HAL comp if denied boarding by zip code?

[thyme2go]

I have no idea if there is a policy or procedure on this..........does anyone know if HAL allows credit for a cruise if  a passenger is considered 'dangerous' due to where they live?   Yes, I'm talking about the area in Seattle that is now saying covid-19 could have been here for 6 weeks.    Have a cruise planned departing out of a different west coast port within a month...........definitely do not want to fly to that port and discover we are 'risky' due to where we live.........anyone know anything about this scenario?   Risk by zip code?

[SumoCitrus]

Is there any indication at all that HAL is doing this? How can we opine on something you imagined?

[thyme2go]

   If restrictions are made based on contact to physical locations.......China, Iran, Italy, etc........would it be a stretch to see HAL do this based on cruiser's zip code origin?   AND, to the point in the 'real' world.........has anyone been denied boarding due to where they have been and what did HAL do when denied boarding happened?   No, this isn't just about compensation.....but especially with the outbreak in the Seattle area it does logically lead to these questions...........

[57redbird]

45 minutes ago, thyme2go said:

I have no idea if there is a policy or procedure on this..........does anyone know if HAL allows credit for a cruise if  a passenger is considered 'dangerous' due to where they live?   Yes, I'm talking about the area in Seattle that is now saying covid-19 could have been here for 6 weeks.    Have a cruise planned departing out of a different west coast port within a month...........definitely do not want to fly to that port and discover we are 'risky' due to where we live.........anyone know anything about this scenario?   Risk by zip code?

We are in the same boat ---- western Washington, cruise in April, flying out of San Diego ...hubby's getting nervous.

[kazu]

21 minutes ago, thyme2go said:

   If restrictions are made based on contact to physical locations.......China, Iran, Italy, etc........would it be a stretch to see HAL do this based on cruiser's zip code origin?   AND, to the point in the 'real' world.........has anyone been denied boarding due to where they have been and what did HAL do when denied boarding happened?   No, this isn't just about compensation.....but especially with the outbreak in the Seattle area it does logically lead to these questions...........

 

Boarding is being denied NOW to guests who have been through China, Hong Kong, Macau or South Korea.  See below from HAL's travel advisory:

 

Guests who have traveled from or through mainland China, Hong Kong, Macau or South Korea, or had contact with a suspected or confirmed case of novel coronavirus (2019-nCoV) or a person who is under monitoring for coronavirus in the last 14 days prior to sailing will not be permitted to board the ship.

• Shipboard staff will be scanning guest passports to verify transit through any of the prohibited areas. Given the serious nature of these circumstances, false responses on pre-boarding documents will result in immediate grounds for disembarkation at the next opportunity. Guests who do not disclose travel through prohibited areas in Asia may also face additional legal consequences.

[bEwAbG]

There hasn't been a consistent standard that applies to all cruise lines but most often we've seen those who are denied boarding being given refunds or future cruise certificates.  

 

Trying to isolate people on a zip code basis would be hard to manage.  In my immediate area, there are 40-something zip codes in use; over 40,000 nationwide. 

 

It is also a bit impractical unless they were banning contiguous zip code areas, and then the question becomes how far out you extend.  Right now it appears there is a cluster in a Seattle suburb, which doesn't bode well for the upcoming Alaska season if it continues to spread.

[thyme2go]

The two deaths were at the hospital closest to the care facility that appears to be a major outbreak........however there are 3 (?) other patients at area hospitals and at least 4 schools are sanitizing today and closed in a larger geographic area.   My use of zip codes was a simple delineation given this greater urban area, I thought it might be a way to identify beyond self reporting......which may or may not actually be reliable given some people not even knowing they are 'sick'.........

57Redbird........I'm guessing we are in the same boat (literally) and I'd love nothing more than to escape on the ocean for 12 days.........          : /

    

[dobiemom]

What about people who physically live in one zip code but their mailing address (and therefore their documentation) is in another? (Heavy sigh.)

[gatour]

2 hours ago, bEwAbG said:

There hasn't been a consistent standard that applies to all cruise lines but most often we've seen those who are denied boarding being given refunds or future cruise certificates.  

 

Trying to isolate people on a zip code basis would be hard to manage.  In my immediate area, there are 40-something zip codes in use; over 40,000 nationwide. 

 

It is also a bit impractical unless they were banning contiguous zip code areas, and then the question becomes how far out you extend.  Right now it appears there is a cluster in a Seattle suburb, which doesn't bode well for the upcoming Alaska season if it continues to spread.

Actually it would relatively easy to implement depending on how granular you want to get.  Zip codes were not assigned willy-nilly. They are also static, so it would be easy to determine which zip codes to look for that corresponds to a given area.  Found the below on the web.

 

As to how cruise lines would handle denied boarding scenarios and said compensation for passengers based on their US hometown know telling.  As of right now you have too look at how they are handling people that have traveled through China and Itally.

 

 

 

The first number of the five-digit code signifies the region which the address is located in, a number that grows from the east coast to the west. For example, Eastern states such as Maine and New York begin with 0 or 1, whereas the Western states of California and Washington begin with a 9. The second two digits in the code determine a smaller region within each initial area that translates to a central post office facility for that area. The final two digits signify the local post office of the address.

[bEwAbG]

I know the zip code pinpoints to a geographical area but the cruise lines would need to screen for hundreds if not thousands of zip codes at a time, sometimes at the pier.  They can barely manage to get people in the right loyalty lines half the time. 

 

It could be done, but it would be complicated.  The poster above mentioned a flaw already (mailing versus actual address).  Passports don't have zip codes.  I could also just use an ID that showed an old zip code.  Zip codes tie to where you live but not where you've been.  Etc., etc.  There are already lots of holes in the current process of screening based on whole countries, so I'm just not optimistic that they could roll out a zip code based system very easily.  I think they'll try to continue the screenings at the ports for now until the problem goes away or they're told to stop operating.  

Edited March 2, 2020 by bEwAbG

[*Miss G*]

3 hours ago, thyme2go said:

The two deaths were at the hospital

 

It’s now six deaths.  ☹️

[woodinville cruisers]

I've been worried about the same issue.

We fly to Ft. Lauderdale from Seattle on March 14 and I wouldn't want to make that trip across the country if we are denied boarding.

 

[thyme2go]

2 hours ago, bEwAbG said:

I know the zip code pinpoints to a geographical area but the cruise lines would need to screen for hundreds if not thousands of zip codes at a time, sometimes at the pier.  They can barely manage to get people in the right loyalty lines half the time. 

 

It could be done, but it would be complicated.  The poster above mentioned a flaw already (mailing versus actual address).  Passports don't have zip codes.  I could also just use an ID that showed an old zip code.  Zip codes tie to where you live but not where you've been.  Etc., etc.  There are already lots of holes in the current process of screening based on whole countries, so I'm just not optimistic that they could roll out a zip code based system very easily.  I think they'll try to continue the screenings at the ports for now until the problem goes away or they're told to stop operating.  

 

The cruise line has passport info and also has addresses in their database and this can be done well before departure.   It may not be perfect, but in the case of the outbreak in King/Snohomish counties it could encompass those who live in these communities before making a trip out of the area, only to (potentially) be turned away later...........   With the characteristics of HAL guests being older clientele, and the disease momentum in the Seattle area, it's a bit of common sense..........

[gatour]

4 hours ago, bEwAbG said:

I know the zip code pinpoints to a geographical area but the cruise lines would need to screen for hundreds if not thousands of zip codes at a time, sometimes at the pier.  They can barely manage to get people in the right loyalty lines half the time. 

 

It could be done, but it would be complicated.  The poster above mentioned a flaw already (mailing versus actual address).  Passports don't have zip codes.  I could also just use an ID that showed an old zip code.  Zip codes tie to where you live but not where you've been.  Etc., etc.  There are already lots of holes in the current process of screening based on whole countries, so I'm just not optimistic that they could roll out a zip code based system very easily.  I think they'll try to continue the screenings at the ports for now until the problem goes away or they're told to stop operating.  

It can be done a few days before hand.  This is not rocket science.  Pull addresses from the reservation database, compare the zip codes in the reservation database to a "zone" and get that information to the check-in agents for denial of boarding purposes.

 

I agree that the zip codes would not tie someone to where they may have been in the last X number of days and there will be cracks.  But for a vast majority of cases it will work.

[Aquahound]

If HAL condemns passengers with a Seattle zip code, they're going to have a hard time filling ships that embark in Seattle, considering you have to enter that zip code in order to board.  How would they staff the embarkation line?  Who would handle luggage?  Who would load provisions, fuel, etc?   

 

Heck, how would they staff their HQ?  

Edited March 3, 2020 by Aquahound

[Ferry_Watcher]

Thanks Aquahound for some sane words of reason. 

 

People are starting to fear monger (albeit unintentionally), and generally speaking, not using their rational mind.

Folks, let's stay calm, rational and compassionate.

[wwcruisers]

1 hour ago, Aquahound said:

If HAL condemns passengers with a Seattle zip code, they're going to have a hard time filling ships that embark in Seattle, considering you have to enter that zip code in order to board.  How would they staff the embarkation line?  Who would handle luggage?  Who would load provisions, fuel, etc?   

 

Heck, how would they staff their HQ?  

Thank you, Aquahound! Not to mention the fact that -- especially here in the Puget Sound area of Washington -- a person may live in one zip code, work in another, and have their doctor/hospital/pharmacy in yet ANOTHER zip code. So -- when that person comes down with a verified case of the virus, WHICH zip-code exactly do you ban from boarding?? Overly simplistic approaches are not the answer to this very complicated problem.

Edited March 3, 2020 by wwcruisers

[Wehwalt]

3 hours ago, gatour said:

It can be done a few days before hand.  This is not rocket science.  Pull addresses from the reservation database, compare the zip codes in the reservation database to a "zone" and get that information to the check-in agents for denial of boarding purposes.

 

I agree that the zip codes would not tie someone to where they may have been in the last X number of days and there will be cracks.  But for a vast majority of cases it will work.

Once. Then word gets out and people change addresses to mail drops or PO Boxes (which some have anyway) 

[thyme2go]

2 hours ago, wwcruisers said:

Thank you, Aquahound! Not to mention the fact that -- especially here in the Puget Sound area of Washington -- a person may live in one zip code, work in another, and have their doctor/hospital/pharmacy in yet ANOTHER zip code. So -- when that person comes down with a verified case of the virus, WHICH zip-code exactly do you ban from boarding?? Overly simplistic approaches are not the answer to this very complicated problem.

OK, settle down those that are going after everyone in Seattle.   There are NO CRUISES coming in or going out of Seattle right now.   The original intention was to avoid people FROM Seattle being turned away at their embarkation port in other parts of the country due to covid-19 restrictions being put in place---such as what happened for people who traveled to China to board a HAL cruise in China after coronavirus was identified................   

I guess whether you think this is important may depend on where you live, where you have to get to in order to board a ship in the next month or two, and if your fingers are crossed that neither you nor anyone else on the ship 'get sick' while you are cruising...........Seattle is a hotbed for covid-19 processes, updates, and planning due to what is happening on a daily basis in this area.   While others may not be exposed to all the info that Seattleites are seeing this would be an easily workable way to notify 'guests' before they are trying to embark on a ship AND before they travel to do so.   Plain, and yes, simple----and of course you can depend on the health questionnaire's at embarkation--always reliable!!  : / 

 

wwcruisers-----You would use your home zipcode, and if you live here you know that if you have tested positive for coronavirus your workplace, home and healthcare should all know you have it AND hopefully you won't be trying to get on a cruise ship!

[thyme2go]

13 minutes ago, Wehwalt said:

Once. Then word gets out and people change addresses to mail drops or PO Boxes (which some have anyway) 

Really?  People would open a PO Box just to avoid having a zip code with HAL?   Oh brother.........

[CruiserBruce]

2 minutes ago, thyme2go said:

Really?  People would open a PO Box just to avoid having a zip code with HAL?   Oh brother.........

Ahhh... a post office box has a zip code.

[thyme2go]

2 minutes ago, CruiserBruce said:

Ahhh... a post office box has a zip code.

Yeah, but in the spirit of this wild topic.........is that Post Office in the same zip as the person lives in or did they go out of zip to get a new code?    : )  

[CruiserBruce]

Just now, thyme2go said:

Yeah, but in the spirit of this wild topic.........is that Post Office in the same zip as the person lives in or did they go out of zip to get a new code?    : )  

It's only a wild, crazy topic because you created it that way.

 

The post office box zip code will be in the range for that area. As you can see from my info, the zip code for my residence ends in 54. There is another post office in my town that ends in 52. The P.O. boxes will end in 51, 53 or 55. So close. 

 

Someone would have to go FAR away to have a significantly different zip code.

[Wehwalt]

39 minutes ago, CruiserBruce said:

It's only a wild, crazy topic because you created it that way.

 

The post office box zip code will be in the range for that area. As you can see from my info, the zip code for my residence ends in 54. There is another post office in my town that ends in 52. The P.O. boxes will end in 51, 53 or 55. So close. 

 

Someone would have to go FAR away to have a significantly different zip code.

My post was in the spirit of this very strange thread, I hope. But the mail drop I use to hold my mail while I cruise is not in the same state as where I live. I could easily change my address with HAL to that, and I'd probably lower the load on my recycling. If ZIP code profiling ever became an issue, and people cared enough to change it, they probably would. 

Edited March 3, 2020 by Wehwalt

[*Miss G*]

They’d also have to change their flight information then.