New vaccine

[terrierjohn]

9 hours ago, KnowTheScore said:

 

What ought to be happening is that the vulnerable and those in close contact with them should be shielded and locked down until they can get vaccinated.  There's just no science or reason to lockdown everyone else who is not remotely vulnerable. 

 

 

It sounds good in theory KTS, but there are far too many multi generational households in the UK for it to be practical, and among the elderly are also those needing care, either at home or in a Care Home setting, and it is not easy to ensure that all the carers are not passing on the virus while they work; especially when you intend freeing up all the non vulnerable and letting the virus run rampant.

Edited December 5, 2020 by terrierjohn

[Adawn47]

8 minutes ago, wowzz said:

JVT said that 99% of deaths and hospital CV19  admissions would be stopped by vaccinating the elderly first. You can't argue with those sort of figures.

It makes no logical sense to vaccinate those that are unlikely to die, when there is only a limited number of vaccine doses available.

I see your point wowzz, but to me it's a complicated decision that I can't get my head round. JTV has been the only scientist that I've had total faith in all through this, and the only one who doesn't try to sugar coat anything. I trust him 110% and if he says that's the way to go then it must be right.

Avril

[davecttr]

33 minutes ago, wowzz said:

JVT said that 99% of deaths and hospital CV19  admissions would be stopped by vaccinating the elderly first. You can't argue with those sort of figures.

It makes no logical sense to vaccinate those that are unlikely to die, when there is only a limited number of vaccine doses available.

Did he say would be or could be? I suspect that even he cannot guarantee that. My local hospital has over 50% of its bed capacity occupied by COVID patients and it serves a population of about 400, 000 people with 588 beds. This is a crisis and this week we had a patient waiting 9 hours outside A&E in an ambulance. The local area is now the worst in England for COVID.

 

Anything which helps reduce stress on hospitals should be top priority.

Edited December 5, 2020 by davecttr

[lincslady]

I can see all points of view - it is just that we, and all our friends and family who are in the most vulnerable groups, are already being extremely careful to keep away from others - even not seeing them at Christmas if they have say student children or grandchildren, and while this is sometimes upsetting, we are now used to being extra careful and some of us willing to go on for longer.  I am sure if you are, say, in your seventies and pretty fit and healthy you may not agree.

 

Certainly in care homes the staff should all be vaccinated as soon as possible, though it would be good to find out that it would reduce your risk of passing it on as well as not getting it yourself.  It is very difficult all round, with something so unknown to the world, to know what is best.

 

 

 

 

[AndyMichelle]

[yorkshirephil]

Bugger

[lincslady]

51 minutes ago, yorkshirephil said:

Bugger

+ 1  😦

[wowzz]

1 hour ago, davecttr said:

My local hospital has over 50% of its bed capacity occupied by COVID patients and it serves a population of about 400, 000 people with 588 beds. This is a crisis and this week we had a patient waiting 9 hours outside A&E in an ambulance. The local area is now the worst in England for COVID.

Which is why you need to vaccinate those most likely to add strain on the NHS,  which statistically speaking, are the elderly.

[kalos]

24 minutes ago, wowzz said:

Which is why you need to vaccinate those most likely to add strain on the NHS,  which statistically speaking, are the elderly.

 

I would add to that anyone staying in hospital as these days the hospitals are getting clogged

up with younger covid patients as well who are now taking up some of these much needed beds.

I made enquires via a local MP and this was his stance on our hospital  a few days ago .....

 

 I wanted to outline the current situation in Rother Valley and South Yorkshire. As I have always said residents should have the full facts, rather than relying on hearsay, internet memes of happenstance. We cannot wish away the virus or wish that it wasn't putting large numbers of people in hospital - it is.

Today I have spoken to Rotherham NHS and wanted to share with you the most up-to-date and sobering statistics of where we are. Everyone in Rother Valley deserves to see what the situation really is in our hospital. As of this morning:

 

The rate per 100k of infections is 201. Although this is a fall from 223 last week, this is still far higher than national average and even areas like London.

We have a positivity rate of about 11% (the World Health Organisations believes we need a rate of about 6%)

Currently there are 162 beds occupied by patients in Rotherham Hospital - the most there have ever been .

This means of the currently available hospital beds (420), 38.5% are taken up with Covid patients

59 Covid patients are either on oxygen or mechanical ventilation

32 Covid patients in hospital are under the age of 54 and 68 are under the age of 74.

 

To put it bluntly we are in an incredibly serious situation. Our hospital is under immense pressure - with almost 40% of beds taken up with Covid patients - and as illnesses and diseases always increase this time of year we all need to play our part to drive down the infection and protect lives.

 

 

So the sooner the hospitals and nursing homes are sorted ,that's staff as well as patients the better.

Edited December 5, 2020 by kalos

[Eddie99]

Deciding who/when is way above my pay grade.  I just hope that when the decision is made it’s on medical grounds not political ones

 

As for me - I guess I’ll just keep on keeping on till my turn comes and I’m “free” again.  OH and I felt we would be impacted, to a greater or lesser degree for all of 2020 for sure, and quite probably for most or all of 2021.  I think it has helped us not grasping at straws so far and mostly accepting and adapting to the situation.  Basically trying to stay well to be ready to resume something like our former lives.  Roll on!

[lincslady]

Looking at the South Yorkshire statistics their proportion of Covid patients in hospital is 100 under 74, and 62  over  74.

[lincslady]

1 hour ago, lincslady said:

Looking at the South Yorkshire statistics their proportion of Covid patients in hospital is 100 under 74, and 62  over  74.

Oops - just realised that the figures may mean 68 altogether under 74  - if so ignore previous post!

[AndyMichelle]

[Selbourne]

On 12/4/2020 at 1:23 PM, Esprit said:

So vaccinate the BAME population next, after the NHS and care homes perhaps?

This question was asked in one of the scientific briefings and the answer they gave was that age was by far and away the biggest single risk factor, far more so than ethnicity / obesity etc. I personally think that they are going to struggle to get all the over 80’s, care home residents & staff and NHS Staff vaccinated within the next couple of months - and that’s just the first two groups! 

[Selbourne]

On 12/4/2020 at 2:01 PM, terrierjohn said:

No wowzz he said once all the vulnerable groups and over 65s were vaccinated it should stop 99% of hospitalizations and deaths.

My understanding John (although it wasn’t terribly clear) was that the 99% referred to by JVT was when ALL the currently published groups were vaccinated, in other words everyone over 50 and all those with underlying conditions. 

[AndyMichelle]

[Adawn47]

1 hour ago, AndyMichelle said:

Oh god Andy!!! you should issue a warning before you post something like that. I've nearly choked on my coffee🤣

We all need  a little perking up now and again though don't we?😉😉

Avril

[ace2542]

They are vaccinating in Moscow on Monday apparently. Anything to be first hey.

[ace2542]

10 hours ago, lincslady said:

I can see all points of view - it is just that we, and all our friends and family who are in the most vulnerable groups, are already being extremely careful to keep away from others - even not seeing them at Christmas if they have say student children or grandchildren, and while this is sometimes upsetting, we are now used to being extra careful and some of us willing to go on for longer.  I am sure if you are, say, in your seventies and pretty fit and healthy you may not agree.

 

Certainly in care homes the staff should all be vaccinated as soon as possible, though it would be good to find out that it would reduce your risk of passing it on as well as not getting it yourself.  It is very difficult all round, with something so unknown to the world, to know what is best.

 

 

 

 

I think the family members of people in care homes should be high on the list as well.

[kalos]

26 minutes ago, ace2542 said:

They are vaccinating in Moscow on Monday apparently. Anything to be first hey.

 

1/The UK was the first to clear Covid vaccine for use .

 

2/The Chinese  Chang'e 5 mission have just landed on the moon 

 

3/ If your lucky enough to use Russian covid vaccine sputnik first ...

Chances are you will get to see where they landed ... (No travel  necessary)

but hey that's just another side effect of 2020 

 

[terrierjohn]

2 hours ago, Selbourne said:

My understanding John (although it wasn’t terribly clear) was that the 99% referred to by JVT was when ALL the currently published groups were vaccinated, in other words everyone over 50 and all those with underlying conditions. 

I was including those with underlying conditions in the vulnerable category.  However if he was including everyone down to the over 50s, then he is assuming that the vaccination programme will be operating even faster than I had thought.

[wowzz]

2 hours ago, Selbourne said:

My understanding John (although it wasn’t terribly clear) was that the 99% referred to by JVT was when ALL the currently published groups were vaccinated, in other words everyone over 50 and all those with underlying conditions. 

Sorry, but I agree with John. JVT said that vaccinating the elderly first would cause a 99% decline in deaths and hospital admissions.

To be fair, that's a ballsy statement, but the logic is spot on. Vaccinate those that will be most likely to cause a drain on the NHS first is the logical way to go.

Without being callous, whilst vaccinating NHS staff first sounds good in principle,  it doesn't reduce the pressure on beds. Vaccinating the elderly first relieves the pinch point.

[Selbourne]

44 minutes ago, terrierjohn said:

I was including those with underlying conditions in the vulnerable category.  However if he was including everyone down to the over 50s, then he is assuming that the vaccination programme will be operating even faster than I had thought.

I thought he was a little evasive about the timescales when questioned, which made me think that he wasn’t as confident as the politicians, as he mentioned the logistical challenges quite a few times. 

[tring]

1 hour ago, Selbourne said:

I thought he was a little evasive about the timescales when questioned, which made me think that he wasn’t as confident as the politicians, as he mentioned the logistical challenges quite a few times. 

 

I seem to remember mention of 75% reduction in hospitalisations after the initial groups, (not sure exactly which) and 99% after they have completed all mentioned (ie down to over 50's).  The later being completed by April.  Not a lot of protection before the end of winter though and of course tales a while for two jabs and a bit longefor max vaccine protection.

[Harry Peterson]

We've got to get the vaccine into the country before we can do anything at all with it, and there are already plans to fly it in if necessary, given the near certainty of problems at the ports from 1 January.

 

I wish I had some confidence in the government's logistical skills (or indeed any skills) to handle this, but given earlier pronouncements which have all failed the words wing and prayer spring to mind.

 

I just hope there's some sort of last minute deal with the EU, skimpy though it will inevitably be, to perhaps reduce some of the disruption.