Celebrity breach of contract.

[gizmodog]

I do wish you luck, I applaud you for trying but celebrity is a big corporation and I doubt you will win, although I wish you would.

bait and switch might be the wrong term, maybe unethical to change their services to sky suites like this when so many people booked expecting more upgraded services. I too have a  sky suite booked in January from last year and it’s upsetting to say the least that they have done this. I love cruising and received a good price on this suite or I too would have cancelled. We will see what the cruise is like and go from there.

good luck!

[Ex-Airbalancer]

15 minutes ago, chuckroast1 said:

Have you actually found an attorney that would take your case?

 

There always a lawyer ready on hourly rate ready 🤣

[EatonDoolittle]

18 minutes ago, chuckroast1 said:

Have you actually found an attorney that would take your case?

 

 

Better Call Saul.

 

Speedy Justice For You

[cruisestitch]

Sadly Celebrity “promises” many things the don’t deliver.  Look at the threads about early/late dining “reservations”!on E class ships.  Nope, all open seating.  They are sloppy in their communication and it never seems to get better but I don’t see how the OP’s threatened lawsuit will lead to any improvements 

[jelayne]

Personally would not waste the time or $ to sue over the Butter issue.  We just downgraded 2 SS bookings to SVs, where th price is in line with the service and amenities,  For us Sky Suites sans butler are not worth the price.  

[OceanCruise]

On another thread I posted this Celebrity link I received in a Celebrity email regarding my upcoming Sky Suite reservation. It is a Celebrity blog (August 2023) that tells all the amazing services that the Sky Suite butler will do to pamper guests (that they actually used to do before the staffing change) but, according to reports on Cruise Critic, in reality isn't happening anymore

https://www.celebritycruises.com/blog/cruise-butler

[alexandria]

10 hours ago, Andy&Mary Reno said:

We had paid off the cruise way before  the "penalty period had just begun. Regardless they offered  FCC.  There was other issues. We have decided to retain Counsel. It seems to me. Celebrity wants to hold you to a contract that they breeched. Very one sided. I believe in principles and ethical practices, Celebrity doesn't.    

Retired trial attorney here.  What, exactly, do you contend would be your measure of damages?  In other words, what is the monetary value of the benefit(s) you allege that Celebrity failed to provide in violation of this "contract"?

 

I am not admitted in Florida, but I would likely charge you $750/hr plus expenses with a $15,000 retainer (to be applied to the billable hours until exhausted or any unearned retainer amount is refunded).  Unless Celebrity offered a "nuisance settlement" that you were willing to accept, you'd need to be prepared to spend well in excess of the retainer amount to achieve any significant result (if such a result were even possible).  Litigation against a large corporation is not quick and inexpensive, rather it is time consumer and costly.  And no attorney worth hiring would ever accept a case such as yours on contingency.  Consumer litigation almost never pays off for the consumer.  If the actions of a company are egregious enough and impact enough consumers, class action litigation might be a course that is taken but in that case, class counsel (the lawyers) are the winners and the consumers involved (other than a few named class representatives) generally only receive a modest refund or discount (in this case, probably a token amount of FCC).  Even the named class representatives only end up with a modest cash settlement.

 

Sorry you were disappointed in your experience with Celebrity (with dozens of cruises under my belt since the 1970's, I sailed Celebrity for the first time a month or so ago and wasn't very impressed).  If you came to see me about your situation, I'd caution you that hiring me to litigate this would be penny wise, pound foolish, and encourage you to vote with your wallet and find another cruise line to patronize.  At the end, if you insisted on pursuing a legal claim, I would politely decline to take your case.  Just based upon what you have posted, you simply don't have a case.

 

Best wishes.

 

 

[CruisinShips]

4 hours ago, mnocket said:

It never fails to disappoint me how many cheerleaders will reflexively jump to side with the cruise lines against almost any complaint against the company. I don't know if Celebrity has the contractual right to change any or every aspect of their product after a customer has purchased it, or not. To me it really doesn't matter -  either way it's treating their customers wrong.  Something can be both legal and wrong. If the OP does indeed proceed with legal action, I hope they win - although I fear it will likely be throwing good money after bad. Still they have my support and gratitude for standing up against a company for doing wrong by their customers, because they know they can get away with it. It's sad to see so many side with the company🙁

It won't be too soon when we can stop reading these repetitive SS/no butler posts. The ironic part is that cruises continue to sell out well in advance, even as suite prices continue to rise.

 

People are "siding with the company" because we love cruising and we still find many reasons to patronize our preferred cruise lines.  When the negatives outweigh the positives, which apparently they have for some and haven't for most, people will stop posting here and move on.  Until then, people will continue to "side with the company".

Edited December 27, 2023 by CruisinShips

[truckswain]

4 hours ago, mnocket said:

It never fails to disappoint me how many cheerleaders will reflexively jump to side with the cruise lines against almost any complaint against the company. I don't know if Celebrity has the contractual right to change any or every aspect of their product after a customer has purchased it, or not. To me it really doesn't matter -  either way it's treating their customers wrong.  Something can be both legal and wrong. If the OP does indeed proceed with legal action, I hope they win - although I fear it will likely be throwing good money after bad. Still they have my support and gratitude for standing up against a company for doing wrong by their customers, because they know they can get away with it. It's sad to see so many side with the company🙁

This is not cheerleading, simply pointing out that "bait and switch" or "false advertising" simply does not apply.  People need to read their cruise ticket/contract.

 

What disappoints me is how many have yet to take a cruise with the new policies and already are complaining.  Take the cruise first.  Will the experience be different? For sure, Will it be better or worse?  Who knows.

 

The best thing to do is vote with your vacation dollars and cruise other lines.

 

But, please come back to the Celebrity Boards and post how much better the cruise line you found is because we all some much enjoy those posts. 

[hcat]

2 hours ago, Ex-Airbalancer said:

There always a lawyer ready on hourly rate ready 🤣

but not if its a loser!

[leaveitallbehind]

36 minutes ago, CruisinShips said:

People are "siding with the company" because we love cruising and we still find many reasons to patronize our preferred cruise lines.  When the negatives outweigh the positives, which apparently they have for some and haven't for most, people will stop posting here and move on.  Until then, people will continue to "side with the company".

And to add, IMO it's very easy - but unfair - to label others as something (in this case a "cheerleader") simply because they express an opposing opinion.  It's something altogether different to express a valid point of view and ask relevant questions, or to point out, in this case, Celebrity's stated policies to help clarify the situation.  IMO, that is just adding to the discussion in an objective manner.

 

And to clarify, I only make these comments in support of my responses on this thread.

[Jim_Iain]

2 hours ago, chuckroast1 said:

Have you actually found an attorney that would take your case?

 

 

I'm sure many attorney would take the cast at $250/hour but none that would take it on a contingency. 

 

In this particular case the OP was offered a FCC which would normally be considered an acceptable offer but I can understand that someone that is not interested in the new SkySuite experience would not want a get a FCC that they would not use.

 

We normally travel in Upper Suites and to be honest really don't use the butler and he is always coming around trying to provide services we aren't interested in.    For the most part all we use a Butler for is doing our Laundry which a room attendant could easily handle.  

 

I'm sure this may be greeted with negativity BUT..... in my experience and observation the change may have been made due to those in Sky Suites demanding and pushing the boundaries and requiring far more time consuming service than those I would ever consider asking for.    OK... it's just us we really don't utilize the butler much.  

[hcat]

never read the full contract as we are mainly interested in insurance issues if we get sick or injured

 

.Is there an arbitration/ mediation clause, where is jurisdiction set? 

 

if these cases were goldmines  I'm sure we would have heard!

 

Not a cheerleader but "it is what it is." We tried a suite but prefer AQ class so not directly affected...other than  our sympathy .

[PTC DAWG]

1 hour ago, jelayne said:

Personally would not waste the time or $ to sue over the Butter issue.  We just downgraded 2 SS bookings to SVs, where th price is in line with the service and amenities,  For us Sky Suites sans butler are not worth the price.  

The retreat area on the E Class and the extra space in the cabin are my and the Brides main draws…YMMV. 

[PTC DAWG]

29 minutes ago, Jim_Iain said:

 

 

I'm sure this may be greeted with negativity BUT..... in my experience and observation the change may have been made due to those in Sky Suites demanding and pushing the boundaries and requiring far more time consuming service than those I would ever consider asking for.    OK... it's just us we really don't utilize the butler much.  

I think you make excellent points here..I am the same way regarding a butler..

[sanger727]

2 hours ago, CruisinShips said:

It won't be too soon when we can stop reading these repetitive SS/no butler posts. The ironic part is that cruises continue to sell out well in advance, even as suite prices continue to rise.

 

People are "siding with the company" because we love cruising and we still find many reasons to patronize our preferred cruise lines.  When the negatives outweigh the positives, which apparently they have for some and haven't for most, people will stop posting here and move on.  Until then, people will continue to "side with the company".

 

I'm a bystander in all this. Celebrity suite prices have always been higher than I was willing to pay and I'm sure will continue to be in the future.

 

It is interesting, however, go back through old posts where people asked what exactly the butler did for them and what the use was. It seemed that many didn't use their butler other than to fill their fridge and bring preferred snacks. Now the world is ending that that benefit is self serve in the retreat lounge. It's hard to take people who want to argue that sky suites are a waste of money now that they have to get their own drinks when they still have the retreat sundeck, retreat lounge, and luminae. 

[CruisersTimesThree]

Retained counsel? You must have a lot of disposable income. You are wasting your money and any lawyer who took this case is laughing all the way to the bank! I’m sure Celebrity has themselves covered for everything they change.

Just curious, what did you expect out of a butler that the Retreat team won’t provide? You’ll still have breakfast/coffee delivered daily, snacks delivered if you want them, reservations made if you want speciality dining. Access to Luminae and the Retreat Lounge and Retreat Deck if your ship has one (which is what most people book the Retreat for, certainly not for a butler) 

Like Jim, I book upper tier suites and rarely utilize the butler. Unless you were expecting the butler to stand on his head and entertain you, I don’t know what exactly you’re looking for. 

[flviking]

We got off an 11 night Beyond cruise on 12/22.  We hadn't been on Celebrity since January.  We were in a SS.  We were concerned about the cutbacks and negative changes written about so frequently.  We had a very good cruise. The staff were as great as always.  We never got an upcharge for anything less than $25 (so $8 for Veuve) though the Premium package limit is $17. Never a wait in Luminae though suites were sold out and we like to dine around 7.  Food quality and variety were good.  A room service person delivered breakfast rather than a butler who we never met.  Fine by us. We have another Beyond cruise booked for January 2025 in a SS.  From booking until today the price went from $10k +/- with tips and $1500 OBC to $15k +/- and no tips and no OBC.  So rather than booking another SS on Celebrity we are trying a PH on Oceania.  After factoring in gratuities and beverage package we are about $400/day less on Oceania.  For us its well worth a try.  I doubt we will consider it a downgrade.  Suites were full on our cruise so Celebrity isn't losing so far.  For our money we owe it to ourselves to give a competitor a try.

[billc23]

3 hours ago, alexandria said:

Retired trial attorney here.  What, exactly, do you contend would be your measure of damages?  In other words, what is the monetary value of the benefit(s) you allege that Celebrity failed to provide in violation of this "contract"?

 

  At the end, if you insisted on pursuing a legal claim, I would politely decline to take your case.  Just based upon what you have posted, you simply don't have a case.

 

Best wishes.

 

 

Great points and advice - for free - yet valuable!

[abbydancer2003]

2 hours ago, Jim_Iain said:

 

I'm sure many attorney would take the cast at $250/hour but none that would take it on a contingency. 

 

In this particular case the OP was offered a FCC which would normally be considered an acceptable offer but I can understand that someone that is not interested in the new SkySuite experience would not want a get a FCC that they would not use.

 

We normally travel in Upper Suites and to be honest really don't use the butler and he is always coming around trying to provide services we aren't interested in.    For the most part all we use a Butler for is doing our Laundry which a room attendant could easily handle.  

 

I'm sure this may be greeted with negativity BUT..... in my experience and observation the change may have been made due to those in Sky Suites demanding and pushing the boundaries and requiring far more time consuming service than those I would ever consider asking for.    OK... it's just us we really don't utilize the butler much.  

We also just use our Butler for laundry and morning coffee.  I was concerned, but our room steward did just fine with laundry, just as they do on Princess and when we don't book suites.  Our head butler arranged with room service for coffee delivery every morning.  It was delivered, set out on the table and one offered to pour.  Not all my butlers have offered to pour.  (Some did).  So no real change there.  On the first day, when I told the head butler we use water, coke and ginger ale, the fridge was emptied and the head butler delivered 2 cokes and 2 ginger-ales.  I don't always drink them so we didn't need more.  The room steward delivered water every day.

 

What bugs me the most was what they promised was a smaller team of butlers.  I assumed that would have meant that we call a number and one of 3 or so dedicated people take care of it.  Guess not.

 

Next cruise, I might invite friends to come over, I'll see what they can do now.  I've done that before once with great results and once with good results.

[billc23]

2 hours ago, Jim_Iain said:

 

 

 

We normally travel in Upper Suites and to be honest really don't use the butler and he is always coming around trying to provide services we aren't interested in.    For the most part all we use a Butler for is doing our Laundry which a room attendant could easily handle.  

 

I'm sure this may be greeted with negativity BUT..... in my experience and observation the change may have been made due to those in Sky Suites demanding and pushing the boundaries and requiring far more time consuming service than those I would ever consider asking for.    OK... it's just us we really don't utilize the butler much.  

Agree!!! I have had butlers that I have known for a while relate the same issue to me. In the past to read on this forum what some consider "hardly ever using their butler", who then go on with all they expect of their butler, amazed me. I'll now duck for cover being an infrequent poster!

[billc23]

1 hour ago, CruisersTimesThree said:

 

Just curious, what did you expect out of a butler that the Retreat team won’t provide? You’ll still have breakfast/coffee delivered daily, snacks delivered if you want them, reservations made if you want speciality dining. Access to Luminae and the Retreat Lounge and Retreat Deck if your ship has one (which is what most people book the Retreat for, certainly not for a butler) 

Like Jim, I book upper tier suites and rarely utilize the butler. Unless you were expecting the butler to stand on his head and entertain you, I don’t know what exactly you’re looking for. 

One butler told me a guest expected him to wait onside the door to his room to cater to his needs. I told him "well, it is a long walk from the kitchen area of the M class PH and the living area and perhaps I should call him to deliver water from the kitchen area"! We had a good relationship, and we both laughed about it, but when I was out of the room he provided a mini fridge in the living area near where I would sit and read!

[8mma]

30 minutes ago, flviking said:

We got off an 11 night Beyond cruise on 12/22.  We hadn't been on Celebrity since January.  We were in a SS.  We were concerned about the cutbacks and negative changes written about so frequently.  We had a very good cruise. The staff were as great as always.  We never got an upcharge for anything less than $25 (so $8 for Veuve) though the Premium package limit is $17. Never a wait in Luminae though suites were sold out and we like to dine around 7.  Food quality and variety were good.  A room service person delivered breakfast rather than a butler who we never met.  Fine by us. We have another Beyond cruise booked for January 2025 in a SS.  From booking until today the price went from $10k +/- with tips and $1500 OBC to $15k +/- and no tips and no OBC.  So rather than booking another SS on Celebrity we are trying a PH on Oceania.  After factoring in gratuities and beverage package we are about $400/day less on Oceania.  For us its well worth a try.  I doubt we will consider it a downgrade.  Suites were full on our cruise so Celebrity isn't losing so far.  For our money we owe it to ourselves to give a competitor a try.

You will love the PH on Oceania!  It will  not be a downgrade.  Enjoy your new adventure.

[seasoon]

3 hours ago, alexandria said:

Retired trial attorney here.  What, exactly, do you contend would be your measure of damages?  In other words, what is the monetary value of the benefit(s) you allege that Celebrity failed to provide in violation of this "contract"?

 

I am not admitted in Florida, but I would likely charge you $750/hr plus expenses with a $15,000 retainer (to be applied to the billable hours until exhausted or any unearned retainer amount is refunded).  Unless Celebrity offered a "nuisance settlement" that you were willing to accept, you'd need to be prepared to spend well in excess of the retainer amount to achieve any significant result (if such a result were even possible).  Litigation against a large corporation is not quick and inexpensive, rather it is time consumer and costly.  And no attorney worth hiring would ever accept a case such as yours on contingency.  Consumer litigation almost never pays off for the consumer.  If the actions of a company are egregious enough and impact enough consumers, class action litigation might be a course that is taken but in that case, class counsel (the lawyers) are the winners and the consumers involved (other than a few named class representatives) generally only receive a modest refund or discount (in this case, probably a token amount of FCC).  Even the named class representatives only end up with a modest cash settlement.

 

Sorry you were disappointed in your experience with Celebrity (with dozens of cruises under my belt since the 1970's, I sailed Celebrity for the first time a month or so ago and wasn't very impressed).  If you came to see me about your situation, I'd caution you that hiring me to litigate this would be penny wise, pound foolish, and encourage you to vote with your wallet and find another cruise line to patronize.  At the end, if you insisted on pursuing a legal claim, I would politely decline to take your case.  Just based upon what you have posted, you simply don't have a case.

 

Best wishes.

 

 

Any lawyer I know would not take the case but sending a 'letter' to Celebrity might bring a little satisfaction....at quite a reduced cost.

[alexandria]

If I wasn't going to accept a case, I would never agree to send a letter or take any other action where it could be inferred that I had undertaken representation of the aggrieved party (or that even had the appearance of such).  Nor would I send such a letter unless I had investigated the allegations, reviewed the applicable statutes and cases, and determined that there was a legitimate basis to support the legal position that is being asserted. 

 

An attorney who would send a demand letter to a potential defendant without being engaged to represent the potential plaintiff and without doing sufficient due diligence is asking for trouble.  Additionally, a client who has unreasonable and unrealistic expectations about "their case" and only wants to pay you a few hundred dollars to send a letter is a red flag for a potential bar complaint when that letter fails to achieve the client's desired results.  Nothing good can come of that for an attorney and I don't know of a single attorney that would agree to such a request.  But, I suspect there are some lawyers out there who are so desperate for a fee of a few hundred dollars, that they would be happy to send a letter to Celebrity.  The likelihood that a letter from such a lawyer would generate anything other than a boilerplate "go pound sand" reply from Celebrity is very, very slim.