Volunteer Passengers?

[nocl]

1 minute ago, TeeRick said:

nocl- I would need to look at the trial designs and see what they are using for placebo formulations.  In some cases definitely saline but possibly some others not.  The mRNA vaccines delivered in lipids might use lipids+ saline as placebo, or the protein subunit vaccines might use adjuvant-only formulations.  I really have not specifically looked across the lead candidates.  

the ones I have read say Saline.

[TeeRick]

1 minute ago, nocl said:

the ones I have read say Saline.

Ok you are way ahead of me on your current information of this.  Thanks!

[nocl]

4 minutes ago, TeeRick said:

Ok you are way ahead of me on your current information of this.  Thanks!

the problem is that they have to use something that is guaranteed to be inert. Anything they use to generate a reaction could skew the data.

[sanger727]

yes, he told me that they are using saline. I'm just telling you what they told him. That the study is scheduled for 2 years and they do not intend "break the blind" when the vaccine is initially released. However, he if/when he is able  to get the vaccine he will be free to leave the trial and get it if he likes. He is 90% sure he has received the placebo so I'm sure that is what he will do. 

[C-Dragons]

12 hours ago, Bo1953 said:

Then that leaves greater capacity for those of us who are not in the 70%.... which also means that any one in the 70% will have a time frame to reduce and get out of that particular 'high risk' category... if that is a condition for sailing.

 

I will miss quite a few of those who are in the 70%, yet will sail on and send postcards and photos of the trip...   😎

 

bon voyage

 We'll be on board with you!
Think of all those chairs available at the Martini Bar. 😎

[C-Dragons]

46 minutes ago, TeeRick said:

I think a bunch of us CC regulars could volunteer or even pitch in for an Iconic Suite once cruising resumes and have a great celebration.  So far me, Bo and ipee.  That is a great start!

You can count me in too. 🥂

[Oceangoer2]

18 hours ago, sanger727 said:

my dad is in one of the vaccine trials and they told him that they wouldn’t be telling them if they were in the control group or vaccine group, but that anyone was free to leave the trial at any point. So basically they will have everyone withdrawing from the trial to take a vaccine when it’s available. Doesn’t seem like a good way to test longer term results, side effects, and effectiveness.

After the vaccine is available, I'd think they wouldn't allow those in the control group who actually rec'd the vaccine to be inoculated again?  So at that point wouldn't they have to tell who rec'd and who had the placebo?

[sanger727]

21 minutes ago, Oceangoer2 said:

After the vaccine is available, I'd think they wouldn't allow those in the control group who actually rec'd the vaccine to be inoculated again?  So at that point wouldn't they have to tell who rec'd and who had the placebo?

 

 I'm just reporting what he was told. They aren't planning on breaking the blind that quickly to get longer term results. They won't tell you whether you had the vaccine or placebo, which means that when the vaccine becomes available you could potential get double vaccinated. Perhaps when everyone starts leaving the study they will reconsider this. Just know that as of right now he plans to leave the study when the vaccine becomes available because he believes he got the placebo. 

[Pinboy]

1 hour ago, TeeRick said:

I think a bunch of us CC regulars could volunteer or even pitch in for an Iconic Suite once cruising resumes and have a great celebration.  So far me, Bo and ipee.  That is a great start!

I like the " once cruising resumes " ----

What ARE the qualifications to join this " Elite " group ??

LOL--- I think I spoiled my chances at the " starting gate " way back when . 

Since joining CC there are so many contributors I would like to meet on a future cruise --but, not in a pool with " you know who "--- just in case he , oops, forget it.  

 

 

 

[TeeRick]

5 minutes ago, Pinboy said:

I like the " once cruising resumes " ----

What ARE the qualifications to join this " Elite " group ??

LOL--- I think I spoiled my chances at the " starting gate " way back when . 

Since joining CC there are so many contributors I would like to meet on a future cruise --but, not in a pool with " you know who "--- just in case he , oops, forget it.  

 

 

 

Its OK.  By our ground rules we have to let in at least one Canadian.  But you will have to pay for your part of the suite in $USD.

[nocl]

10 hours ago, sanger727 said:

yes, he told me that they are using saline. I'm just telling you what they told him. That the study is scheduled for 2 years and they do not intend "break the blind" when the vaccine is initially released. However, he if/when he is able  to get the vaccine he will be free to leave the trial and get it if he likes. He is 90% sure he has received the placebo so I'm sure that is what he will do. 

they will not break it during an interim read which they will use to file an EUA.

They should break the blind when they reach final case numbers which should not take long. For example pfizers interim was at 96 out of their final number of 162. so they will hit the max in about 2 months.

 

For ethical reasons if a drug is efficacious then those that received placebo should get study drug once  the patient numbers are reached. especially for infectious disease.

 

the 2 years is a max period if the numbers are not reached. it is also the amount of time for tracking safety. which does not require the blind nor for the placebo arm to remain untreated.

 

Might they be confused between an eua release from an interim read and the max patient count.

[luv2cruise391]

On 10/30/2020 at 2:48 PM, nocl said:

No it also includes volunteer passengers.  It is described on page 24 in the simulated voyage section.

 

The volunteer passengers cannot have any pre-existing conditions that will make them high risk for COVID.

 

[luv2cruise391]

A different subject I know, but related?

 

When cruising DOES begin, are passengers that have pre=existing conditions NOT going to be allowed to sail? Will they re

[luv2cruise391]

Will they require a doctor's "permission" slip? For instance, if obesity is considered a pre-existing, alot of folks (possibly including myself) will not be able to cruise.

Can they do that? I bet we will have to sign some kind of waiver to sail.And who decides exactly what pre-exisitng conditions are?

I am a senior and want to cruise again - have a January 2, 2021 cruise booked on Apex in a Sky suite for 50th wedding anniversary!

[mom says]

5 minutes ago, luv2cruise391 said:

I am a senior and want to cruise again - have a January 2, 2021 cruise booked on Apex in a Sky suite for 50th wedding anniversary

Um, you might want to start looking for a lift and shift. I think you've got about a .01% chance of that cruise sailing.

Edited November 14, 2020 by mom says

[Sailfish]

On 11/9/2020 at 9:34 AM, Oceangoer2 said:

After the vaccine is available, I'd think they wouldn't allow those in the control group who actually rec'd the vaccine to be inoculated again?  So at that point wouldn't they have to tell who rec'd and who had the placebo?

I am in the Merck  vaccine study. When a viable vaccine is approved, we were told that it will be revealed who got the plecibo and who got the real thing so we could get a covid shot. But our study is different from the others. The Merck vaccine doesn't need to be kept frozen. It's the existing measles vaccine with the covid spikes spliced onto it. There are two versions of the Merck shot, one and two vaccines. I am in the two shot group.  So the advantage to the Merck vaccine is that it's easy to transport as it doesn't require a low temp storage. It too is very close. I don't know about the others. At the facility where we go, all of the vaccine studies are being administered, not just Merck. It's a race.  

[Covepointcruiser]

I also thought that being overweight was also a significant risk for COVID.   Guess any extra weight hurts your major organs.   We need to know what is considered overweight and what is obese.   In the past I heard a BMI of 25-28 is considered overweight and 29 and over is considered obese but I have seen those numbers change from one site to another.   Guess it is time to start dieting but would like to know the target.

[NutsAboutGolf]

5 hours ago, luv2cruise391 said:

Will they require a doctor's "permission" slip? For instance, if obesity is considered a pre-existing, alot of folks (possibly including myself) will not be able to cruise.

Can they do that? I bet we will have to sign some kind of waiver to sail.And who decides exactly what pre-exisitng conditions are?

I am a senior and want to cruise again - have a January 2, 2021 cruise booked on Apex in a Sky suite for 50th wedding anniversary!

 

The cruise lines tried requiring a doctors note during start of the pandemic and had to reverse due to the lawsuit blitz.  I'm sure if they could find a way to get global litigation immunity they would love to require a doctors note.

 

5 hours ago, mom says said:

Um, you might want to start looking for a lift and shift. I think you've got about a .01% chance of that cruise sailing.

100% agree!  Not only that, but book a backup celebration plan.  Most hotels are offering free cancellations if before 24-48 hours.  Book the hotel now, cancel it if somewhat the cruise happens.

[nocl]

5 hours ago, luv2cruise391 said:

A different subject I know, but related?

 

When cruising DOES begin, are passengers that have pre=existing conditions NOT going to be allowed to sail? Will they re

no sign of that in the framework. 

[kathynorth]

7 hours ago, Sailfish said:

I am in the Merck  vaccine study. When a viable vaccine is approved, we were told that it will be revealed who got the plecibo and who got the real thing so we could get a covid shot. But our study is different from the others. The Merck vaccine doesn't need to be kept frozen. It's the existing measles vaccine with the covid spikes spliced onto it. There are two versions of the Merck shot, one and two vaccines. I am in the two shot group.  So the advantage to the Merck vaccine is that it's easy to transport as it doesn't require a low temp storage. It too is very close. I don't know about the others. At the facility where we go, all of the vaccine studies are being administered, not just Merck. It's a race.  

Thanks for this information! It’s great that you’ve stepped up to help in this awful situation.  I hope all goes well for you. 

[TeeRick]

17 hours ago, Sailfish said:

I am in the Merck  vaccine study. When a viable vaccine is approved, we were told that it will be revealed who got the plecibo and who got the real thing so we could get a covid shot. But our study is different from the others. The Merck vaccine doesn't need to be kept frozen. It's the existing measles vaccine with the covid spikes spliced onto it. There are two versions of the Merck shot, one and two vaccines. I am in the two shot group.  So the advantage to the Merck vaccine is that it's easy to transport as it doesn't require a low temp storage. It too is very close. I don't know about the others. At the facility where we go, all of the vaccine studies are being administered, not just Merck. It's a race.  

From your description you are getting the Merck Vaccine (called V591) developed by the company Themis (Austria) which they recently acquired.  It is listed as a Phase 1 trial currently.

[Sailfish]

4 hours ago, TeeRick said:

From your description you are getting the Merck Vaccine (called V591) developed by the company Themis (Austria) which they recently acquired.  It is listed as a Phase 1 trial currently.

I dont have that info, but its definitely a long study. We will get the second injection in December, detailed followup for a month, then periodic visits, several months apart. Our first shot was in Oct, the second 8 weeks apart. After the second shot, for two weeks, daily temp checks logged into a diary. Then for the rest of 2021, just periodic check ups. 

 

Our hope is to have received the real thing so as to get early immunity. But if a vaccine from another study becomes available, we would be informed of our immunity or lack thereof if we want to quit the study, which we can do anytime. 

 

 

[upwarduk]

On 11/8/2020 at 11:14 PM, Covepointcruiser said:

When you are considered high risk if you are overweight and 70% of the folks in the U.S. are overweight, they will have trouble finding non overweight passengers for a test cruise.   

Michael Bailey has just posted on Social media, saying they have 100,000 volunteers. Not sure if this is passengers and crew, or just passengers.

[sandancer]

1 hour ago, upwarduk said:

Michael Bailey has just posted on Social media, saying they have 100,000 volunteers. Not sure if this is passengers and crew, or just passengers.

Well we know it’s not me or thee as we are still under the “no cruising advisory”

[Tigrou]

1 hour ago, sandancer said:

Well we know it’s not me or thee as we are still under the “no cruising advisory”

 

It didn't stop people from the UK being on the recent SeaDream cruise.  All the government advice means is that we're unlikely to get travel insurance cover, it doesn't ban people from cruising. 

 

Personally I wouldn't travel without insurance but many people do, and I expect will continue to do so despite coronavirus.