All inclusive. Not really. Expensive, YES!

[HMR74]

20 minutes ago, Denny01 said:

This is a very perceptive statement. Well said. 

 

Den

It is an oldie but goodie borrowed from the business sector. OMG

 

My wife and I are pretty much old school. We normally do not spend freely, we buy nice cars, keep them in good shape and thus keep them for a long time. And we as I mentioned before normally do not go out for expensive meals, and I think some of the prices now are ridiculous compared to dining at home. Yet will will do that from time to time.

 

However, there are times we splurge, and vacations are one of those times. Cruises especially. I have said that the service levels on Celebrity (not the front office mind you) but on the ships is pretty darn good. (actually its pretty good on all of them). We find that the moment we board its like a snap of the finger and all changes. (The muster sucked but that's been changed).

 

I have tried to reach Celebrity and RCL to politely give them my suggestions for improvement-it was a dream. Nobody ever called me back including investor relations which is truly amazing.

 

However, again, I have been able to separate the treatment by the front office from the experience on the ships and it's the latter which keeps me coming back-like a birdie on the 18th hole.

Edited May 2, 2021 by HMR74

[cantstopingcruising]

I took a look  at Royal Carib.

Jan/23 they have a 14 day cruise on the Rhapsody out of Barbados. The price is amazing (at least yesterday it was!) and we can add a week in Barbados and still come out ahead of our usual 21 days on Celebrity.

 

Question is:  Would we like the Rhapsody?  I have no idea.

[davekathy]

58 minutes ago, cantstopingcruising said:

I took a look  at Royal Carib.

Jan/23 they have a 14 day cruise on the Rhapsody out of Barbados. The price is amazing (at least yesterday it was!) and we can add a week in Barbados and still come out ahead of our usual 21 days on Celebrity.

 

Question is:  Would we like the Rhapsody?  I have no idea.

Only you can answer that. 

[cantstopingcruising]

I thought that perhaps one of you has been on that ship.

 

I can't answer that because I know nothing about it. Is it an old tub?

[davekathy]

33 minutes ago, cantstopingcruising said:

I thought that perhaps one of you has been on that ship.

 

I can't answer that because I know nothing about it. Is it an old tub?

My point is, other than yourself who really can say whether or not you will like the Rhapsody. We've cruised on the Rhapsody and liked the ship and crew. Does that mean you will like the Rhapsody or not? No the Rhapsody is not a old tub, IMO. The ship is ~24 years old. Refurbished in 2016. GT 78,878. What ships have you sailed on that you want to compare the Rhapsody to? 

Edited May 2, 2021 by davekathy

[ScubesDad]

In reading through this thread, two general themes keep popping up, value and quality, and then the catch all of luxury. Having first sailed with Celebrity in 2001 and having sailed with them exclusively for the past 20 years  it was certainly the quality of the experience and the pricing of the experience that kept us coming back.  However, in my opinion (and to be honest, that is all that really matters) the experience was closer to luxury for the first 10 years than it has been for the last 10.  Until recently we have always felt we were getting good value for the money spent. For the past 8 or 10 years we have sailed in suites, sky suites as we did not perceive any benefit in moving up, and have been extremely pleased.  Things have changed, it feels like the bean counters have more input and are trying to squeeze more out of each passenger. In fairness, i trained as a bean counter then took a different career path in the world of finance. If you are going to call it luxury, and price it as luxury, then you better deliver luxury. In my opinion they have failed in the delivery.  Pricing right now is the focus, and so it should be as they need to generate cash flow asap. The Retreat experience on M & S class ships is nothing like the product provided on the E class.  The retrofits are great, just not a complete experience. However, the price charged on a M class is excessive given the limitations of the offering compared to the standard established on the E class, and similarly on the S class. Also, only a few of the ships have been revolutionized, yet the pricing is inflated across all ships. However, as far as our decision making process is concerned, i recently compared a Celebrity cruise against a Seabourn cruise, similar itinerary incouding departure and embarkation ports for Jan 2023,....the Celebrity trip is 12 night vs 14 night, but the cost is almost identical on a per night cost, with Seabourn being C$15 per person per night more expensive, however Seabourn is including economy airfare.   The decision is made for you. My conclusion is that Celebrity has priced themself into the luxury category, and is hoping no one asks too many questions about the product.

[iancal]

I agree with Flyer Talker.  This is a complete no brainer.  Why moan and groan or argue endlessly about the merits of this.

 

So simple.  If you do not like it then vote with your feet and with your wallet.   There are lots of travel vendors in the marketplace with many different offerings.  Find one that suits you. 

 

 Being loyal to a cruise line does not infer a life long commitment.  It only means as long as you are happy with the product and happy with the value. 

 

We very much like Celebrity.  But if the price and the value, from our perspective, is not attractive  on a particular buy we will select another cruise line.  No issue whatsoever for us.

Edited May 2, 2021 by iancal

[kelmac]

Hello cruisers,

I'm not sure Celebrity's prices are out of whack with the rest of the industry.  For example, we are doing several cruises during the fall and winter of 2021/2022, some with Celebrity and some with other cruise lines.  We board the NCL Joy 11/20/2021 in an inside cabin -- the total cost is $2,509.78 (includes drink package + NCL's up charge, a two night alternative restaurant pkg + NCL's up charge, for two people)

 

On 11/27/2021 we will board Celebrity's Apex, in a CAT 9 inside -- the cost is $2,200.54 (includes drink package + gratuities + a WiFi package).  We really like the Joy's itinerary, but NCL is not in the same class as Celebrity, yet they consistently charge more when you include their drink/dining packages.  

 

HAL has some great prices, but they don't offer many perks.  We are doing a week on MSC's Seashore, in the Yacht Club (yes, inside cabin), for $600 more than our Joy cruise.  The Joy's cheapest Haven cabin is $7,530.38 total for two people. 

 

IMO -- Celebrity still remains the best "bang for the buck" in the cruise industry.

Enjoy!

Kel

[ALWAYS CRUZIN]

54 minutes ago, ScubesDad said:

In reading through this thread, two general themes keep popping up, value and quality, and then the catch all of luxury. Having first sailed with Celebrity in 2001 and having sailed with them exclusively for the past 20 years  it was certainly the quality of the experience and the pricing of the experience that kept us coming back.  However, in my opinion (and to be honest, that is all that really matters) the experience was closer to luxury for the first 10 years than it has been for the last 10.  Until recently we have always felt we were getting good value for the money spent. For the past 8 or 10 years we have sailed in suites, sky suites as we did not perceive any benefit in moving up, and have been extremely pleased.  Things have changed, it feels like the bean counters have more input and are trying to squeeze more out of each passenger. In fairness, i trained as a bean counter then took a different career path in the world of finance. If you are going to call it luxury, and price it as luxury, then you better deliver luxury. In my opinion they have failed in the delivery.  Pricing right now is the focus, and so it should be as they need to generate cash flow asap. The Retreat experience on M & S class ships is nothing like the product provided on the E class.  The retrofits are great, just not a complete experience. However, the price charged on a M class is excessive given the limitations of the offering compared to the standard established on the E class, and similarly on the S class. Also, only a few of the ships have been revolutionized, yet the pricing is inflated across all ships. However, as far as our decision making process is concerned, i recently compared a Celebrity cruise against a Seabourn cruise, similar itinerary incouding departure and embarkation ports for Jan 2023,....the Celebrity trip is 12 night vs 14 night, but the cost is almost identical on a per night cost, with Seabourn being C$15 per person per night more expensive, however Seabourn is including economy airfare.   The decision is made for you. My conclusion is that Celebrity has priced themself into the luxury category, and is hoping no one asks too many questions about the product.

Agree. If you are going to charge for luxury, you better provide it. The past pricing and the past experience was well worth it. No longer. Again, I do not want to pay for others to enjoy what I do not want or need.

[LGW59]

1 hour ago, ScubesDad said:

In reading through this thread, two general themes keep popping up, value and quality, and then the catch all of luxury. Having first sailed with Celebrity in 2001 and having sailed with them exclusively for the past 20 years  it was certainly the quality of the experience and the pricing of the experience that kept us coming back.  However, in my opinion (and to be honest, that is all that really matters) the experience was closer to luxury for the first 10 years than it has been for the last 10.  Until recently we have always felt we were getting good value for the money spent. For the past 8 or 10 years we have sailed in suites, sky suites as we did not perceive any benefit in moving up, and have been extremely pleased.  Things have changed, it feels like the bean counters have more input and are trying to squeeze more out of each passenger. In fairness, i trained as a bean counter then took a different career path in the world of finance. If you are going to call it luxury, and price it as luxury, then you better deliver luxury. In my opinion they have failed in the delivery.  Pricing right now is the focus, and so it should be as they need to generate cash flow asap. The Retreat experience on M & S class ships is nothing like the product provided on the E class.  The retrofits are great, just not a complete experience. However, the price charged on a M class is excessive given the limitations of the offering compared to the standard established on the E class, and similarly on the S class. Also, only a few of the ships have been revolutionized, yet the pricing is inflated across all ships. However, as far as our decision making process is concerned, i recently compared a Celebrity cruise against a Seabourn cruise, similar itinerary incouding departure and embarkation ports for Jan 2023,....the Celebrity trip is 12 night vs 14 night, but the cost is almost identical on a per night cost, with Seabourn being C$15 per person per night more expensive, however Seabourn is including economy airfare.   The decision is made for you. My conclusion is that Celebrity has priced themself into the luxury category, and is hoping no one asks too many questions about the product.

However, in my opinion (and to be honest, that is all that really matters) You are of course 100% correct, when one is laying down their hard earned vacation dollars, we want to get what we believe to be a value for what we spend and an amazing experience.  Once that ceases to anyone, time to make a change.  While Celebrity is definitely providing the luxury experience and value for me, clearly it is not the same for everyone, there is no one size fits all.  I like that you did not whine or bemoan all of this, you clearly stated your reasons and perspective from your experience and seem to be making the best decision on how you want to spend your vacation $$.  

Edited May 2, 2021 by LGW59

[4774Papa]

5 hours ago, Denny01 said:

And those who will not cruise on X because they don’t want to pay for what they don’t use, quite legit. But if you think that will adversely impact X and make a change, realize there will be more than a few RCL / NCL / Carnival / etc cruisers who realize they save money by cruising on X with AI instead of paying for all the packages or paying by-drink. 

 

And yes, there is a cruise out there that will be cheaper than some X cruise with the additions added. Go for it, and I bet/hope you’ll enjoy the new line you select. I’ve not been on any cruise that I disliked. A few I’d not do again, but….

 

Den

Den,

We have done 20 cruises in the past 10 years with X, Royal C and NCL.  All of the cruises were good.  From friends that have done Princess, I believe we would enjoy that line.   Prior to every cruise I do a best value, comparing price, itinerary, ship.  I have, in the past chosen X when the price difference was modest for basically the same cruise.

 

After being able to go on Royal C. with Diamond benefits, we have done two cruises with them on Radiance class ships (not a mega ship that we don't care for).   We won't be picking X with the  very significant price difference.    Still, I will continue to do my spread sheet as I do when picking a land tour.  

 

We have about $25 K to spend on travel every year and the more we save, the more we travel.

[Denny01]

2 minutes ago, 4774Papa said:

Den,

We have done 20 cruises in the past 10 years with X, Royal C and NCL.  All of the cruises were good.  From friends that have done Princess, I believe we would enjoy that line.   Prior to every cruise I do a best value, comparing price, itinerary, ship.  I have, in the past chosen X when the price difference was modest for basically the same cruise.

 

After being able to go on Royal C. with Diamond benefits, we have done two cruises with them on Radiance class ships (not a mega ship that we don't care for).   We won't be picking X with the  very significant price difference.    Still, I will continue to do my spread sheet as I do when picking a land tour.  

 

We have about $25 K to spend on travel every year and the more we save, the more we travel.

Good approach. One heads up for Princess. we enjoyed Princess, good lIne. But the three ships we were on, the standard SRs had very small BRs and the showers were very small and I would end up with the curtain against me the entire time, and I’m not that big. And the SR had no seating for guests to come over which we like. What we’d do then for Princess was get a Mini-Suite. Larger (and Big veranda) even than the X standard SR’s, but their standard didn’t meet what we needed. So when I compare X to Princess, I compare the standard X Balcony SRs to the Princess Mini-Suite costs. Not sure if this is true for all the Princess ships, just the smaller ones we cruised on.

 

And agree, the smaller RCL are nice, but never again on a mega ship……I’ve never been on a cruise I disliked, but that was close. The only saving grace was nice dining and their Diamond club that gave us some privacy. 

 

Enjoy picking and choosing. Somethings I think making the choice is 1/2 the fun…..well maybe not That much, but it is. And once I pick, I focus on that baby a good deal making plans, now That could be 1/2 the fun!!

 

Den

[NHCRUISIN]

If I don’t like entertainment and don’t go to shows should I have to pay for that ?😉

[Covepointcruiser]

You should try Cunard, they have single/solo cabins.   I don’t know the other lines offering single occupancy cabins.   I am sure they sell out quickly. I remember when you were able to request a shared cabin and you were put in a cabin with someone of the same sex.   Guess that wouldn’t work so well these days.

[davekathy]

9 hours ago, Denny01 said:

That’s why I use a professional TA. 

 

Den

I sometimes use a TA. But I'm still looking for a professional TA. 

[HMR74]

A suggestion:

on the AI upcharge, start a separate thread 

Solo Cruises AI upcharge

That might get some broader attention. 

 

But word it to include other cruise lines like NCL and possible some of the true  premium cruise lines. to make it less specific to any one cruise line to draw broader interest.

 

It does not make a difference how they package and price it word , if you have to pay for 2 complete passengers for one passenger,  there some inequities there. The Cabin Steward is going to spend the same time for one as two, I would use 2 full internet connections, one for phone and one for ipad,  most others not, but there are some true non debatable variable costs.

 

Unlike food, booze does not get thrown away.

 

And pray on their empathy. Not the woe  is me issue, which does come in handy at some points. There is a basic policy issue to deal with.

 

 

 

[CroozFanatic]

Seems the main sticking point with AI is from including drinks. Virgin Voyages did not include drinks in their AI package. Easy for Celebrity to modify/copy...and they should.

 

I know a lot of folks disagree, but Edge, Apex, and Beyond and the AI package are "most like" Virgin Voyages and the Scarlet Lady, Valiant Lady, and Resilient Lady.

[LGW59]

1 minute ago, CroozFanatic said:

Seems the main sticking point with AI is from including drinks. Virgin Voyages did not include drinks in their AI package. Easy for Celebrity to modify/copy...and they should.

 

I know a lot of folks disagree, but Edge, Apex, and Beyond and the AI package are "most like" Virgin Voyages and the Scarlet Lady, Valiant Lady, and Resilient Lady.

Of course no one has sailed on a Virgin ship yet, but that said, they look like a college dorm room, no thanks!

[Jeremiah1212]

16 minutes ago, CroozFanatic said:

Seems the main sticking point with AI is from including drinks. Virgin Voyages did not include drinks in their AI package. Easy for Celebrity to modify/copy...and they should.

 

I know a lot of folks disagree, but Edge, Apex, and Beyond and the AI package are "most like" Virgin Voyages and the Scarlet Lady, Valiant Lady, and Resilient Lady.

 

I don't see anyone copying Virgin's approach until they actually have some sailing history and feedback can be evaluated. The drink package inclusion seems to work well for Celebrity and I'm sure their decision to include it by default was prompted by having several years of data amongst those who chose it as one of the perks to include. 

[Spif Barwunkel]

18 minutes ago, LGW59 said:

Of course no one has sailed on a Virgin ship yet, but that said, they look like a college dorm room, no thanks!

But the hazing will make it all worthwhile. If you're up to it.

[Tipsy252]

On 4/26/2021 at 4:38 AM, NMTraveller said:

I lucked out in my next cruise.  It was booked before AI was offered.

I booked my next cruise before the "Always included" was available, a quick phone call to my TA and it was added to my cruise at no extra cost!

[iancal]

It is a simple math exercise for us.  We look at an AI price.  We reduce it by the value to us of the AI inclusives.   We know on average what we spend for drinks.   

 

We come down to a baseline balcony cabin plus gratuities price for two or three different ship/itinerary options.  Then we make a choice.  Not always on lowest price, but the bottom line price is always considered. 

[LGW59]

On 5/1/2021 at 7:47 PM, cruisemom42 said:

 

Thanks -- I only recently discovered that the E-class ships had single cabins. I will check it out in future -- but I have to confess that I prefer smaller ships to larger ones.

 

IMO one does not really feel like you are on a large ship, we did not anyway, the ship is so open with loads of windows and natural light, made a huge difference.

[Ex-Airbalancer]

On 5/2/2021 at 1:29 PM, davekathy said:

My point is, other than yourself who really can say whether or not you will like the Rhapsody. We've cruised on the Rhapsody and liked the ship and crew. Does that mean you will like the Rhapsody or not? No the Rhapsody is not a old tub, IMO. The ship is ~24 years old. Refurbished in 2016. GT 78,878. What ships have you sailed on that you want to compare the Rhapsody to? 

Did a TA in Nov 2017, Rhapsody is the worst ship I have been on , crew was so so 

it sure is no Celebrity ship , I thought it was in pretty bad shape year after a refurbishing . 

the crew was spreading armours that it was bout to be sold 

but who knows what cruises will be like once it starts up again 

[PTC DAWG]

On 5/2/2021 at 4:45 PM, kelmac said:

Hello cruisers,

I'm not sure Celebrity's prices are out of whack with the rest of the industry.  For example, we are doing several cruises during the fall and winter of 2021/2022, some with Celebrity and some with other cruise lines.  We board the NCL Joy 11/20/2021 in an inside cabin -- the total cost is $2,509.78 (includes drink package + NCL's up charge, a two night alternative restaurant pkg + NCL's up charge, for two people)

 

On 11/27/2021 we will board Celebrity's Apex, in a CAT 9 inside -- the cost is $2,200.54 (includes drink package + gratuities + a WiFi package).  We really like the Joy's itinerary, but NCL is not in the same class as Celebrity, yet they consistently charge more when you include their drink/dining packages.  

 

HAL has some great prices, but they don't offer many perks.  We are doing a week on MSC's Seashore, in the Yacht Club (yes, inside cabin), for $600 more than our Joy cruise.  The Joy's cheapest Haven cabin is $7,530.38 total for two people. 

 

IMO -- Celebrity still remains the best "bang for the buck" in the cruise industry.

Enjoy!

Kel

Nice comparisons...you make great points..