[foodsvcmgr]

Reverting to the classical piano/violin duo in Explorers and rotating the larger Lincoln Center groups ship to ship would be a lot more palatable than just eliminating classical music altogether.

Hopefully what you are experiencing on ZUIDERDAM now will be the new model.

Much better than the news story implied.

[GeezerCouple]

1 hour ago, cruisemom42 said:

 

I do, but seeing them on TV or the internet is not the same kind of experience as seeing and hearing music played live.  At least, not for me.

 

I'd venture to guess if they were to hook one up to one of those machines that measures brain activity, the areas that would "light up" at a live concert versus a virtual one would be quite different.

 

 

 

This ^^

 

It's NOT the same, not even close.

 

I'm not a jazz aficionado, but trying to imagine a possible similarity...

For someone who enjoys evenings (or afternoons, etc.) at jazz clubs or such, would watching the same thing on a movie (or a TV!?) be the same for you?

If "yes", then why bother to leave home, find parking, pay for the tickets/etc....?

 

GC

[REOVA]

11 minutes ago, foodsvcmgr said:

 

Hopefully what you are experiencing on ZUIDERDAM now will be the new model.

Much better than the news story implied.

Keep in mind what is happening on Zuiderdam may not be indicative of fleet wide since its a GWC (and spoils many of us for later cruises 😄). But I do remember having the duo or trio playing up in the MDR as well. Don't think that will happen again. 

[Mary229]

56 minutes ago, GeezerCouple said:

 

This ^^

 

It's NOT the same, not even close.

 

I'm not a jazz aficionado, but trying to imagine a possible similarity...

For someone who enjoys evenings (or afternoons, etc.) at jazz clubs or such, would watching the same thing on a movie (or a TV!?) be the same for you?

If "yes", then why bother to leave home, find parking, pay for the tickets/etc....?

 

GC

For someone who has heard great jazz in person I can assuredly say it is far better to listen to the streaming version of great jazz than listen to BB King lounge on HAL 

[SilvertoGold]

1 hour ago, SharonN said:

There is a Classical Duo scheduled most days on the Zuiderdam right now in the Explorer's Lounge so probably similar to what they used to have. Haven't been by there when they're playing so don't know any more than that.

Thanks, Sharon, that is a plus for the WC!  BTW: love your Blog and want to thank you for the editing :)

[jimbob22]

23 minutes ago, Mary229 said:

For someone who has heard great jazz in person I can assuredly say it is far better to listen to the streaming version of great jazz than listen to BB King lounge on HAL 

just out of curiosity, what music would you want to see? Obviously, BB/RS are just cover bands, not bigtime recording artists.  If they got rid of all of it and said they would replace with a mix of variety acts, I'd probably be ok with it.  My biggest pet peeve is drastic cutbacks on food quality on cruises in general, not specific to Hal (yes, I realize there's no free lobster, but we had no issues with the quality and variety of is available).

Edited January 8, 2023 by jimbob22

[Mary229]

Just now, jimbob22 said:

just out of curiosity, what music would you want to see? Obviously, BB/RS are just cover bands, not bigtime recording artists.  If they got rid of all of it and said they would replace with a mix of variety acts, I'd probably be ok with it.  My biggest pet peeve is drastic cutbacks on food quality (yes, I realize there's no free lobster, but we had no issues with the quality and variety of is available).

I have heard excellent performers in the theatre.  These are usually special acts or soloist hired for a single or a series of concerts and are usually virtuosos.  The house bands used on the music walk are not, they are interchangeable and quoting a former poster - “commoditized” versions of branded music.  I am fine with BB Kings, Billboards and Rolling Stones as lounge music suitable for dancing, socializing or partying.  
 

Classical music doesn’t have that middle ground in my mind.  It should either be performed well or not at all.   

[Hlitner]

8 hours ago, vswan said:

............

 

I am not sure what the answer is for HAL's entertainment. Perhaps they need to start doing things earlier in the day - 4, 5 or 6 and keep things going rather than trying to get us to be ready to party at 9. By 9, if I haven't started "partying" I am ready for a movie and bed...

And therein lies the issue with HAL.  Many passengers are early to bed and early to rise.  Consider that on Seabourn (part of the HAL group) the MDR does not even open for dinner until 7pm  (7-9) and there is usually one main show (I think its usually at 9:30).  I mentioned that when we have cruised on Celebrity, they will sometimes have an adult comedy show which is generally at 11:30 and it is often SRO.

 

I imagine if HAL opened the MDR for dinner at 3:30 and had a show at 5 it would suit at least half the passengers who would be happy to head back to their cabins by 6:30.  In fact, just tell the Floridians that there is an "Early Bird" dinner at 3:30 and lobster tails are 50% off and they would fill the MDR 🙂

 

Hank

[Kamfish642]

On 1/7/2023 at 12:38 PM, mcrcruiser said:

Candidly it is a shame that this is happening .We loved the old HAL .now they want to encourage the younger generations  .However ,the  younger generations can ill afford the longer HAK cruises being  produced  .so why change a good thing ?

Scary part is that the younger generation is probably in 50s, which has different tastes in entertainment.  HAL needs to evolve business model to look at upcoming generations to be successful in the future due to intense competition.