Spa-disaster on Reflection ..Buyer Beware!

[Z3RACERGIRL]

We just sailed 12/10-12/17. Lovely ship, and overall nice cruise, but my experience in the spa was quite the opposite. A little background..this was my 38th cruise and I've frequented the spa on nearly all of them. Never had a single bad experience with facials, massages, etc. I am familiar with the Steiner group that run the spas for other cruise lines as well as Canyon Ranch which Celebrity now uses. I am recovering from a serious surgery, and heat therapy has been instrumental during the healing process. I fell in love with the heated tile loungers on the Silhouette last year. As soon as I stepped aboard the Reflection, I went to the spa and immediately bought the unlimited weekly pass for Persian Gardens for 88.00 - it was the one thing I had anticipated most about the entire cruise. Ironically, during the spa open house tour, all the beds were full, but I didn't think much about it. I asked how soon I could use the pass, and the gal said not until later during dinner hours. That was fine. Came back that night and beds were full. No big deal. Returned at lunch the following two days. Beds were full again. Came back late afternoon and overheard another lady at the desk complaining about the same issue, and just left. I am not a complainer by nature, and I was also mindful that I was in the waiting area where people who were spending money to relax could overhear me and didn't want to create a negative vibe. After two port days, I went up and asked to speak to the manager (Vivian) after making sure no one was around. I explained what had happened. I politely asked her for a credit on my account. She told me the pass was non-refundable. I told her I hadn't even been able to use the pass a single time all week, she suggests I go use it right then- I was already dressed up for dinner at this hour, and couldn't. She just shrugs and says try tomorrow. I was shocked at her lack of professionalism, I've never seen this aboard a ship...ever. I went to guest services ( a first for me, as well). They contacted the spa on my behalf, and told me the spa would be calling my cabin later in the evening. No call, no voicemail. The last sea day, I return to the spa and spoke to Vivian who again refused the credit and told me to go use the beds right then, that she would personally make sure they were being rotated. I literally couldn't believe my ears. I reminded her that this wasn't like a pool lounger, that I had paid for something that they just were not providing, and that wasn't acceptable. It's not good business to oversell a service. The cruise was almost over. She became very argumentative and STILL insisted there was time to use the beds as long as I was onboard one last day. I truly left feeling insulted. I never did get to use the pass a single time. This alone could have ruined my cruise, because I was dreaming about those loungers for months, and was very disappointed. I won't return to another Canyon Ranch Spa, ever, this could have been handled so much better. FYI- It wasn't even about the credit, I actually disembarked yesterday with 78$ worth of OBC that wasn't ever spent. As a business owner, I just cannot imagine treating a client like this, and wanted others to know. Purchase the passes with caution, and low expectations.

[TeaBag]

So sorry about your bad experience. So, using the beds on the last day would constitute use for 7 days paid?? You're right, an insult. I have found CR staff quite snooty on several cruises, so I never go near them. I really liked Steiner and wish Celebrity had not discontinued their services. BTW, the beds are free for AQ class, if you should ever book it.

[jelayne]

I can understand your frustration. I personally have no great interest in the Persian Garden, having said that I agree that you paid for something you weren't able to use.

 

Since AQ passengers have the Persian Garden included and Elite & above passengers have 1 free pass on a port day I have always thought that the odds of finding a open lounger should I want one was slim to none.

 

Thanks for sharing your experience.

[easyboy]

Must have been really frustrating that the manager failed to get your point till you got off the ship, I admire the calmness you have shown under that situation that I may have been unable to do. Thank you for the feedback for our future guidance.

 

 

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[Sandtrap328]

I was on the same cruise as the OP. I am Elite+ and get a free Persian Spa day as part of my perks. I used it during the afternoon of the St. Maarten day since it was rainy and I had been to the beach in the sunny morning.

 

No problem getting access with my Elite+ keycard. I was shown right into the rooms with the heated loungers - about half were not being used - and had a very nice, relaxing time catching up on a Tom Clancy book on my Nook and taking a well deserved snooze.

 

When I was ready to leave, there were still a few loungers being unused. Those heated loungers really are relaxing.

 

I believe Canyon Ranch is separate from Celebrity so getting money back would be up to Canyon Ranch HQ.

[Iamthesea]

Anytime we have ever gone to the Persian Gardens, the loungers have been full. We just stand and wait for availability, or go into the steam or sauna rooms and keep checking until one or two were available.

 

Eventually, you would have been able to use a lounger. You just have to take turns. ;) Speaking of which, I do wish that the spa management would put a time limit on the loungers, though. Some passengers read on them, while others fall asleep. :rolleyes: This is not being very nice to the fellow passenger. We've even seen heated lounge "hoggers!" One man left his things on a lounger to go to the sauna and then to take a shower.

[NLH Arizona]

I would write a letter to Canyon Ranch At Sea and voice your displeasure. Here is the address and phone numbers:

 

Canyon Ranch At Sea

8600 E. Rockcliff Road, Tucson, AZ 85750

Ph. 520-749-9000

Fax 520-235-8535

 

Possibly they will be more understanding and refund your money.

[riclop]

That is why you stay away from ship spas.

[4cats4me]

We just sailed 12/10-12/17. Lovely ship, and overall nice cruise, but my experience in the spa was quite the opposite. A little background..this was my 38th cruise and I've frequented the spa on nearly all of them. Never had a single bad experience with facials, massages, etc. I am familiar with the Steiner group that run the spas for other cruise lines as well as Canyon Ranch which Celebrity now uses. I am recovering from a serious surgery, and heat therapy has been instrumental during the healing process. I fell in love with the heated tile loungers on the Silhouette last year. As soon as I stepped aboard the Reflection, I went to the spa and immediately bought the unlimited weekly pass for Persian Gardens for 88.00 - it was the one thing I had anticipated most about the entire cruise. Ironically, during the spa open house tour, all the beds were full, but I didn't think much about it. I asked how soon I could use the pass, and the gal said not until later during dinner hours. That was fine. Came back that night and beds were full. No big deal. Returned at lunch the following two days. Beds were full again. Came back late afternoon and overheard another lady at the desk complaining about the same issue, and just left. I am not a complainer by nature, and I was also mindful that I was in the waiting area where people who were spending money to relax could overhear me and didn't want to create a negative vibe. After two port days, I went up and asked to speak to the manager (Vivian) after making sure no one was around. I explained what had happened. I politely asked her for a credit on my account. She told me the pass was non-refundable. I told her I hadn't even been able to use the pass a single time all week, she suggests I go use it right then- I was already dressed up for dinner at this hour, and couldn't. She just shrugs and says try tomorrow. I was shocked at her lack of professionalism, I've never seen this aboard a ship...ever. I went to guest services ( a first for me, as well). They contacted the spa on my behalf, and told me the spa would be calling my cabin later in the evening. No call, no voicemail. The last sea day, I return to the spa and spoke to Vivian who again refused the credit and told me to go use the beds right then, that she would personally make sure they were being rotated. I literally couldn't believe my ears. I reminded her that this wasn't like a pool lounger, that I had paid for something that they just were not providing, and that wasn't acceptable. It's not good business to oversell a service. The cruise was almost over. She became very argumentative and STILL insisted there was time to use the beds as long as I was onboard one last day. I truly left feeling insulted. I never did get to use the pass a single time. This alone could have ruined my cruise, because I was dreaming about those loungers for months, and was very disappointed. I won't return to another Canyon Ranch Spa, ever, this could have been handled so much better. FYI- It wasn't even about the credit, I actually disembarked yesterday with 78$ worth of OBC that wasn't ever spent. As a business owner, I just cannot imagine treating a client like this, and wanted others to know. Purchase the passes with caution, and low expectations.

 

 

 

That is awful that you didn't get what you paid for. I know exactly what you mean about those beds. We had it for free while in Aqua

But many times weren't able to enjoy them. At least we could get a lounger, but the ridiculous part was those who fell asleep and snored loudly or the married couples who would get into loud arguments, with no consideration for the rest of us who were trying to relax.

In Princess cruise lines they do limit the number of Persian spa-type passes. I guess there are so many more people on board the reflection with AQ that it impacts the spa severely, but the attitude of the spa woman was reprehensible

 

 

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[awhcruiser]

http://boards.cruisecritic.com/showthread.php?t=2432256&page=6

 

See post #105

[Cruise Junky]

http://boards.cruisecritic.com/showthread.php?t=2432256&page=6

 

See post #105

 

So what? It's illegal now to post in more than one place?

[Cruise Raider]

So sorry to hear this ... it must have been very disappointing. As others have insinuated, they may have been oversold seeing that all elite and above get one free port day and all aqua class passengers have unlimited access.

It sounds like the post that provided the contact info for the spa services will be your best bet in at least getting your payment back for something you weren't able to use.

Thanks for you post ... it was very informative.

[caribill]

 

I believe Canyon Ranch is separate from Celebrity so getting money back would be up to Canyon Ranch HQ.

 

I would first contact Celebrity HQ to get a refund. You paid your $$ to Celebrity.

 

If you had a Celebrity shore excursion problem, you would contact Celebrity for any partial or total refund, not the excursion company that Celebrity contracted to supply the excursion.

[Miaminice]

I am sorry you feel the way you feel. Maybe the spa manager could have told you different, I grant you that - however, basically I think she was correct.

 

The facilities of Persian Garden are not limited to the loungers (even if they are the only thing you were interested in). Thus the charge is not just for the loungers but also for steam room, aroma therapy room, relaxation lounge etc. They were all available to you. Just because you are only interested in using the loungers, you can not expect a lounger to be vacant or held vacant whenever you choose to use one. You just have to wait or go at times were you can be sure you do not have to wait.

 

All our Celebrity cruises were and are in AQ. Just mentioning S-class (because of the nicer Persian Garden) we cruised on Reflection, Silhouette, Eclipse... also to colder destinations like Iceland were the loungers were in high demand. Yes, we got there sometimes and all the loungers were already taken - just as others mentioned, we went to the steam room and waited. Never did we have to leave without being able to use them - after a bit of patience. At many other times the place was completely empty.

 

If I had to decide I would not grant a refund. Because of a simple point - by purchasing the pass you do not purchase the right to use a lounger only and no assigned times of use are part of the purchase. So the sellers part of the contract was fulfilled.

Edited December 19, 2016 by Miaminice

[hcat]

..Sounds like they may have oversold the passes. Even with more heated loungers than other S class ships, Ref is an overcrowded ship at several venues.

 

Also sounds like many were using it for longer time periods. They should limit lounger use to 1/2 hr....like the gym equip at busy times.

 

We sail in AQ all the time, and although PG is bigger on Ref, we disliked it....esp since spa is one level up from the Solarium and seemed to have more loud talkers...

 

Sorry OP could not get much use of it..

[chrisaus]

That's a disaster?

 

 

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[Living4acruise2day]

That's a disaster?

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Forums

 

My sentiments exactly. I was expecting when I logged on, reading about a pax getting hurt or the ship being damaged.

Edited December 19, 2016 by Living4acruise2day
edit......

[BRIFRO]

We just sailed 12/10-12/17. Lovely ship, and overall nice cruise, but my experience in the spa was quite the opposite. A little background..this was my 38th cruise and I've frequented the spa on nearly all of them. Never had a single bad experience with facials, massages, etc. I am familiar with the Steiner group that run the spas for other cruise lines as well as Canyon Ranch which Celebrity now uses. I am recovering from a serious surgery, and heat therapy has been instrumental during the healing process. I fell in love with the heated tile loungers on the Silhouette last year. As soon as I stepped aboard the Reflection, I went to the spa and immediately bought the unlimited weekly pass for Persian Gardens for 88.00 - it was the one thing I had anticipated most about the entire cruise. Ironically, during the spa open house tour, all the beds were full, but I didn't think much about it. I asked how soon I could use the pass, and the gal said not until later during dinner hours. That was fine. Came back that night and beds were full. No big deal. Returned at lunch the following two days. Beds were full again. Came back late afternoon and overheard another lady at the desk complaining about the same issue, and just left. I am not a complainer by nature, and I was also mindful that I was in the waiting area where people who were spending money to relax could overhear me and didn't want to create a negative vibe. After two port days, I went up and asked to speak to the manager (Vivian) after making sure no one was around. I explained what had happened. I politely asked her for a credit on my account. She told me the pass was non-refundable. I told her I hadn't even been able to use the pass a single time all week, she suggests I go use it right then- I was already dressed up for dinner at this hour, and couldn't. She just shrugs and says try tomorrow. I was shocked at her lack of professionalism, I've never seen this aboard a ship...ever. I went to guest services ( a first for me, as well). They contacted the spa on my behalf, and told me the spa would be calling my cabin later in the evening. No call, no voicemail. The last sea day, I return to the spa and spoke to Vivian who again refused the credit and told me to go use the beds right then, that she would personally make sure they were being rotated. I literally couldn't believe my ears. I reminded her that this wasn't like a pool lounger, that I had paid for something that they just were not providing, and that wasn't acceptable. It's not good business to oversell a service. The cruise was almost over. She became very argumentative and STILL insisted there was time to use the beds as long as I was onboard one last day. I truly left feeling insulted. I never did get to use the pass a single time. This alone could have ruined my cruise, because I was dreaming about those loungers for months, and was very disappointed. I won't return to another Canyon Ranch Spa, ever, this could have been handled so much better. FYI- It wasn't even about the credit, I actually disembarked yesterday with 78$ worth of OBC that wasn't ever spent. As a business owner, I just cannot imagine treating a client like this, and wanted others to know. Purchase the passes with caution, and low expectations.

It's not the money it is the calculated planning that makes this a angry moment.

The inclusion of the hot beds is simply the sizzle and there is no way that the numbers sold ever will equal the numbers available. This is an employee spiff that never works for the customer. Shame on Celebrity for making a money revenue center out of the heated lounges. The Cruise Critic rumblings foretell their anxious sales pressure we all experienced in the Spa Area. We are going to see"Vivian" on the 24th and ask her about the "Heated Lounge Hogs" after we board Saturday. always best regards, brifro

Edited December 19, 2016 by BRIFRO

[Fish Lover]

..

Also sounds like many were using it for longer time periods. They should limit lounger use to 1/2 hr....like the gym equip at busy times.

.

 

If they did this, I for one, would be furious. This is exactly like the pool lounges. If you are lying in it, it is in use. This is a perk given to Aqua guests and it should not be limited in use. What they shouldn't do is sell day passes unless there is ample space available for additional use. Limiting use so that they can sell more is tantamount to double dipping.

[Miaminice]

If they did this, I for one, would be furious. This is exactly like the pool lounges. If you are lying in it, it is in use. This is a perk given to Aqua guests and it should not be limited in use. What they shouldn't do is sell day passes unless there is ample space available for additional use. Limiting use so that they can sell more is tantamount to double dipping.

 

Well, then you have to be furious - they do limit the time!

There is a sign on the wall asking you to limit your time to X minutes - just as there are signs in the gym asking you to only use the equipment for a certain time. ;)

 

I just looked at photos I took in Persian Garden. I will have to look if I have them on a hard disk with a higher resolution so I can zoom in on the sign to show you.

[jayoldschool]

I believe there actually is a sign asking users to limit their time so others can experience the loungers. I've never had to wait more than a few minutes for one to turn over. Full? Enjoy one of the steam rooms until a lounger opens.

 

Staying on a heated lounger for an extended period is poor form.

[GaryR6273]

The Persian Gardens on the Solstice Class Ships are a poor excuse for a spa area IMHO.

 

We had the same experience on Silhouette with the loungers and honestly, they were cold in comparison to heated loungers when you got to use them. We felt the room was cold as well. After two days, we decided it was not worth the walk up one level and didn't visit the Persian Garden again.

 

We had not paid for the access, since it came with being in AQ, and felt that the lack of a thelassotherapy pool on the Solstice Class ships do not warrant the need to charge for 2 saunas and 8 to 10 beds. It's a rip off compared to other spa areas on other ships (Princess, Holland). You also had to be let in to the area as they did not issue key cards, so for trips to the restroom, you had to wait for staff at the front desk to get you back into the room.

 

We had other issues with the spa staff as well. The manager was most receptive to our issues and handled the situations wonderfully. He was one of the most friendly and attentive staff on the entire ship.

 

Sorry you had a negative experience. I understand how upset you are as I feel that the spa is a major part of my cruise experience.

[rootswings]

I was on the same sailing as OP. I, too, found the spa environment and use of the Persian Garden to be not as relaxing as I expected. Based on my experience, I would attribute the shortcomings to staff and, to a lesser degree, the facilities. As a point of comparison, I have also visited the spa and Persian Garden on Celebrity's Eclipse.

 

When I entered the spa, at the reception desk there were two employees. One was on the phone, the other left the area as I approached the desk. I waited while employee finished her phone call, which seemed to be a personal call. I told her that I wished to purchase a day pass and confirmed the price. She said fine, asked for my sea pass, and handed me a different card to use while in the spa. She did not indicate the purpose or use of the spa card.

 

She then walked me to the changing area. I expected that at some point, I would be provided with a robe, footwear, access to a locker, and perhaps a tour of the facilities. Instead, she unlocked a locker, told me to remember the locker number and to change, so that she could re-lock the locker. I found this odd, and wondered if she was going to stay there and watch me change. I then inquired about a robe. She left and returned with a robe - sure, that's all that I had asked for, but then had to ask if they were going to provide footwear as is typical. She sighed, seemed annoyed, and went off to get the footwear.

 

I had to go find her again when I needed to get something from the locker. At this point, I imagine that she was annoyed, as I was, but I had no option, since she was the only person who could unlock the locker.

 

She walked me to the Persian Garden, no tour or discussion of the facilities that were available. In the Persian Garden, the trash and towel bins were overflowing. Of course, it is a high use area, but during the several hours that I was in PG, observed that there were no employees maintaining the area.

 

Regarding the heated loungers, I noticed that they were not as warm as I expected, and at least two seemed to not be heated at all.

 

Later, when I asked why she needed to lock and unlock the lockers, since there were combination locks on the locker, she replied that the combination locks didn't work.

 

When I received my final bill, I noted that the actual cost of the day pass was about $5 more than the amount I confirmed (29.50 instead of 25.00); I assume the difference was a required gratuity, or tax, but think it would've been better for her to advise me of the price difference.

 

I suppose these inconveniences may seem trivial, but the combination of things made the experience less than stellar. Given the cost, brand, and past experiences, I was expecting an experience closer to stellar. I was disappointed and regretted that I had recommended the Persian Garden to others on the ship.

[excitedofharpenden]

If they did this, I for one, would be furious. This is exactly like the pool lounges. If you are lying in it, it is in use. This is a perk given to Aqua guests and it should not be limited in use. What they shouldn't do is sell day passes unless there is ample space available for additional use. Limiting use so that they can sell more is tantamount to double dipping.

 

It makes perfect sense to me to limit the time. Guests pay for using the area so why should someone hog the space?

 

I spent a few hours in Persian Gardens on Constellation as part of the Captain's Club perk. It was poorly run, the place was a mess with various things not working and I was totally underwhelmed.

[donaldsc]

I realize that we are not supposed to criticize spelling and English. However breaking your post up into several paragraphs would have made it a lot easier to read.

 

DON