What are peoples thoughts on Always INcluded?

[LGW59]

6 minutes ago, Bo1953 said:

In my case, I only need to know what the bottom line is for sailing under the given circumstances... and answer the question "do I think this is a fair price or not?" when calculating that answer, then I decide if I will purchase or not.

 

There are other lines which have AI currently and I had long ago determined that they were not for us, not because of the AI as opposed to policies and standards and passengers that I prefer X for. The bottom line pricing was within 5% of X at that, so not a deal breaker.

 

Does this mean that you will not consider lines with AI currently in place?

 

As for knowing what the 'true costs' are, one (with a calculator) can get close if using the most recent info for the costs of beverage packages, gratuities and WiFi...

 

X, like other businesses which have similar pricing schemes, just are doing away with a la carte, which is fine. For those of us who either purchase or are gifted Perks, we can go back to determine where we may have spent those savings i.e. specialty dining, specialty cocktails, excursions, etc. then figure out our true cost of sailing.

 

Only us as individuals as passengers can decide if the price of sailing X with AI is of value or not, currently, regardless of their reasons to introduce it. Apparently some of us will find enough value to book.

 

bon voyage

this may help:

[Bo1953]

Just now, LGW59 said:

this may help:

LOL, not sure it has enough keys and most certainly no tape to review...

 

bon voyage

[Spif Barwunkel]

I’m liking this thread. Occasionally it gets a little feisty, blood starts to simmer, dentures start to rattle and sides are drawn. Not unlike most CC threads, actually.

 

Consider this post a recommence of my previous #250. This continuation fits quite well here considering some of the posts between then and now. As we are all aware, consumption of goods and services is not just a matter of what’s in our wallets but also what’s in our hearts and minds apposite to that consumption. Hence, one size does not fit all, for various reasons. That’s as it should be.

 

I do find it interesting that some fellow posters have implied that a Shakespeare quote from Hamlet, although paraphrased, is pertinent here. “Neither a burrower nor a lemming be.”  It is quite clever the way they subliminally inserted that into the conversation. Whereas I can appreciate their characterization and intent toward others – from a learned perspective, I’m sure - I must disagree on my behalf. My head is not in the sand nor do I subscribe to the “blindly following” myth. Naivety defines a person who navigates life with eyes wide shut, and refuses to see things in plain view. I think most of us see things for what they are and act accordingly. If I will pay X $10,000 for a seven night cruise, inside cabin and no perks, indulge me that desire and disagree with me. I guarantee you, my eyes are wide open. Of course, that won’t happen because I’ll be paying more money for a veranda cabin somewhere between decks 7 and 10.

 

Now, as to the earth being flat……

      

[highway180]

2 hours ago, Bo1953 said:

In my case, I only need to know what the bottom line is for sailing under the given circumstances... and answer the question "do I think this is a fair price or not?" when calculating that answer, then I decide if I will purchase or not.

 

There are other lines which have AI currently and I had long ago determined that they were not for us, not because of the AI as opposed to policies and standards and passengers that I prefer X for. The bottom line pricing was within 5% of X at that, so not a deal breaker.

 

Does this mean that you will not consider lines with AI currently in place?

 

As for knowing what the 'true costs' are, one (with a calculator) can get close if using the most recent info for the costs of beverage packages, gratuities and WiFi...

 

X, like other businesses which have similar pricing schemes, just are doing away with a la carte, which is fine. For those of us who either purchase or are gifted Perks, we can go back to determine where we may have spent those savings i.e. specialty dining, specialty cocktails, excursions, etc. then figure out our true cost of sailing.

 

Only us as individuals as passengers can decide if the price of sailing X with AI is of value or not, currently, regardless of their reasons to introduce it. Apparently some of us will find enough value to book.

 

I get it as to how we, at times, get entrenched and fixated on why our 'line of choice' makes changes which we may not like or desire or believe it is not in our interest to support any longer. Most reasons are valid, generally.

 

Each of us have to figure out if the changes/pricing are what we want or desire to remain on-board with our current chosen line.... OR just move on!

 

bon voyage

Well said!

[Ride-The-Waves]

22 hours ago, Bo1953 said:

In my case, I only need to know what the bottom line is for sailing under the given circumstances... and answer the question "do I think this is a fair price or not?" when calculating that answer, then I decide if I will purchase or not.

 

There are other lines which have AI currently and I had long ago determined that they were not for us, not because of the AI as opposed to policies and standards and passengers that I prefer X for. The bottom line pricing was within 5% of X at that, so not a deal breaker.

 

Does this mean that you will not consider lines with AI currently in place?

 

As for knowing what the 'true costs' are, one (with a calculator) can get close if using the most recent info for the costs of beverage packages, gratuities and WiFi...

 

X, like other businesses which have similar pricing schemes, just are doing away with a la carte, which is fine. For those of us who either purchase or are gifted Perks, we can go back to determine where we may have spent those savings i.e. specialty dining, specialty cocktails, excursions, etc. then figure out our true cost of sailing.

 

Only us as individuals as passengers can decide if the price of sailing X with AI is of value or not, currently, regardless of their reasons to introduce it. Apparently some of us will find enough value to book.

 

I get it as to how we, at times, get entrenched and fixated on why our 'line of choice' makes changes which we may not like or desire or believe it is not in our interest to support any longer. Most reasons are valid, generally.

 

Each of us have to figure out if the changes/pricing are what we want or desire to remain on-board with our current chosen line.... OR just move on!

 

bon voyage

Bo,

 

My observation was based on the accretion of pricing by X over what the line was asking for the same/similar cruise before AI.  Not concerned by having "everything included."  Our favorite cruise line is Azamara and we book "Club Continent Suites."  The line is not only all inclusive for libations, service and other things, but also for specialty dining in the "CC" category.  Just booked an Oceania suite for a TA in late Fall 2022, a line where everything is also all included.

 

The issue with X is their effort to obscure or "cloud" their price increases as "AI."  Unsettling, at the least.  All lines have lost huge Dinars during the pandemic.  X appears to want to make one believe that you are getting a great deal for little while in fact X is "over charging" you for what you could have purchased  before the pandemic sidelined cruising.  This is a typical US company practice.  Sell the hype and hope people buy.  Problem is that post-pandemic this may not work.  Lipstick on a pig never works for long.

 

That said, we have booked a mid-2022 Reflection suite (being marketed as a "Retreat") for a Med cruise.  Hits the ports we want to visit and Reflection is a good ship.  It's about overall perceived value, not hype and really not about calculators.  To me it's more about a company, cruise line in this instance, being forthright with prospective customers.  If they can't be trusted to do that what else can't they be trusted to roved us as potential customers?

[ORV]

22 minutes ago, Ride-The-Waves said:

Just booked an Oceania suite for a TA in late Fall 2022, a line where everything is also all included.

You might want to double check that. 

[rodan]

33 minutes ago, Ride-The-Waves said:

Bo,

 

My observation was based on the accretion of pricing by X over what the line was asking for the same/similar cruise before AI.  Not concerned by having "everything included."  Our favorite cruise line is Azamara and we book "Club Continent Suites."  The line is not only all inclusive for libations, service and other things, but also for specialty dining in the "CC" category.  Just booked an Oceania suite for a TA in late Fall 2022, a line where everything is also all included.

 

The issue with X is their effort to obscure or "cloud" their price increases as "AI."  Unsettling, at the least.  All lines have lost huge Dinars during the pandemic.  X appears to want to make one believe that you are getting a great deal for little while in fact X is "over charging" you for what you could have purchased  before the pandemic sidelined cruising.  This is a typical US company practice.  Sell the hype and hope people buy.  Problem is that post-pandemic this may not work.  Lipstick on a pig never works for long.

 

That said, we have booked a mid-2022 Reflection suite (being marketed as a "Retreat") for a Med cruise.  Hits the ports we want to visit and Reflection is a good ship.  It's about overall perceived value, not hype and really not about calculators.  To me it's more about a company, cruise line in this instance, being forthright with prospective customers.  If they can't be trusted to do that what else can't they be trusted to roved us as potential customers?

 

[jagoffee]

On 2/11/2021 at 6:31 PM, ChucktownSteve said:

WOW!!! That's $638pd US$ per day for a standard non real balcony infinity?  I wonder if they named it infinity balcony because the prices have gone to infinity and beyond? 😄

Do you actually believe that the $638 pp cost per day is driven by the AI change?  You are certainly implying that you do.

[rodan]

Sorry to disagree but Oceania is not AI and that is a good thing. Internet is included and sometimes gratuities. Dining in all their specialty restaurants are included but you are only guaranteed one visit each unless an opening is available. Drinks except alcohol are included which is fine by us. All in all they are our favorite line thus pushing Celebrity to number 2 or worse although we are Elite plus. I am not a fan of their AI and will sail with them maybe once a year if I can find a cruise and price that is exceptionally appealing and that will be their loss as we are heavy cruisers and will no longer push Celebrity to friends or acquaintances 

[drakes2]

On 2/2/2021 at 9:49 PM, LGW59 said:

I am good with it, though i do one cruise per year so I am a very happy Celebrity cruiser.

Not happy with it as I'm a solo cruiser most of the time and sail 3 to 4 times a year. If I can't find someone to share the cost of the cruise I may well drop down to an inside from a balcony.  Don't spend a ton of time out there anyway.

 

[ECCruise]

2 hours ago, ORV said:

You might want to double check that. 

Yep.  That was my thought.  Grats and drinks are not included on O and can run a pretty penny.

[Jcafe]

Let’s call it for what it is.........a money grab!  My wife and I are Elite+ and while we both drink I would rather pay individual drink prices than a higher cruise price that includes drinks.   Also what about the passengers that do not drink or like my wife and I have one or two drinks a day?  Why should we subsidize other passengers that drink 5+ a day.  Also this does not promote a healthy lifestyle for some because one may tend to drink more than usual to get the value of “drinks included fare”. 
 

Due to COVID we are  re-considering our future vacation lifestyle.  With higher cruise prices, so called free perks and I fear degraded service on the horizon, we are leaning toward land travel opposed to sea travel.   We have been loyal to X but loyalty is slowly being thrown out the window.  We are still upset in the manor in which X showed little transparency at the beginning of COVID and left many passengers in a state of anxiety over refunds and FCC.   

[TeaBag]

4 hours ago, Ride-The-Waves said:

The issue with X is their effort to obscure or "cloud" their price increases as "AI."  Unsettling, at the least.  All lines have lost huge Dinars during the pandemic.  X appears to want to make one believe that you are getting a great deal for little while in fact X is "over charging" you for what you could have purchased  before the pandemic sidelined cruising.  This is a typical US company practice.  Sell the hype and hope people buy.  Problem is that post-pandemic this may not work.  Lipstick on a pig never works for long.

 

Well said.  We have 2 cruises booked last June before the AI grab started.  We received 3 perks plus OBC on each one.  The first, 9 days, is selling at nearly $1,000/pp more if I booked today.  The second, 14 days, is $1550/pp more if booked today.  As an example, on the second sailing the perks are documented, grats $271, Internet $299, drink pkg $856, all per person, added on and then taken off.  So, the $1000 and $1550 are price increases.  I understand Celebrity needs to make up for all the losses they have incurred with this dreadful COVID but I don't like them clouding it either.

I also resent paying the equivalent of $856/pp on a 14 day cruise for other peoples' alcohol.

[LGW59]

7 minutes ago, TeaBag said:

Well said.  We have 2 cruises booked last June before the AI grab started.  We received 3 perks plus OBC on each one.  The first, 9 days, is selling at nearly $1,000/pp more if I booked today.  The second, 14 days, is $1550/pp more if booked today.  As an example, on the second sailing the perks are documented, grats $271, Internet $299, drink pkg $856, all per person, added on and then taken off.  So, the $1000 and $1550 are price increases.  I understand Celebrity needs to make up for all the losses they have incurred with this dreadful COVID but I don't like them clouding it either.

I also resent paying the equivalent of $856/pp on a 14 day cruise for other peoples' alcohol.

But you did not book today, you booked last June, is that correct?  If so, then there was no money "grab" and going forward you can shop elsewhere. 

[ECCruise]

30 minutes ago, LGW59 said:

But you did not book today, you booked last June, is that correct?  If so, then there was no money "grab" and going forward you can shop elsewhere. 

But honestly, it doesn't have to affect just this poster to be a "money grab."   I know value is in the eye of the beholder, but I am in awe at what some consider to be reasonable prices.  

But in the final analysis,  everyone is free to spend--or waste, as it may be--their dough as they see fit.

[TeaBag]

I was making a comparison, showing the "clouding or "grab", hidden in AI, but I guess I didn't make it clear enough.  Sorry.   Of course, I can shop elsewhere,  I've already done it.

[ChucktownSteve]

7 hours ago, jagoffee said:

Do you actually believe that the $638 pp cost per day is driven by the AI change?  You are certainly implying that you do.

 

Nope not all by that but a good portion. The other is the demand to use the inflated FCCs before they expire.  XX gave them 125% and then charge 200% of what they used to before the pandemic.  However the bottom line is what do you really get for what you pay.  If you have a lot of FCC then it's irrelevant.  So too if you L&S'd.  If you're paying out of pocket for a new booking, then OMG.

Edited February 14, 2021 by ChucktownSteve

[drakes2]

On 2/3/2021 at 8:46 AM, Bo1953 said:

Personally, we always get a beverage package and then upgrade, we always pay grats, we always use the Wifi in port (now we do not have to wait so long LOL).

 

I trust the upgrade packages will be on sale from time to time in order to take advantage of them, as in the past for upgrades to PBP...

 

We shall see, for sure.

 

No issues with AI, really, just a different approach for the "few" who almost always purchase or have included a beverage package, and those who always pay their gratuities and then some, and those who use WiFi...

 

As with many of the changes at X over the last few years, some of us like them, some of us do not... go figure...

 

For those of us who travel solo, I do not know pre-AI, how X compared to comparable lines in terms of pricing, but I do know how they compare in other terms and for us, X is our line of choice due to service and other amenities... price excluded. We look for the best pricing for our chosen itinerary on X and not on other lines.

 

I Am sure there will be a few who will leave X over this and others who will ride it out looking for amendments or changes to the policy...

 

Cheers and bon voyage

Hi Bo. Not sure where I heard this but can you combine more than 1 FCC on a sailing?  I have 2 small ones and once sailings resume would like to use them together. I realize prices have gone up considerably and now include 3 perks.  Since I usually sail solo this is no longer of any value to me. Being an Elite member I already get some perks which are sufficient for my needs. If I can use the 2 FCC s that would help defray the cost.

[drakes2]

On 2/11/2021 at 4:28 PM, LGW59 said:

Then you can surely find a line that will work for you

I checked another cruise lines pricing for similar itinerary same length and time of year. Celebrity's lowest balcony cabin was $1,100 more expensive per person with 3 perks included.  

[Fouremco]

6 minutes ago, drakes2 said:

Hi Bo. Not sure where I heard this but can you combine more than 1 FCC on a sailing?  I have 2 small ones and once sailings resume would like to use them together. I realize prices have gone up considerably and now include 3 perks.  Since I usually sail solo this is no longer of any value to me. Being an Elite member I already get some perks which are sufficient for my needs. If I can use the 2 FCC s that would help defray the cost.

Not Bo, but yes, you can combine FCC's now.

[LGW59]

3 minutes ago, drakes2 said:

I checked another cruise lines pricing for similar itinerary same length and time of year. Celebrity's lowest balcony cabin was $1,100 more expensive per person with 3 perks included.  

I def hear you on that.  I generally only take one cruise per year and it is usually as a solo.  So I guess for me, just taking one each year causes less of a burden, those of you who cruise far more often, I am sure it hurts.

[paulh84]

I'm still surprised that people are offended at a 'money grab' from a company that hasn't had operating income in almost a year, is not sure when they will see income again and has an insane amount of new debt. It's a business....

[drakes2]

7 minutes ago, Fouremco said:

Not Bo, but yes, you can combine FCC's now.

Thank you. I thought I saw it somewhere on this board but could not find the post so called Celebrity and they said no but they are not always up to date on their info. 

[Fouremco]

38 minutes ago, drakes2 said:

Thank you. I thought I saw it somewhere on this board but could not find the post so called Celebrity and they said no but they are not always up to date on their info. 

In case you need it at some future point, here's a direct cut and paste from the Q&A:

 

Can I use the Future Cruise Credit across multiple itineraries, or does it have to be used for a single booking?

Your Future Cruise Credit may be used across multiple sailings if there is a remaining balance after its initial use.  Any remaining funds on the FCC will continue to be available until you have used the entire value of the FCC or it expires, whichever occurs first.  A recent enhancement now allows multiple FCCs to be applied per guest within the same reservation.

[drakes2]

4 minutes ago, Fouremco said:

In case you need it at some future point, here's a direct cut and paste from the Q&A:

 

Can I use the Future Cruise Credit across multiple itineraries, or does it have to be used for a single booking?

Your Future Cruise Credit may be used across multiple sailings if there is a remaining balance after its initial use.  Any remaining funds on the FCC will continue to be available until you have used the entire value of the FCC or it expires, whichever occurs first.  A recent enhancement now allows multiple FCCs to be applied per guest within the same reservation.

I have $500 canadian in total from 2 FCC s so perhaps will apply to one sailing next January. Unfortunately will have to drop down to an inside unless I find someone to share. In 2018 I paid a friend's fare for a 14 night Caribbean cruise but can't keep doing that.