Passport theft-warning

[sambamama]

I was on the Oosterdam 14 night TA that just ended today in Fort Lauderdale today. My passport and wallet were stolen by a pickpocket in Sintra, Portugal. I was on a private tour and couldn't report it until 4pm to the Lisbon consulate. Despite the embassy stated closing time of 5pm, they told me they were closed, I should get off the ship and stay overnight since they only do replacement passports between 8-11am. I was told to borrow money from people and catch up to the ship in Madeira. Instead, I went back to the ship and reported the theft and was told it was very likely I would be kicked off the ship. I got very upset, but I and while 2 HAL employees were explaining available options, the ship purser came over and yelled at me. He told me to stop being loud, and to stop insulting his crew (I never insulted them, I was just upset) and that he had to obey the rules. Not once did he express any sympathy for my sympathy for my situation. The Hal employees determined that my driver's license would allow me to stay on the ship if I got a police report from Lisbon. I did that. The same day, the the purser cursed out the asst cruise director multiple times in front of the passengers when she made an announcement about a delayed disembarkation.Every other Hal employee I spoke to was extremely sympathetic and kind. I reported his conduct to the front desk and never got a response. The last day, I filled out another comment card and finally got a fairly weak apology letter with not even a free drink offer. The port agent told me to never ever take your passport off the ship-regardless of what the ship says,  and to not rely on the ship to allow you to continue on. I learned the consulate will not help you in an emergency, and at least on the Oosterdam, rude officer conduct is acceptable, but condoned, and and needs no apology. 

[*Miss G*]

I am sorry to hear of your misfortune.  I can only imagine how horrible that would be.  Some people are not trained or do not have the ability to handle stress; or maybe he (the Purser) was under some undue stress of his own and he had reached his saturation point.  You never know what goes on in the lives of others or what news he had just received.  He may have been upset too.

 

Regardless, it was a terrible thing that happened and I am sorry.

[OlsSalt]

It would be good to get the other side before commenting on your claims against ship personnel's conduct. And all you wanted was a free drink to make things better? I am not going to take sides on this matter. 

 

Crummy situation you found yourself in, no question about that.. But thanks for reinforcing the standard warning -don't take anything ashore that you cannot afford to lose and think about this precaution twice  or three times when arranging your own private tours. 

Edited November 10, 2018 by OlsSalt

[*Miss G*]

9 minutes ago, OlsSalt said:

It would be good to get the other side before commenting on your claims against ship personnel's conduct. And all you wanted was a free drink to make things better? I am not going to take sides on this matter. 

 

 

Sounds more like (s)he wanted some compassion, which some people don’t have the ability to give.

[VMax1700]

Sorry you didn't get a free drink, but how do you know it was a pickpocket and your wallet wasn't just mislaid or dropped somewhere?

(Not excusing bad behavior, but if you were as upset as you say, then misunderstandings can occur).

[yerdua]

I am so sorry that you had to experience this - both the pickpocket and the less than sympathetic response from a ship officer. I do thank you for posting your experience. Its a good reminder that there are thieves everywhere. We are booked for a similar itinerary next year and will be more vigilant regarding our documents and valuables in ports. Recommendation is to only take a photocopy of your passport off the ship, use slash resistant accessories and for men, never carry your wallet in your back pocket. Also, be wary of any stranger getting too close to you. 

[the2ofus]

There was really no need for the negative, unkind comments to the OP.  Compassion for her predicament, yes.  Lessons learned that can benefit future pax, yes.  Suggestions that we don't always know what happens in the lives of others, nor how any of us might react in stressful situations, yes.  If you have nothing useful to contribute, just read the post and move on.

[STANCPA44]

That why I have a passport card along with my passport.  I take the passport card when I am off the ship.

[canadianbear]

12 minutes ago, the2ofus said:

There was really no need for the negative, unkind comments to the OP.  Compassion for her predicament, yes.  Lessons learned that can benefit future pax, yes.  Suggestions that we don't always know what happens in the lives of others, nor how any of us might react in stressful situations, yes.  If you have nothing useful to contribute, just read the post and move on.

Totally agree.  

 

OP-thank you for sharing your experience. It is a big reminder to all of us.  I’m also sorry for the attitude of the ship purser making a bad situation worse.  

[alwaysfrantic]

11 minutes ago, STANCPA44 said:

That why I have a passport card along with my passport.  I take the passport card when I am off the ship.

A passport card won’t really do you much good.

 

I have scanned copies in email email I could pulll up at a consulate if needed.  But I don’t take them off the ship.  

[kazu]

Sorry OP, that you lost your passport.

 

I've never had to carry my passport in Lisbon and I've been there a number of times.  We take a colour copy of our main page and only carry our passport if it is absolutely mandatory.

 

If you were upset (which I understand) you might not have realized how forceful you were sounding.  

 

Sorry you didn't get the empathy you were looking for but sometimes when we are upset, we don't hear or see the empathy and others have to be more forceful.

 

Sorry to hear it wasn't handled well.

[Vict0riann]

OP, what a disaster!  I remember the panic.  Our daughter had both her her passports (Canadian and Irish, and all her other cards, IDs, etc.) stolen in Copenhagen  before we started our Baltic cruise a few years ago, and we spent a day finding a police station to make a report (Saturday), and then find out what to do about a new passport.  She had to stay behind until the following week to replace her Canadian one, and she joined us in Helsinki.  But that was at the beginning of a cruise, and we knew they wouldn't let her board. 

 

I am paranoid about carrying my passports in a pouch hidden around my waist now.  We do take our EU passports ashore in Europe, as we get concessions at museums, etc., with them.  But we make sure to keep them very safe.  I think if I had my Canadian one stolen during the cruise, I would do the police report and tell the embassy, and I would re-board the ship very quietly, and then report it (in the hope they wouldn't boot me off).  Do you think that would be a better option?  Of course, a big problem then is what is going to happen when you disembark....

 

OP, how did your disembarkation go?

[SetAnOpenCourse]

Glad you were not made to leave the ship, except to get the police report.  Was that difficult to obtain?  Who who actually needed that, HAL or immigration/customs in Ft Lauderdale?

Thanks for the informative thread.

[Copper10-8]

1 hour ago, sambamama said:

I was on the Oosterdam 14 night TA that just ended today in Fort Lauderdale today. My passport and wallet were stolen by a pickpocket in Sintra, Portugal. I was on a private tour and couldn't report it until 4pm to the Lisbon consulate. Despite the embassy stated closing time of 5pm, they told me they were closed, I should get off the ship and stay overnight since they only do replacement passports between 8-11am. I was told to borrow money from people and catch up to the ship in Madeira. Instead, I went back to the ship and reported the theft and was told it was very likely I would be kicked off the ship. I got very upset, but I and while 2 HAL employees were explaining available options, the ship purser came over and yelled at me. He told me to stop being loud, and to stop insulting his crew (I never insulted them, I was just upset) and that he had to obey the rules. Not once did he express any sympathy for my sympathy for my situation. The Hal employees determined that my driver's license would allow me to stay on the ship if I got a police report from Lisbon. I did that. The same day, the the purser cursed out the asst cruise director multiple times in front of the passengers when she made an announcement about a delayed disembarkation.Every other Hal employee I spoke to was extremely sympathetic and kind. I reported his conduct to the front desk and never got a response. The last day, I filled out another comment card and finally got a fairly weak apology letter with not even a free drink offer. The port agent told me to never ever take your passport off the ship-regardless of what the ship says,  and to not rely on the ship to allow you to continue on. I learned the consulate will not help you in an emergency, and at least on the Oosterdam, rude officer conduct is acceptable, but condoned, and and needs no apology. 

 

Being the victim of a crime, you state yours was a pick-pocket theft, is never a good thing and I fully understand your frustration which apparently started with the staff at the U.S. consulate in Lisbon ("we are closed at 4:00 PM" event though the opening hours are listed as 5:00 PM in addition to their advise ("leave the ship, come see us tomorrow and borrow money to fly to Madeira to re-board there" - awwrighty then). Good for you in obtaining a copy of the crime report from the local Portuguese law enforcement agency! Many crime victims abroad do not remember doing that and/or are too flustered!

 

So you are already frustrated  when you arrive back onboard in Lisbon and went to Guest Services to report the theft. Then you get told by staff that "you, in all likelihood, would be kicked off the ship" (no doubt a poor choice of words on their part if it was uttered in such a crass manner) until looking into it further and finding out that a valid DL would allow you to remain onboard, good for you. And luckily for you, that DL was not in the wallet that was also stolen! Most persons, incl. yours truly, carry a DL in some kind of wallet

 

By your own words, you were "very upset" by now and that probably manifested itself in your interaction with the Guest Services staff - I know, a pure assumption on my part since I wasn't there, hope I'm somewhat accurate. The Purser's office on a Vista class ship like Oostie, is located to the left of the front desk as you're facing it, one small corridor plus one additional office space away. He/she has an exterior office door that leads out to the guest corridor to the left (aft) of the counter. Even though the purser is not in charge of Guest Services, the guest relations manager (who outranks the purser) is, he/she (going back to the purser) is in charge of the controller and printer. However, both the purser and GRM belong to the ship's Admin Dept. I would think that the purser overheard the, shall I say "commotion", came to find out what was happening, and addressed you, by your description, not in the most advantageous and deescalating manner possible.

 

Perhaps he was having a bad day and wanted to come to the "rescue" of the front desk staff, I don't know, doesn't matter. Regardless, after that initial entry onto the scene, he should have pulled you aside, perhaps taken you into his office (along with a female staff member) and, for lack of a better description, should have attempted to "dust you off" / explain the "now no longer being in possession of a valid passport which is a requirement traveling abroad" situation from his standpoint, knowledge and expertise, and make an attempt to make you feel whole again after such an anxious experience ashore on a private excursion.

 

I hope you have a safe journey home today and the best wishes for obtaining a new passport in an expedient manner from the National Passport Service!

 

 

[sambamama]

I was not looking for sympathy or empathy from this forum, but I but was posting to let people know about consequences. FYI, my passport and wallet were in a pouch I wear around my neck, and that compartment was unzipped. Yes, it was careless of me, and I agree. However, the tour guide told me this never happens in Sintra-Lisbon, yes. I know exactly what happened-I did not put all the details in an already lengthy story. So, no, I did not set my wallet and passport down somewhere-they were stolen and the credit cards were fraudulently used within 30 minutes (which I reported.) I was hysterically crying once they mentioned kicking me off the ship yet never once said anything vaguely derogatory to any of the employees. In fact, I wrote up praise for everyone but the purse. I was NOT looking for a handout-but I felt and still feel the purser's behavior was entirely inappropriate. I would NOT have reported it had he not repeatedly cursed out and chastised the assistant cruise director in front of 100-200 passengers. I doubt anyone can agree that was acceptable behavior. If you are working in a business where you deal with customers and service, then you need courtesy. Had he at any point expressed any sympathy for me as a crime victim, I never would have mentioned this. Also, I was traveling totally alone, and 250 Euros, my debit card and my major credit cards were stolen.  The cards I had left I could not get cash advances on. All of this increased the severity of the theft. Dont judge the impact of a crime theft until you are the victim of one!! 

[sambamama]

FYI, I am a MA criminal defense attorney, ironically enough. Two women from Guest Services worked very hard with me to help. I had my driver's license and MA BBO card which I gave to them. They had me stay in my cabin and I believe they called Hal authorities and faxed my documents. Whoever they called gave me permission to stay if I filled out a ship theft report and got a Lisbon police report. So they arranged for me to meet the Lisbon port agent,  Miguel, and he took me to the police where I got a 3 page Portuguese police report.Guest Services got a copy and I was set, and was able to get off in Gibraltar the next day. I had to meet with someone from the Border and Customs Unit today who read my documents (I also had 2 statements from 2 people on the tour who knew what happened) and let me through without grilling me. I reported the passport stolen today to the State Department and now have to get a new one. The two women from Guest Services, the 2 guys from Security, the Chief Security Officer and the Port Agent were very empathetic , as were all passengers on the ship who heard about it. One of my dinner table mates loaned me some money that I will repay once I get home. (I had planned to stay 2 nights here in Fort Lauderdale before flying home.)

[OlsSalt]

State Department provides their STEP program for US travelers overseas - worth taking a look to learn what you can and can not expect from them during emergencies or in the case of a lost/stolen passport, as well as signing up for notifications if there are particular safety concerns in various countries of planned traveled : https://travel.state.gov/content/travel/en/international-travel/emergencies/lost-stolen-passport-abroad.html

 

We were also robbed on our very first Holland America cruise in Antigua. We were surprised at the level of care we got from ship's personnel, since we had no expectations they had any responsibility for what happened to us onshore when we were traveling on our own.  

 

We realize after our own experience HAL does want you to have a good overall travel experience and they reached out several times after the incident to check our  well-being as well. However we did not create a scene in front of other passengers. Nor did we carry all our valuable possessions with us when we were robbed so we did not have to face the lost passport issue and the very real possibility of being denied onward passage. 

 

Compassion also includes hearing both sides of the story before piling on someone who is not there to defend themselves.  Compassion for the lost passport and the scary thought of being denied passage is real. No one would want to go through this.  Using this awful incident to attack someone who cannot defend themselves is where I do part company in this discussion. 

 

Edited November 10, 2018 by OlsSalt

[Nashna]

5 minutes ago, sambamama said:

I was not looking for sympathy or empathy from this forum, but I but was posting to let people know about consequences. FYI, my passport and wallet were in a pouch I wear around my neck, and that compartment was unzipped. Yes, it was careless of me, and I agree. However, the tour guide told me this never happens in Sintra-Lisbon, yes. I know exactly what happened-I did not put all the details in an already lengthy story. So, no, I did not set my wallet and passport down somewhere-they were stolen and the credit cards were fraudulently used within 30 minutes (which I reported.) I was hysterically crying once they mentioned kicking me off the ship yet never once said anything vaguely derogatory to any of the employees. In fact, I wrote up praise for everyone but the purse. I was NOT looking for a handout-but I felt and still feel the purser's behavior was entirely inappropriate. I would NOT have reported it had he not repeatedly cursed out and chastised the assistant cruise director in front of 100-200 passengers. I doubt anyone can agree that was acceptable behavior. If you are working in a business where you deal with customers and service, then you need courtesy. Had he at any point expressed any sympathy for me as a crime victim, I never would have mentioned this. Also, I was traveling totally alone, and 250 Euros, my debit card and my major credit cards were stolen.  The cards I had left I could not get cash advances on. All of this increased the severity of the theft. Dont judge the impact of a crime theft until you are the victim of one!! 

Oh my...you really were in a horrible situation.  I would have been hysterical as well.  Thank goodness, you were not hurt in the robbery.  I had a friend who had her money in a neck pouch.  Thieves slashed the strap off the pouch and threw her to the ground.  She ended up with two cracked ribs and a dislocated shoulder.  She was walking back from a Princess shore excursion in Martinique and was within sight of the ship.  She only had 10 Euros in the pouch, but, it took her over a year and several surgeries to heal her shoulder.   She did say that Princess was very helpful and kind to her.  Thank you for posting your story.  It is a good reminder to just take one credit card with you, take a limited amount of money and leave your passport on the ship.   

[sevenseasnomad]

So sorry this happened to you.  It is never easy to be a victim of crime, especially when far from home.  The consulate/embassy isn't much help as my friends had a similar story.  It surprised me that as Americans we can't expect much help when in a foreign country.  Each citizen is basically on his/her own, despite the fact that there could even be a U.S. embassy right across the street!  

[Copper10-8]

29 minutes ago, sambamama said:

.......................... However, the tour guide told me this never happens in Sintra-Lisbon............................................................

 

There is some Arizona beachfront property for sale for that Sintra-Lisbon tour guide

 

29 minutes ago, sambamama said:

...............but I felt and still feel the purser's behavior was entirely inappropriate. I would NOT have reported it had he not repeatedly cursed out and chastised the assistant cruise director in front of 100-200 passengers.....................................

 

Two entirely different departments; Administrative and Entertainment.  The purser has no business cursing out and chastising the ACD and especially not in public! If he had an issue with her/him, he should have gone to the Dept. head of the Entertainment Dept. for that person to address it with the ACD

[Cruise_More_Often]

OP, thank you for reporting on your experience. I have always taken my passport off the ship, but I won't any longer.

[rkacruiser]

I do appreciate the OP's post.  I am one who always uses a neck pouch to hopefully secure my documents and money whenever I am in a port where one probably ought to do so.  But, I always keep it next to my chest under any and all clothing that I have on.  I only take it out when I need to do so, i.e.  making a purchase, getting my cruise card out for ship re-boarding, etc.  Anyone who tries to get to that pouch is going to have to begin disrobing me first.  I think I might notice that.

 

I also carry some used tissues in my pants pockets to "reward" any pickpocket that would care to have them.

[Cruising-along]

3 minutes ago, rkacruiser said:

I do appreciate the OP's post.  I am one who always uses a neck pouch to hopefully secure my documents and money whenever I am in a port where one probably ought to do so.  But, I always keep it next to my chest under any and all clothing that I have on.  I only take it out when I need to do so, i.e.  making a purchase, getting my cruise card out for ship re-boarding, etc.  Anyone who tries to get to that pouch is going to have to begin disrobing me first.  I think I might notice that.

 

I also carry some used tissues in my pants pockets to "reward" any pickpocket that would care to have them.

We do the same.  We've had too many close calls over the years (thankfully none were successful). 

[mcrcruiser]

OP so sorry for the  difficulties you endured . 

 

 In any foreign port of call ,we just take pass port photo copies  ,a credit card that has no foreign exchange rates ,some money &  our  sign & sail card . All those things  we place in a  waist pouch under our clothing . I just place a few dollars in my front pocket 

[awhcruiser]

Just wondering why you would take your passport and wallet off of the ship in the first place?