Now for something completely different

[Aus Traveller]

2 minutes ago, ilikeanswers said:

 

The oldest archaeological evidence in Marquesas 300AD. Tahiti Island they say 500AD. Tuamutus they found a marae about 1000AD. Mangareva they say about 10-1300 AD. It has to be remembered that migration waves were not linear. While there may have been inhabitants already in FP there could still have been early New Zealand inhabitants who decided to pack up and go to Tahiti🤗

That would be contrary to Maori stories about their settlement of NZ.

[Blackduck59]

I think I will let the discussion of who is right about the Maoris and how they got to New Zealand carry on while I'm sleeping it's almost 2300 hrs yesterday here and I have to work in the morning. Fare well and have a great rest of your day

[By The Bay]

2 minutes ago, Blackduck59 said:

I think I will let the discussion of who is right about the Maoris and how they got to New Zealand carry on while I'm sleeping it's almost 2300 hrs yesterday here and I have to work in the morning. Fare well and have a great rest of your day

Good night Lyle and sweet dreams.😴

[NSWP]

3 minutes ago, Blackduck59 said:

I think I will let the discussion of who is right about the Maoris and how they got to New Zealand carry on while I'm sleeping it's almost 2300 hrs yesterday here and I have to work in the morning. Fare well and have a great rest of your day

Sweet dreams Lyle.

[ilikeanswers]

8 minutes ago, Aus Traveller said:

That would be contrary to Maori stories about their settlement of NZ.

 

Maybe but there is a lot of evidence in Polynesia that people moved back and forth between archipelagos. So it wouldn't be out the realm of possibility that some Maori tribes left for some reason. Polynesians had a lot of disagreements with each other especially when it came to politics and religion and exile was a pretty common punishment for the losing side. 

Edited August 17, 2020 by ilikeanswers

[Russell21]

Many here would be stunned to find where the Polynesians originally came from.

[Aus Traveller]

18 minutes ago, Russell21 said:

Many here would be stunned to find where the Polynesians originally came from.

It is believed that they migrated across the Pacific from Asia, probably Taiwan.

[The_Big_M]

6 hours ago, ilikeanswers said:

 

I another google with if there were people before Maori and found what you guys were taking about 😁. It turns out the story is a historical myth not backed up by any evidence. No wonder I couldn't find it before, I was looking for anthropology not myths and legends😆. Museums aren't always accurate. 

 

Oh, and Google is? Gotcha...

[Russell21]

8 minutes ago, Aus Traveller said:

It is believed that they migrated across the Pacific from Asia, probably Taiwan.

Actually the Philippines.

[Aus Traveller]

Just now, Russell21 said:

Actually the Philippines.

But how did they get to the Philippines? I understand that it was a wave of migration that headed east from the mainland of Asia.

[ilikeanswers]

1 minute ago, The_Big_M said:

Oh, and Google is? Gotcha...

 

Google is where you can access links to history papers and finds on archaeological digs. You can also compare information with many sources to see if they agree or is this an outlier. You are not relying on one source like you do with a museum or a guide. Yes Google has dodgy websites but that is not Google's fault. Making a dig at Google is short sighted. Thanks to Google we can access information that you use to needed to be in the know or part of a research group. Google has opened up information to everyone and that shouldn't be underestimated🤗. 

[The_Big_M]

41 minutes ago, ilikeanswers said:

 

Google is where you can access links to history papers and finds on archaeological digs. You can also compare information with many sources to see if they agree or is this an outlier. You are not relying on one source like you do with a museum or a guide. Yes Google has dodgy websites but that is not Google's fault. Making a dig at Google is short sighted. Thanks to Google we can access information that you use to needed to be in the know or part of a research group. Google has opened up information to everyone and that shouldn't be underestimated🤗. 

 

Oh dear.

 

And you know in museums it's not the work of a single researcher who's just relying on their memory either.

 

But imply google is infallible, or that a majority automatically means it is right is foolish.

[SinbadThePorter]

1 hour ago, Aus Traveller said:

But how did they get to the Philippines? I understand that it was a wave of migration that headed east from the mainland of Asia.

 

Polynesian languages, along with Malay, Micronesian and some Melanesian languages are part of the Austronesian language group. Based on linguistic analysis the origin of these languages is with the native Formosan languages of Taiwan.

 

That doesn't necessarily mean that all the people who now speak an Austronesian language had ancestors that came from Taiwan. But most probably do.

Edited August 17, 2020 by SinbadThePorter

[ilikeanswers]

18 minutes ago, The_Big_M said:

 

Oh dear.

 

And you know in museums it's not the work of a single researcher who's just relying on their memory either.

 

But imply google is infallible, or that a majority automatically means it is right is foolish.

 

I was not trying to imply google is infallible you are misreading my words and making your own implications. I am saying you under estimate Google Everyone is quick to bash Google but even reseachers have said that Google has given them access to research and other researchers that normally they would not know about. There are actually a lot of good quality websites out there. There are even websites that have uploaded actual historical documents for people to look at. Normally I would have to travel to other side of the world to see this stuff or wouldn't have access because I'm not some professer🙄. You seem to assume every website is crap. The internet let's you access things beyond your small community if you let it. That can be the problem with museums like the one I visited on St Simons Island who had a display about why slavery was OK. There was clearly no African Americans working there to give their point of view of history. Also when it comes to science it is generally majority rules since you either have evidence for a theory or you don't. Even Google can't change that basic tenet. 

[ilikeanswers]

2 hours ago, Aus Traveller said:

But how did they get to the Philippines? I understand that it was a wave of migration that headed east from the mainland of Asia.

 

I did read some interesting research looking at the DNA of the animals they brought with them to try and trace migration routes. Chickens they traced back to the Philipines, Pigs to Vietnam, Rats from Indonesian islands Flores and North Maluku, Dogs they traced to South China around the Yangtze River but they think Polynesians more likely collected them from West Kalimantan and Bali since the descendants of those dogs ended up there.

[Aus Traveller]

1 minute ago, ilikeanswers said:

 

I did read some interesting research looking at the DNA of the animals they brought with them to try and trace migration routes. Chickens they traced back to the Philipines, Pigs to Vietnam, Rats from Indonesian islands Flores and North Maluku, Dogs they traced to South China around the Yangtze River but they think Polynesians more likely collected them from West Kalimantan and Bali since the descendants of those dogs ended up there.

Migration across the Pacific to French Polynesia (your map has the year 100), then later migration to NZ (year 1000). Usually 1200 or so is usually quoted. The map has migration to Easter Island around 300 whereas from what I know of Easter Island, it was the last outlier of Polynesian migration. I suppose different researchers come up with different time frames for this great migration.

[ilikeanswers]

49 minutes ago, Aus Traveller said:

Migration across the Pacific to French Polynesia (your map has the year 100), then later migration to NZ (year 1000). Usually 1200 or so is usually quoted. The map has migration to Easter Island around 300 whereas from what I know of Easter Island, it was the last outlier of Polynesian migration. I suppose different researchers come up with different time frames for this great migration.

 

I think the map might be a little outdated. 100 AD was suggested for Marquesas until 2014 when radio carbon dating knocked some centuries off. Rappa Nui there is a split between historical linguists and archaelogical evidence. The graphics designer seems to have sided with the linguists😆. I choose this map because it had the most detail in visualising the routes. Other maps merge the routes too much. Guess there had to be a compromise somewhere🙄.

[The_Big_M]

5 hours ago, ilikeanswers said:

 

I was not trying to imply google is infallible you are misreading my words and making your own implications. I am saying you under estimate Google Everyone is quick to bash Google but even reseachers have said that Google has given them access to research and other researchers that normally they would not know about. There are actually a lot of good quality websites out there. There are even websites that have uploaded actual historical documents for people to look at. Normally I would have to travel to other side of the world to see this stuff or wouldn't have access because I'm not some professer🙄. You seem to assume every website is crap. The internet let's you access things beyond your small community if you let it. That can be the problem with museums like the one I visited on St Simons Island who had a display about why slavery was OK. There was clearly no African Americans working there to give their point of view of history. Also when it comes to science it is generally majority rules since you either have evidence for a theory or you don't. Even Google can't change that basic tenet. 

 

I don't underestimate google - and I''m not sure where I said "every website is crap."

 

However, it gives you access to far more dross than you'll get at major museums, as is being talked about.

 

[Docker123]

https://www.facebook.com/breakfastnews/videos/632129261014605/

 

I thought this would raise Lyle’s seafaring spirits. As long as the link opens to the Manly Ferry video.

 

 

Edited August 17, 2020 by Docker123

[lyndarra]

12 hours ago, ilikeanswers said:

Dogs they traced to South China around the Yangtze River but they think Polynesians more likely collected them from West Kalimantan and Bali since the descendants of those dogs ended up there.

Now I'm thinking I should have paid more attention to what the dogs looked like in West Borneo (Kalimantan Barat - Pontianak, Sinkawang Dua) when I lived there for a short time in a past life. Having visited China a few times, in some places I noticed a remarkable resemblance of dogs to dingoes. Too far OT? I'd better go back and check.

[NSWP]

19 minutes ago, Docker123 said:

https://www.facebook.com/breakfastnews/videos/632129261014605/

 

I thought this would raise Lyle’s seafaring spirits. As long as the link opens to the Manly Ferry video.

 

 

Yes he will like that, getting their monies worth on the Manly Ferry.Calm day 

Edited August 17, 2020 by NSWP

[Aus Traveller]

29 minutes ago, lyndarra said:

Now I'm thinking I should have paid more attention to what the dogs looked like in West Borneo (Kalimantan Barat - Pontianak, Sinkawang Dua) when I lived there for a short time in a past life. Having visited China a few times, in some places I noticed a remarkable resemblance of dogs to dingoes. Too far OT? I'd better go back and check.

We have remarked on the 'ubiquitous Pacific Island dogs' we have seen on many of the islands. They look like they are all related.

[ilikeanswers]

2 hours ago, lyndarra said:

Now I'm thinking I should have paid more attention to what the dogs looked like in West Borneo (Kalimantan Barat - Pontianak, Sinkawang Dua) when I lived there for a short time in a past life.

 

They probably won't look much like the dogs Polynesians sailors added to their fleet. Other dogs have been brought onto those islands since then especially the European dogs and after a few generations I would think it would have changed their looks🤔. The breed of Polynesian Dog is extinct because of all the interbreeding (they had to extract DNA from bones for the study) so I imagine the same thing has happened in Indonesia. 

2 hours ago, lyndarra said:

Having visited China a few times, in some places I noticed a remarkable resemblance of dogs to dingoes. 

 

They did remark that the Polynesian Dog shared some DNA with Dingoes so there probably is a common ancestor🐕

[Blackduck59]

3 hours ago, Docker123 said:

https://www.facebook.com/breakfastnews/videos/632129261014605/

 

I thought this would raise Lyle’s seafaring spirits. As long as the link opens to the Manly Ferry video.

 

 

 

Just a bit of an unfortunate sea state in that video Adrian. Are there cars on that ship? I have been in a ship where the waves were breaking over the bridge. It was in 1976 and the ship was HMCS Yukon, I was a 17 year old sea cadet and found that such seas are not conducive to retaining ones evening meal.

[Blackduck59]

 

This is HMCS Yukon she is now a dive site off San Diego. She was 366 ft long, when we went through the trough of the waves they would break on the windows of the bridge.