Norovirus

[chemmo]

Other than living in a bubble at home infection is always a risk when sharing space with lots of others be it on land, sea or in the air.

 

Like many others we take the obvious precautions including cabin wipe down, we wash our hands frequently, we avoid public restrooms where possible and use the sanitizer before entering venues. The only time we caught Noro was in Alaska....We had always thought we would be more at risk in warmer climates.

 

Also like others if we did see guests handling food we would report. This has only been experienced by us once in suite lounge on an RC cruise a young girl was picking up every pastry to see which one had the most fruit in it whilst her mother watched!?!? This isn’t something we have particularly seen to be an issue on Celebrity. We are always very reassured to see the constant wiping down of handrails and cleaning of the lifts.

 

I would never comment about a guest entering Oceanview without using sanitizer....I would assume they had an issue with it and had, or were about to use, their own alternative. I sincerely hope that the guests who just “don’t use and don’t care” are a very small minority....

 

Over many years of travel we have walked into restaurants and then walked out even faster when it was clear to see that health/hygiene was not up to standard. Whilst I am fully aware we cannot see these little bugs I have never seen a dirty Celebrity ship. I genuinely feel the cruise lines do take the issues seriously and are genuinely doing all they can to promote safer cruising. Whilst I know I could catch something on a cruise I think I could be more at risk in many land based restaurants.

 

Edited January 16, 2019 by chemmo

[floralscent]

I sanitize my hands before entering the buffet with washy washy. After getting my food at the buffet I go to the restroom and wash my hands.  When eating a chip, French fry or other type of finger food, I touch in the same area when I pick it up and don't eat the area where my fingers were.  This is probably not all germ free but I do my best

[NLH Arizona]

This is what I take on my cruises:  Clorox CLO 02174 Bleach-Free Hand Sanitizer, 2.0 FL OZ, Contains Hand Moisturizers, Alcohol-Based

 

The C.D.C. says that as a means of preventing norovirus infection, alcohol-based sanitizers can be used “in addition” to hand washing, never as a substitute. 

[kathynorth]

On 1/14/2019 at 2:38 PM, jsf said:

I'm wondering why this seems to hit cruise ships so often,is it the confined space or because of pax from so many different countries or what?

J.

 

Neuro doesn't just hit cruise ships and this has absolutely nothing about people being from different countries. This type of event hits the news because people are on vacation expecting a good time, and if they get sick they are disappointed they become vocal. Schools, large office buildings, even hospitals get hit with neurovirus because these locations have lots of people in contained areas who share use of bathrooms, cafeterias, handrails, doorknobs, etc. What this comes down to is that there are lots of people who are more concerned for themselves than for others. They just don't see themselves as being potential carriers of a virus, so they don't take appropriate precautions. 

[kathynorth]

On 1/14/2019 at 2:42 PM, bikerunner said:

I remember my last cruise watching this lady in OVC use her hands to grab bacon/sausage among other things.  It really don't find it shocking anymore, I worked ran hotels/restaurants for over 20 years.  I just let one of the workers know to remove those trays and they did promptly. 

It may be forward of me, but when I see people touching food in OVC I let whomever is attending that station know that someone touched the food and put it back, so please remove it from the buffet station. I try to do this within earshot of the person who was doing the touching. The attendance always takes care of it. 

[Fjcpooh17]

On 1/15/2019 at 8:17 AM, tkere said:

You actually only need about 20 seconds of hand washing but the key is friction, rub the soap between your hands.

The cabin steward uses the same rag to clean cabins, Saturngrl do you lysol everyday? 

 

While wiping down the cabin on Reflection this past Dec, cabin steward Green came in. He stated they use sanitation cleaner not only in the cabins but all over the ship. I asked does this kill germs and bacteria, he said yes. We still finished wiping down the rest of cabin and everything we would touch. We wipe the sea pass card on a daily basis as well. 

 

We consistently wash our hands and try to always have sanitizer with us, especially at the buffet. I have witnessed people sneezing into their hands then grab tongs or food directly from trays. That’s why we get all our food first then go wash hands or sanitize down. 

[jamacka]

use your elbow to hit the elevator buttons and the public washroom buttons, try not to touch railings, when filling up you drink at the machine in the cafeteria use a napkin so you don't directly touch the button or lever, try not to touch salt and pepper shakers or condiment dispensers with bare hands.  Most of us wash our hands and use hand sanitizer before we go into eat but forget that once in there, people cough and sneeze into their hands or directly onto the serving tools. Somebody coughs into their hand, picks up a menu and carries on with their day.  Next person comes in, picks up the menu, makes an order and then picks up their bread with their freshly contaminated hand.  Just keep in mind that just because people enter with clean hands doesn't mean their hands stay clean.

[Loanrngr]

Over Sanitizing is creating more outbreaks and sickness!!! Wash your hands when you need too and for me Ketel One Vodka :)

 I manage a fair amount of amount of young sales people 25-35 year old's who are constantly using the hand sanitizer's and oddly enough are always getting sick??? Plenty of info to back this up, and I would venture to say that the widespread outbreaks have been getting more prevalent over the years???  Just my .02 cents worth...

 

https://www.cbsnews.com/news/does-hand-sanitizer-give-people-a-false-sense-of-security/

 

 

[jamacka]

On 1/20/2019 at 2:42 PM, Loanrngr said:

Over Sanitizing is creating more outbreaks and sickness!!! Wash your hands when you need too and for me Ketel One Vodka :)

 I manage a fair amount of amount of young sales people 25-35 year old's who are constantly using the hand sanitizer's and oddly enough are always getting sick??? Plenty of info to back this up, and I would venture to say that the widespread outbreaks have been getting more prevalent over the years???  Just my .02 cents worth...

 

https://www.cbsnews.com/news/does-hand-sanitizer-give-people-a-false-sense-of-security/

 

 

well, I think you'd have a lot of convincing to do to, especially in the medical profession where doctors and nurses routinely use hand sanitizer before visiting with a patient.   I don't think its use should be down played.  As the article you posts says, they remove common cold, strep, and even flu.  If you've ever watched people in public washrooms you'll know that most people don't adequately wash their hands and some don't wash hands at all.   I also know that many of those people also don't use hand sanitizers which mean they could be walking petri dishes.  I will continue to use hand sanitizer in addition to washing my hands (I'm very thorough) because I know those people exist.

 

Last year I was in the grocery store produce section and I watched a women open a container of raspberries, poke them wit her finger the close the lid and put it back.  She did this wit several containers.  Raspberries are hard to wash and best you can do it run water over them unlike fruit with a peel which you can wash wit soap and water.  As far as I'm concerned her poking each raspberry is the same as sticking her finger directly in a stranger's mouth.  I don't have faith that her hands were clean.. not after hanging not the grocery cart handle.   So two things i picked up rom that: people are disgusting and don't buy raspberries. 

[mfs2k]

It’s not just cruise ships.

 

I spent last weekend at Atlantic City casinos for Superbowl and caught Norovirus. I’m pretty sure I got it from touching slot machine screens and not washing my hands well enough before eating. 

I just had the worst 3 1/2 days of my life. But I lost 10 pounds so there’s that. I’ll fit better in my bathing suit on my March cruise. 

 

I empathize with anyone who gets Norovirus on a cruise. I missed 3 days of work. It would be much worse, locked in a cabin, missing vacation. 

[PTC DAWG]

On 1/20/2019 at 1:42 PM, Loanrngr said:

Over Sanitizing is creating more outbreaks and sickness!!! Wash your hands when you need too and for me Ketel One Vodka 🙂

 I manage a fair amount of amount of young sales people 25-35 year old's who are constantly using the hand sanitizer's and oddly enough are always getting sick??? Plenty of info to back this up, and I would venture to say that the widespread outbreaks have been getting more prevalent over the years???  Just my .02 cents worth...

 

https://www.cbsnews.com/news/does-hand-sanitizer-give-people-a-false-sense-of-security/

 

 

My thoughts exactly...creates weak immune systems...eat more dirt. 🙂

[Diamond lover]

On 1/15/2019 at 3:37 PM, uktog said:

See post 28, to repeat the detail there it can only be used every 6 hours

Hopefully this helps you understand why I have the difficulties I have and whilst your solution works for you it does not for me.  

 

Where there’s a will, there’s a way.

[Lastdance]

I also know that having a great immune system is so important...all my years in education have kept it working optimally, but then I am also a gym rat, and try to eat healthy foods too...as one cannot be too healthy...I bring those school germs home too, so my DH also has a great immune system...and yes, I take precautions onboard too, both for me and others!

 

 

 

[Psychbabs]

Alcohol hand sanitizers do not kill the norovirus. The best way to prevent  getting infected is good hand washing, esp. before you eat. A product called Zylast does  kill the norovirus. It comes in a lotion anti septic bottle. You only need to apply the size of a pea onto your hands. And it lasts 6 hours on your hands. It can only be ordered via their web site: Zylastdirect.com. IT IS NOT A DRUG.  It is an antiseptic. It doesn’t dry out and crack your skin like alcohol hand  sanitizers. Bleach also kills the norovirus, but is impractical to use on skin. 

[barb-ottawa]

Frankly, I wish all cruiselines dealt with food in the buffet like Holland America does. Most of the food items are only handled by servers, not by guests. If you feel like they didn't give you enough, you can always ask for more or go back for seconds. 

 

Edited February 12, 2020 by barb-ottawa

[Denny01]

A few points after reading:

1. What I’ve read on medical sites is to wash your hands for 20sec is sufficient, not 1min. Think about how long a minute is. 20sec is about how long it takes to sing ‘99 bottles of beer on the wall’ down to 97 bottles......one of my favorite songs!

 

2. To the poster who gets grief for not using the ship sanitizer because they are allergic and said for others to quit being santiizing police, I’m afraid that’s not solution. Not sure how to nicely remind someone they should actually wash up or use a sanitizer, but this isn’t some useless exercise. If someone reaches in to take food by hand, they need to be called out For Sure and also let the staff know right then. Obviously we haven’t ‘lost’ our resistance to noro because we use sanitizers, and it is effective for cruising, airlines, buses, shops and hospitals for many nasty organisms. I suggest you carry handwipes or a dispenser you aren’t allergic to and use when entering areas that are dispensing it. You may be allergic, but that doesn’t mean you arent carrying the viruses that spread such good stuff you picked up in the common areas you crossed coming to the MDR, just was we all do. But you do as you wish. Just a suggestion. 

 

enough. This type of thread brings out some real come-backs that get colorful. 

 

Den

[Fouremco]

1 hour ago, Psychbabs said:

Alcohol hand sanitizers do not kill the norovirus. The best way to prevent  getting infected is good hand washing, esp. before you eat. A product called Zylast does  kill the norovirus. It comes in a lotion anti septic bottle. You only need to apply the size of a pea onto your hands. And it lasts 6 hours on your hands. It can only be ordered via their web site: Zylastdirect.com. IT IS NOT A DRUG.  It is an antiseptic. It doesn’t dry out and crack your skin like alcohol hand  sanitizers. Bleach also kills the norovirus, but is impractical to use on skin. 

Zylast has been in trouble with the FDA for several years, and the FDA has pursued a permanent injunction against company selling unapproved hand sanitizers that claim to prevent infections from numerous pathogens. Please don't try to push your snake oil here.

[RosieRoo]

I don’t want to rain on anyone’s parade, but Lysol and Clorox wipes do not kill the Noro virus. 

https://www.nytimes.com/2018/11/29/smarter-living/norovirus-prevention-stomach-flu-winter.html

 

“A little-known fact about noroviruses is that many household cleaners and wipes don’t kill them. Clorox and Lysol Disinfecting wipes claim to kill 99.9 percent of viruses and bacteria, but that doesn’t include noroviruses.“

Edited February 12, 2020 by RosieRoo

[dkjretired]

I don't use hand sanitizer ever because I break out with every brand I have ever tried.   I also reject completely comments that I should sort of fake it just to satisfy other people.  I don't care what other people think, you don't like me not using hand sanitizer, that's your problem not mine.  By the way, I wash my hands probably more than most people and I'm not making any excuses so no comments that its not just my problem.    

Edited February 13, 2020 by dkjretired

[D C]

14 hours ago, Fouremco said:

Zylast has been in trouble with the FDA for several years, and the FDA has pursued a permanent injunction against company selling unapproved hand sanitizers that claim to prevent infections from numerous pathogens. Please don't try to push your snake oil here.

The FDA is not disputing the effectiveness. They're disagreeing with the labeling and claims being made. 

 

We’re concerned that people potentially exposed to pathogens may use these products with a false sense of safety. This may result in infrequent hand washing, or the substitution of these products for protective gloves and clothing or hand washing, which are the principal methods for protecting against the spread of diseases. 

 

 

Zylast contains Benzethonium Chloride, which is effective in killing norovirus. That isn't being disputed. 

[sippican]

Why has this thread even appearing as current?  It is out dated and not relevat to the current corona virus. FWIW - Zylast is not longer sold due to false advertising claims.

 

 

[TeeRick]

On 1/14/2019 at 5:54 PM, trivia addict said:

Proven fact that hand sanitizer makes germs more resistant.

I do not use it because of this, and my husband does not use it because it makes his hands severely cracked and dried. So much so, that he has had to get medical attention after one cruise.

We wash our hands with soap  before the meal and then again afterwards.

Absolutely not a proven fact.  

[Fouremco]

1 hour ago, D C said:

The FDA is not disputing the effectiveness. They're disagreeing with the labeling and claims being made. 

That's not accurate, as the FDA found that the claims for Zylast being effective were unproven and that there wasn't adequate evidence that it prevents infection. From the FDA's news release announcing that they were seeking a permanent injunction:

 

"Despite being warned by the FDA about their unproven claims, this company has continued to market their products as a tool for preventing infection from serious disease-related pathogens, without adequate evidence to support these uses," said FDA Commissioner Scott Gottlieb, M.D.

 

1 hour ago, D C said:

 

Zylast contains Benzethonium Chloride, which is effective in killing norovirus. That isn't being disputed. 

 

Again, not accurate. From an FDA Warning Letter date June 30, 2015 to Innovative Biodefense, the manufacturer of Zylast:

 

 

The following labeling claim was included on your website, www.zylastdirect.com:

 

• "The active ingredient in Zylast, BZT ... and is considered safe and effective in concentrations of 0.1-0.2% by the FDA."

 

FDA has not established nor proposed BZT (benzethonium chloride) to be safe and effective at any concentration when used as a leave-on antiseptic such as Zylast XP Antiseptic Lotion. Thus, this claim is false and misleading...

[ShipWalker]

2 hours ago, sippican said:

Why has this thread even appearing as current?  It is out dated and not relevat to the current corona virus...

 

 

Because this thread is about Norovirus, not COVID-19.

 

And the top personal prevention to disease (and spreading) is still relevant - properly wash your hands.

Edited February 13, 2020 by ShipWalker

[AnnemarieC76]

On 1/15/2019 at 3:57 PM, m8zenblue said:

Responding to "uktog", it seems that you are making very excuse in the book NOT to clean your hands.

How do you clean your hands after using the restroom ?

Do you go straight from restroom to buffet or MDR ?

I'm just saying.

@uktogwas referring to not being able to use the prescribed sanitizer more than once every 6 hours - please read before coming at someones neck -