90% effective vaccine EVEN without booster shot...

[BND]

1 hour ago, crewsweeper said:

Similar schedules have been floated here in the States.  But thus far each state will impose it's own schedule.  I believe the focus has been on frontline health workers first in all 50 states.  

 

People need to understand that these vaccines will take time to administer.

 

Also, I saw some news reports on various sites that are saying that the so-called asymptomatic people are not showing up as  infection transmitters in contract tracing.  so that's some good news.

Infection transmission requires shedding enough of the virus to infect others.  It makes sense that asymptomatic people wouldn't shed like symptomatic.  What it could mean is that you need certain symptoms, such as coughing to actually pass the virus.  Or, it could just mean asymptomatic don't have enough virus in their system to infect others.

[broberts]

The WHO certainly disagrees, https://www.who.int/emergencies/diseases/novel-coronavirus-2019/question-and-answers-hub/q-a-detail/coronavirus-disease-covid-19-how-is-it-transmitted

 

Asymptomatic COVID-19 sufferers DO transmit the disease.

 

https://www.google.com/url?q=http://scholar.google.ca/scholar_url%3Furl%3Dhttps://www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/NEJMe2009758%26hl%3Den%26sa%3DX%26ei%3DY1HOX5D9CobcmAHI4qzQBg%26scisig%3DAAGBfm3JLNFGbIvacLz60Oju1ahx_xuQBQ%26nossl%3D1%26oi%3Dscholarr&sa=U&ved=2ahUKEwidvPDKnrztAhV-EVkFHXOvB8wQgAN6BAgTEAM&usg=AOvVaw30c9iZf-ThWqp9H8JKrxai

 

http://scholar.google.ca/scholar_url?url=https://www.pnas.org/content/pnas/117/30/17513.full.pdf&hl=en&sa=X&ei=Y1HOX5D9CobcmAHI4qzQBg&scisig=AAGBfm0HUW7tHzcm0D9pECWE-BB7tanMGw&nossl=1&oi=scholarr

[Milwaukee Eight]

2 hours ago, crewsweeper said:

Similar schedules have been floated here in the States.  But thus far each state will impose it's own schedule.  I believe the focus has been on frontline health workers first in all 50 states.  

 

People need to understand that these vaccines will take time to administer.

 

Also, I saw some news reports on various sites that are saying that the so-called asymptomatic people are not showing up as  infection transmitters in contract tracing.  so that's some good news.

See post #751

[firefly333]

Some bank council just applied for bank workers to bet classified as essential workers so they get the vaccine earlier.

 

Well in line with ford buying freezers to store to give their employees vaccine.

 

Let the scrambling begin who is next in line

[reallyitsmema]

5 hours ago, ipeeinthepool said:

 

I was thinking a similar thing for the nursing homes.  Do you vaccinate the entire nursing home on the same day or stagger it?   What happens if most of the nursing home suffers side effects after receiving the vaccine?  There may not be resources available to tend to everyone.

 

I have a relative in an assisted care facility.  They are not requiring all residents to get the vaccine, some can't have it due to medical issues and others don't want it.  They have compiled a list and will be doing all the vaccines on the same day.  I have heard nothing about staggering for the staff or for residents.

[BND]

Just now, firefly333 said:

Some bank council just applied for bank workers to bet classified as essential workers so they get the vaccine earlier.

 

Well in line with ford buying freezers to store to give their employees vaccine.

 

Let the scrambling begin who is next in line

Essential is such a broad word.   My DH and both my sons are Fed Gov contractors in Essential positions doing jobs that can't just be put aside or done from home so they have been working this entire time, although with some accomodations such as staggered scheduling and spacing of employees.  Both sons have their own offices and my DH shares with one other person and they alternate times with short overlap.  If I  hadn't retired I would also be working, and I had my own office.  My DIL is an RN in a GP office.  As a healthcare worker, she's at higher risk.  But, essential jobs can mean a lot of things.  I can't go into why our jobs were essential, but certain things can't stop.

[ipeeinthepool]

10 minutes ago, firefly333 said:

Some bank council just applied for bank workers to bet classified as essential workers so they get the vaccine earlier.

 

Well in line with ford buying freezers to store to give their employees vaccine.

 

Let the scrambling begin who is next in line

 

Let's add cruise ship employees to the list.

[BND]

5 minutes ago, reallyitsmema said:

 

I have a relative in an assisted care facility.  They are not requiring all residents to get the vaccine, some can't have it due to medical issues and others don't want it.  They have compiled a list and will be doing all the vaccines on the same day.  I have heard nothing about staggering for the staff or for residents.

It also makes you wonder how many of those that passed with Covid wouldn't have been eligible for the vaccine?  My MIL lives in a senior complex.  She's in the independent living part even though she has 24/7 care and should be in assisted living but she refuses so she pays for caregivers.  The facility plans to go door to door like they did with the flu shot once they get the vaccine in.  What we're not clear on, will the independent living residents get it at the same time as the assisted/full time care people will who are in a separate building?  My DH thinks so.  I think those in independent living will have to wait til it's rolled out for their age/risk level.  You have to be 62 to live there, but there are residents in their 80's and 90's as well as those in their early-mid 60's, who will fall into the gray area of not old enough or with co-morbidities.  The facility has it's own medical staff.

 

[reallyitsmema]

2 minutes ago, BND said:

It also makes you wonder how many of those that passed with Covid wouldn't have been eligible for the vaccine?  My MIL lives in a senior complex.  She's in the independent living part even though she has 24/7 care and should be in assisted living but she refuses so she pays for caregivers.  The facility plans to go door to door like they did with the flu shot once they get the vaccine in.  What we're not clear on, will the independent living residents get it at the same time as the assisted/full time care people will who are in a separate building?  My DH thinks so.  I think those in independent living will have to wait til it's rolled out for their age/risk level.  You have to be 62 to live there, but there are residents in their 80's and 90's as well as those in their early-mid 60's, who will fall into the gray area of not old enough or with co-morbidities.  The facility has it's own medical staff.

 

 

The facility my relative is in has independent living, assisted living and a memory care unit.  All residents who want the vaccine as of now, will be getting the vaccine on the same day.  This is a smaller facility that only has 81 residents right now, with many openings that they aren't filling at this time.  The regional medical director was on our Zoom call on Friday and he said all that can should get it and will be available to all.  They are considered to be in group 1A last we were told.

[grandgeezer]

6 minutes ago, ipeeinthepool said:

 

Let's add cruise ship employees to the list.

I don’t think cruises are shut down because they can’t get enough employees.
Might as well add cruise zealots too, they are crying more than any other groups affected by the pandemic.

[ipeeinthepool]

7 minutes ago, grandgeezer said:

I don’t think cruises are shut down because they can’t get enough employees.
Might as well add cruise zealots too, they are crying more than any other groups affected by the pandemic.

 

No, but the close living conditions may require a vaccination or perhaps many smaller countries won't allow cruise ships to arrive unless everyone onboard is vaccinated.

[Milwaukee Eight]

1 hour ago, Milwaukee Eight said:

See post #751

Post #755

[Iamcruzin]

I just received this text message 

 

 

[Coralc]

1 hour ago, ipeeinthepool said:

 

No, but the close living conditions may require a vaccination or perhaps many smaller countries won't allow cruise ships to arrive unless everyone onboard is vaccinated.

 

Correctional facilities are very high on the vaccination list here. Right or wrong, they are in the second or third group. 

[Tree_skier]

32 minutes ago, Coralc said:

 

Correctional facilities are very high on the vaccination list here. Right or wrong, they are in the second or third group. 

A very large percentage of prison inmates have significantly compromised immune systems because of a lifetime of drug and alcohol abuse as well as a lifetime of bad nutrition.

[ipeeinthepool]

57 minutes ago, Coralc said:

 

Correctional facilities are very high on the vaccination list here. Right or wrong, they are in the second or third group. 

 

Hopefully you don't have that many people in California prisons.

[TheMastodon]

On 12/4/2020 at 10:56 AM, yogimax said:

That's like saying that it's more important to cure cancer than heart disease.  Duh

 

I think I would want to cure cancer, but thats just me!

 

Do you like reading?  I have a book for you to enjoy.

 

The Parasitic Mind - Gad Saad

 

 

[yogimax]

40 minutes ago, TheMastodon said:

 

Do you like reading?  I have a book for you to enjoy.

Nah, send the cash instead!

[BND]

4 hours ago, reallyitsmema said:

 

The facility my relative is in has independent living, assisted living and a memory care unit.  All residents who want the vaccine as of now, will be getting the vaccine on the same day.  This is a smaller facility that only has 81 residents right now, with many openings that they aren't filling at this time.  The regional medical director was on our Zoom call on Friday and he said all that can should get it and will be available to all.  They are considered to be in group 1A last we were told.

The one my MIL is in has probably close to 1500 residents and it's one of three or four in the DC area owned by the same company.  It's an extremely well run organization and I'm sure they have ordered doses.  What no one has said is what constitutes "senior living facilities". The assisted living/memory care building of course would be in that group, but more healthy 62+ yr olds in the independent living section wouldn't all be.   The assisted living/memory care building is basically a  really nice nursing home.  The independent living portion is not.  It's an apartment complex that has an age requirement with amenities like medical, banking, gym, indoor pool, one meal per day and restaurants.    My MIL is 88 so she is in the age group that would be eligible anyway, but most of the under 70 yr olds who live there are there because they're married to someone older.  A few years ago their youngest resident was a very healthy 62 yr old whose husband was 75 and needed the one level living and facilities.  She, otherwise wouldn't qualify for the vaccine until later.  They've also had very few cases in IL and those were brought in from outside contacts.  It's just not the same as a nursing home/assisted living would be.  I do wonder if they're going to ask/require that anyone under 65 or so and healthy wait to get it.   Also, only the assisted living/memory care building accepts medicare.  Everyone in the IL has to be financially able to qualify, buy in and pay out of pocket which is very different than most facilities.  Which also makes me wonder if they have to show how many are in the higher risk age group.

Edited December 7, 2020 by BND

[reallyitsmema]

11 minutes ago, BND said:

The one my MIL is in has probably close to 1500 residents and it's one of three or four in the DC area owned by the same company.  It's an extremely well run organization and I'm sure they have ordered doses.  What no one has said is what constitutes "senior living facilities". The assisted living/memory care building of course would be in that group, but more healthy 62+ yr olds in the independent living section wouldn't all be.   The assisted living/memory care building is basically a  really nice nursing home.  The independent living portion is not.  It's an apartment complex that has an age requirement with amenities like medical, banking, gym, indoor pool, one meal per day and restaurants.    My MIL is 88 so she is in the age group that would be eligible anyway, but most of the under 70 yr olds who live there are there because they're married to someone older.  A few years ago their youngest resident was a very healthy 62 yr old whose husband was 75 and needed the one level living and facilities.  She, otherwise wouldn't qualify for the vaccine until later.  They've also had very few cases in IL and those were brought in from outside contacts.  It's just not the same as a nursing home/assisted living would be.  I do wonder if they're going to ask/require that anyone under 65 or so and healthy wait to get it.   Also, only the assisted living/memory care building accepts medicare.  Everyone in the IL has to be financially able to qualify, buy in and pay out of pocket which is very different than most facilities.  Which also makes me wonder if they have to show how many are in the higher risk age group.

 

Big difference between assisted living/memory care and a nursing home but that is a completely different discussion.  There are many different types of assisted living, some with buy ins and others that are basically month to month tenants.  Amenities vary greatly too.  What you are describing sounds like Brooksby Village which would not have been a fit for my relative.  A smaller facility was a much better choice.

 

The facility my relative is in expects the vaccine before the end of the year.  This facility has been covid free until last week.  No resident or staff has had covid during the entire pandemic, which is amazing and the staff should be commended for their dedication to the health of the residents.  Unfortunately, during their weekly surveillance testing, they found four staff who are positive, all asymptomatic.  All residents have since been tested, memory care twice now, and are all negative.  They are supposed to have PCR testing today by the state.  Not sure what will happen as far as the vaccine if the outbreak spreads.  We are hoping the strict PPE regulations for the staff will keep the residents negative, but time will tell.

[BND]

14 minutes ago, reallyitsmema said:

 

Big difference between assisted living/memory care and a nursing home but that is a completely different discussion.  There are many different types of assisted living, some with buy ins and others that are basically month to month tenants.  Amenities vary greatly too.  What you are describing sounds like Brooksby Village which would not have been a fit for my relative.  A smaller facility was a much better choice.

 

 

Hers is a buy in and a big one.  Her buy in was just over 400K.   What the contract/buy in gets her is that now that she's gone through all her cash (she had quite a bit, but outside 24/7 care runs 20K/mo) they are allowing withdrawals of her buy in with her current care co.  Once that's gone, she will go on benevolence.  The agreement is they will take care of her after her money runs out if required, but tht's because they pre-qualify people and most don't outlive their money.  When you leave, one way or the other, you or your heirs get 90% of your buy in back.  The assisted living/memory care/long term care facility that is part of my MIL's residence is still considered more nursing home because of the services they provide there vs the IL portion.  They take medicare, they provide long term care with hallways (very wide, nice carpeted ones) with individual rooms, but they provide the same services nursing homes do.  24/7 care, medication dispensing, common areas, food delivery, activities for those that choose to eat in a group, etc.  The facility has been on lockdown since March. The IL has only had 4 cases and one death and those were brought in by the residents who got sick, but didn't pass them on.  In the assisted living/memory care/ LTC which has at least 100 residents, they lost about 12, with a lot of staff who got sick while caring for those who were.  Most of those were people transferred in for care as new residents in Mar/April.   None of the staff passed away, just some of the people in LTC.  

Edited December 7, 2020 by BND

[Tree_skier]

5 hours ago, TheMastodon said:

 

I think I would want to cure cancer, but thats just me!

 

Do you like reading?  I have a book for you to enjoy.

 

The Parasitic Mind - Gad Saad

 

 

Prof. Saad is one of the most brilliant minds currently in Academia.  I loved the "The Parasitic Mind". 

[crzndeb]

6 hours ago, Tree_skier said:

A very large percentage of prison inmates have significantly compromised immune systems because of a lifetime of drug and alcohol abuse as well as a lifetime of bad nutrition.

Hmmmm...that might apply to some cruisers also 😉

Edited December 8, 2020 by crzndeb

[Tippyton]

Ahhhh - the ole Lifeboat Dilemma makes its 2020 appearance.😲

[meadowlander]

On 12/6/2020 at 4:34 PM, broberts said:

 

I was surprised at the relatively low number committed to the US. It would be interesting to learn if that was a number set by the government or the supplier.

Even more surprising considering we were promised 300 million vaccines by January 1,2021 but with 1 million new cases in 5 days, we are as promised "rounding the corner".