New vaccine

[Josy1953]

Our surgery usually texts telling us the times of the vaccination sessions but this year they rang and asked when we wanted to go in because it was appointment only.

[majortom10]

4 hours ago, P&O SUE said:

Aah yes they are supposed to be but when I asked my GP’s receptionist they were still doing the ‘usual’ list first and wouldn’t get round to the under 65’s until at least Mid December 🙄

I  have had a phone call today from my GP practice about flu vaccination for me and my wife, we are both 61, and she booked us in for 12th December. I had already looked online at Boots website and could have booked in for tomorrow if I wanted at store in Stafford and my local chemist I phoned them this morning before phone call from GP and he said you can come this afternoon or if not convenient just phone up on the day convenient to and they will give me vaccine. 

[wowzz]

2 hours ago, Bazrat said:

Interesting thing is my wife would get the new vaccine but I would have to wait, considering it is made in Belgium and sent to us what do the Belgium’s think about that.

Irrelevant where it is made. The UK put in a pre-order, at a cost, and then confirmed the order. The Belgian government could have taken the same risk, but decided not to.

Not sure what your point is?

[Snow Hill]

2 hours ago, Bazrat said:

Interesting thing is my wife would get the new vaccine but I would have to wait, considering it is made in Belgium and sent to us what do the Belgium’s think about that.

The Pfizer European factory is in Belgium hence why its being made there for U.K. and EU countries. The Moderna vaccine in Europe is to be manufactured in Switzerland and put into vials in Spain. Two examples of EU countries working together to bring a vaccine to the market. Pfizer used to have a cold storage in U.K., but that was closed following UKs decision to leave the EU, so it will need to be transported from Belgium to U.K. at -70C hope we have enough low temperature freezers to store it. 

 

its probable that the AstraZeneca/Oxford vaccine will be manufactured in Italy and vialled up elsewhere in Europe. 

[tring]

1 hour ago, Bazrat said:

Really depends on size of surgery I asked the question why not just send them out letters the reply I got, most people read them but it requires an action on there part so some just forget, when you call them you can book them in, before I was volunteered to help they just ran a Saturday clinic, after my calls they ran clinics twice a day for 3 weeks plus a couple of Saturdays than I was thrown on the street, (actually returned to work).

I assume that is why we are asked to return a slip if we do not want the jab.  They may well contact people who do not respond in one way or another at a later date.  Our letters are not sent out locally, so obviously from a bulk mail company on contract.  When appointments are made by phone we can choose the date (2or 3 a week through September/October), but expected to take the next apt available rather than choose a time.  When we arrive at the surgery we are sent to the next availale member of staff, rather than follow ridgid appointments, so we have never had to wait - it is a pop in/out system.

 

Must say I think the system is helped by the fact we are in a very area were most people are fairly well off, so more are likely to use a computer and have a good standard of education, ability and motivation.  Must be a much bigger challenge in deprived or even mixed areas.

[wowzz]

1 hour ago, Snow Hill said:

Pfizer used to have a cold storage in U.K., but that was closed following UKs decision to leave the EU, so it will need to be transported from Belgium to U.K. at -70C hope we have enough low temperature freezers to store it. 

Brexit strikes again! 

Nissan will be next, and who can blame them.

 

 

 

 

[davecttr]

8 hours ago, tring said:

I assume that is why we are asked to return a slip if we do not want the jab.  They may well contact people who do not respond in one way or another at a later date.  Our letters are not sent out locally, so obviously from a bulk mail company on contract.  When appointments are made by phone we can choose the date (2or 3 a week through September/October), but expected to take the next apt available rather than choose a time.  When we arrive at the surgery we are sent to the next availale member of staff, rather than follow ridgid appointments, so we have never had to wait - it is a pop in/out system.

 

Must say I think the system is helped by the fact we are in a very area were most people are fairly well off, so more are likely to use a computer and have a good standard of education, ability and motivation.  Must be a much bigger challenge in deprived or even mixed areas.

I had an invitation letter for the flu jab but as usual had it at the local pharmacy. I did not return the slip ( I forgot)  but I understand that the pharmacy inform the doctors practice anyway.

[Dermotsgirl]

My husband and myself have heard nothing from our doctors surgery about flu jabs. 
 

So we have them done at Boots. My husband had his done on 24th September, and mine is booked for next Monday 

[terrierjohn]

10 hours ago, wowzz said:

Brexit strikes again! 

Nissan will be next, and who can blame them.

 

 

 

 

You're letting your political bias show again wowzz.😉

[daveoc]

There was a post in the papers saying that GP's have agreed a contract to provide the vaccine. The contract states that they must be available to give it from 8am to 8pm, seven days a week including Bank Holidays. They will be paid £25.16 for every 2 doses they give, so really per person as you need 2 doses.

There seems to be a reluctance from Government Ministers to go with a vaccination passport. Don't see why as I cannot see any overseas travel being allowed for some time without proof of a vaccination.

[wowzz]

26 minutes ago, terrierjohn said:

You're letting your political bias show again wowzz.😉

Well, it has been a while!

[wowzz]

24 minutes ago, daveoc said:

There seems to be a reluctance from Government Ministers to go with a vaccination passport. Don't see why as I cannot see any overseas travel being allowed for some time without proof of a vaccination.

I think the reluctance for any form of physical documentation is that it will be far too easy to forge. I would think it more likely that proof of vaccination will be held on some sort of central database, and a code will be issued on an individual basis, in the same way that you generate a code when you hire a car, which allows access to your driving convictions.

[tring]

52 minutes ago, daveoc said:

There was a post in the papers saying that GP's have agreed a contract to provide the vaccine. The contract states that they must be available to give it from 8am to 8pm, seven days a week including Bank Holidays. They will be paid £25.16 for every 2 doses they give, so really per person as you need 2 doses.

There seems to be a reluctance from Government Ministers to go with a vaccination passport. Don't see why as I cannot see any overseas travel being allowed for some time without proof of a vaccination.

 

Proof of vaccination is something that has never been supplied on the NHS, even if a vaccine itself is not chargeable.  It is often supplied on payment of a private fee though.  Given the fees that can be charged I am sure GP surgeries will be happy to arrange for that to be supplied to those who ask for it, but at a fee.  All vaccination administration is normally notified to GP's, so it will presumably be the same for this vaccine and will show on medical records.

 

They could easily pay for extra staff to provide certificates and may even be possible to have it done on a computer system by clerical staff, rather than a professional and subsequently signed off.  That is what happens with online prescription requests, if my understanding is correct.

 

I do not see holiday companies insisting on vaccination proof until everyone has been able to have a vaccine, so some time away yet.

 

Edited December 3, 2020 by tring

[tring]

31 minutes ago, wowzz said:

I think the reluctance for any form of physical documentation is that it will be far too easy to forge. I would think it more likely that proof of vaccination will be held on some sort of central database, and a code will be issued on an individual basis, in the same way that you generate a code when you hire a car, which allows access to your driving convictions.

The snag I could see there is the confidentiality of medical records, though may be possible for individuals to waive that confidentiality, like is often asked on job application forms, to enable access for a doctor doing a health screening for the prospective employer.  Would likely need some way to ensure restricted access.

[ace2542]

14 minutes ago, tring said:

 

Proof of vaccination is something that has never been supplied on the NHS, even if a vaccine itself is not chargeable.  It is often supplied on payment of a private fee though.  Given the fees that can be charged I am sure GP surgeries will be happy to arrange for that to be supplied to those who ask for it, but at a fee.  All vaccination administration is normally notified to GP's, so it will presumably be the same for this vaccine and will show on medical records.

 

They could easily pay for extra staff to provide certificates and may even be possible to have it done on a computer system by clerical staff, rather than a professional and subsequently signed off.  That is what happens with online prescription requests, if my understanding is correct.

 

I do not see holiday companies insisting on vaccination proof until everyone has been able to have a vaccine, so some time away yet.

 

Wouldn't European GDPR regulations be a big problem here?

[Esprit]

It will be argued that proof of vaccination is almost worthless as the vaccine doesn't give 100% protection against the virus. With 95% efficacy there is a 5% chance someone may still get the virus despite thinking they are protected. 

[zap99]

2 hours ago, tring said:

 

Proof of vaccination is something that has never been supplied on the NHS, even if a vaccine itself is not chargeable.  It is often supplied on payment of a private fee though.  Given the fees that can be charged I am sure GP surgeries will be happy to arrange for that to be supplied to those who ask for it, but at a fee.  All vaccination administration is normally notified to GP's, so it will presumably be the same for this vaccine and will show on medical records.

 

They could easily pay for extra staff to provide certificates and may even be possible to have it done on a computer system by clerical staff, rather than a professional and subsequently signed off.  That is what happens with online prescription requests, if my understanding is correct.

 

I do not see holiday companies insisting on vaccination proof until everyone has been able to have a vaccine, so some time away yet.

 

Sorry.

When we first had our free jabs for travel. The nurse at the GP surgery issued us with a card. The vaccine and date was written on it also the date a booster was required. Again when the booster, or a new vaccine was given ,that was added. We carry the cards with us whenever and wherever we travel. Nobody has ever asked for proof, but we have it.

 

[tring]

1 hour ago, yorkshirephil said:

Proof of most vaccination has always been free on the NHS, here is a snippet from my records which I can freely access, I also have a booklet with all this data signed by various doctors and nurses over the past 63 years. I am assuming you are referring to things like Yellow fever which has to be paid for? Whether my vaccination book would be acceptable as proof of vaccination is another story as most people with a computer and a bit of free software could easily make their own. As they could for Yellow fever if they were desperate enough.

 

It will be a bold move for any cruise line to insist on proof of vaccination, we have no real idea how long it will be before everyone that wants the vaccine gets it. We don't know how effective it will be, the figures touted by the drug companies are statistically best case. Even if a vaccine prooved to be 90% effective across all parties that still leaves 10% unprotected (you could argue some of the 10% would have natural immunity). This could be several hundred people on a large ship.  Personally I would prefer that proof of vaccination was required as that would make me feel safer, however I wouldn't be too pleased if I was younger and effectively banned from cruising for months to come. It will be interesting to see how it pans out over the coming months.

 

Yes, I was referring to a situation when a certificate is required as proof of vaccination for entry to a certain country or countries, like yellow fever.  It is a certificate that is required and is always signed by the person who administered the vaccine and not supplied as a copy.  I suppose it may well be possible for someone to forge such a document as happens with other documents, but it would be a forgery.  IMO it would be a bit stupid for someone to do so if leaving themselves open to infection with yellow fever in a distant country and also not being insured for those consequences.

 

When we had our first yellow fever vaccination in 2006 we seem to remember being told that the vaccination was free, but it was the certificate which we needed to pay for.  I think that has changed since then though, now that the NHS charge for certain jabs.

 

Certificates would be valid for the time which protection would cover you for, admittedly a length of time to be determined for COVID, so another problem.  I am also not convinced something like proof of vaccine would be needed for any travel, but possibly for certain places - only time would tell.

 

I do not believe the vaccination booklet was ever intended as proof of administration, but it did give the particular vaccine used and, I think the batch as well.  Useful for your own record though, which is what was explained to us. 

Edited December 3, 2020 by tring

[tring]

28 minutes ago, zap99 said:

Sorry.

When we first had our free jabs for travel. The nurse at the GP surgery issued us with a card. The vaccine and date was written on it also the date a booster was required. Again when the booster, or a new vaccine was given ,that was added. We carry the cards with us whenever and wherever we travel. Nobody has ever asked for proof, but we have it.

 

 

There are certain vaccines that are recommended for travel to certain countries by our health organisations, but they are not something that is essential for travel, though it is standard practice for insurance companies to make their administration a condition of the insurance and would not pay up if not administered.  I have no idea what would happen if an insurance company wanted to check that since the person had contracted the disease, but perhaps they would ask for permission to consult your GP as they do for medicals etc. which are needed for various policies. 

 

Yellow fever is the only vaccine I can think of that is essential for entry to certain countries, though there may be others.  A formal yellow fever certificate is necessary, though I am aware there are certain exceptions.  That is why it would perhaps seem unlikely that vaccination would become essential for COVID, but insurance companies may feel differently.  All speculation of course as no one knows what will happen at this stage.

 

We joined Minerva II in 2006 to cruise up the Amazon.  Someone who had a suite booked found when he went to check in that his yellow fever vaccine had expired (at that stage they expired after ten years), so the ship sailed with an empty suite and he would have been left with a very large bill to not go on holiday - Swan cruises were not cheap!

Edited December 3, 2020 by tring

[terrierjohn]

3 hours ago, tring said:

 

Proof of vaccination is something that has never been supplied on the NHS, even if a vaccine itself is not chargeable.  It is often supplied on payment of a private fee though.  Given the fees that can be charged I am sure GP surgeries will be happy to arrange for that to be supplied to those who ask for it, but at a fee.  All vaccination administration is normally notified to GP's, so it will presumably be the same for this vaccine and will show on medical records.

 

They could easily pay for extra staff to provide certificates and may even be possible to have it done on a computer system by clerical staff, rather than a professional and subsequently signed off.  That is what happens with online prescription requests, if my understanding is correct.

 

I do not see holiday companies insisting on vaccination proof until everyone has been able to have a vaccine, so some time away yet.

 

I thought that your medical records were now freely available if you request them, if so surely these would show your covid vaccination?

[Adawn47]

41 minutes ago, zap99 said:

Sorry.

When we first had our free jabs for travel. The nurse at the GP surgery issued us with a card. The vaccine and date was written on it also the date a booster was required. Again when the booster, or a new vaccine was given ,that was added. We carry the cards with us whenever and wherever we travel. Nobody has ever asked for proof, but we have it.

 

Same here zap. I'm trying to remember which card it was , but we had to show it with our passport on entry in one country. Ooh these old brain cells do frustrate me at times.

Avril

[zap99]

16 minutes ago, Adawn47 said:

Same here zap. I'm trying to remember which card it was , but we had to show it with our passport on entry in one country. Ooh these old brain cells do frustrate me at times.

Avril

Ours is a small booklet called an international travel vaccination record. Things like polio, Hep A, typhoid etc.

[Dinglebert]

57 minutes ago, terrierjohn said:

I thought that your medical records were now freely available if you request them, if so surely these would show your covid vaccination?

Perfectly correct.  Just do a Subject Access Request and you will get the information.  That is the reason why there will be a solution to the proof issue.  GP surgeries could not cope with thousands of SAR applications.  They stuggle as it is with the current workload to turn them around.

[tring]

1 hour ago, terrierjohn said:

I thought that your medical records were now freely available if you request them, if so surely these would show your covid vaccination?

 

We can get those details from our online access, though that is not equivalent to proof.  As said by others it would probably be quite difficult to accertain it was a true copy as could easily be fiddled.  Who knows what will be asked for (or not) in the future, perhaps something like that could be asked for, or possibly just asking someone to sign to say they have been vaccinated, a wrong statement presumably then being illegal.  I do not see GP's providing any sort of certification without getting paid for it though.  Boris seems to shy away from any suggestion of proof of vaccine and once the pandemic is potentially sorted by a vaccine which stops a serious illness it is no longer a problem to other countries.

 

As they do not yet know if the vaccine stops transmission, it is also pretty worthless at present to prove you have been vaccinated as you could still pass it on.  The reason that certain countries ask for a yellow fever certificate, (which has to be dated a certain time before entry), is to ensure the disease is not brought into their country.

[Bazrat]

19 hours ago, wowzz said:

Irrelevant where it is made. The UK put in a pre-order, at a cost, and then confirmed the order. The Belgian government could have taken the same risk, but decided not to.

Not sure what your point is?

The point I was making was the Belgian government had the opportunity to pre order but obviously didn’t, so those living there must be wandering why not them, obviously my post caused you some consternation my apologies for that.