Zaandam and Rotterdam Situation (merged topics starting March 22, 2020)

[3rdGenCunarder]

2 minutes ago, DFD1 said:

Things have been moving very fast as result of this virus outbreak. Governments all over the country are racing to deal many situations. Broward County is just one of them.

 

Let's give them some time. I expect they, together with HAL and the Federal Government, will come to a reasonable and relatively safe solution to the Zaandam and Rotterdam issues.

 

In the meantime, that TODAY SHOW story was a good example of why the media is held in such low esteem. They obviously made every effort to make the situation look as bad as they possibly could....even hopeless.  In my opinion, they did their viewers a disservice.....but this is not the first nor the last time this will happen. Too bad.

 

I didn't see the show, but the description in the earlier post and your comment reminds me of the old newspaper saying "if it bleeds, it leads." My take is that the couple who didn't get moved had an axe to grind. They or someone they know contacted news stations or news stations found them from posts online somewhere and boom! we have a news story. 

 

Such a contrast to the happy ending story for Kindergirl's parents. 

[cat shepard]

6 hours ago, SedNabokos said:

 

And Zaandam descending the first two locks at Agua Clara:

 

https://imgur.com/9N4OnTR

Thank you for these. I was in bed when the magic happened. You all made it come alive. And these videos & the screen shots really helped! Stay well everyone!

[AmBear]

3 minutes ago, LMaxwell said:

The right thing must involve an actionable plan for this humanitarian mission.  There is due to be a Broward County commission meeting regarding plans tomorrow evening. There seems to be some finger pointing locally over which entity has responsibility at this point in time. 

Thanks to all showing the maps, pics of this ongoing crisis!

Agreed to the Humanitarian view, and something must be done, but there is no way this is going to be an easy solution, and we could see the ship stuck outside the port until safety procedures are finalized!

This area of Florida is really in crisis right now with the virus, and where will this support, nurses, drs., facilities, equipment come from?

This Port can't just unload a ship of possibly infected passengers into a community that's already under stress from the virus!

Whats troubling is there's so little info in the Press or coming from the local government about what they will do! 

Agree with Lmax here there will be a lot of finger pointing locally cause it seems no one wants to say or do anything, cause the politics in this area 'is not' agreeable with this ship porting there.

And the County does own the Port, and has final say!

The 15 min. test many here have mentioned is reported only 60% accurate as reported late last week by national news, so while that might help in some cases, with a ship porting in the middle of a hot virus zone, doubtful its the answer here.

 

[sansterre]

7 hours ago, Copper10-8 said:

 

I told Maria, who's cutting zzzz's already, that when we wake up around 0700-0730, we could see Zaandam going through Gatun Locks. Boy, was I wrong...........

I expected to see that this morning too!

Instead they are already in the Caribbean Sea!

Thanks to all for the blow-by-blow account through the night.

And many thanks to Panama and Panama Canal Authority for such a fast and smooth transit.

Question:  Do we know why the passengers on both HAL ships had to keep the windows closed and lights out?  If it had been my first time through the canal, I would have wanted to watch everything - day or night, sick or not.

Edited March 30, 2020 by sansterre

[Tampa Girl]

22 minutes ago, LMaxwell said:

Exactly; there has to be some sort of plan going forward. Another poster made a point in their reply that we don't know what HAL is doing; but that goes to your point...we don't know what HAL is doing.  If they are making accommodations (charter busses from terminal straight to charter flights at FLL), they should be communicating that to people onboard and publicly to show that leadership is making plans and mitigating risks. I did see the update posted yesterday but hopefully they are back today or tomorrow with more details.  HAL needs to be working with Fort Lauderdale, Broward County, Port Everglades, and State of Florida on a plan. 

 

 

I agree, but what makes anyone think that HAL is not doing everything in its power to work with any entity or person that can help?  HAL managed to get the PCA to relent.  And until something concrete is in place, I think HAL is wise not to pass along hopeful info that is subsequently quashed.  I think that we are doing too much Monday-morning quarterbacking, as well as unnecessary speculation since we have no facts.  

[DFD1]

HAL is not going to give you a minute-by-minute report on its efforts to deal with this situation...whether you want it or not.

 

They would be irresponsible to constantly feed the public information which is not finalized and could change half a dozen time before it is finalized.

 

Be reasonable. This thing will be worked out the best HAL, Broward County and the Federal Government can do, but it will take some time.

[Tampa Girl]

10 minutes ago, AmBear said:

 

And the County does own the Port, and has final say!

 

 

 

I wonder about that contention.  The County might own the port, but I suspect that it receives federal funds and the management is certainly subject to some extent by federal law.  The President has declared a state of emergency, which give his enormous powers over private entities.  We will see if those powers intervene.

Edited March 30, 2020 by Tampa Girl
typo.

[DFD1]

There are several authorities working in and around the port, including Homeland Security, Customs and Immigration, county and state law enforcement and others.

 

The County is the owner of the port, but it shares management responsibilities with many vested interests.

[Max2003]

4 minutes ago, Tampa Girl said:

 

 

I agree, but what makes anyone think that HAL is not doing everything in its power to work with any entity or person that can help?  HAL managed to get the PCA to relent.  And until something concrete is in place, I think HAL is wise not to pass along hopeful info that is subsequently quashed.  I think that we are doing too much Monday-morning quarterbacking, as well as unnecessary speculation since we have no facts.  

 

Absolutely spot on!!!   I wouldn't give the media anything to ruminate on until I knew it was a done deal.   

 

This will turn out well!!   Or as well as it can under the circumstances.

[3rdGenCunarder]

9 minutes ago, Tampa Girl said:

 

 

I agree, but what makes anyone think that HAL is not doing everything in its power to work with any entity or person that can help?  HAL managed to get the PCA to relent.  And until something concrete is in place, I think HAL is wise not to pass along hopeful info that is subsequently quashed.  I think that we are doing too much Monday-morning quarterbacking, as well as unnecessary speculation since we have no facts.  

 

Yes to everything you said!

 

HAL has to be feeling burned after all the "yes you can dock--no wait! GO AWAY" they've been dealing with at so many ports over the past month. Just because there's been no announcement it doesn't mean they're ignoring the situation.

 

[capriccio]

9 minutes ago, LMaxwell said:

Exactly; there has to be some sort of plan going forward. Another poster made a point in their reply that we don't know what HAL is doing; but that goes to your point...we don't know what HAL is doing.  If they are making accommodations (charter busses from terminal straight to charter flights at FLL), they should be communicating that to people onboard and publicly to show that leadership is making plans and mitigating risks. I did see the update posted yesterday but hopefully they are back today or tomorrow with more details.  HAL needs to be working with Fort Lauderdale, Broward County, Port Everglades, and State of Florida on a plan. 

 

According to Port Everglades (https://www.sun-sentinel.com/coronavirus/fl-ne-sick-ship-approval-fort-lauderdale-20200329-pymhibz6bvduxbwfgk2mil23ku-story.html#rt=chartbeat-flt), the plan must include, at a minimum I presume, the following information for the passengers (1243 of which 305 are Americans) and crew:

 

• Documentation of all illnesses (virus, flu, etc.) for all passengers and crew
• HAL provides PPE to all responders
• All those disembarking will have temperatures taken
• HAL provides ambulance transportation for ill passengers and crew
• At least 24 hours in advance HAL must provide the disembarkation security plan

That just gets them off the ship.  Then the real coordination begins.  Where will ill passengers be taken?  Where will quarantining take place?  For those requiring self quarantine, how will transportation (especially given that most of the passengers and crew are foreigners) be coordinated?  While it is being coordinated, where will those people be housed?

 

Like LMaxwell I can only hope (and presume) that round the clock meetings are being held to determine the safest and most efficacious way to rescue the passengers and crew of the Zaandam with minimal potential impact on the health of Fort Lauderdale residents (or any other port should the destination change).  It is a monumental challenge but I have faith that it can be done.

 

 

[DaveRRT]

They will go to a cargo area or a naval base Im sure not the regular port.  All will be tested a few times and they  will be quarantined after leaving the ship. crew that are not sick will remain on ship

Edited March 30, 2020 by DaveRRT

[conwakr]

The world is very different today than it was even 3 weeks ago. And how this is handled could be very different.  We just don't know and can't even speculate. Ships are dropping off crew here and there in Florida since the announcement that some lines are waiting an additional 30 days before restarting operations and they are getting to airports and flying to their hometowns and countries. People are coming and going in and out of Florida every day.  I think we'll just have to wait and see what the final chapter of this story holds. I do agree and my gut says it won't be an entirely "local" decision. 

[capriccio]

 

Just after making my post above, I received this notification.  Governor DeSantis on Fox News says no.

 

“We cannot afford to have people who are not even Floridians dumped into South Florida using up those valuable resources," he said, adding he is in touch with the White House over the fate of these ships. “We view this as a big, big problem and we don’t want to see people dumped in southern Florida right now.”

[1ANGELCAT]

3 minutes ago, capriccio said:

 

Just after making my post above, I received this notification.  Governor DeSantis on Fox News says no.

 

“We cannot afford to have people who are not even Floridians dumped into South Florida using up those valuable resources," he said, adding he is in touch with the White House over the fate of these ships. “We view this as a big, big problem and we don’t want to see people dumped in southern Florida right now.”

How does he know NONE of them are Floridians ? 
 

[capriccio]

1 minute ago, 1ANGELCAT said:

How does he know NONE of them are Floridians ? 
 

 

Some of the 305 Americans onboard are definitely Floridians because they have been contributing to the Sun-Sentinel articles.

[Hlitner]

This is not just about HAL.  It took more than HAL to get the PCA to grant them priority status.  We are talking about a major effort from our State Department and possibly some quiet diplomacy from the White House.  The situation with Port Everglades truly sucks!  South Florida is the main beneficiary of the cruise lines influence on the local economy.  To be blunt, South Florida owes the cruise lines a lot of support.  While we can understand Broward County insisting on a plan that protects folks, they also should be thinking how to help HAL not throw up roadblocks.

 

But there is a big problem with these HAL passengers since a large majority are from outside the USA.  We assume the bulk of the passengers are from various South/Central American countries others from Europe.  With flights at a minimum this is going to take some major planning on getting those folks home.

 

Hank

[Tampa Girl]

1 minute ago, Hlitner said:

This is not just about HAL.  It took more than HAL to get the PCA to grant them priority status.  We are talking about a major effort from our State Department and possibly some quiet diplomacy from the White House.  The situation with Port Everglades truly sucks!  South Florida is the main beneficiary of the cruise lines influence on the local economy.  To be blunt, South Florida owes the cruise lines a lot of support.  While we can understand Broward County insisting on a plan that protects folks, they also should be thinking how to help HAL not throw up roadblocks.

 

But there is a big problem with these HAL passengers since a large majority are from outside the USA.  We assume the bulk of the passengers are from various South/Central American countries others from Europe.  With flights at a minimum this is going to take some major planning on getting those folks home.

 

Hank

 

I completely agree, particularly with your first paragraph.  Should the ship be allowed to enter the port, there surely are ways to protect the Florida residents of further contamination.  How many military bases do we have in Florida?

[phil09]

10 minutes ago, capriccio said:

 

 

“We cannot afford to have people who are not even Floridians dumped into South Florida using up those valuable resources," he said, adding he is in touch with the White House over the fate of these ships. “We view this as a big, big problem and we don’t want to see people dumped in southern Florida right now.”

 

Looking at the Governor's quote posted above (thanks capriccio) - he seemed to emphasize "south" Florida.  There are other Florida ports.  I can't see any way there will not be a solution for a Florida port.  One way or the other.

[Tampa Girl]

13 minutes ago, capriccio said:

 

Just after making my post above, I received this notification.  Governor DeSantis on Fox News says no.

 

“We cannot afford to have people who are not even Floridians dumped into South Florida using up those valuable resources," he said, adding he is in touch with the White House over the fate of these ships. “We view this as a big, big problem and we don’t want to see people dumped in southern Florida right now.”

 

Talk about grandstanding!

[DFD1]

1 minute ago, phil09 said:

 

Looking at the Governor's quote posted above (thanks capriccio) - he seemed to emphasize "south" Florida.  There are other Florida ports.  I can't see any way there will not be a solution for a Florida port.  One way or the other.

There will be.

Phones are ringing off the hook right now in an effort to find a solution to this situation....and one will be found....not just in the next five minutes.

[Barney10]

Watching with interest as there are 247 Canadians onboard one or the other ships.

[DFD1]

1 minute ago, Barney10 said:

Watching with interest as there are 247 Canadians onboard one or the other ships.

No other group of foreign nationals is held in higher esteem in this country than Canadians. Hang in there...they will not be neglected.

[AdoraBelle]

I know everyone is looking at the big picture right now, but has anyone heard from the passengers on Zandaam lately? Do they post here? How are conditions aboard? Do they have enough food meds etc? 

[Max2003]

On the west side of Cuba, in about 40 hours they will still have options. If things don't work out, I would look seriously at Galveston (already familiar with cruise ship ops).  Not far from Lackland (used before) and Fort Hood.  

Edited March 30, 2020 by Max2003