Update on P&O Insurance Issues

[howmuch!]

LV seem to be at odds with that approach, as annual policy holders do not need to inform LV of health changes until renewal. Regarding 'negative passengers and cover - 

 

I've lodged a complaint with LV, based upon the email received by 'Carpgirl' from LV showing that 'negative' passengers were covered for quarantine costs, which is the opposite to what LV had previously told me by telephone on 2 occasions.

 

When they clarify their position on this to me in writing, I'll provide an update

[Cristaltips]

I am insured with Travel50Plus under the Civil Service Insurance Scheme. I have asked them the questions regarding negative traveller with a positive companion and also being forced to quarantine as a “close contact”. I asked specifically about Spain as that seems to be where the problem arises.  Unfortunately, only positive case has cover and there’s none for negative close contacts. As this scheme covers Civil Service, Local Government, Police, NHS and more, it seems pretty poor to me. Below is their reply

 

 

Thank you for your enquiry regarding your travel insurance policy.

Your policy covers you for medical and repatriation cover in regards of illness.  This would only apply to the traveller who is ill.  The Insurer would advise if the second traveller would be covered at the time of any claim.  i.e  If it was felt the traveller should remain to assist the poorly passenger as they would struggle by themselves.

The policy does not provide any cover if you chose or were recommended to quarantine or isolate as a result of exposure to an infectious disease including Covid 19.

A copy of the Insurance Product Information Document is attached for your perusal.

Kind Regards


Travel 50 Plus Team
Tel: 01622 766 960
Email: sales@csis.co.uk


Civil Service Insurance Society
www.csis.co.uk 

 

 

[zap99]

1 minute ago, howmuch! said:

LV seem to be at odds with that approach, as annual policy holders do not need to inform LV of health changes until renewal. Regarding 'negative passengers and cover - 

 

I've lodged a complaint with LV, based upon the email received by 'Carpgirl' from LV showing that 'negative' passengers were covered for quarantine costs, which is the opposite to what LV had previously told me by telephone on 2 occasions.

 

When they clarify their position on this to me in writing, I'll provide an update

We had a Annual worldwide all singing and dancing policy with staysure. DW saw a specialist for an ongoing ( 20 years+ ) issue that had always been declared and covered. Due to changes in medicine over the years the specialist said they could now fix it and put her on a waiting list. When I told the insurer, they cancelled the policy.

[zap99]

4 minutes ago, Cristaltips said:

I am insured with Travel50Plus under the Civil Service Insurance Scheme. I have asked them the questions regarding negative traveller with a positive companion and also being forced to quarantine as a “close contact”. I asked specifically about Spain as that seems to be where the problem arises.  Unfortunately, only positive case has cover and there’s none for negative close contacts. As this scheme covers Civil Service, Local Government, Police, NHS and more, it seems pretty poor to me. Below is their reply

 

 

Thank you for your enquiry regarding your travel insurance policy.

Your policy covers you for medical and repatriation cover in regards of illness.  This would only apply to the traveller who is ill.  The Insurer would advise if the second traveller would be covered at the time of any claim.  i.e  If it was felt the traveller should remain to assist the poorly passenger as they would struggle by themselves.

The policy does not provide any cover if you chose or were recommended to quarantine or isolate as a result of exposure to an infectious disease including Covid 19.

A copy of the Insurance Product Information Document is attached for your perusal.

Kind Regards


Travel 50 Plus Team
Tel: 01622 766 960
Email: sales@csis.co.uk


Civil Service Insurance Society
www.csis.co.uk 

 

 

That, I bet has excluded many thousands of folk from having cover for, even 1 quarantine for a positive test, or a close contact.

[Cristaltips]

3 minutes ago, zap99 said:

That, I bet has excluded many thousands of folk from having cover for, even 1 quarantine for a positive test, or a close contact.

Exactly, and how many of those thousands are travelling in blissful oblivion? Makes me so cross 

[Megabear2]

FCA have called. No need to do individual complaints. I need everyone's insurance replies forwarding under a reference he gave me.  I have forwarded 20 so far.  Don't worry if they're duplicate companies, Leigh wants them all! When forwarding refer to PAC (that's me!).

 

His email address:

 

Consumer.queries@fca.org.uk 

Our reference: 208031712

Attention Mr Leigh Genery

 

QUOTE

 

Dear xxxxxxxx

Thank you for your recent webform to our unfair contracts team that's been passed to me as best placed to respond to you and thank you for your time in our earlier telephone conversation this afternoon. 

I understand you're raising concerns that insurance firms are not clearly stating whether their travel insurance policy either includes or excludes the following: 'cover costs of quarantine including but not limited to accommodation, food and sustenance, sundries such as internet and telephone access, transportation to and from the quarantine premises, covid testing while in quarantine, nursing/doctors' costs for administering and documenting these required tests and repatriation to the United Kingdom.'

I can appreciate the concerns this has caused you and thank you for bringing this matter to our attention.
 
Our remit
 
We're responsible for authorising firms offering financial services and products to consumers in the UK. For example, a firm dealing in insurance would have to comply with our rules and we do expect firms to pay due regard to the information needs of its clients, and communicate information to them in a way which is clear, fair and not misleading.

What I have done with your information 
 
As I mentioned I have shared the information you provided with my colleagues in our General Insurance policy team for their intelligence and I'd welcome you coming back to me with any firm response you may receive for our additional intelligence.

Thank you once again for taking the time to bring this matter to our attention. If you need to speak to us further on this matter, have any other questions for the FCA, or have more information to share with us then please dont hesitate to contact us again and please quote the following number, to ensure we can link all your correspondence to the correct reference number. Your reference number is [208031712].
 
I trust this information is helpful and wish you the best going forward.
 
To help us improve our service, Im interested in finding out about your experience with the Supervision Hub today. Ill send you a link to a survey and Id appreciate it if you could take a few moments to share your feedback on the service youve received from me. 
 
Kind regards 
 
Leigh Genery (Mr) 

 

Unquote 

 

 

[howmuch!]

Looking at the problem from a different direction, the experience of people who have been in the unfortunate position of being debarked from a cruise, and how they went on financially, would be extremely useful. There have been many passengers in that position who sailed with Marella in the past couple of months, but hardly anyone is posting on that thread, and my attempts to find information via Face-ache has also yielded very little.

 

Has anyone else found anything in this respect.

[Megabear2]

25 minutes ago, zap99 said:

You may not be covered for anything whist awaiting diagnosis. Nowadays you could be on that waiting list for yonks. Be careful, very careful.

Trouble is if you ignore it and "forget" when the worst happens you have no cover because you didn't update them.  Staysure used to send six monthly reminders for health updates, do they still do this after the pandemic?

 

Most failed insurance claims are for failure to declare something.  Honestly not worth risking it.  People often declare because they think the premium will sky rocket, quite often it doesn't but if you miss something and then need to make a serious claim you will normally live to regret it.  My towbar on your car analogy once more, don't declare it, write your car off for something unrelated but your not insured because it's a modification.

[Megabear2]

11 minutes ago, howmuch! said:

Looking at the problem from a different direction, the experience of people who have been in the unfortunate position of being debarked from a cruise, and how they went on financially, would be extremely useful. There have been many passengers in that position who sailed with Marella in the past couple of months, but hardly anyone is posting on that thread, and my attempts to find information via Face-ache has also yielded very little.

 

Has anyone else found anything in this respect.

My TA had one of the first offloaded by Fred as a client. The person had to sign some sort of agreement (I think a non disclosure one) to get help. I doubt we will find anything as a result.

[Bazrat]

33 minutes ago, Megabear2 said:

My TA had one of the first offloaded by Fred as a client. The person had to sign some sort of agreement (I think a non disclosure one) to get help. I doubt we will find anything as a result.

If it was a non disclosure agreement all parties involved would have to agree to it including the TA.

[Stu UK]

Another useful EU document on cruises below. 
 

https://www.healthygateways.eu/Novel-coronavirus

[Teddy123]

2 hours ago, Edith1950 said:

Thank you Megabear2 for highlighting this problem and all the work you have done. On Monday I emailed my Travel Insurance Company Barclays Travel Pack. I quoted P&Os updated T&Cs of 12 January 2022 and asked the 3 questions you advised with a Yes or No answer. The reply I received today didn't reply in the way I had asked. What I found interesting was that if one or both of us had tested positive for Covid in the past 12 months we wouldn't be covered and would need to speak to the Risk Assessment Team to be assessed if we could be covered. Thinking on this is probably the same as normal when you have a change in your health you have to inform them. Luckily we haven't had Covid but I'm not sure if we had and recovered in say a week or two would I have thought it necessary to inform them as it is not a permanent condition. In the email a Travel Pack policy booklet was sent but it's the same as I have December 2020 and obviously doesn't take into account of where we are now. The email received is as follows:

Thank you for your recent contact request form.

 

 I can confirm if an insured person tests positive for Covid-19 on a trip, the policy provides medical cover to £10,000,000 per person. This is providing there has not been a positive test result within the last 12 months which we have excluded from cover. If somebody has tested positive, please call our medical risk assessment team on 0800 158 2688 who will assess if we are able to cover Covid-19.  

 

 

 

The insurance will also provide cover for additional travel/accommodation expenses until you can get home if you are in self-isolation. If the whole family need to self-isolate due to being a close contact, we will provide cover for each insured person. If the whole family is not required to self-isolate, we will cover an adult to stay with a child. 

 

 

 

To request a confirmation of cover document should the cruise company ask for it please follow the link below. You will be asked to create a password before submission at the bottom of the form, please take a note of this.

 

 

 

https://www.aviva.co.uk/barclaystravelproof

 

 

 

Yours Sincerely,

I read this as saying if somebody is quarantined because they are positive, their family members are covered too if they are in close contact.  This is good, but my understanding is that people are being quarantined because they are a close contact of somebody not in the family.  If one is quarantined because one sat next to a stranger who turns out to be positive, I'm not sure this provides any cover  (perhaps it does, perhaps it doesn't).

[Megabear2]

49 minutes ago, Bazrat said:

If it was a non disclosure agreement all parties involved would have to agree to it including the TA.

My T/A is a personal friend. She told me she had no information from her clients when I asked after their well being, just that it was resolved.

[bee-ess]

1 hour ago, Megabear2 said:

FCA have called. No need to do individual complaints. I need everyone's insurance replies forwarding under a reference he gave me.  I have forwarded 20 so far.  Don't worry if they're duplicate companies, Leigh wants them all! When forwarding refer to PAC (that's me!).

 

His email address:

 

Consumer.queries@fca.org.uk 

Our reference: 208031712

Attention Mr Leigh Genery

 

QUOTE

 

Dear xxxxxxxx

Thank you for your recent webform to our unfair contracts team that's been passed to me as best placed to respond to you and thank you for your time in our earlier telephone conversation this afternoon. 

I understand you're raising concerns that insurance firms are not clearly stating whether their travel insurance policy either includes or excludes the following: 'cover costs of quarantine including but not limited to accommodation, food and sustenance, sundries such as internet and telephone access, transportation to and from the quarantine premises, covid testing while in quarantine, nursing/doctors' costs for administering and documenting these required tests and repatriation to the United Kingdom.'

I can appreciate the concerns this has caused you and thank you for bringing this matter to our attention.
 
Our remit
 
We're responsible for authorising firms offering financial services and products to consumers in the UK. For example, a firm dealing in insurance would have to comply with our rules and we do expect firms to pay due regard to the information needs of its clients, and communicate information to them in a way which is clear, fair and not misleading.

What I have done with your information 
 
As I mentioned I have shared the information you provided with my colleagues in our General Insurance policy team for their intelligence and I'd welcome you coming back to me with any firm response you may receive for our additional intelligence.

Thank you once again for taking the time to bring this matter to our attention. If you need to speak to us further on this matter, have any other questions for the FCA, or have more information to share with us then please dont hesitate to contact us again and please quote the following number, to ensure we can link all your correspondence to the correct reference number. Your reference number is [208031712].
 
I trust this information is helpful and wish you the best going forward.
 
To help us improve our service, Im interested in finding out about your experience with the Supervision Hub today. Ill send you a link to a survey and Id appreciate it if you could take a few moments to share your feedback on the service youve received from me. 
 
Kind regards 
 
Leigh Genery (Mr) 

 

Unquote 

 

 

 

I have forwarded my 2 emails I sent and 2 replies I got from Staysure.

[Bin man]

High Megabear is that email address correct can't seem to send for some reason .It might be me just been thick ?

[Megabear2]

consumer.queries@fca.org.uk

 

 

[Cristaltips]

Thank you Megabear2 for all you are doing. I’ve sent my response on too

[zap99]

38 minutes ago, Megabear2 said:

My T/A is a personal friend. She told me she had no information from her clients when I asked after their well being, just that it was resolved.

Not P&O, but when I signed a non-disclosure agreement, one clause said I couldn't acknowledge that I signed one...............whoops🙊

[Bin man]

Thankyou it had a capital C when I had copied it across from original email now sent ,many thanks once again 

[Megabear2]

3 minutes ago, Bin man said:

Thankyou it had a capital C when I had copied it across from original email now sent ,many thanks once again 

Sorry for the typo, getting tired and it's been a busy day.  

[Bin man]

Guess if I was better on the Internet would have guessed it would be a small c 

[terrierjohn]

18 hours ago, Megabear2 said:

Too honest for her own good.  She's hoping things are better by December for her much wanted Arcadia Northern lights cruise.  Tried to ask P&O if they'd allow the money to switch as it was a genuine reason but they wouldn't have it I'm afraid.

 

I have FCA news which I will post shortly just awaiting an email from them.

Was this for a Southampton cruise? We managed to get our TA to transfer our Iona Feb cruise money to the same cruise next year, which we already had booked, this was only about 3 weeks ago.

[Megabear2]

2 hours ago, terrierjohn said:

Was this for a Southampton cruise? We managed to get our TA to transfer our Iona Feb cruise money to the same cruise next year, which we already had booked, this was only about 3 weeks ago.

Yes it is the Aurora 1 April Canaries cruise.  They had booked direct.  My sister moved her money to the Northern Lights Arcadia cruise in December that the rest are booked on.  She had used an agent based in Scotland, I'm not sure who, but I think it may have been before P&O final payment date.

[david63]

I have had a clear response from LV (it was forwarded to their underwriters)

 

The questions I asked were:

"In the event that one member of a travelling couple tests positive for Covid during a cruise and because of the local requirements of a particular country that passenger has to be disembarked and put into quarantine in that country will all relevant costs be covered? Furthermore where that country also requires  that a "close contact" of the positive passenger also has to be disembarked and placed in isolation separately from the positive passenger will their overseas costs and repatriation be covered?"

 

And the reply:

"If the insured person tests positive for Covid OR is identified as a close contact and is told to isolate on board the ship or on land, there is cover under Section N Part 4 (when cruise cover is included. We will pay under Cabin Confinement for onshore isolation).

 

 

If you have an Essential policy We’ll pay you £100 for each 24 hour period, up to a maximum £1,000 in total, that you have to stay in your cabin on the orders of the medical officer of the cruise vessel.

If you have a Premier policy We’ll pay you £150 for each 24 hour period, up to a maximum £1,500 in total, that you have to stay in your cabin on the orders of the medical officer of the cruise vessel.

If the travelling companion (also insured with LV) of a Covid Positive Traveller who has been instructed to leave the ship to isolate on shore chooses to disembark with them, there is cover under Section C for Curtailment. They can claim for unused holiday costs under Section C, but not additional hotel and accommodation costs."

Edited January 27, 2022 by david63

[Megabear2]

11 minutes ago, david63 said:

I have had a clear response from LV (it was forwarded to their underwriters)

 

The questions I asked were:

"In the event that one member of a travelling couple tests positive for Covid during a cruise and because of the local requirements of a particular country that passenger has to be disembarked and put into quarantine in that country will all relevant costs be covered? Furthermore where that country also requires  that a "close contact" of the positive passenger also has to be disembarked and placed in isolation separately from the positive passenger will their overseas costs and repatriation be covered?"

 

And the reply:

"If the insured person tests positive for Covid OR is identified as a close contact and is told to isolate on board the ship or on land, there is cover under Section N Part 4 (when cruise cover is included. We will pay under Cabin Confinement for onshore isolation).

 

 

If you have an Essential policy We’ll pay you £100 for each 24 hour period, up to a maximum £1,000 in total, that you have to stay in your cabin on the orders of the medical officer of the cruise vessel.

If you have a Premier policy We’ll pay you £150 for each 24 hour period, up to a maximum £1,500 in total, that you have to stay in your cabin on the orders of the medical officer of the cruise vessel.

If the travelling companion (also insured with LV) of a Covid Positive Traveller who has been instructed to leave the ship to isolate on shore chooses to disembark with them, there is cover under Section C for Curtailment. They can claim for unused holiday costs under Section C, but not additional hotel and accommodation costs."

Okay so basically no cover for negative test apart from curtailment.  I assume the sum insured for this will be the basic maximum £5,000 or £10,000.  As curtailment costs are paid on return to UK with supporting documents the passenger will  need to pay their costs upfront.

 

In light of two different LV replies I will copy both replies to send to FCA as an example of how the insurers don't even understand their own terms.  If you object please let me know in the next hour.

 

I'm working on the cruise lines at present.