Second Seating Pet Peeve

[kazu]

Hi there

 

I am just not able to agree with many voicing their opinions.

 

It is not a cruisers responsibility to inform fellow guests or staff of their dining intentions. It might be nice but it is not required. Many people may not even know what their plans are for the next day.

 

Some people have suggested that by not informing staff, those not showing up are holding tables places that could be used by others. Well, that's just not the case. Everyone has a seating place assigned. So that is the place that they would be able to sit if they do show up. These people do not ask for seating at a large table, it is assigned to them by the ship.

 

If you feel that other people (in this case people not showing up for their assigned seating) is adversely impacting your cruise, it is you who needs to ask to be reassigned. Just the same as if you were at a table and did not like your table mates for any other reason.

 

The wait staff don't know that you specifically want a large group unless you tell them. There are times that they may ask, but to be clear you should let them know and if you are not happy by the second night, I would ask to move.

 

hope this helps

 

Your post has me confused. This is about late seating, fixed dining, so, of course, the wait staff know your table assigned. There is nothing to ask for unless you want to change to a different sized table. That request is made to the Dining Room Manager.

 

I don't know about you, but if we are at a table with others, we wait until everyone arrives before ordering. That's the polite thing to do. If someone is not dining there that night, it means the entire table waits for 15 minutes for nothing. So, we have always let our tablemates know and our stewards so they are not looking for us to arrive last minute.

 

It has been a rarity that our tablemates have not let us know if they are dining elsewhere the following night. But, I guess they were courteous people. ;)

 

Certainly, if one is not happy with their table they can ask to change. Or switch to open dining.

[Nic6318]

I think what folks are saying deals with consideration not responsibility.:)

 

 

But what I am saying, is that it is still up to people to speak up for themselves. What if my wife and myself were happy that no one else was showing up at the 6 top because they said there were no 2 tops available. I might be upset if the waiter arbitrarily moved me to another table, I would have to speak up...this is just the opposite of what others are complaining about.

 

If staff was informed of each occasion that a cruiser was not going to be present it wouldn't change anything for those that did. To be fair consideration can only be expected if there was an expectation for it. I don't believe there is any expectation or request for anything beyond the dress codes and that people not to be late. I do feel breaking those expectations to be rude.

 

just a matter of perspective

[Hlitner]

Your interpretation of "As You Wish" is a common misconception. "As You Wish" is HAL's very confusing blanket term for all choices--dining room, Lido, specialty restaurants. When you make a booking, you may request either set-time dining (early or late) or open dining ("Anytime"). If you have set-time, you have the same table and dining companions every night, and you are expected to honor that reservation, and not ask to be seated in the dining room at some other time. One level of the dining room is usually set up for set dining. The other level is open dining, where you may just show up and ask to be seated at the time of your choosing. Open dining is what you describe--maybe 5 PM one night and 7 PM another night.

 

 

Whether you have set-time or open dining, you may opt to go to the Lido for dinner or book one of the specialty restaurants. The OP's point was that if you have set-time dining and choose not to go to the table that night, it's good manners to let your dining companions or the restaurant manager know. If you do not intend to eat at the same time each night, then you should ask for open dining when you book.

 

Several years ago we were on a RCI cruise and, as was our normal practice, reserved a late seating large table (we love to meet new folks and socialize). We had a table of 8, and we were the only 2 to show-up The Maitre 'd told us the other 6 were aboard, but apparently preferred to dine in the Lido. But according to the line's policy, the seats had to be held for them....and there were no other available seats at a large table. That was the last time we ever booked Fixed Dining.

 

Now, no matter which cruise line we are on (we have cruised on 14 lines) we simply do the Open Sitting scheme. We simply show-up at our usual late time (often after 8) and simply ask to share a large table. We always get a full (or near full) table and meet lots of interesting folks. On longer HAL cruises we often will form our own table (group) after a few days....with folks we have met at previous dinners. We never have a "bad" table more then 1 night...and when we form a table with like minded folks its always a lot of fun.

 

If you want Fixed dining at a large table, it is really rolling the dice. Folks do not always show, you might be stuck at a boring (or annoying) table for an entire cruise, etc. On some other lines there are many more alternative dining options then on HAL. On those lines (Celebrity is a good example) one will often find that there are often empty seats at Fixed tables...because folks are simply dining at one of the alternative dining options. Open seating is about the only way to guarantee you will always have dining companions...unless you are traveling with friends or a like minded group.

 

Hank

[cbr663]

...If you want Fixed dining at a large table, it is really rolling the dice. Folks do not always show, you might be stuck at a boring (or annoying) table for an entire cruise, etc. On some other lines there are many more alternative dining options then on HAL. On those lines (Celebrity is a good example) one will often find that there are often empty seats at Fixed tables...because folks are simply dining at one of the alternative dining options. Open seating is about the only way to guarantee you will always have dining companions...unless you are traveling with friends or a like minded group.

 

I agree with your analogy of rolling the dice. As cruise ships continue to add and aggressively promote more and more specialty dining options it would seem to me that fewer people will select MDR dining. There is no need for fixed dining to have assigned tables as it just leads to empty spaces and unhappy passengers. The dining room should be filled as folks arrive and passengers who wish to dine together can just as easy do as we do on land - all arrive together.

[cbr663]

...

It is not a cruisers responsibility to inform fellow guests or staff of their dining intentions. It might be nice but it is not required. Many people may not even know what their plans are for the next day...

 

 

I agree. I also don't think that it is courteous to tell people that you do not wish to dine with them because they are boring, you find the dinner topic of conservation inappropriate, you found someone's comments rude or insensitive, someone is dressed poorly, someone is wearing too much perfume, you can't stand the smell of cigarette smoke... you get the drift. There are lots of reasons that people do not return to the table.

[RuthC]

There is no need for fixed dining to have assigned tables as it just leads to empty spaces and unhappy passengers. The dining room should be filled as folks arrive and passengers who wish to dine together can just as easy do as we do on land - all arrive together.

Then it isn't "fixed" dining; it's open seating.

"Fixed" dining includes more than just the time of arrival. It also includes same table, and same tablemates, assigned. To fill the table as people arrive defeats the purpose of having the same people to dine with every night.

[geoherb]

Now, no matter which cruise line we are on (we have cruised on 14 lines) we simply do the Open Sitting scheme. We simply show-up at our usual late time (often after 8) and simply ask to share a large table. We always get a full (or near full) table and meet lots of interesting folks.

The one time we tried open seating (on a Princess ship) did not work out well. By the time we arrived in the dining room fairly late (to avoid having to wait in line), no one else was asking to share a table. We ended up at a table for two every night.

 

I still say that if you sign up for traditional fixed seating, you should show up a majority of the time. Do not show up the last night of a 10-day cruise to claim your seat. After three nights of not showing up, the dining room manager should send you a note to let you know that you've been reassigned to the open seating so that your space at the table can be given to someone who wants it.

[3rdGenCunarder]

Then it isn't "fixed" dining; it's open seating.

"Fixed" dining includes more than just the time of arrival. It also includes same table, and same tablemates, assigned. To fill the table as people arrive defeats the purpose of having the same people to dine with every night.

 

 

And with that same table you get the same waitstaff. Good waiters learn guests' preferences quickly and it makes the service go more smoothly.

 

The one time we tried open seating (on a Princess ship) did not work out well. By the time we arrived in the dining room fairly late (to avoid having to wait in line), no one else was asking to share a table. We ended up at a table for two every night.

 

I still say that if you sign up for traditional fixed seating, you should show up a majority of the time. Do not show up the last night of a 10-day cruise to claim your seat. After three nights of not showing up, the dining room manager should send you a note to let you know that you've been reassigned to the open seating so that your space at the table can be given to someone who wants it.

 

(bold is mine) I like this idea! Especially for early seating, which is the most in demand. There are always people wanting to have the early seating, and a table that's sitting empty could satisfy that request.

[DaveOKC]

I like this idea! Especially for early seating, which is the most in demand. There are always people wanting to have the early seating, and a table that's sitting empty could satisfy that request.

 

I agree - if you are not going to use your Early dining table (which normally is in high demand), please switch to Open and let someone else use it.

[cruisemom42]

I agree. I also don't think that it is courteous to tell people that you do not wish to dine with them because they are boring, you find the dinner topic of conservation inappropriate, you found someone's comments rude or insensitive, someone is dressed poorly, someone is wearing too much perfume, you can't stand the smell of cigarette smoke... you get the drift. There are lots of reasons that people do not return to the table.

 

 

I don't think etiquette requires you to give a reason (or litany of reasons). A simple "My husband/wife/SO and I won't be able to join you for dinner tomorrow evening as we'll be dining elsewhere" should be fine.

 

I'm pretty sure Emily Post (and my mother) would say you should let others know if you have an assigned seat and you don't plan to show up. Manners are what people use to gloss over awkward situations.

[BellBoys]

We were on Celebrity's Reflection this month and had an interesting conversation with a member of the staff about the main dining room. Their next build the Edge Class will do away entirely with the main dining room concept and focus entirely on smaller specialty dining venues. Some will be free while others will have a surcharge. The feedback they have received is that the concept of fixed seating is losing its popularity as diners want a variety of reservation times based on their daily activities. For example an afternoon arrival in San Juan with tours may have a passenger request an 830 dinner reservation rather than their typical earlier dining time. He said to picture an all inclusive resort or a larger hotel with multiple dining venues as a reference. Its kind of how we dine now whether we are on HAL or Celebrity, we have a late seating table of 6 or 8 but are there only a few nights at the most. We always have our first meal there and advise our fellow table mates they will be back only a few more times. Its never felt awkward.

[cbr663]

Glad to see that Celebrity is first out the gate with the elimination of the MDR. It was only a matter of time and others will quickly follow. The introduction of more and more speciality dining options means less demand for traditional dining.

[cbr663]

Then it isn't "fixed" dining; it's open seating.

"Fixed" dining includes more than just the time of arrival. It also includes same table, and same tablemates, assigned. To fill the table as people arrive defeats the purpose of having the same people to dine with every night.

 

 

While fixed dining on HAL includes an assigned table, my suggestion was that it doesn't need to be. I offered this suggestion as a possible solution to the OP's problem.

 

When we were on X and dined in Blu, that was considered our MDR and we had fixed dining also. But the staff there had no issue whatsoever with us selecting different tables at breakfast and at dinner. It worked remarkably well.

[3rdGenCunarder]

While fixed dining on HAL includes an assigned table, my suggestion was that it doesn't need to be. I offered this suggestion as a possible solution to the OP's problem.

 

When we were on X and dined in Blu, that was considered our MDR and we had fixed dining also. But the staff there had no issue whatsoever with us selecting different tables at breakfast and at dinner. It worked remarkably well.

 

 

If you take away the assigned table, you have pretty much taken away anything we would see as an advantage to fixed dining. I don't care much where the table is. We don't obsess about a window table or tipping the maitre d' to get a "better" place. For us it's having the same waitstaff and dinner companions.

[summersigh]

If you take away the assigned table, you have pretty much taken away anything we would see as an advantage to fixed dining. I don't care much where the table is. We don't obsess about a window table or tipping the maitre d' to get a "better" place. For us it's having the same waitstaff and dinner companions.

We're the "retired demographic" and frankly, if they take away all fixed seating it's a deal breaker with us. We really enjoy the dynamic of having the same waitstaff and dinner companions every evening. With a couple of exceptions we've been very fortunate and have had great fun with our fixed dining table mix.

 

 

As empty nesters we really like dining with others - and not having to do the "getting to know you dance" every evening. That dance is fine at breakfast and lunch but we like dinner more relaxed with folks we "know".

[3rdGenCunarder]

We're the "retired demographic" and frankly, if they take away all fixed seating it's a deal breaker with us. We really enjoy the dynamic of having the same waitstaff and dinner companions every evening. With a couple of exceptions we've been very fortunate and have had great fun with our fixed dining table mix.

 

 

As empty nesters we really like dining with others - and not having to do the "getting to know you dance" every evening. That dance is fine at breakfast and lunch but we like dinner more relaxed with folks we "know".

 

 

That's exactly how we feel!

 

We eat at pretty much the same time each night at home, so having a consistent dinner time is not a bother. I hope I'm not jinxing myself, but we've had great table karma. Meeting new people and getting to know them is part of the fun of cruising. I still keep in touch with some people we've met on past cruises.

[cbr663]

We're the "retired demographic" and frankly, if they take away all fixed seating it's a deal breaker with us. We really enjoy the dynamic of having the same waitstaff and dinner companions every evening. With a couple of exceptions we've been very fortunate and have had great fun with our fixed dining table mix.

 

 

I understand that many people enjoy and look forward to traditional dining. And I hope that HAL does not abandon it any time soon. I think though that traditional dining is on its last legs. More and more cruise lines are introducing more and more dining options with fewer people wanting fixed dining times. Add to that the financial incentive of specialty dining options and reading that Celebrity may be completely eliminating the MDR doesn't come as a surprise.

 

If there is one thing that HAL has shown is that it will hang on to traditions as long as it possible can. It was a long time changing its smoking policy and changing its dress code policy. And its new Pinnacle Class ships have shown that while it has added new dining options, HAL has resisted the urge to keep up with its competition on the dining options front. I think it is safe to say that traditional dining will be around for quite some time on HAL.

[geoherb]

Its kind of how we dine now whether we are on HAL or Celebrity, we have a late seating table of 6 or 8 but are there only a few nights at the most. We always have our first meal there and advise our fellow table mates they will be back only a few more times. Its never felt awkward.

I'd prefer people who only want to dine in the main dining room a few times choose the anytime option instead of fixed seating. While you are courteous in letting people know you're not going to be there more than a few times, your doing so leaves two empty chairs at the table every night you don't show up. It messes with the dynamics of a large table.

[summersigh]

If there is one thing that HAL has shown is that it will hang on to traditions as long as it possible can. It was a long time changing its smoking policy and changing its dress code policy. And its new Pinnacle Class ships have shown that while it has added new dining options, HAL has resisted the urge to keep up with its competition on the dining options front. I think it is safe to say that traditional dining will be around for quite some time on HAL.

I'd think that HAL has actual data that tracks requests for fixed seating vs your time aiding them in making decisions. The HAL demographic is somewhat older than some other lines so I'd assume that more folks might prefer traditional cruise options than on those other lines.:)

It's my understanding that after RCCL launched one of its newest ships - with nothing but your time dining in its 4 large dining rooms - they had to back-peddle and reinstate that fixed option due to unhappy passengers.

 

 

The solution was explained to me as having tables with the same group of passengers and waiters who moved as a group to different dining rooms each evening. :D

[oaktreerb]

My favorite part of fixed dining is being able to walk to our table in the dining room without having to stand in line to wait to be seated.

 

My second favorite is having the same waitstaff who can suggest items from the menu because they know our taste preferences. (Lemon for my water on the table before I sit down.)

 

My third favorite is the ability to meet new people and have in depth conversations without having to start over with introductions every evening.

 

I have had very little luck with the reservations system of the "open seating" routine. Next cruise I'm trying "open seating" again but I'd really like to have the same staff and a well placed table so we'll see how it goes!

[NordicPrince]

that's exactly how we feel!

 

We eat at pretty much the same time each night at home, so having a consistent dinner time is not a bother. I hope i'm not jinxing myself, but we've had great table karma. Meeting new people and getting to know them is part of the fun of cruising. I still keep in touch with some people we've met on past cruises.

 

 

ditto

[DaveOKC]

One thing that is better with Fixed vs Open Dining is the wine steward service, especially if you order a wine package. With Open it is often a hassle to find the leftover bottle of wine from your last meal. With Fixed, it is usually already on the table waiting for us.

[Cruising-along]

One thing that is better with Fixed vs Open Dining is the wine steward service, especially if you order a wine package. With Open it is often a hassle to find the leftover bottle of wine from your last meal. With Fixed, it is usually already on the table waiting for us.

 

 

I guess I've been lucky, I've never had a problem with them finding our leftover bottle. Other than when the Pinnacle wine steward on the Koningsdam misplaced our bottle the night before! Thanks to the excellent MDR wine steward who took some time locating it (and was rewarded for his trouble).

[3rdGenCunarder]

I'd think that HAL has actual data that tracks requests for fixed seating vs your time aiding them in making decisions. The HAL demographic is somewhat older than some other lines so I'd assume that more folks might prefer traditional cruise options than on those other lines.:)

It's my understanding that after RCCL launched one of its newest ships - with nothing but your time dining in its 4 large dining rooms - they had to back-peddle and reinstate that fixed option due to unhappy passengers.

 

 

The solution was explained to me as having tables with the same group of passengers and waiters who moved as a group to different dining rooms each evening. :D

 

 

I've heard that the migrating passengers and waiters works well. It sounds crazy, but I guess the table layouts are the same for the different dining rooms.

 

Cruise lines do track all kinds of data about cruisers. I recall a galley tour on either HAL or Cunard, where the chef said they can predict to about 1 or 2 percent error how many of each entree will be ordered, based on previous experience. Another time a chef said the first night is their test--do more people order beef or fish or vegetarian? That trend is likely to follow through the cruise. So if they're tracking WHAT we eat, they're almost certainly tracking WHEN. First seating is tough to get. I look around at First and I see very few empty chairs. HAL has to know that the demand is there.

[DaveOKC]

I guess I've been lucky, I've never had a problem with them finding our leftover bottle. Other than when the Pinnacle wine steward on the Koningsdam misplaced our bottle the night before! Thanks to the excellent MDR wine steward who took some time locating it (and was rewarded for his trouble).

 

 

Same experience with Pinnacle wine steward on another ship. He could not find my bottle, even though I had it sent there from the night before.