Yikes! Over age 70 passengers need doctor’s note (Merged threads)

[tiggy85]

39 minutes ago, mafig said:

 

So they'll be just asking people?  

That seems strange, doesn't it?

I guess they think people 69 and under are honest, but once you turn 70 you're not to be trusted to tell the truth and need a doctor's note.

 

 

The rep told me they would be asking people via a questionnaire at the port day of embarkation. He wouldn’t give it to me in advance so I don’t know what exactly is in it. I suppose someone could lie but then I assume if something bad happens and they find out the person lied they are probably going to stick that person with any expenses surrounding their treatment/evacuation. Just my guess...
 

I also asked if there was a list of examples of diseases and he rattled this off: chronic heart, lung, liver, or kidney disease, diabetes, HIV/AIDS, or cancer. Then he said to look at what CDC says are chronic medical conditions. 
 

after the phone call I checked the website and saw he was reading directly from it. Today when I looked the language has changed to this:

 

 

• Boarding will be denied to any person with a severe, chronic medical condition, including those specified by the CDC. Guests of all ages will be screened prior to boarding, regarding underlying health issues that may prevent them from sailing.

[Fouremco]

3 hours ago, Mr&MrsBee said:

Both of us have type 2 diabetes for years and are under control.  Have had many cruises since 2008 with no complications,  Does this mean we can never cruise again?  Or is this a temporary rule?  Needs clarification?  Very poorly written response.

 

 

2 hours ago, drakes2 said:

I agree very poorly written but I think this will be permanent. What I'm wondering if you book a cruise very far in advance when do you have the letter signed before or after booking when you are cleared to sail? Refundable vs non refundable? 

 

2 hours ago, Mr&MrsBee said:

Possible situation:  Dr does not sign off. Cruise is paid.  X  denies boarding.  Since you not approved to sail again, what good is a FCC ?  X has your $ but you cannot sail.

Again, one of those things that Celebrity hasn't given much thought to, or at least hasn't addressed on the website or the email we received overnight.

 

DW and I cancelled this week and have a few thousand dollars in FCC. But as we both have underlying medical issues, no doctor would sign off on any future cruise. So if Celebrity plans to keep this in place beyond the current pandemic, we too will be in the Catch-22 position of having FCC but not being able to use it.

[Fouremco]

6 minutes ago, WonderMan3 said:

 This not fit to cruise thing is only temporary while corona is active. The FCCs are good until the end of 2021 are they not?

Has Celebrity stated that? I must have missed it. That certainly would make me happier with the FCC issued this week. Of course, that's assuming that the coronavirus is no longer active prior to the end of 2021.

[mafig]

So we are in agreement, at least for this thread, that if a person is under 70 (won't have a doctor's note), has diabetes, even if controlled, even if well-controlled, they will be denied boarding.

 

 

[miXterOB]

I've had Type 1 diabetes 64 years

I've used an insulin pump for over 20 years and been using a CGM for the last 5 years. You really can't hide them.

 

My A1c is consistently right under 7 which is precisely where my PCP wants it.

My new pump/cgm combo adjusts my insulin rates automatically except for dosing for carb input when I enter carb amounts.

It's been nearly 25 years since diabetes has caused a need for an ER visit.

That I use insulin is NOT indicative of poorly controlled diabetes...so please adjust your thinking folks.

 

CDC is right and the cruise lines have to be prudent.

I hate that we can't cruise right now but I want to stay safe and healthy

BTW...I'm 67

Edited March 13, 2020 by miXterOB

[mafig]

20 minutes ago, tiggy85 said:

 

 

after the phone call I checked the website and saw he was reading directly from it. Today when I looked the language has changed to this:

 

 

• Boarding will be denied to any person with a severe, chronic medical condition, including those specified by the CDC. 

 

I guess I'm hung up on the "severe, chronic".

I know Fouremco interprets that as severe or chronic and he may be right.  But I also read it as severe AND chronic.

[tiggy85]

2 minutes ago, mafig said:

 

I guess I'm hung up on the "severe, chronic".

I know Fouremco interprets that as severe or chronic and he may be right.  But I also read it as severe AND chronic.

I got the distinct impression from the rep that if asked at the port if you have any of the x,y,z conditions they would deny boarding. I don’t think they want to deal with all the medications and complications that could arise if something were to go wrong. 
 

I’m guessing it was either close up shop for a few months like some other lines or continue sailing with passengers who pose the least amount of risk to their operations. Just my thoughts on it

[tiggy85]

14 minutes ago, mafig said:

So we are in agreement, at least for this thread, that if a person is under 70 (won't have a doctor's note), has diabetes, even if controlled, even if well-controlled, they will be denied boarding.

 

 

Yes - I’m basing it off my chat last night with the rep. If I fell into that category I would not even bother going to the port.

 

Im supposed to be on a free Heroes cruise on 3/27 out of LA. If it doesn’t get cancelled I will post on here what they ask and how the process goes now that they have implemented all these additional screening procedures. 

[mafig]

3 minutes ago, tiggy85 said:

 

 

Im supposed to be on a free Heroes cruise on 3/27 out of LA. If it doesn’t get cancelled I will post on here what they ask and how the process goes

Please do.❤️

[Pickels]

1 hour ago, mafig said:

 

So they'll be just asking people?  

That seems strange, doesn't it?

I guess they think people 69 and under are honest, but once you turn 70 you're not to be trusted to tell the truth and need a doctor's note.

 

 

How about that yo-yo who got on a JetBlue plane after he got a positive medical result.  They should take him behind the barn and shoot him!!

[lovecruzin]

19 minutes ago, mafig said:

 

I guess I'm hung up on the "severe, chronic".

I know Fouremco interprets that as severe or chronic and he may be right.  But I also read it as severe AND chronic.

 

I also read it is “and”

According to the CDC....

Chronic diseases are defined broadly as conditions that last 1 year or more and require ongoing medical attention or limit activities of daily living or both. 

 

I cant find a list of Severe, Chronic.

But based on the CDC definition, it sounds like anyone with say, High cholesterol, high blood pressure, arthritis, depression...etc...even managed by medication would be denied boarding.

 

[Mr&MrsBee]

Again another thoughtless decision and comment by the LLP crew without clarification.  If you cannot Cruise  how can one use FCC.  $ should be refunded.  No doctor would sign the form as written.

[Barcelona17]

I am very surprised people are not a little more outraged by this than it appears on this board. And I don't think we need the input of an attorney to realize this discrimination is wrong. First, there has been no national emergency declared by the president (maybe he should but he hasn't). Secondly, there is no proof that those over 70 are at risk of infecting others more than anyone else. In fact it appears it is younger people who seem to carry the virus secretly with no symptoms thus endangering others much more than the elderly who may appear to show symptoms to a greater degree. The elderly may be at more risk but it should be their decision to make. Thirdly, I don't understand why the 70+ individuals must bring a note when those with underlying health issues don't. I guess it is because the cruise line knows our age. Well lets just have everyone bring a note saying they are healthy. Fourthly, and this is very scary, it is a scientific fact that certain races are prone to certain diseases more than others. I don't even want to give examples because we should limit such discussions to purely medical practices and research. How we treat and deal with people should not be based on their proclivity for a particular disease. We need to deal with this crises in a honest and sincere manner letting science dictate our actions. This is one of those actions that looks good on paper but hides the real underlying problems. If you didn't think so before this action by Celebrity should drive it home to you. In this current environment...cruising is simply not safe. Seniors can get it and get sick, sick people can get it and get sicker, young people can get it and infect other people back home, and yes younger people can get it and get sick. 

 

dcl

[mafig]

While they're at it, why not restrict smokers from cruising also?  

 

I would think as a group they are certainly less healthy than, say someone with a chronic condition that takes good care of themselves.

[tiggy85]

7 minutes ago, Mr&MrsBee said:

Again another thoughtless decision and comment by the LLP crew without clarification.  If you cannot Cruise  how can one use FCC.  $ should be refunded.  No doctor would sign the form as written.

I don’t think it’s thoughtless...

 

Its just for the next 30 days which we all know could change depending on how much footing this virus gets here in the US. 
 

Those who have a compromised system are at a disadvantage right now but those of us who aren’t still have the ability to proceed with life while taking extra precautions. 
 

What I think is thoughtless is that airlines are not screening passengers (JetBlue) https://www.google.com/amp/s/people.com/health/passenger-who-boarded-flight-after-testing-positive-for-coronavirus-gets-lifetime-ban-from-jetblue/amp/

[lovecruzin]

19 minutes ago, Mr&MrsBee said:

Again another thoughtless decision and comment by the LLP crew without clarification.  If you cannot Cruise  how can one use FCC.  $ should be refunded.  No doctor would sign the form as written.

 

This is one thing I don't think can be blamed on LLP. It is all of the RCCL brands that are affected.

[Happy Cruiser 6143]

4 hours ago, Argo. said:

We are on Silhouette as the first of three in a row.  Because the second cruise leaves on the 15th, no note is required.  The third cruise departs on the 27th.  How do I get a note from our family doctor who retired a year and a half ago.  The MD would have to know your medical history.  Making an appointment for getting a doctors note for a frivolous activity such as cruising when there are patients requiring serious help would be laughed off.

how old can this note be? I certainly would not make final payment before getting a note... so much for making a last minute booking.

oh.. we cancelled the next two cruises and are hightailing it to the border before it’s closed .

 

Probably a good decision.  Safe home.  The folks from Ontario who rent the unit over mine during season left early for the same reason.  I won't be making final payment on the Iceland/Greenland cruise next month.  Celebrity will already have far too much of my money tied up in dubious FCCs.  Looks as if my B2B2B in April & May is DOA since my traveling friend has diabetes.  And, of course, we are both over 70, so now being heavily discriminated against by Celebrity.

[davekathy]

1 hour ago, Barcelona17 said:

I am very surprised people are not a little more outraged by this than it appears on this board. And I don't think we need the input of an attorney to realize this discrimination is wrong. First, there has been no national emergency declared by the president (maybe he should but he hasn't). Secondly, there is no proof that those over 70 are at risk of infecting others more than anyone else. In fact it appears it is younger people who seem to carry the virus secretly with no symptoms thus endangering others much more than the elderly who may appear to show symptoms to a greater degree. The elderly may be at more risk but it should be their decision to make. Thirdly, I don't understand why the 70+ individuals must bring a note when those with underlying health issues don't. I guess it is because the cruise line knows our age. Well lets just have everyone bring a note saying they are healthy. Fourthly, and this is very scary, it is a scientific fact that certain races are prone to certain diseases more than others. I don't even want to give examples because we should limit such discussions to purely medical practices and research. How we treat and deal with people should not be based on their proclivity for a particular disease. We need to deal with this crises in a honest and sincere manner letting science dictate our actions. This is one of those actions that looks good on paper but hides the real underlying problems. If you didn't think so before this action by Celebrity should drive it home to you. In this current environment...cruising is simply not safe. Seniors can get it and get sick, sick people can get it and get sicker, young people can get it and infect other people back home, and yes younger people can get it and get sick. 

 

dcl

We think it's a pile of crap, but just going to roll with the flow. Oh well, got the forms signed today. Looking forward to our B2B cruise on the Summit, 28 March and 4 April. 😎

Edited March 13, 2020 by davekathy

[Fouremco]

 

1 hour ago, tiggy85 said:

after the phone call I checked the website and saw he was reading directly from it. Today when I looked the language has changed to this:

 

 

• Boarding will be denied to any person with a severe, chronic medical condition, including those specified by the CDC. Guests of all ages will be screened prior to boarding, regarding underlying health issues that may prevent them from sailing.

 

1 hour ago, mafig said:

 

I guess I'm hung up on the "severe, chronic".

I know Fouremco interprets that as severe or chronic and he may be right.  But I also read it as severe AND chronic.

Just to clarify, we both interpret the wording found on the website as severe AND chronic. I'm not sure why you thought otherwise. 

[B113]

Celebrity needs to refund the cruise fare and not future credit. No one knows how long this will last. 

 

Daryl

[tiggy85]

13 minutes ago, B113 said:

Celebrity needs to refund the cruise fare and not future credit. No one knows how long this will last. 

 

Daryl

Per Celebrity contract they don’t have to:

 

“d) Carrier shall have the right to comply with any orders, recommendations, or directions whatsoever given by any governmental entity or by persons purporting to act with such authority and such compliance shall not be deemed a breach of this Agreement entitling the Passenger to assert any claim for liability, compensation or refund.“

 

 

in addition...

 

”e. Carrier may also change accommodations, alter or cancel any activities of, deny service of alcohol to, confine to a stateroom or quarantine, search the stateroom, property or baggage of any Passenger, change a Passenger’s Land Tour, disembark or refuse to embark the Passenger and/or any Passenger responsible for any minor Passenger, or restrain any Passenger at any time, without liability, at the risk and expense of the Passenger, when in the sole opinion of Carrier or Captain the Passenger’s conduct or presence, or that of any minor for whom the Passenger is responsible, is believed to present a possible danger, security risk or be detrimental to himself or the health, welfare, comfort or enjoyment of others, or is in violation of any provision of this Agreement.”

Edited March 13, 2020 by tiggy85

[B113]

7 minutes ago, tiggy85 said:

Per Celebrity contract they don’t have to:

 

“d) Carrier shall have the right to comply with any orders, recommendations, or directions whatsoever given by any governmental entity or by persons purporting to act with such authority and such compliance shall not be deemed a breach of this Agreement entitling the Passenger to assert any claim for liability, compensation or refund.“

 

 

in addition...

 

”e. Carrier may also change accommodations, alter or cancel any activities of, deny service of alcohol to, confine to a stateroom or quarantine, search the stateroom, property or baggage of any Passenger, change a Passenger’s Land Tour, disembark or refuse to embark the Passenger and/or any Passenger responsible for any minor Passenger, or restrain any Passenger at any time, without liability, at the risk and expense of the Passenger, when in the sole opinion of Carrier or Captain the Passenger’s conduct or presence, or that of any minor for whom the Passenger is responsible, is believed to present a possible danger, security risk or be detrimental to himself or the health, welfare, comfort or enjoyment of others, or is in violation of any provision of this Agreement.”

Celebrity needs to refund the cruise fare and not future credit. No one knows how long this will last. 

 

Daryl

[B113]

Just now, B113 said:

Celebrity needs to refund the cruise fare and not future credit. No one knows how long this will last. 

 

Daryl

It doesn't matter about the legal jumbo. They just need to do the right thing.

[tiggy85]

1 minute ago, B113 said:

Celebrity needs to refund the cruise fare and not future credit. No one knows how long this will last. 

 

Daryl

I think it would be very nice of them if they did that for people caught up in this mess BUT my point is they don’t have to. We as customers entered into an agreement with Celebrity were all of this is clearly spelled out. Offering a FCC is  an act of goodwill on their behalf whether we think it’s good enough or not. 

[tiggy85]

3 minutes ago, B113 said:

It doesn't matter about the legal jumbo. They just need to do the right thing.

“Legal jumbo” does matter when you are the one entering into the agreement 🙂